OT: nationalization of american banks?

[uki]

wow. seems greenspan has the solution to the problem... :rolleyes:


The US government may have to nationalise some banks on a temporary basis to fix the financial system and restore the flow of credit, Alan Greenspan, the former Federal Reserve chairman, has told the Financial Times.

In an interview, Mr Greenspan, who for decades was regarded as the high priest of laisser-faire capitalism, said nationalisation could be the least bad option left for policymakers.

”It may be necessary to temporarily nationalise some banks in order to facilitate a swift and orderly restructuring,” he said. “I understand that once in a hundred years this is what you do.”

Mr Greenspan’s comments capped a frenetic day in which policymakers across the political spectrum appeared to be moving towards accepting some form of bank nationalisation.

“We should be focusing on what works,” Lindsey Graham, a Republican senator from South Carolina, told the FT. “We cannot keep pouring good money after bad.” He added, “If nationalisation is what works, then we should do it.”

Speaking to the FT ahead of a speech to the Economic Club of New York on Tuesday, Mr Greenspan said that “in some cases, the least bad solution is for the government to take temporary control” of troubled banks either through the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation or some other mechanism.

The former Fed chairman said temporary government ownership would ”allow the government to transfer toxic assets to a bad bank without the problem of how to price them.”


man this keeps getting better every single day...

full article... http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/e310cbf6-fd4e-11dd-a103-000077b07658.html?nclick_check=1

[SimonM]

Yes! Nationalize the banks! Nationalize the industries! Workers of the world unite, you have nothing to lose but your chains!!!

thank you.

[uki]

Workers of the world unite, you have nothing to lose but your chains!!!the chains will become shackles.

[SimonM]

Just because some jerks have used Marxist rhetoric to obfuscate the crap they do does not mean that there is no validity to Marx. Looks like Greenspan may have figured this out... too bad it's too little too late. :D

[David Jamieson]

Simon you are such a commie.

[SimonM]

Yup, I am. :D

[uki]

Looks like Greenspan may have figured this out... too bad it's too little too late.all part of the plan... america was never mean't to get out of debt. :)

[SimonM]

That's right Uki. It's not the reptoids you have to watch out for...

It's the soviet union.

That's right, the fall of communism was a ruse designed to lure the decadent west into a false sense of security.

Mikhail Gorbachev, Boris Yeltsin, Vladimir Putin and Dmitri Medevev are the secret cabal behind all that happens in the world.

Starting from the "democratization" of Russia they injected Russian gas and oil into the markets, destabilizing them.

Meanwhile their sleeper agents in the USA, Alan Greenspan, Barack Obama and most of the bankers on Wal Street (fun fact, all soviet "defecters") arranged a financial collapse so that when things looked bleakest...

BANG!

The Soviet Socialist States of America.

Now it is in it's end-game and I, a deeply initiated member of the communist cabal am allowed to tell you this as it is too late to avert it. :D

[1bad65]

This will not end well.

Isn't nationalisation what people like Hitler, Stalin, and Mussolini did?

[uki]

That's right Uki. It's not the reptoids you have to watch out for...

It's the soviet union.

That's right, the fall of communism was a ruse designed to lure the decadent west into a false sense of security.

Mikhail Gorbachev, Boris Yeltsin, Vladimir Putin and Dmitri Medevev are the secret cabal behind all that happens in the world.

Starting from the "democratization" of Russia they injected Russian gas and oil into the markets, destabilizing them.

Meanwhile their sleeper agents in the USA, Alan Greenspan, Barack Obama and most of the bankers on Wal Street (fun fact, all soviet "defecters") arranged a financial collapse so that when things looked bleakest...

BANG!

The Soviet Socialist States of America.

Now it is in it's end-game and I, a deeply initiated member of the communist cabal am allowed to tell you this as it is too late to avert it. very nice. you're getting there ole boy. :D

[SimonM]

Rotflmfao!!!!! :D

[David Jamieson]

This will not end well.

Isn't nationalisation what people like Hitler, Stalin, and Mussolini did?

Man, how old are you? Why is your world so black and white? Why do you bother with WW2 references when you ahve plenty of examples in the world right now. I don't know if you noticed, but this problem is a global problem and stems from unregulated capitalism and not from other forms of governance.

It was capitalists who packaged up lies and bad deals with other products and distributed them out over a wide array that in turn caused the collapse of the banking system in virtually every corner of the world.

It wasn't hitler stalin and mussolini and don't forget, Stalin was an Ally and not an enemy.

[uki]

*starts munching the popcorn again*

[Faruq]

I'm not happy about the nationalization of commercial banks, but would nationalization of the Federal Reserves be bad? I don't know who's telling the head of the Federal Reserve what to do now, but I don't think our government printing and controlling the supply of currency out there would necessarily be all bad.

[1bad65]

I'm 37.

Right is right, and wrong is wrong. I've asked repeatedly for someone to show JUST ONE example of government social spending ending a recession or depression. No one has. Yet I've shown where Reagan and JFK (A Democrat) both ended recessions with massive tax cuts.

You want a current country? Ok. Cuba has nationalized banks. You want that here? You want the average American to live on like $260/month like the average Cuban does?

And it was not capitalism that failed here. It was government intervention. Government, through the CRA, FORCED banks to make bad loans. Then government backed the bad loans! The housing mess is the root of the mess we are in now.

And Stalin was only an ally because of a common enemy. He needed us and we needed him. Look at what happened to Eastern Europe after WWII. It was Stalin who took over those countries and looted them, it was the West who condemned him and formed NATO to stop the FORCIBLE expansion of the Soviet Bloc.

[1bad65]

And you failed to answer the question:

Isn't nationalization what Hitler, Stalin, and Mussolini did?

[BoulderDawg]

And it was not capitalism that failed here. It was government intervention. Government, through the CRA, FORCED banks to make bad loans. Then government backed the bad loans! The housing mess is the root of the mess we are in now.

You still need to attend that Econ 101 class.

[uki]

You want the average American to live on like $260/month like the average Cuban does?i have been laid off since november, spring doesn't look to hot yet... after they deduct what they can out of my UC benefits for child support(1 child with my ex and i am ordered to pay 498/month, heck i have two full time kids at home!) my bi-weekly UC check is 90 bucks, thats right folks, $180 dollars a month. good thing the house is ours or we'd be frigg'in screwed... and thank goodness the girlfriend works part-time. i love it when hear people complaining about having it rough. :rolleyes:

[1bad65]

i have been laid off since november, spring doesn't look to hot yet... after they deduct what they can out of my UC benefits for child support(1 child with my ex and i am ordered to pay 498/month, heck i have two full time kids at home!) my bi-weekly UC check is 90 bucks, thats right folks, $180 dollars a month. good thing the house is ours or we'd be frigg'in screwed... and thank goodness the girlfriend works part-time. i love it when hear people complaining about having it rough. :rolleyes:

You live on $180 AFTER child support and bills. The average Cuban makes ~$260/month in wages. Do you have government imposed milk and food rations? The Cubans do.

There is a huge difference.

And like I tell anyone defending Cuba, you are free to go there and renounce your US citizenship and live under the same rules as the other Cubans do.

It is sad to hear you lost your job, I wish you luck in finding a new one. What is your field of work, if you don't mind me asking?

[golgo]

My understanding of this form of nationalization is that it would not follow the Japanese model (which took many years to have its desired effect) but more like the Swiss model. After the banks are more stable they would be auctioned off to the highest bidder. I'm not saying that is the right approach - just reiterating what I have heard.

[BoulderDawg]

And like I tell anyone defending Cuba, you are free to go there and renounce your US citizenship and live under the same rules as the other Cubans do.

It is sad to hear you lost your job, I wish you luck in finding a new one. What is your field of work, if you don't mind me asking?

Dam right dude....Like Bad said, If you don't like the fact you lost your job then F you....move to Cuba!

After all we all know that Bad is correct. Only the lazy no-good do not have jobs. It's time we sent to whole lot to Cuba...see how they like it...Right Bad?

[Reverend Tap]

Dam right dude....Like Bad said, If you don't like the fact you lost your job then F you....move to Cuba!

After all we all know that Bad is correct. Only the lazy no-good do not have jobs. It's time we sent to whole lot to Cuba...see how they like it...Right Bad?

Um...did you actually read his post?

[David43515]

Dam right dude....Like Bad said, If you don't like the fact you lost your job then F you....move to Cuba!

After all we all know that Bad is correct. Only the lazy no-good do not have jobs. It's time we sent to whole lot to Cuba...see how they like it...Right Bad?

Typical. If you can`t refute what someone actually says with logic and facts, it always pays to misquote them.

[BoulderDawg]

Typical. If you can`t refute what someone actually says with logic and facts, it always pays to misquote them.

To start with, Where did I misquote Bad? That quote word for word what he said.

Also, Uki was telling about his personal life....I didn't hear anything in there about comparing himself with someone in Cuba. I'm sure Uki has enough troubles without giving an S what the average Cuban makes or what Bad is telling him to do.

I'm sure you Neos could care less though. Any time someone complains about conservative ideology it's always "If you don't like it leave". Guess what guys this country belongs to everyone.:D

[uki]

You live on $180 AFTER child support and bills.after child support only... they deduct 55% or which ever is lesser... my UC is 180 a week, i get 90 dollars every two weeks to pay for bills.


The average Cuban makes ~$260/month in wages. Do you have government imposed milk and food rations?my girlfriend collects food stamps, thank goodness.


There is a huge difference.not really... cost of living is cheaper in cuba and they recieve free healthcare. i cannot afford a monthly premium for insurance... it's like 60 bucks just to get a doctors visit.


And like I tell anyone defending Cuba, you are free to go there and renounce your US citizenship and live under the same rules as the other Cubans do.i wish i could renounce my citizen to any country and simply become a simple inhabitant of earth.


It is sad to hear you lost your job, I wish you luck in finding a new one.i didn't actually lose it per se, every winter i get laid off due to the weather and tempatures... i usually start back up in march.


What is your field of work, if you don't mind me asking?i am a mason... block, concrete, stucco stone, natural stone, flagstone, dry stack, brick, and just about everything else done with cement or concrete besides poured walls. i am the not quite the lowest guy on the totem pole and my boss gives me side jobs such as patios to do when he's too busy... i have a 1000ft patio in waiting to be done for a fellow once it warms up... at my own house i have 14 yards of concrete poured, over 1000 square feet of patio, 1/3 of it is flagged wet with 2 inch stone, it has a stone table that took 7 people to lift and set(it weighs near the half ton range)

i like my work, it keeps me in shape. :D

[David Jamieson]

Canada has highly regulated banks that are controlled in their functions by federal law. In essence they are more or less nationalized institutions. The Bank of Canada itself was nationalized in 1938.

it is worthy of note that in this huge economic crisis the world over Canada is the only developed country that hasn't had a bank failure and hasn't propped up any of it';s banks with tax dollars.

Some of you might want to rethink your reaganomics on regulating your banks.

It is because of the removal of regulation, by Reagan btw, that the entire free market capitalist system was eroded. It has to be regulated in order to offset the tendency for greed and corruption.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Canada has highly regulated banks that are controlled in their functions by federal law. In essence they are more or less nationalized institutions.

it is worthy of note that in this huge economic crisis the world over Canada is the only developed country that hasn't had a bank failure and hasn't propped up any of it';s banks with tax dollars.

Some of you might want to rethink your reaganomics on regulating your banks.

It is because of the removal of regulation, by Reagan btw, that the entire free market capitalist system was eroded. It has to be regulated in order to offset the tendency for greed and corruption.

Our chartered banks have regualtions they must follow in regards to % of investments in volitile markets, such as real estate.

[sanjuro_ronin]

I'm 37.

Right is right, and wrong is wrong. I've asked repeatedly for someone to show JUST ONE example of government social spending ending a recession or depression. No one has. Yet I've shown where Reagan and JFK (A Democrat) both ended recessions with massive tax cuts.

You want a current country? Ok. Cuba has nationalized banks. You want that here? You want the average American to live on like $260/month like the average Cuban does?

And it was not capitalism that failed here. It was government intervention. Government, through the CRA, FORCED banks to make bad loans. Then government backed the bad loans! The housing mess is the root of the mess we are in now.

And Stalin was only an ally because of a common enemy. He needed us and we needed him. Look at what happened to Eastern Europe after WWII. It was Stalin who took over those countries and looted them, it was the West who condemned him and formed NATO to stop the FORCIBLE expansion of the Soviet Bloc.

First, stop talking about what you THINK happens in other countries you have never been to.
That said, you are correct, no country has ever spent their way out of a recession by govermental means.
One of the reasons I was ****ed at Obama's speachw as because he did the stupid " its gonna bet worse before it gest better" crap.
ERROR.
The only thing that stops a recession is consumer confidence and spending, period.
Scare the consumer, take it in the ass.
Just how it is.
They need to instill confidence in the consumer, get him back to spending and buying, even if only a little, then we will have a turnaround.
GM and Chrysler are dying because people are NOT BUYING their cars, period.
All the cuts and crap won't make a difference if people don't BUY their cars.

[David Jamieson]

Our chartered banks have regualtions they must follow in regards to % of investments in volitile markets, such as real estate.

yes they do, and they are highly regulated in almost all areas of their functions.

the losses people saw in their rsps and such are strictly coming from other markets.
an rsp for you mercan folks is like a 401k.

on average, the loss to investments was about 20% for most people and the rest is good to go, insured or protected through regulations.

gotta love canada! woot!
Canadian Banks ftw! lol

[1bad65]

First, stop talking about what you THINK happens in other countries you have never been to.

Are you denying the average Cuban makes ~$260/month? Are you denying they have forced rationing of food?


That said, you are correct, no country has ever spent their way out of a recession by govermental means.

Thank you. The sad thing is that our current President is ignorant of this fact.


One of the reasons I was ****ed at Obama's speachw as because he did the stupid " its gonna bet worse before it gest better" crap.
ERROR.
The only thing that stops a recession is consumer confidence and spending, period.
Scare the consumer, take it in the ass.
Just how it is.
They need to instill confidence in the consumer, get him back to spending and buying, even if only a little, then we will have a turnaround.

Proving my assertion that we elected a guy who is flat-out not capable or competant enough to do the job. Remember, I've said I think Obama may make Carter look like an economic genius. And at the rate we are going, the deficit in 4 years will be a record high, yes even higher than under George W Bush.


GM and Chrysler are dying because people are NOT BUYING their cars, period.
All the cuts and crap won't make a difference if people don't BUY their cars.

You completely left out their enormous labor (read UAW) costs. Remember, the Chevy Silverado truck is the #2 selling vehicle in America, and the Chevy Malibu was the best-selling passenger car in America in 2008.

[David Jamieson]

Are you denying the average Cuban makes ~$260/month? Are you denying they have forced rationing of food?



Thank you. The sad thing is that our current President is ignorant of this fact.



Proving my assertion that we elected a guy who is flat-out not capable or competant enough to do the job. Remember, I've said I think Obama may make Carter look like an economic genius. And at the rate we are going, the deficit in 4 years will be a record high, yes even higher than under George W Bush.



You completely left out their enormous labor (read UAW) costs. Remember, the Chevy Silverado truck is the #2 selling vehicle in America, and the Chevy Malibu was the best-selling passenger car in America in 2008.

1) Dude, go to Cuba, you'll be surprised.

2) Obama got handed a crap sandwich. There's no harm and no foul in him saying that you are all in a crap sandwich situation. You are. No point in getting mad at the president about it. it's proven nothing about your assertions at all. You are a right wing neo con ditto head for the most part as far as your political rants and leanings go. Given that, it is understandable as to why you hate democrats and it is likely you aren't to happy with a black man in the white house either.

3) labor accounts for about 7% of production costs in all the big 3 suto makers. whining about the unions is typical right wing crap.

[sanjuro_ronin]

You completely left out their enormous labor (read UAW) costs. Remember, the Chevy Silverado truck is the #2 selling vehicle in America, and the Chevy Malibu was the best-selling passenger car in America in 2008.

The labour costs ( which are and always been WAY TOO high) weren't an issue when they were selling cars.

[sanjuro_ronin]

1) Dude, go to Cuba, you'll be surprised.

2) Obama got handed a crap sandwich. There's no harm and no foul in him saying that you are all in a crap sandwich situation. You are. No point in getting mad at the president about it. it's proven nothing about your assertions at all. You are a right wing neo con ditto head for the most part as far as your political rants and leanings go. Given that, it is understandable as to why you hate democrats and it is likely you aren't to happy with a black man in the white house either.

3) labor accounts for about 7% of production costs in all the big 3 suto makers. whining about the unions is typical right wing crap.

Actually David, the labour costs are what make the US automakers far less competitive than the others, that and just lousy customer service.
But the labour costs are a vital issue, the majority are unskilled labour getting paid as HIGH skilled labour.
I think that it runs about 60 some odd bucks per hour for the average line worker, benefits and all.

[David Jamieson]

It's actually about 75, but that cost rolls in all retired employees, their benefits and the offshoot benefits to their families etc etc. And it is still about 7% of the total production cost.

The real issue is that the big three aren't selling cars.

they are leasing them, but then, they are getting all these old cars back and no one is buying them.

This is where they failed. By this kind of obfuscation they can hold off their investors in the short term, but ultimately they have shot themselves in the head.

wasteful, decadent, and hubris are 3 words that spring to mind when thinking about the American auto industry. these guys lose 1000 plus dollars on every car they make while the Japanese automakers profit about 1000 on every car they make.

anyway you spin it, the Americans are doing it wrong and that much is obvious from the failed sales, the failing plants, the failure of management to get it under control and the failure of the executive to do anything but line their own pockets.

what kills me is that they have the freaking audacity to go begging for money.
that is crap!!

get your business model in order and make your business work or accpet it's failure. plain and simple.

[SimonM]

Nationalize the car companies!

[1bad65]

1) Dude, go to Cuba, you'll be surprised.

I don't support totalitarian regimes by spending money in their countries.

Again, was ANYTHING I said about Cuba incorrect?


There's no harm and no foul in him saying that you are all in a crap sandwich situation.

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but he campaigned on "Hope" and "Change" and not "it's going to get worse", right?


You are a right wing neo con ditto head for the most part as far as your political rants and leanings go. Given that, it is understandable as to why you hate democrats and it is likely you aren't to happy with a black man in the white house either.

Wow, the tried-and-true insults, including the racists charge. :rolleyes:


labor accounts for about 7% of production costs in all the big 3 suto makers. whining about the unions is typical right wing crap.

Actually, people like me who know how it works saw this coming years ago. See, the automakers played a 'solve it now and dont worry about the future' strategy. When the unions demanded more, management gave them money on the back end. They gave the workers benefits like 'job banks', huge pensions, generous healthcare packages, etc rather than large per hour raises. So every year, as more workers retired, their labor costs actually go up! And the money goes to workers who are no longer producing. It was a system doomed to fail, but the unions held all the cards. Now it's the unions who have to budge, because if they don't the automakers either go under or go to Chapter 11. Either one will result in the unions losing big. So, instead of admitting how they screwed it up, the unions now want THE TAXPAYERS to get stuck paying them if the companies they bankrupted cannot.

FYI, this 'solve it now and dont worry about the future' is EXACTLY how Social Security is designed. You think whats happening now is bad, you just wait til SS goes under. And since they ARE the government, who in the world is going to bail them out? :eek:

[1bad65]

what kills me is that they have the freaking audacity to go begging for money.
that is crap!!

And they will get it.

You know why? Because the candidates THE UNIONS backed are in power. So the automakers will get the money, because if they don't its the unions who lose big.

FYI, Ford is in alot better shape than GM and Chrysler.

[SimonM]

I wonder if 1bad remembers that I have him on ignore, he was sure hot to reply after my post. ;)

[BoulderDawg]

FYI, this 'solve it now and dont worry about the future' is EXACTLY how Social Security is designed. You think whats happening now is bad, you just wait til SS goes under. And since they ARE the government, who in the world is going to bail them out? :eek:

Once again, taking a good Econ class is in order if you are doing to dicuss things like this. Do you think that the government has this great big checkbook and (like us) can overdrawn, bounce checks and go bankrupt? The economic strenght of the US is based on many things including natural resources, technology and intellectual property. You will notice that the government is in trouble when people stop investing in bonds.....that's not gonna happen anytime soon.

Social Security? This country, as we know it, would cease to exist way before we got to the point of not being able to pay for Social Security.

[BoulderDawg]

Actually, people like me who know how it works saw this coming years ago. See, the automakers played a 'solve it now and dont worry about the future' strategy. When the unions demanded more, management gave them money on the back end. They gave the workers benefits like 'job banks', huge pensions, generous healthcare packages, etc rather than large per hour raises. So every year, as more workers retired, their labor costs actually go up! And the money goes to workers who are no longer producing. It was a system doomed to fail, but the unions held all the cards. Now it's the unions who have to budge, because if they don't the automakers either go under or go to Chapter 11. Either one will result in the unions losing big. So, instead of admitting how they screwed it up, the unions now want THE TAXPAYERS to get stuck paying them if the companies they bankrupted cannot.


People like you who know how it works.......:D

You mean people like you who listen to Limbaugh and visit Neo blogs.

The way you describe the union is F'ing hilarious! Do you not know that the major auto producers are all public companies. When the union contract comes up for renewal it is negotiated. Every finanacial aspect is taken into account and the final projections are made that allows both sides to benefit. That said the success or failure of the business is 100% on the management. If they can't meet the projections they have made then how can the union be blamed. Personally if I held Ford/GM/Chrysler stock I would be looking for new management.

[sanjuro_ronin]

It's actually about 75, but that cost rolls in all retired employees, their benefits and the offshoot benefits to their families etc etc. And it is still about 7% of the total production cost.

The real issue is that the big three aren't selling cars.

they are leasing them, but then, they are getting all these old cars back and no one is buying them.

This is where they failed. By this kind of obfuscation they can hold off their investors in the short term, but ultimately they have shot themselves in the head.

wasteful, decadent, and hubris are 3 words that spring to mind when thinking about the American auto industry. these guys lose 1000 plus dollars on every car they make while the Japanese automakers profit about 1000 on every car they make.

anyway you spin it, the Americans are doing it wrong and that much is obvious from the failed sales, the failing plants, the failure of management to get it under control and the failure of the executive to do anything but line their own pockets.

what kills me is that they have the freaking audacity to go begging for money.
that is crap!!

get your business model in order and make your business work or accpet it's failure. plain and simple.

Actually the lease issue caused a HUGE SURPLUS of vehicles and CAUSED A BIG JUMP IN PRODUCTION, due to the increase in sales.
Bad and good go hand in hand.
And what did GM ( for example) do when they started to lose sales?
Eliminate the option to lease, which accounted for their drammatic jump in sales to begin with.
Smart move eh?
On top of that that come out and say " Our cars are worth crap when we get them back so we don't want them, we want YOU to buy these very cars that are worth crap".
Nice move, worked really well as we can see,

[1bad65]

GM has hope. For example the new Malibu's orders have already exceeded the number produced.

[1bad65]

I wonder if 1bad remembers that I have him on ignore, he was sure hot to reply after my post. ;)

Rahter than stick my head in the sand, and then make sure to brag about it, I like to refute my opponents points with things like facts and figures. Try it sometime.

[sanjuro_ronin]

GM has hope. For example the new Malibu's orders have already exceeded the number produced.

While I am tempted to say there is no way to go but up, that would not be true and I am glad that something is going their way.

[1bad65]

While I am tempted to say there is no way to go but up, that would not be true and I am glad that something is going their way.

By no means do I want the US automakers to fail. But at the same time, it's not the taxpayers responsibility to bail them out. I love American cars. I love racing cars. I love the jawing over cars, it's all in good fun. While Ford is doing alot better than GM and Chrysler (and would likely benefit from their demise), I would miss them not being in the car market anymore.

[sanjuro_ronin]

By no means do I want the US automakers to fail. But at the same time, it's not the taxpayers responsibility to bail them out. I love American cars. I love racing cars. I love the jawing over cars, it's all in good fun. While Ford is doing alot better than GM and Chrysler (and would likely benefit from their demise), I would miss them not being in the car market anymore.

Ford still lost 14 billion last year.

[1bad65]

While I am tempted to say there is no way to go but up, ...

Well there isn't too far left to fall. ;)

Even if they get another bailout (and I predict Obama will give them one), there will be a limit. Sooner or later the taxpayers who elect our Congress and President will say enough is enough if they cant fix theri own problems.

Japan repeatedly tried bailouts (I believe they had at least 8) in the 1990s. The policy failed badly, and the 1990s are referred to as the "Lost Decade" in Japan.

[sanjuro_ronin]

The automotive sector issue is lack of sales for what they are producing.
They MUST cut production AND increase sales.
Eco 101.

They must motivate buyers to buy their cars by not only making them more affordable, but better with better purchase options and better customer service.

[1bad65]

Ford still lost 14 billion last year.

I said they were doing better than GM and Chrysler. They are.

They have lost money for awhile now, but under their new CEO (Alan Mulally), they had their first profitable quarter in two years. He also sold Jaguar and Land Rover to concentrate on the Ford line of vehicles. He brought back the Ford Taurus, which was an excellent decision. And remember, Ford is not facing bankruptcy like the other 2 Amercan car makers.

[sanjuro_ronin]

I said they were doing better than GM and Chrysler. They are.

They have lost money for awhile now, but under their new CEO (Alan Mulally), they had their first profitable quarter in two years. He also sold Jaguar and Land Rover to concentrate on the Ford line of vehicles. He brought back the Ford Taurus, which was an excellent decision. And remember, Ford is not facing bankruptcy like the other 2 Amercan car makers.

Normally I would say "YET", but I think Ford is more viable then the others, IF they keep their customer base happy.
We shall see.

[1bad65]

The automotive sector issue is lack of sales for what they are producing.
They MUST cut production AND increase sales.
Eco 101.

Well, they have to get their production costs down too, and that includes labor. In that department the Japanese are beating the pants off them.

Again, the top 2 selling vehicles here are GM and Ford pick-ups. They can sell cars. The Malibu can't be produced fast enough, so it's not entirely a case of over producing and low sales.


They must motivate buyers to buy their cars by not only making them more affordable, but better with better purchase options and better customer service.

Agreed

[1bad65]

Normally I would say "YET", but I think Ford is more viable then the others, IF they keep their customer base happy.
We shall see.

It's an 'If', that's for sure. Bringing back the Taurus was smart. That car was loved by fleets and had a very loyal individual customer base. F-150 buyers tend to be quite loyal as well. Ford also got into the hybrid market quite quickly, which helped their market share in that new market.

If they put the 5.0 motor back in the Mustangs, I'll likely be buying one of those as well. ;)

[sanjuro_ronin]

I can tell you this, GM already lost one car from our fleet, we went with Nissan instead, better monthly payments.
They lost another last year, we went with Mazda.
We have two more coming due this summer, I don't think GM will get these two either.

[1bad65]

We have two more coming due this summer, I don't think GM will get these two either.

Cars or trucks?

If cars, did you guys ever buy a Taurus?

[sanjuro_ronin]

Cars or trucks?

If cars, did you guys ever buy a Taurus?

We got the Altima from Nissan and a Tribute from Mazda.
The other two are trucks, right now both are GMC Canyons.
Looks like we may go after the Frontier (Nissan) or the Tacoma ( Toyota).
Although the F-150 looks tempting, but is probably too much on the monthly payments.