grandmasters

[grifter721]

Does anyone know what it takes to be a grandmaster.
And has anyone ever heard of GRANDMASTER PHILIPMAN CHOW (Chow Chi Fung )

[Kiasyd]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Does anyone know what it takes to be a grandmaster.
[/quote]

I've heard that it takes many, many, many years of experience in the art, but I think that everyone could figure that out, right? :)

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
And has anyone ever heard of GRANDMASTER PHILIPMAN CHOW (Chow Chi Fung )
[/quote]
Nope.

-- Kiasyd

[BeiTangLang]

Grandmaster is the accomplisment of first being a master of the system (obviously), & then training one or more students to a point of mastery of the system.
--
As to Phillip Man Chow,...yes I have heard of him.
-BTL

"It's all the same; Only the names have changed........."

[EARTH DRAGON]

As BTL has stated one must teach someone to master level, but be careful their are very few true masters and even less grand masters! one can claim they are a master but by who's standards? I have a tae kwon do school across the street from me that has a picture of the owner doing a jumping side kick and calls himself master so & so,however he is american, 28 years old and has not been in business but 5 years yet claims he is a master! so beware of the man that says watch me pull a rabbit out of my hat.........

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[EARTH DRAGON]

although I have never heard of him personally,and he may be great, no grand master should be under the age of 60, for it takes that long to master and teach to master.at least.. hope this helps you

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[grifter721]

BeiTangLang , I see you have heard of him , I have also heard of your teacher. I met him when he was here. Nice guy.

I know that my sifu is a GRANDMASTER At his system I just wanted to know what it took, so all the more respect goes to him .
My Sifu is well beyond the age of 60 and he KNOWS his kung fu Extremely well.

[BeiTangLang]

Sibak,
Consider your self quite lucky to have the instructor that you have. Not many around from that generation to appreciate anymore.
My Sifu said that his visit was quite memorable & that he enjoyed it very much.
Best wishes to you,
BTL

"It's all the same; Only the names have changed........."

[8stepmantis]

"although I have never heard of him personally,and he may be great, no grand master should be under the age of 60, for it takes that long to master and teach to master.at least.. hope this helps you" what about grandmaster sun? I can tell you for sure that is is not 60 years of age.

"when one is eating, they must becareful not to bite there tongue."

[EARTH DRAGON]

Yes master sun is only 49 but if you are referring to dean as being a master of 8 step, and the 5th generation I think you should ask him yourself!

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[EARTH DRAGON]

hey 8stepmantis who are you ? i've read all your posts and all you seem to do is put down other 8 step practioners,you shout from the rooftops but hid behind your keyboard and screen name! you even went as far as not filling out your profile so no one will know who you are! what or who are you scared of?

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[rumantid]

Earth Dragon
As soon as someone questions what you say, you get on the defensive. What IS! your deal. It's like you try to police what everybody else says, if they don't agree with you there is something wrong with them. You really need to relax, and take a look at yourself in the mirror.

[EARTH DRAGON]

I only get on the defesive side becuse of the posts people write about my teacher, my freinds or my students! It was our federation who put this catagory on KFO therefore I am having to constantly defend what and who I beleive in. I dont feel like there's anything wrong with that. It is only some bad apples, but realize there is a on going battle with a handful of people who log in with ten diffrent screen names but are all the same people, so I try to keep them in check. If this offends you I am sorry but I stand up for what I beleive in and defend my self and my 60+ students who are on this board. every one has a right to their opion but maybe I'm wrong for stressing mine.....

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[rumantid]

Earth Dragon
You have every right to stress your opinion and you do it well. I respect that without a doubt. But don't forget so do others.

[8stepmantis]

I am really offended on they way you responed. I am still in the system and have for a couple of years. I was just quoting you on what you had said. I just didn't want any one elst to contridict you. I also have seen you have been posting and somethings we differ. But you can not atack every one who says anything about the system. The best way to fight against these people is to ignore them and move on. Trust me it really works. I love the system but I am not going to kick the **** out of every body that tells me that is sucks or is a cult. Have fun and use this forum for cummuntication not war. Talk to you later. ;)

[EARTH DRAGON]

8 step mantis, you still have not told me who you are! you said you've been in the system for a couple years, well i've been in the system 13 years and its still bothers me that people out there judge me or my students by what some bad apples did to tarnish the name. I thought you were one of those apples, the guys who use different screen names and leave their profile blank so they can slander and put people down and not have the balls to admitt who they are! if this is not you Then I take back what I said and I apologize deeply....... one cannot fight wars alone, and not that easy to just ignore people whom disrespect what you beleive in ... other wise why would we ever go to war?

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[8stepmantis]

I accept and do understand what you are saying. I have stop coming to this forum because of that. It just made me sick but again I should have realized that those who do hide only hit and run but never stay for the entire battle. I really don't like others to know who I am, I hope you can respect that. I just have this thing with internet connection stuff. Please understand only one person knows who I am and if you do just give me my peace of mind. Thanks. I should be testing in a couple of months. I just finished practicing my level for about 2 hours. So no hard feelings earthdragon and talk to you later. :) :D

[EARTH DRAGON]

no hard feelings either... I hope It was not me who made you sick LOL it is that reason exactly that we made up our own forum and welcome you to be a part of it........... check out the site and feel free to post whatever you want.. but please no negativity...... thanks ED

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[8stepmantis]

ED who????

[Taijimantis]

EARTHDRAGON:
Remember what your definition of a "Grandmaster" is and remember that other cultural arts... that is Taekwondo, Shorin Ryu, Shotokan, and Tang Soo Do, have different criteria for the earning of that title than traditional Chinese Martial Arts.

Age, national origin, religious affiliation, or the like do not have anything to do with these. In many cases just being a fourth dan qualify one to be a "master". This is the gig for these styles. Cant knock it just because its different than our own.

What does "being American, 28 years old, and not having been in buisness five years" have to do with it? I am afraid, my friend it is ethnocentric, or one sided comments such as this that you find it necissary to strongly defend yourself, your sifu or your school against when directed towards eight step.

I hate to say it because I do enjoy many of your posts, but perhaps it is time you tok a step back and remambered this is an online forum where a lot of sh*t gets thrown around... often just for the sake of insulting or getting a rise out of someone else. Water off of a ducks back my friend. Or you simply fuel the fire.

As a Korean stylist as well as a Chinese one, your comment about the Taekwondo practitoner could have gotten me all riled up. But I understand that many TCM artists dont understand the systems of others as Kungfu can be an all consuming passtime. Please, just remember not to be judgemental or critical of others, because as has been mentioned... you dont like it when it is done to you.

Shanti my friend.

[EARTH DRAGON]

I respect what you say and your posts, however When grifter721 asked this question on the northern praying mantis side of KFO , I automatically assumed he was reffering to the CMA. Maybe in other martial arts it is different and not as long, but according to what I have been taught the title "grand master" is when you have first mastered the style and then taught a student to master level. This takes at least fifty years, so age is a factor, race is not but how many american grand masters are there? I mean real grand master's not just a teacher who gives himself the title to inflate his ego.
And you said what does 28 years old, business for 5 years have to do with it? the guy across the street from me learned from a good freind of mine who is a 3rd degree. That student opened up a school and calls it master SO &SO's school of tae kwon do Please tell me how you consider your self a master when the guy in which he learned from does not?
And I am not being biased becuse I came from okinawan go-ju ryu karate, and some kook su young tae kwon do, But you are'nt attempthing to compare koren stlyes to chinese are you ?
And yes I know that any fool with a computer can post any thing they want but it does bother me when posts are nothing more then cries for help from a inflated subconcious post hypnotic dilemma.

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[Taijimantis]

I am not out to offend anyone, or for that matter add insult to injury. It was merely my own observation that there were bruised ego's all around.

I too assumed that what was being asked was Traditonal Chinese Martial Arts... YOU mentioned the Taekwondo stylist across the street, which is why I said what I did. I wasnt trying to sound defensive. I was simply stating a fact. Each style was and is different. Nothing better or worse, they just are what they are.

It is extremely disrespectful to down any style, because by doing so you insult the potential thousands of practitoners of that system, who may do it soley for exercise or because they love and enjoy it. Not everyone is in Martial arts to be a "Grandmaster" or a Professional Fighter. Some dont care about "internal" vs. "external" they just like the moves or "looking good". Ther s nothing wrong with that. It is a shame when someone does not do the system they represent justice, as you feel your Taekwondo neighbor does. I do not know the individual so I cannot place any opinion about his school on anything.

This was by no means me traying to compare Chinese systems with Korean. I almost read astonishment or disbelief in the tone of your post with that statement... lol. Perhaps I am wrong. I often am. But as I said before, none is the ultimate...they are what they are. Each has its place.

By the way, EARTH... How does a
"Cry for help from a inflated subconcious post hypnotic dilemma" affect you anyway? No one can make you feel anyway. You choose to react the way you do. ;)

and what does that mean anyway? lol

Shanti

[EARTH DRAGON]

You are right, I shouldnt put down any other stlye based on the judgement of my opion. It's just that I dont like black belt factories and thats what my town is filled with. I have a new student comming who's dad emailed me and told me he doesnt like his school anymore and will be bringing him by next week after his black belt test.... his son is 9 years old. that is what I down, money hungry school owners, and yes it is the school across the street. As for ego brusing we all have ego's its our natural defense system. And I feel strongly about sticking up for what I beleive in. Ever since the days of the internet I feel compelled to defend what I say and walk on egg shells so not to hurt anyones feelings but when some one talks crap about you and calls you out I come out fighting. Maybe it is not everyone's outlook on life and maybe it is a fault in my personality,but thats how I am to get respect you must first earn it and not to many people out here have it! but didnt it bother you when some one said something negitve about something that you love? I just dont like wise guys and bad people. ....wheew I feel better now

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[Taijimantis]

Im glad you feel better. ;)

In truth five years or so ago comments directed at someone or something I love would have gotten your head busted with a baseball bat. I was angry and violent. And if I couldnt take you, I knew someone who could.

But shortly after my daughters diagnosis, I found a new way of looking at and dealing with life.

Of course it bothers me when someone does something disrespectful to me or my cherished posessions, loved ones, or passtimes. But its all about how you react. If someone has a problem with me, its not my fault. I think I said it before... I cant make anyone feel anything. They are the ones reacting to whatever situation. If they react poorly, its not on my head.
I can be quietly assertive in getting satisfaction. But I have found that the rude, threatening, overbearing, and shocking behavior of my past didnt get me nearly as far as letting it roll off.

You cant help some people.
You can only help yourself.

As far as my kungfu goes, hell... If anyone wants a piece of my Sifu... its their funeral.

I guess I just see lots of headaches and high blood pressure for you if you continue to let what a few individuals say
especially online...

You do what you have to do I guess. You mentioned the reason we go to war... I am more along the George Carlin School of Philosophy here.

We go to war because "Those guys over there have bigger dicks than we do."

And we cant have that now can we?

machismo is the most useless thing in the world.

ami tou fou

[EARTH DRAGON]

I think what burns me up the most is the guy that screams your lucky man as he drives off in his car! I get the same feeling from some people on this site, people who have big mouths becuse they can hide behind their keyboard, that is not what I call fair. It's those kinda people in the world the we need less of. Whats funny Is I have been a bouncer for 11 years at various bars some tough some easy but I am the nicest guy when it comes to kicking you out or breaking up a fight. I have never gotten angry, hit anyone nor hurt them (except for a finger or two) and I'm always smiling and being polite. But in real life I can handle situations and read people very well, but online its the jerks who insult from a far who get my goat and I dont know why, other than like I said the guys with the biggest mouths can be heard when their across the street. you know the type dont you. "tough guys"

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[Taijimantis]

Yeah, I hear ya...
Whats really funny is that these guys are the ones who need to be ignored the most...

ha ha haaaa!

Oh well.

We all have things to work on :)
Or else we would all be Buddhas ;)

[EARTH DRAGON]

you are correct my freind, I should ignore them and thier comments. I will do my best! as you say we all have things to work on ......... the more I learn the less I know....

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[pebble]

As Master Dean can not(should not)drink any alcohol..to try something does not make one a user....As for Mike,,he runs a business (his school),,as I hear a good one..to be a user is having a monkey on your back,,he would be unable to run his business....he is able therefore he is not......

[bratok304]

i heard...

-Master is someone that has a lot experience (no duh) and excelles. (e.g. Jet Li, in real life, he's an expert master)

-But a G.Master, it is totally diffrent, you can count on your fingers how many REAL G.Masters are on earth. You have to dedicate your life to martial arts, and go beyond anything u have ever imagined.

Think wisely before talking. :)

[nobody]

I was not there so I woundnt know, but i will tell you this. from what i have heard, this most advanced student of master wei was also, kicked out because he went behind wei's back and studied other arts besides mantis, which was not what wei wanted. as that may be i will not turn this into a history debate, as i have not physical evidence to back that up. I will however say, yes you are probably right, when master sun came to the states he wasnt by definition a grand master, because he had not taught anyone to mastery level. but it seems to me, since the system was passed on to him, he was in effect a grand master, just hadnt put in all the years yet ;). as for mike haley, he does happen to be MY sifu, and I and all his students would have no problem defending that he has the knowledge. obviously this can be construed as a bias opinion, i will not argue because it MAY be...however it MAY not. all i can say is that since i first started training, i have had no problems with the way he teaches or what he teaches. (he may be a little crazy but we love him for it :D ) and since you seem to know a whole lot about him, why dont you tell us a little about you.

[Tainan Mantis]

If any of you know a master or grandmaster would you please be so kind as to ask him the question I submitted under the heading "Wang Lang's staff hand"?

I believe that we may consider this technique as one of Wang Lang's most essential movements. It is listed as the 17th in his 18 families.

In 7 Star:
the 7th in 8 rigid
the 4th in 12 flexible

In Taiji Mantis:
the 8th in 8 rigid
the 11th in 12 flexible

Also in Plum Flower and Secret Door...

[8stepmantis]

I just read what you had to say. It is getting very boring because you have been saying this for the past couple of years on this forum. I truly beleive you should give it up and go on your way. Are you really harde up for attention??? Are you getting enough sex??? Because it can lead to looking at the opposit sex sometimes hey you never know......or do we??? If you nothing to add that is positive to this forum then I suggest that you start one of your own and talk all the s-h-i-t you want. Have a nice day and try to get laid it can save your life. :) Yes I am still in the system. :D

[EARTH DRAGON]

may I ask who you are? becuse I dont beleive I know you, therefore you dont know me, so please stop telling lies before someone cuts out your tongue. It quite ironic you talk bad about people you dont know, and yet you dont have the guts or the balls to even fill out own your profile! however you hid behind your keyboard and talk smack! you really need to get out of the house more often, the sun is shinng just look in the sky

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[EARTH DRAGON]

you know the more I think of you the more it burns me up that you would say such nasty things about another. Answer me this if you said you were in cali when I was then tell me who you are! funny I dont smoke, do drugs, drink alcohol or caffine lived in san fran at the school for over a year but was only in class 12 weeks? come on man cant you do better than that LOL

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[EARTH DRAGON]

You must be mistaken for I do not know who you are! I do wonder how you know people in buffalo but you claim you were in san fran with me....which is it ? I think you have your lies mixed up. So for god sakes if your going to talk **** about people get your stories straight! PS I guess if you were there then you must have been doing dean and me also right? LOL

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[nobody]

but you seem to sound like an angered student who quit. but not before you took a good long look, into those photo binders.

[8stepmantis]

for all that read this forum. Ignor 6hmantis for he uses this forum in the way it was not intended. This forum is to help those and share good info. about ones style. So whatever 6hmantis does post or responds to just ignore him. Plus a little scoop on 6hmantis...he jumps around from style to style, he has no idea what his purpose in life is, he takes it up the a-s-s, he can't fight to save his gay a-s-s, plus if he was ever in our system i dought it if he would have made it past yellow(hahahahhaha :) ) So 6hmantis go watch you kung fu movies and practice. 6hmantis is a want to be but really can't be or beat anyone or anything. Again I am asking all in this forum to ignore 6hmantis no mater and all others like him. Let's make this forum a better place to meet and share. thanks

[Taijimantis]

You ask us to ignore something but you call names and make allegations about his sexual orientation (which by the way has nothing to do with anything, making the statements you made just as ridiculous and offensive to some).
All you do is encourage more.

I am tired of this.
All of you grow up.

Its the same **** every time.
EVERY time.

Some of you claim to be Sifu... then act like it and teach the rest of these children something.

I think I am done with this forum again or a while. and all the others. Flame on all you want. I wont be here to read it.

[Nutt'nhunny]

wow. Coke heads that share wives. Can I sign up at your school

[xygie]

Master Wei most have liked Master Lin enough for him to have Master Lin write the foward in one of his books. Also, Master Lin's pictures can be seen through out Wei's books. James Sun's picture or name for that matter does not appear at all in any of the books.

In addition to 8 Step Master Lin studied Suai Jiao (throws)and the core styles of 8 Step___He learned Suai Jiao from Master Cheng, Ba Gua and Hsing-I from "Big" Wang. Master Lin has signed books from all of his teachers. I saw them.

Also, for your information, Master Wei himself trained with other Masters besides Feng. That is how he knew certain weapons and Wu style Tai Chi.

[nobody]

as i have said i did not want to debate that particular issue because i have not read all of these books, and i doubt you have also. not to meantion the only people that really know the whole truth would be master sun, and this other person you speak of (no disrespect intended, just dont know his name). but would you be willing to ask these questions to master sun?...i doubt it.

[nobody]

that it is quite rude to be spreading rumors about someone. and even if they are true...which i doubt, that would be private and shouldnt be said anyway.

[yingching]

These discussions do not belong in this board room. Apparently they need someone else to be a moderator. This garbage should have ended a long time ago.
Maybe someday they will figure out how to keep the TROLLS out. Until then, I'm out of here...

[EARTH DRAGON]

we have all agreed to ignore people that have nothing better to do than to attempt to insult users of this forum! this is a place for martial artists, and has no room for such ignorance. certain people on this board are being looked into by steeve creel the board designer, and has been contacted to trace their login defualt/cookies leads to assure that they will not be allowed to post further garbage on this site. So please just ignore negitive posts and do not let it ruin your outlook or perspective on this site.

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[EARTH DRAGON]

well well well, we found out who you were! lawyer working at a bank huh? you are a part time chiropracter that has a office in hamburg, you were never in san fransisco and were kicked out of the federation for being the kind of person you are! you are a sick sick person spreading rumors about me or my wife! the only reason you know i'm married is becuse I thought we were freinds and her neck bothered her and I was stupid enough to bring her to you to give her an adjustment. And now you include her in your sick twisted posts. You are very stupid to think that I could not find out who you were, just read your posts, you incriminate yourself. as for your marriage how about I call your wife and her your posts and what you said about my wife you sick F**k no wonder you were kicked out of our federation! now all you have is a measly old video of master wei to watch while you sit on your couch and try to figure out what stlye of kung fu you do! Dont bother to respond to this post remember I know where you live! and I have two very close freinds of the family that are hamburg cops and they have alredy been contacted on your threats! LOVE YA TOO YOU SICK F**K

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[Nutt'nhunny]

Ego master Earth Dragon and his enemies were once drugbuddies that shared wives. The plot thickens.

[EARTH DRAGON]

you know george having 2 accounts on this board is really tricky you fooled so many people your so clever why dont you put your mind to good use and figure out what your gonna call your style of kung fu? your website has no style? whats wrong did you get kicked out of our federation?

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[EARTH DRAGON]

lets see I went back and read all of your posts, so lets see who lies shall we?
1.you train under kevin loftus in south dakota
but never lived there
2.you lived in San fransisco when I lived at the
school but yet I never saw you?
3.you train iron palm under john newberry in
wellsville your so called buddy who you said is
a fake
4.you live in buffalo and practice law at a HSBC
bank funny no law classes in a bank is there?
5.you work out at worlds gym where you have a
school in the upstairs cause you couldnt afford
to keep your open, Ive been there remember
6. you are a chiropractor in hamburg NY with his own office, Ive been there two remember

wow you really get around! how is it that you can live in oppostie parts of the US at the same time have three teachers of kungfu and work 3 jobs in differnt cities all at once? wow you are my hero when do you have time to get on line a **** so many people off with your rude lie's maybe its in your sleep! please get out of this one ok Im dying to hear your excuses make um a good one

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[EARTH DRAGON]

if you so postitve your not george and you can talk so much crap why are you so afraid to tell me who you really are? who are you then? you keep avoiding to tell me! are you that much of a ***** that you type crap but are afraid to talk it to my face? Ive been waiting for a month for you to admitt who you are but you dont have the balls!!! you didnt even fiil out your profile for fear that I will find out who you are! TELL ME then we can handle this the right way! then you can say all you want to my face!!!!! ******

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[EARTH DRAGON]

hey george just got off the phone with sifu dean remember him? I told him about the posts where you disrespected him, He couldnt beleive you have stooped to such a level as to talk crap about him too! you claim to be a student of master sun but when you got kicked out of the federation you claim not to be associated with him. tell me when did you ever learn from master sun? you are deans student and yet you never claim him to be your teacher! the only mantis you know came from him and your 1 or 2 vists to NYC where you go and watch classes and buy old video tapes of master wei to put on your website! you dont even have a style of mantis let me guess you think you know 8step until you get kicked out then you watch a class in NY and pretend to know that too! you are a pathetic man and your life has been dictated and contorted by your alcholic father! by the way I guess all that abuse as a child did have long term effects!!!!!!!!

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[EARTH DRAGON]

george xygie,6hmantis, you are all the same person you have more than 1 account they found that out by tracing your cookie/leads and ISP address so stop with the crap about I'm not who I claim to be! I've had admin and mods from every board checking out your little game and your rude and threatening posts. The next step after we contact your ISP and file a complaint is pressing charges through the FCC who have also been contacted due to artical 1053.2 of the federal communications act! maybe you've never heard of it but you broken a federal law so keep it up! just that much easier to prove!

http://www.kungfuUSA.net