things you struggle with

[LSWCTN1]

wanted to start a thread that dealt with situations people struggle with, i know some people wont want to comment on this but it would be interesting to know what wck people are having difficulty with, and have other wck people do to deal with those problems....

I'll go first. i find a good uppercut almost always manages to catch me. not necessarily at full power, but i do struggle with them. i think the answer is in the timing of my advancement rather than the actual defensive movement, but i want to hear what people think?

fire away...

[Vajramusti]

IF you have internalized wing chun motions properly, with either a chum kiu step or a small turn,
a jam sao should stop an uppercut. There are many other options. There could be timing related issues.

joy chaudhuri

[Phil Redmond]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YsawCZ-MaA

[Phil Redmond]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4dzwaBeKxs

[LSWCTN1]

IF you have internalized wing chun motions properly, with either a chum kiu step or a small turn,
a jam sao should stop an uppercut. There are many other options. There could be timing related issues.

joy chaudhuri

Thank you for the advice - that is one of the ways we are taught, and one of the ways that Phil shows in his first? video. perhaps i didnt explain myself too clearly, i actually meant when we both meet in 'chi sau' range/boxers clinch range. as this is often how i have experienced fights start.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YsawCZ-MaA


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4dzwaBeKxs

i see the ideas as they are similar to how we are taught, but i am talking more specifically about 'chi sau' range or boxers clinch range. however we are taught that when the hand is free (ie no attachment) we go forward (ie strike). therefore when they draw back to strike we should be hitting in theory. the turning that you do in the videos is fine for that distance but how would you deal with the void (as he draws back) at that closer distance

the reason i ask is because our school shares with a boxing gym (and a womens fitness centre for that matter, although they dont give us to much bother...) and they often come and practise a little too.

one method i have found works a little is gaan sau. not been taught it for that use, just worked it out through practise. it clears the whole line in theory, but in practice it just takes some of the sting out of an uppercut.

however ive fallen out with gaan sau recently, but thats a whole other story :D

ALSO

what have others found difficult, either now, or in the past and now overcome it? and how was it overcome?

[monji112000]

wanted to start a thread that dealt with situations people struggle with, i know some people wont want to comment on this but it would be interesting to know what wck people are having difficulty with, and have other wck people do to deal with those problems....

I'll go first. i find a good uppercut almost always manages to catch me. not necessarily at full power, but i do struggle with them. i think the answer is in the timing of my advancement rather than the actual defensive movement, but i want to hear what people think?

fire away...

most people will not start a attack with a upper cut unless they are already very close to you. So it may be a question of dealing with earlier attacks and distance. Are you talking about body uppercuts? or head shots? I wouldn't suggest using a jum sao.. but hey in theory it should work. You have to realistic about how far he is going to be from you.. if he is throwing it from a very far distance.. you may just ignore it all together and do something else.

The two answers I use are a gun sao and a tan sao (not for head shots) and a driving tight elbow.. it uses the elbow from the fook sao.. ie driving forward. Some people call it a shield. Footwork is just as important or most important. if you just stand there and let them hit you.. vrs driving forward. ect..

[LSWCTN1]

most people will not start a attack with a upper cut unless they are already very close to you. So it may be a question of dealing with earlier attacks and distance. Are you talking about body uppercuts? or head shots? I wouldn't suggest using a jum sao.. but hey in theory it should work. You have to realistic about how far he is going to be from you.. if he is throwing it from a very far distance.. you may just ignore it all together and do something else.

The two answers I use are a gun sao and a tan sao (not for head shots) and a driving tight elbow.. it uses the elbow from the fook sao.. ie driving forward. Some people call it a shield. Footwork is just as important or most important. if you just stand there and let them hit you.. vrs driving forward. ect..

in my experience attacks often start right next to each other, especially when there is drink involved - which has got to be 90% of the time.

imho, you cant jum at that distance (at least not unless your timing is perfect)

i guess being in that range can be avoided, but sometimes not ;)

seriously though, i like the fook elbow idea, i'll give it a whirl. against a proper boxer it will work. against a streetfighter :confused: conversely, gaan seems to work against streetfighters better than boxers... go figure...

[Vajramusti]

Originally Posted by Vajramusti View Post
IF you have internalized wing chun motions properly, with either a chum kiu step or a small turn,
a jam sao should stop an uppercut. There are many other options. There could be timing related issues.

joy chaudhuri
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thank you for the advice - that is one of the ways we are taught, and one of the ways that Phil shows in his first? video. perhaps i didnt explain myself too clearly, i actually meant when we both meet in 'chi sau' range/boxers clinch range. as this is often how i have experienced fights start.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Different universes apparently. Adaptation.
If you are not stiff- you can use the jam sao at the range you are talking about.
Jam is a concept not a mechanical technique.

joy chaudhuri

[HumbleWCGuy]

Here is a slightly different application of a JS.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fyz0_GKmoMw&feature=PlayList&p=DB7CECFE229770E1&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=16

In my school we tend to see the uppercut block as a lan sao technique because of the shorter travel.

[Vajramusti]

Here is a slightly different application of a JS.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fyz0_GKmoMw&feature=PlayList&p=DB7CECFE229770E1&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=16

In my school we tend to see the uppercut block as a lan sao technique because of the shorter travel.
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A lan sao could work but the great danger is an issue of angles of the forces involved. A good uppercut can touch and slip/slide through a lan sao.

joy chaudhuri

[Sihing73]

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A lan sao could work but the great danger is an issue of angles of the forces involved. A good uppercut can touch and slip/slide through a lan sao.

joy chaudhuri

Hello,

I believe that Joy is correct. A Lan, imho, is an obstruction and really does not give energy to the opponent, other than perhaps when struck to the side, like an elbow. I believe that a Jum would be the more appropriate response. The Lan would protrude too far in front of the body to effectively deal with an uppercut, imo. As Joy has pointed out, an uppercut could slip through and still strike you. In order to make the Lan effective against a true short range uppercut, the arm would need to be pulled closer to the body and in doing so would sacrifice structure and become less effective.

Just an opinion, not saying it can't work but then again you could bring down a man-eating tiger with a .22 but it would not be my weapon of choice. :)

[HumbleWCGuy]

Watch the video that I posted to see the correct execution. The kid executing has a low execution level but pay attention to what the instructor is saying. The jum is a long range technique or requires footwork to use against the uppercut. Also, the Jum reaches. By the time that you recognize a masterful uppercut, and reach for the block, you are hit. And you will be left open for additional shots if you reach for the jum and don't get the jum just right or get the angle. Give it a try and see.

[Vajramusti]

Hi Humble wc guy- you have a right to your opinion.
With good practice a jum motion can be applied in different ranges- even very very close-and can cut an uppercut away from the line.
A good uppercut has a unique forward and upward angle - a lan could actually add power to the
slipped in upper cut. Suggest great care.

Ofcourse a well timed straight punch can beat an uppercut.

I try not to see utube much because you can import malware from some videos...so some techies tell me.


joy chaudhuri.

[HumbleWCGuy]

A good uppercut has a unique forward and upward angle - a lan could actually add power to the
slipped in upper cut.

joy chaudhuri.
That makes no sense. I have been practicing kickboxing and Wing Chun concurrently for 22 years. Maybe your lineage uses the lan differently than mine. Watch the video!

Edit: I am not really sure why you are commenting without watching the videos. Oh well, believe whatever you want.


All this other is great if you can get out of the way. However, in a close-quarters situation or against a boxer who can cut people off to force exchanges, you will be in a lot of trouble without the block that I recommend. The outside is not always an option which is what the original poster is starting to find out.

[Ultimatewingchun]

"...the turning that you do in the videos is fine for that distance but how would you deal with the void (as he draws back) at that closer distance." (LSWCTN1)
..............................

***GOOD analysis, and good question. AT THE CLOSER DISTANCE I think the boxing uppercut defense vid that Humble posted is a good place to start, although without gloves I wouldn't be too keen on blocking with an open hand, as fingers could get broken on the blocking hand. So I'd go with more of a closed fist block but trying to mainly utilize the forearm/elbow area as the main blocking surface, and of course, a slip of the head if possible.

If you want to put it "almost" into wing chun terms, kinda like a kan sao (splitting arm) block (with one arm instead of two) - but not as extended as it is normally done in wing chun, ie.- it looks more like a boxing block in the final analysis.

[Katsu Jin Ken]

Lan is a great space maker, holder and as a shuck/hacking weapon. Bong is great at close range we use it the way Mr. Alan Orr does (we are an mma school) as a "feeler" much like professional boxers do, to give a sense of timing an rhythm. I am not affiliated with Alan Orr but he has a some great DVD's some vids on youtube as well, expecially the old school boxing vid. Don't have time to search for the links but i have them in mp4 if anyone wants. If your getting uppercuted coming in, you need to take an step outside then come in at a 45% angle or so that should take care of the uppercut threat and force your opponent to either step back to the side or turn and face you either way they are in a place i wouldnt want to be, you can easily pin the outside arm and throw a clean one over the top and then you can lan or whatever, personally ima follow them and look for a throw/sweep.

hope that makes sense.

[HumbleWCGuy]

Allen Orr: Lan sao



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPxklnLPeRM

[HumbleWCGuy]

I would have to go with Lan sao, but I can see where someone could think of the boxing uppercut block as a bong sao or kan sao or sorts. When we use side body, the same technique comes out more like a bong sao.


Edit: Lets not quibble over terminology when the block of interest is there to be seen. Moreover, terms like splitting block, wing arm, barred arm, are open to some interpretation.



Here is another application of the lan sao. Foreman uses it as a catch-all block to the head. He overuses it and Hollyfield game-planned for it which may have cost him the fight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_d7dXVBJpM&feature=PlayList&p=C31718D52B917841&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=8

[couch]

For close range uppercuts, I often use a Bong/moreoften a Dai (Low) Bong.

[k gledhill]

The move and strike , angling as you do to the line of force [aka uppercut from either side]...
the chi-sao step & angling / seung ma is for developing thoughtless angling ,relative to the earm strike from the opponent ...not to stand front and center blocking ...but striking constantly with angling to the movement of the attempts to re-face us....
the ability to keep elbows on your defensive line as you strike is designed to intercept and intersect incoming lines of force ...simultaneously...economy of motion...as we are ATTACKING not standing front and center blocking like the chi-sao starting point DRILL.
Chi-sao square on facing with a partner is a starting point to learn to MOVE AWAY FROM as each delivers random strikes from EITHER SIDE so we can become adept at shifting and striking with a defensive line at the same time....this allows us to pressure the opponent with our 2 FREE STRIKING hands , rather than one blocking a gate while standing in one spot turning to face a gate , rather than the guy your attacking from the flanks.

we try to turn the opponent from facing us with his 2 hands like the chi-sao drill. A common misunderstanding , leading to gate facing with errant arms flying off the centerline to chase them....

by also not allowing them to face us by movement relative to theirs ..this can be by angling to entering ,stepping strikes they make [our role playing stepping entry strikes in chi-sao]....rendering their opposite arm off target[as in chi-sao by angling to and striking across bridges we develop 2action strikes adopting the forearms as a hand as the same fist strikes]...to achieve the seamless ability to thread our own line with alternating strikes that cover our own centers in rotation we need elbows in strikes along the centerline ..with motion. SLT + CK

tan sao is a training baby step for a more advanced dual strike in conjunction with jum sao thew inward elbow line ...each are strikes in 1 beat....redundancy is a 2 beat block n strike or worse hands leaving the line....

lan sao is used to trap or prevent refacing once the opponent is turned from us.
lop sao is to grab and aggressively turn the opponent from facing us as a hanging bag...


your arm positions /angles should prevent entry, no arm present and we are striking , kicking etc...not looking for a block to do.

[Vajramusti]

There are alternatives, timing and experience are the keys. But not all uppercuts are the same. From a good uppercutter they can come from either hand and anywhere from groin to head... and be a finisher.
joy chaudhuri

[Ultimatewingchun]

I like the lan sao work on Alan Orr's vid, but I would add this: it assumes a slightly longer range between the boxer throwing the uppercut and the defender using the lan sao than is often the case with boxers throwing uppercuts. And it assumes space enough to turn into the outside of the boxer's arm with the lan sao.

Without such space, the move resembling something more like a kan sao (that I referred to earlier) is what I would use. In other words, the block resembling something like a one handed kan sao has the defender's elbow/forearm area moving down and in close to the defender's body.

[monji112000]

in my experience attacks often start right next to each other, especially when there is drink involved - which has got to be 90% of the time.

imho, you cant jum at that distance (at least not unless your timing is perfect)

i guess being in that range can be avoided, but sometimes not ;)

seriously though, i like the fook elbow idea, i'll give it a whirl. against a proper boxer it will work. against a streetfighter :confused: conversely, gaan seems to work against streetfighters better than boxers... go figure...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9ffxu8--wg&feature=response_watch

get to about 2:20. I don't believe standing and taking a hit is the best idea, but sometimes the minimal technique is the most effective. using your elbow to cover and driver like Dave is doing in my opinion is the safest method for tight clinching. I would suggest driving forward and counter attacking also.. JMO (standing still and taking hits is a dumb tactic).

also watch the famous 6 gate..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZanByE4fLZw
I don't believe this a strict rules.. but its a smart one.

I say the shield method is a WC concept becouse 1) you are covering were you are opened (major WC idea) 2) you are moving to a safe position 2) it uses a driving elbow similar to a fook sao, but in this case your hand is vertical. 3) its quick and minimal which I found is best for faster passed tight fighting.

I would not suggest trying to catch the punch... bong the punch, lan the punch . The basic reason why is one often you are opening yourself up, so must cover the new opening you just made. The second being you are often covering a small area when you don't know were they will punch you. it could be a head show it could be a body shot , it could be a hook to the body.

Again I firmly believe that you must look at what you are doing with footwork too. Do you want to get away or jam in?

[Ultimatewingchun]

Although Dave Ross is not throwing an uppercut in this sequence, nonetheless what the boxer does with his right arm against the left handed punch that Ross throws at approximately 2:18 in the vid that monji just posted...is exactly the move I've been talking about against an uppercut from very close quarters.

It almost resembles a one handed kan sao (splitting arm) block that is used in wing chun, but done very close to the defenders body.

Again, watch at 2:18 of this vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9ffxu8--wg&feature=response_watch

[monji112000]

Although Dave Ross is not throwing an uppercut in this sequence, nonetheless what the boxer does with his right arm against the left handed punch that Ross throws at approximately 2:18 in the vid that monji just posted...is exactly the move I've been talking about against an uppercut from very close quarters.

It almost resembles a one handed kan sao (splitting arm) block that is used in wing chun, but done very close to the defenders body.

Again, watch at 2:18 of this vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9ffxu8--wg&feature=response_watch

I'm not putting Dave out there, and I know he didn't invent this stuff.. I just found it on youtube.

just to split hairs..
at about 2:06 Dave shows it for a uppercut to the body. No he doesn't show it for a uppercut to the head.. The difference would be that you are more likely to have it slide off using the "shield" method. This is again another WC concept, redirection. If it doesn't slide off you are probably going to block with the elbow again.

[HumbleWCGuy]

I think that you need to find a legit boxer to try these techniques out on before you pick one as your bread and butter. The problem that i see in a lot of kung fu schools is that nobody can actually box so they throw sloppy uppercuts at each other that can be blocked with a myriad of techniques. Trust me, you have the lan sao and a double forward shield. Do not do things that will cause you to hunker down or you will end up eating an uppercut or clinched and eating knees.

[Phil Redmond]

I think that you need to find a legit boxer to try these techniques out on before you pick one as your bread and butter. The problem that i see in a lot of kung fu schools is that nobody can actually box so they throw sloppy uppercuts at each other that can be blocked with a myriad of techniques. Trust me, you have the lan sao and a double forward shield. Do not do things that will cause you to hunker down or you will end up eating an uppercut or clinched and eating knees.
Fortunately for us we have a pro boxer to train with so we have an idea about what will work and what won't.

[HumbleWCGuy]

Fortunately for us we have a pro boxer to train with so we have an idea about what will work and what won't.
That's good assuming that he is candid and not so old or injured that he can't spar legitimately.

[Lee Chiang Po]

None of you make much sense to me. An uppercut is just a hook coming in from below. It is a short weapon at best. If you maintain proper distance from an opponent he can simply not hit you with it. There are several different methods, or techniques, with several different variations of each, that can be used to deflect one, but the main thing is to keep your distance from him. He can not hit you if he can not reach you, and if he is curling his arm he is not going to reach far enough to hit you. If you are just standing there trading blows with someone you need to catch a few to wake you up. Keep your distance.

[LSWCTN1]

None of you make much sense to me. An uppercut is just a hook coming in from below. It is a short weapon at best. If you maintain proper distance from an opponent he can simply not hit you with it. There are several different methods, or techniques, with several different variations of each, that can be used to deflect one, but the main thing is to keep your distance from him. He can not hit you if he can not reach you, and if he is curling his arm he is not going to reach far enough to hit you. If you are just standing there trading blows with someone you need to catch a few to wake you up. Keep your distance.

sorry to be pedantic, but i disagree with you here.

for me at least, the best (or certainly one of the better) advantage wck gives is speed. reaction speed is developed by practising constantly at very close quarters. of course we learn to close gaps. of course we learn to fight from a distance, but one of the major strengths of wck is the 'in tight' range.

therefore, imho, if you are changing the way you fight (by staying out of our 'core' range) then your opponent is dictating the fight. also, if you stay out of that range because you feel a western boxer is better than you are in that range - the range that is your bread and butter - then why should wck be regarding as a legitimate fighting art?

anyway, when i have previously asked my instructor he genuinly didnt understand why i asked. when he fights anyone (that i have seen) they are contantly off balance and uprooted. and therefore an uppercut is not an option. he didnt understand why i had asked!

however, that is a very high level of skill - and one that is difficult to attain - and i feel that there should be a 'stop gap' in between that covers this. i asked my Dad last night (my first teacher) and he said that they are all valid points made here, but if you are sinking and rising as you strike, as thats how he teaches power generation at close quarters. then you can just simply strike (as a push) when the hand is free - just before the uppercut comes - and they are then too far away to reach you. it worked pretty much every time we practised it last night so i have found the right answer for me

what about any other techniques people struggle with?

[Vajramusti]

That's one of the options I suggested earlier in the thread- a straight wing chun punch will get there earlier.The key is sensing the start of the opponent's motion. Good wing chun training helps with that "sensing".


joy chaudhuri

[LSWCTN1]

That's one of the options I suggested earlier in the thread- a straight wing chun punch will get there earlier.The key is sensing the start of the opponent's motion. Good wing chun training helps with that "sensing".


joy chaudhuri

i did read it earlier, but i didnt paraphrase you because it wasnt quite how we was practising it. what we did was to push rather than punch.

i know for some groups these have the same effect, but how i am taught is that the punch doesnt move them (unless used with pushing/chasing steps) it drops them - the push moves them

although i do agree with you. if you are confident you have knockout power in both hands that is enought to ko 90% of people then the punch is the best way forward i guess.

[monji112000]

That's one of the options I suggested earlier in the thread- a straight wing chun punch will get there earlier.The key is sensing the start of the opponent's motion. Good wing chun training helps with that "sensing".


joy chaudhuri

not really. Its a theory and not 100% correct in reality. You will always be behind the person because you are reacting.. Superman maybe could react that fast.. that's why most of the time when you punch to try and deal with a curved attack you have to cover also. Tan+da, gun+da ect..

you can assume you are super man and try to be this amazing super sensitive fighter or you can be pragmatic.. its up to you.

[Vajramusti]

not really. Its a theory and not 100% correct in reality. You will always be behind the person because you are reacting.. Superman maybe could react that fast.. that's why most of the time when you punch to try and deal with a curved attack you have to cover also. Tan+da, gun+da ect..

you can assume you are super man and try to be this amazing super sensitive fighter or you can be pragmatic.. its up to you.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You have a right to your opinion.Thanks for your response. However- wing chun is a two handed system- my other hand is
also doing something. If you are ready- you fire. Not an issue of trying to be superman- just good wing chun training.Presumably, in firing with good wing chun training you have good timing, distance, position-angle and line and structure and decisiveness. Good wing chun is pragmatic.

joy chaudhuri

[sanjuro_ronin]

The biggest issue with "stop hits" and "beating" your opponent to the punch isn't always one of reaction time.
A good stop hitter ( for lack of a better word" doesn't react to his opponent but acts BEFORE his opponent, a good stop hitter will look like he is hitting the other guy who is "just standing there".
The issue is to do that well takes LOTS of sparring and it takes LOTS of sparring with people from different MA systems because people will move differently and attack differently, they will give off different clues and hints based on their chosen MA system, at least that is the issue in the beginning.
When you are more experienced what they other person does is irrelevant because you have "the touch".
Thing is, stop hitting is the hardest thing to be good at because it revolves around the one thing that has the highest variables: timing.

[Yoshiyahu]

I seen some very interesting advice. All of it is great advice. However I need to know. When you speak of defense against an upper cut are you speaking of fighting, chi sau or sparring. Both will be very different. In an actual fight an upper cut thrown will have a different effect or different energy than in sparring.


However one must realize sometimes an strike can get through. So you will not be able to block or intercept every attack. Sometimes you will eat an attack. But I will say this the best thing to do is prepare.

I agree with the Lan sau approach. I suggest practicing Lan Sau while simulatanously striking your opponent in the face. As some say Lan Da.
I can't imagine a bong sau or gan sau intercepting an upper cut effectively. At least not against someone really trying to hit you. But I could be wrong I would have to see and feel the application.

But for me the best defense against an upper cut is Lan Da or Jum Da. Lan Da is the most accurate. Jum Da will not be as accurate in a real fight but if your skilled enough it will do damage to his upper cut. The best place for your lan sau to strike is middle of the forearm. Second best place is near the wrist. Appling the Lan Sau at inside of the elbow or bend in the arm can be problamatic. Because if the fighter is skilled enough or his arm is long enough he will still hit you.


First drill the Lan Da and Jum Da at a slow, medium and then fast speed. Then go from stationary to movement. I would suggest drilling the technique 100 to 350 times. Then move up to sparring. Medium and then hard sparring. Your opponent duty is to throw upper cuts at least 60% of the time. Your duty is defend and counter. Continous this over and over again each day. After awhile your muscle memory will increase and your reaction time and skill in defending this sorta of attack will incease.

But in reality you don't want to stand there like a knockem sockem robot. If your fighting against a skilled boxer or street fighter. You don't sit in fromt of him waiting for him to unload his attacks on you. You want to move out of his attacking range while still having him with in yours. WC does not stay with in range of their opponents attacks. They move to flanks or turn their opponents centerline. With WC you stay connected when possible and continue to stay in range. But you shouldn't be with in their attacking line. Control their centerline. Turn their attacking line away from you so you can attack their vital points accurately with out the ability of their counter. This is what staying out range truly means. Your still connected and in range to attack, but out of their range of attacks.

Take it as you will?

[CFT]

I agree with the Lan sau approach. I suggest practicing Lan Sau while simulatanously striking your opponent in the face. As some say Lan Da.
I can't imagine a bong sau or gan sau intercepting an upper cut effectively. At least not against someone really trying to hit you. But I could be wrong I would have to see and feel the application.Bong and gan intercept at different point to lan and deal with the incoming energy in a different manner (sideways). I think they both need a shift to pull it off though.

[Ultimatewingchun]

not really. Its a theory and not 100% correct in reality. You will always be behind the person because you are reacting.. Superman maybe could react that fast.. that's why most of the time when you punch to try and deal with a curved attack you have to cover also. Tan+da, gun+da ect..

you can assume you are super man and try to be this amazing super sensitive fighter or you can be pragmatic.. its up to you.

***QUITE CORRECT. To assume that you just have to beat the man to the punch if your timing is good - with a straight punch against his uppercut - is a giant assumption, and not a very realistic one. A tenth of a second off in your timing (or if his arms are longer than yours)...then you better have a Plan B ready.

In other words, whatever Plan B is should really be Plan A...because to make your absolutely flawless timing (not to mention any reach disparity) your main defense is to invite big trouble against a man with a good uppercut.

[Vajramusti]

As often happens- each to his own! Cheers.


joy chaudhuri

[Katsu Jin Ken]

In an actual fight an upper cut thrown will have a different effect or different energy than in sparring.

To me, this is wrong. If you're sparring and the uppercut has the wrong energy then whats the point of sparring. Sparring isn't fighting, its fight preparation. Correct energy is the entire point of sparring. Realistic energy at all times but not fight speed or power. Energy must be consistant and real. When sparring we go about half speed and power, if we want to go higher we do so but usually just faster im not trying to KO my classmates.

[Yoshiyahu]

Bong and gan intercept at different point to lan and deal with the incoming energy in a different manner (sideways). I think they both need a shift to pull it off though.


I can not imagine that Bong or Gan will work for and upper cut. Its like doing tan sau against a front kick. Ha Ha. Anyway. The energy of upper cut is upward. So why would you interept using a horizontal defense. Gan and Bong are use best against strikes coming from an horizotal angle like a punch to your diaphram or stomach.

I personally think that using Bong Sau especially is very very risky. But I would have to see what you mean. You would have to show me in real sparring to make me a believer.


To me, this is wrong. If you're sparring and the uppercut has the wrong energy then whats the point of sparring. Sparring isn't fighting, its fight preparation. Correct energy is the entire point of sparring. Realistic energy at all times but not fight speed or power. Energy must be consistant and real. When sparring we go about half speed and power, if we want to go higher we do so but usually just faster im not trying to KO my classmates.

Exactly your not trying to KO your opponent. In real fighting everything is different. Maybe sligtly but its different. The energy is different. Sparring is the closes you get to actual fighting. But it is still not fighting. In actual fighting your trying to hurt one another...