Sticky Hands?

[wtf]

Anyone practice "Sticky Hands" with their mantis training? Any Mantis system (8 Step, 7 Star, Wah Lum, etc) have "sticky hands" training/exercises in their curriculum? Or is this just a Tai chi and Wing Chun thing?

[dedboy]

Yes, see the earlier thread about gym sau.

[aw.axis]

Yes

I have done mantis sticking hands, wing chung chi sau and tai chi pushing hands (I have to admit to doing more mantis sticking hands) all the techniques are excellent for developing sensitivity, when to resist and when to give way. An opponent is the best way to train and develop techniques, then to spar against. a good opponent makes sure its never simple.

Good luck to you sir

[EARTH DRAGON]

we use a variety of training tecniques in our system to enhance fighting skills, chi sao, pak sao and tuai sao. It is not only used in the nun's favorite pastime......

http://www.kungfuUSA.net

[cha kuen]

STICKY HANDS is not an excercise. Sticky hands is when your hands touch. I can go touch a strangers hands and it would be " chi sao" Every style has sticky hands, chi sau.

That is just another way of saying techniques. If you mean STICKY HANDS as in freestyle applicaitons, then yes every style has that. It's up to the individual. There's a ton of ways to coutner punches. You choose the one that's the most efficient, and the one that comes free.

[tanglangman]

Yep,

Have practiced some sticky hand drills and done some freestyle sticky hands too. It's great fun!!!

[Papieboni]

"when to resist and when to give way."


Whenever you resist and you are touching hands or playing with someone that knows what they are doing you will always get hit, over and over and over again, one should never resist but collapse, flow and go with the momentum of the opponent.

" Moss Never Grows on a Rolling Stone"

[HKMantis]

Kicking Mantis,

"one should never resist but collapse"

"Collapse"? I'm not familiar with this term as it pertains to sticking hands. Can you please elaborate?

HK

[Papieboni]

maybe......... yielding!is a better word.

" Moss Never Grows on a Rolling Stone"

[HKMantis]

Ok, Thanks.

HK

[cha kuen]

I don't agree with the term collapse. My block would not be totally stiff nor would it collapse. My block will have something there, elbow energy.

In wing chun there is a famous saying, " Loy Lau Hui Song, Lut Sau Jake Chong."

"Loy Lau " meanas when he comes you receive. You should not push away .

"Hui Song" means when he goes, you escort.

"Lut sau , jake chong" When hands don't touch and are free, shoot in. Chi sao is when hands are sticking. Lut sau is when hands are not sticking. When hands are not sticking, you should keep punching inorder to get the hands sticking again.

[ExitusDeorum]

In 7 Star Mantis we do sticking hands training, but it is very basic compared to what you find in Wing Chun relying less on sensitivity and more on hand-eye. It utilises a lot of mantis-hand techniques. This training is rarely practiced though...

"Cry shamefully and let loose the turnips of war!"

[Kiasyd]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
In 7 Star Mantis we do sticking hands training, but it is very basic compared to what you find in Wing Chun relying less on sensitivity and more on hand-eye. It utilises a lot of mantis-hand techniques. This training is rarely practiced though...
[/quote]

I also train 7 star praying mantis, and i could say exactly the oposite about our sticking hands techniques... It rely alot on sensivity and we practice it all the time. :) I'm not familiarized with Wing Tsun to compare it tough.

-- Kiasyd

[KickingMantis]

Cha Kuen, maybe you should take a closer look;

MMMMMMMmmm
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
maybe......... yielding!is a better word.
" Moss Never Grows on a Rolling Stone"

posted 08-04-01 01:15 PM

"The key is to begin at the beginning;high level short cuts can only lead to dead end."
"If You can't be honest nothing can happen."

[KickingMantis]

I agree as well. Maybe your Sifu have a limited knowledge in these things or choose not to pass them on to the students yet because there are people in 7* that are involved in them designed specifically for Mantis students.

"The key is to begin at the beginning;high level short cuts can only lead to dead end."
"If You can't be honest nothing can happen."

[ExitusDeorum]

Kiasyd - you say that you practice your sensitivity in training? I don't know whether you have a different method of training or whether it is simply practiced differently as you advance - I haven't been training for long. What lineage does your 7 Star come from? Thanks for the information! :) There aren't too many 7* practitioners to talk to where I live - it's always good to hear from someone else!

"Cry shamefully and let loose the turnips of war!"

[Kiasyd]

0Hi! I'm a beginner myself too... I'm training for about six months now but my sifu put a lot of emphasis on the sticking hands aspect of almost everything that we train, even forms.

About my linneage: my sigung is Brendan Lai, and his sifu is Won Hon Fun... And yours? I've heard that are some differences in the 7 star praying mantis from hong kong linneages and from mainland, but as I said, I'm just a beginner to know about this stuff :)

-- Kiasyd

[aw.axis]

Neon

Are you one of Sifu Dereks students? If so I will probably see you on Sunday. If you ever want to practise sticking hands, blocking or any of the other two man drills you can find me there.

Cheers

Al

[ExitusDeorum]

Al? Is that Big Al? Yes, I'm one of Derek's students! Just got back from summercamp! I didn't see you there! :( I'll try to make it for sunday!

Kiasyd - I've trained for longer than you then! Nearly a year! But what's 6 months in Kung Fu? :) My Sifu is Sifu Frearson in England - his teacher is Lee Kam Wing. Therefore, you're right - there probably are variations.

Let's hope that Al can clear some things up for us both! :)

Good luck in training!

"Cry shamefully and let loose the turnips of war!"

[Kiasyd]

Yes, I know, 6 months is nothing in KF training... but I'm working on it :), you know, day by day :)

And since our lineages are different, probably the training is also distict. Maybe someone more experienced here can clear up what are the main diferences between Brendan Lai and Lee Kam Wing branches? If I'm not wrong, I think that Lee Kam Wing was a disciple of Won Hon Fun, so both Brendan Lai and Lee Kam Wing are Hong Kong branches, Am I right? Probably this makes both branches very similar.

-- Kiasyd

[ExitusDeorum]

Hmm.. Lee Kam Wing was taught by Chiu Chi Man. Obviously the styles are far more distinct than we thought. Is there anyone out there who can help us? :)

"Cry shamefully and let loose the turnips of war!"

[Kiasyd]

I found something interesting! In this site: http://www.geocities.com/mantiscave there's a awesome and extensive genealogy chart of our style (your sifu is listed there, and so does mine :) ) And there you can see that Chiu Chi Man was taught by Luo Guang Yu, and he is our common root. So your line comes as this:

Luo Guang Yu -> Chiu Chi Man -> Lee Kam Wing

and mine:

Luo Guang Yu -> Won Hon Fun -> Li Da Chung (Brendan Lai)

And both linneages came from Hong Kong. Well, I know this doesn't solve the enigma of the diferences between these lineages. I hope someone else can do this :)

-- Kiasyd

[ExitusDeorum]

Some good research there friend! Makes you feel like part of one big family, doesn't it? :)
Let's hope someone else can enlighten us more!

"Cry shamefully and let loose the turnips of war!"