Strikeforce: Evolutions

[GeneChing]

I'm thinking about calling the fights on a blog here. Would you all be interested in that? It would be more work for me because blogging a fight as it happens is challenging, but if there's enough support here, I'll give it a go. This is all assuming my press pass application is approved...


MAIN CARD (http://strikeforce.com/events/)
CUNG LE (6-0) VS SCOTT SMITH (16-6)
RONALDO "JACARE" SOUZA (10-2) VS MATT "THE LAW" LINDLAND (21-6)
"RUTHLESS" ROBBIE LAWLER (16-5) VS TBA
MUHAMMED "KING MO" LAWAL (5-0) VS TBA

TIME
SATURDAY, DECEMBER 19, 2009 - 10:00PM/ET (PRELIMS AT 8:00PM)

HOW TO WATCH
LIVE ON SHOWTIME - TICKETS

ABOUT
The stakes will be high when STRIKEFORCE closes out a spectacular 2009 with the return of one of the most prolific and exciting fighters in Mixed Martial Arts - unbeaten former STRIKEFORCE world middleweight champion Cung Le, who will face Scott "Hands of Steel" Smith in the main event of a star-studded lineup at HP Pavilion in San Jose, CA. on Saturday, Dec. 19, on SHOWTIME.

Joining Le (6-0) and Smith (16-6) will be three other outstanding and widely recognized 185-pound stalwarts, "Ruthless" Robbie Lawler (16-5), Matt "The Law" Lindland (21-6) and Ronaldo "Jacare" Souza (10-2) as well as light heavyweight star (205 pounds) Muhammed "King Mo" Lawal (5-0). Lindland will face Souza in what represents both fighters' STRIKEFORCE debuts. Opponents for Lawler and "King Mo," whose start will also be his first with STRIKEFORCE, will be announced soon.


JOSH THOMSON AND GILBERT MELENDEZ TO SQUARE OFF FOR UNDISPUTED STRIKEFORCE LIGHTWEIGHT CHAMPIONSHIP DEC. 19 (http://strikeforce.com/blog/2009/11/josh-thomson-and-gilbert-melendez-to-square-off-for-undisputed-strikeforce-lightweight-championship-dec-19/)
November 24, 2009 by strikeforce

NEW YORK (Nov. 24, 2009)—After twice being forced out of the highly-anticipated rematch due to injuries, STRIKEFORCE World Lightweight (155 pound) Champion Josh “The Punk” Thomson (16-2) is healthy and ready to defend his title against top-seeded mixed martial arts (MMA) rival and Interim Champion Gilbert “El Nino” Melendez (16-2) on Saturday, Dec. 19 at HP Pavilion in San Jose, Calif.

Thomson, who captured the lightweight championship by earning a five round, unanimous decision over Melendez in the main event at HP Pavilion on June 27, 2008, has not seen action since September 20, 2008 when it took him a mere 1 minute and 14 seconds to demolish Ashe “The Archer” Bowman during STRIKEFORCE’s second event at the Playboy Mansion in Beverly Hills, Calif.

Shortly after undergoing surgery for a broken fibula in his left ankle earlier this year, Thomson sustained a break in the bone located above the original injury. He suffered yet another setback after the bone broke a second time.

“Everything feels great now. Nothing is going to keep me out of this fight,” said the 31-year-old Thomson of San Jose. “I’m looking forward to getting back in there and going to work.”

While Thomson was sidelined, the 27-year-old Melendez of Santa Ana, California remained busy in 2009, scoring a second round (2:02) knockout on Brazil’s Rodrigo Damm at STRIKEFORCE: Shamrock vs. Diaz on April 11, 2009 and avenging the first defeat of his career by punching his way to a third round (3:56) TKO of Mitsuhiro “The Endless Fighter” Ishida at STRIKEFORCE: Carano vs. Cyborg on August 15, 2009. Both bouts took place at HP Pavilion.

His brilliant performance against Ishida, whom he had lost a unanimous decision to in Saitama, Japan on December 31, 2007, returned Melendez to the top-10 rankings in MMA’s lightweight division.

“I’ve been training for this fight for a long time now and have been thinking about it ever since Josh beat me last year,” said Melendez, a protégé of both STRIKEFORCE World Middleweight Champion Jake Shields and Muay Thai legend Jongsanan Fairtex. “I’ll be getting the best Josh Thomson out there and he’s going to get the best Gilbert Melendez so it’s going to be a great fight for the fans.”

Tickets, priced from $30, are on sale at the HP Pavilion box office as well as at all Ticketmaster locations (800-745-3000), Ticketmaster online (www.ticketmaster.com <http://www.ticketmaster.com/> ) and STRIKEFORCE’S official website (www.strikeforce.com <http://www.strikeforce.com/> ).

The live SHOWTIME® telecast will begin at 10 p.m. ET/PT (delayed on the West Coast), and conclude with a sensational, strikers’ main event featuring undefeated superstar and former STRIKEFORCE World Middleweight (185 pounds) Champion Cung Le (6-0) against power punching Scott “Hands of Steel” Smith (16-6).

Also in action will be 2000 Olympic wrestling silver medalist Matt “The Law” Lindland (21-6), who will take on fellow superstar Ronaldo “Jacare” Souza (10-2) at middleweight. Light heavyweight (205 pounds) star Muhammed “King Mo” Lawal (5-0) and middleweight knockout artist “Ruthless” Robbie Lawler (16-5) will each face opponents to be announced.

[GeneChing]

So any Bay Area locals going to this fight? I hope to see you there!

Just got this press release from Strikeforce (sorry for all the code at the end but it might be useful to some):

SUPER CHANNEL INKS DEAL WITH SHOWTIME® TO AIR STRIKEFORCE MMA LIVE ACROSS CANADA

First Telecast To Feature Undefeated Superstar CUNG LE In His Long-Awaited Return To The Cage, Saturday, Dec. 19 vs. Scott Smith
__________________________________________________ _______

EDMONTON (Dec. 2, 2009)-Super Channel, Canada's only national pay television network, is pleased to announce an exclusive agreement to offer SHOWTIME Sports® telecasts of STRIKEFORCE Mixed Martial Arts (MMA) events live to viewers across Canada, beginning Saturday, Dec.19. On that night, undefeated middleweight (185 pounds) superstar Cung Le (6-0) will take on hard-hitting Scott "Hands of Steel" Smith (16-6) in the main event of a stacked fight card at HP Pavilion in San Jose, Calif.

The live HD telecast of STRIKEFORCE: Le vs. Smith on Super Channel will begin at 10 p.m. ET and will include as many as five bouts.

"Super Channel is striving to offer Canadians programming they can't get anywhere else and we saw an excellent opportunity in bringing live MMA to viewers from coast-to-coast and knew it would be well received," said Sandy Perkins, Super Channel's Vice President Programming. "We are very pleased to add SHOWTIME Sports® and STRIKEFORCE MMA to our roster with an exclusive deal and will be rounding out our Super Channel Fights! lineup. They are a great team to have in our corner."

"Canadian fans have consistently shown a deep appreciation for MMA, so to have the opportunity to bring live STRIKEFORCE action to this market on a regular basis on an outstanding, high definition platform like Super Channel is very exciting," said STRIKEFORCE Founder and CEO Scott Coker.

Also in action on December 19 will be 2000 Olympic wrestling silver medalist Matt "The Law" Lindland (21-6), who will take on fellow superstar Ronaldo "Jacare" Souza (10-2) at middleweight. Light heavyweight (205 pounds) star Muhammed "King Mo" Lawal (5-0) and middleweight knockout artist "Ruthless" Robbie Lawler (16-5) will each face opponents to be announced.

Le recently made a successful transition to acting and has since been touted as Hollywood's next great martial arts action film star. In 2009, he played supporting roles in the science fiction thriller Pandorum, co-starring Dennis Quaid and Ben Foster, as well as the action film Fighting, which co-stars Channing Tatum and Terrence Howard. Next year, he will return to the silver screen in the motion picture adaptation of blockbuster video game franchise Tekken.

Le, who last month voluntarily relinquished the STRIKEFORCE middleweight belt he had claimed by dismantling MMA legend Frank Shamrock in 2008, has never lost a fight in his professional fighting career. He's perfect in MMA, kickboxing (22-0) and Sanshou (17-0).

About Showtime Networks Inc.
Showtime Networks Inc. (SNI), a wholly owned subsidiary of CBS Corporation, owns and operates the premium television networks SHOWTIME®, THE MOVIE CHANNEL® and FLIX®, as well as the multiplex channels SHOWTIME 2(tm), SHOWTIME® SHOWCASE, SHOWTIME EXTREME®, SHOWTIME BEYOND®, SHOWTIME NEXT®, SHOWTIME WOMEN®, SHOWTIME FAMILY ZONE® and THE MOVIE CHANNEL(tm) XTRA. SNI also offers SHOWTIME HD®, THE MOVIE CHANNEL(tm) HD, SHOWTIME ON DEMAND® and THE MOVIE CHANNEL(tm) ON DEMAND. SNI also manages Smithsonian Networks, a joint venture between SNI and the Smithsonian Institution. All SNI feeds provide enhanced sound using Dolby Digital 5.1. SNI markets and distributes sports and entertainment events for exhibition to subscribers on a pay-per-view basis through SHOWTIME PPV®.

About STRIKEFORCE
STRIKEFORCE (www.strikeforce.com <http://www.strikeforce.com/> ) is a world-class mixed martial arts cage fight promotion which, on Friday, March 10, 2006, made history with its "Shamrock vs. Gracie" event, the first sanctioned mixed martial arts fight card in California state history. The star-studded extravaganza, which pitted legendary champion Frank Shamrock against Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu black belt Cesar Gracie at San Jose's HP Pavilion, played host to a sold-out, record crowd of 18,265. Since 1995, STRIKEFORCE has been the exclusive provider of martial arts programming for ESPN and, after 12 years of success as a leading, world championship kickboxing promotion, the company unveiled its mixed martial arts series with "Shamrock vs. Gracie." In May 2008, West Coast Productions, the parent company of STRIKEFORCE, partnered with Silicon Valley Sports & Entertainment (SVS&E), an entity created in 2000 to oversee all business operation aspects of the San Jose Sharks and HP Pavilion at San Jose.

About Super Channel
Super Channel is Canada's only national pay television network, consisting of two new HD channels, four new SD channels, and Super Channel On Demand.

Super Channel's vision is to expand the Canadian premium TV experience by offering a broad range of fresh, entertaining movies, series and live events. Super Channel is owned by Allarco Entertainment 2008 Inc., an Edmonton-based media company.

Super Channel is currently available on Bell TV <http://www.bell.ca/shopping/PrsShpPromo_Tv_big_picture.page?ADV=ON_CDN_EN_bigp icture_superchannel> , Shaw Direct <http://www.starchoice.com/promotions/english/superchannel/default.asp> , Rogers PersonalTV <http://www.rogers.com/web/resources/service/selectLanguageNonFlash.jsp?targetURL=%252Fweb%252F Rogers.portal%253F_nfpb%253Dtrue%2526_pageLabel%25 3DGCT%2526template%253Dpersonal-programming%2526setLanguage%253Den%2526sub_templat e%253Dmovies%2526setLanguage%25> , Shaw Cable <http://www.shaw.ca/en-ca/ProductsServices/Television/Digital/ProgrammingPackages.htm> , Cogeco Cable <http://www.cogeco.com/en/digital_cable_tv_packages_o.html> , Access Communications <http://www.accesscomm.ca/> , Bell Aliant TV <https://mail.svse.net/Documents%20and%20Settings/jrebelo/Local%20Settings/AppData/Documents%20and%20Settings/Documents%20and%20Settings/jrebelo/Local%20Settings/Temporary%20Internet%20Files/Content.Outlook/Local%20Settings/AppData/Local/Microsoft/Windows/Temporary%20Internet%20Files/jrebelo/Local%20Settings/Temporary%20Internet%20Files/Content.Outlook/0XK9RGYP/bellaliant.net> , Mountain Cablevision <http://www.mountaincable.net/index.php?id=6,499,0,0,1,0> , Source Cable <http://www.sourcecable.ca/> , SaskTe <https://commerce.sasktel.com/eSales/start.swe?SWECmd=InvokeMethod&SWEMethod=Linkup&SWEService=SKTL+eSales+Link+Service&ViewName=Product+Detail+-+Features+View+(eSales)&BusObject=Catalog&BusComp=Internal+Product+by+Price+List+Optional&Id=1-XOAR5&SWERF=1&SM> l, MTS <http://www.mts.ca/portal/site/mts/menuitem.c5a4913ffc7f8abaa66d2523408021a0/?vgnextoid=06b4830adc19a110VgnVCM1000000408120aRCR D> , Novus <http://www.novusnow.ca/> , EastLink <http://www.eastlink.ca/cable/digitalchannels/index.asp> , Delta Cable <http://www.deltacable.com/> /Coast Cable <http://www.coastcable.com/> , TELUS <http://www2.telus.com/cgi-ebs/jsp/homepage.jsp> and other regional providers.


www.superchannel.ca <http://www.superchannel.ca/>

[GeneChing]

From a press release from Josh's agent.

STRIKEFORCE LIGHTWEIGHT CHAMPION JOSH THOMSON HOPES TO KO DOG FIGHTING

SAN JOSE, Calif. --- Mixed martial arts star and Strikeforce Lightweight Champion Josh "The Punk" Thomson knows dog fighting is no laughing matter, but he attempts to knock it out with hilarity on Tuesday Dec. 8 at the San Jose Improv.

Thomson will share his thoughts about his upcoming title defense against Strikeforce Interim Champion Gilbert Melendez on Dec. 19 with professional comedian Kris Tinkle (USO Comedy Tour veteran in Iraq, Kuwait and Japan, XM and Sirius Radio) in a live on stage conversation dubbed "Steel Cage Comedy." After the Bay Area's brightest comics entertain, Thomson will join the headliner Tinkle in a talk show style interview about his fight, which airs live on Showtime from the HP Pavilion in San Jose.

"Josh has tons of personality and so many stories. It's going to be fun to get him onstage and bust him a little bit," said Tinkle, whose debut comedy album "Almost Awesome" is now available through Amazon and iTunes. "And as of now he is letting me, so I'm glad he is a good sport and we aren't going to have an incident onstage if I make fun of him."

Thomson quipped, "Who's TInkle? You mean the caveman from the Geico commercials." The event highlights the champion's humor as well as his humanitarian efforts with non-profit organization Knockout Dog Fighting. An array of prizes will be raffled off with 100% of proceeds going to Thomson's charitable cause. "It's a great show and I'm proud to be part of something that helps stop animal abuse," said the San Jose native.

Thomson returns to action at "Strikeforce: Evolution" for the first time since stopping Ashe Bowman in September 2008 at "Strikeforce: Playboy Mansion II." He captured the title from Melendez three months prior, earning a unanimous decision after 25 minutes of action. The rematch had been scheduled twice since with Thomson withdrawing due to injury. Before tangling with "El Nino" again, he plans to showcase his personality that earned him the nickname "The Punk" while positively impacting his local community.

The world's premier mixed martial arts publication, FIGHT! Magazine, as well as Ranger Up, Projekt Label, Manumission Fightceuticals Inc. and IBN Sports are sponsoring the charitable venture.

For ticket information, call (408) 280-7475 or visit www.sanjoseimprov.com or the San Jose Improv box office. Tickets are $10 with a two-drink minimum. Attendees must be 18 and over with valid ID. Doors open at 7p.m. and show begins at 8p.m.

For more information about Knockout Dog Fighting, please visit www.knockoutdogfighting.org If you would like to donate an item or items to the raffle, please see the contact information below.
Now I'd like to see a Thompson Vicks fight. ;)

[couch]

Thanks for the links. Didn't know Superchannel was gonna help out us Canucks.

[Dragonzbane76]

Thought on fight? Don't know much about other guy he's fighting anyone got the info on him? Standup or ground guy?

have to track this down on showtime this weekend to watch.

[Lucas]

scott smith fighter bio (http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Scott-Smith-2578)

like usual i have to wait for the fight to be posted on the net somewhere, i dont watch or have TV.

But im looking forward to this one, its been a minute since Cung fought, so its going to be fun to watch him in the ring again.

im rooting for cung le of course, but im hoping for a nice exciting match, looks like smith has 3 sub wins to his name, I want to see him push that on Cung if his game is strong enough there, but hes looking like a stand up kind of fighter from his record.

[GeneChing]

Cung Le on STRIKEFORCE: EVOLUTIONS & BODYGUARDS AND ASSASSINS. (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/ezine/article.php?article=864)

See you all at the fight this Saturday!

[Frost]

Smiths mainly a stand up guy, its good match making as it gives the crowd what they want a stand up war, i doubt many fans are going along hoping to see Cung in a technical ground match :)

[Iron_Eagle_76]

Here is a good interview with Scott Smith, Cung's opponent this Saturday:

http://www.sportingnews.com/blog/The_Rumble/entry/view/47786/scott_smith_interview_ive_got_to_overwhelm_him

He talks about his preparation for the fight, good interview.

[Frost]

"I'm getting paid good money to go out there and bang and that's what I love to do. " i hope he is not suggesting that strikeforce paid him extra for agreeing to keep the fight standing....that kind of thing got another promotion in a whole heap of trouble :D

(just kidding :D )

[GeneChing]

An odd coupling of stories...


MMA fighters making big moves into movies, TV (http://www.usatoday.com/sports/mma/2009-12-16-mma-tv-movies_N.htm)
Posted 13h 50m ago
By Beau Dure, USA TODAY

The U.S. mixed martial arts calendar wraps up Saturday with two cards featuring a fighter and an organization with big media plans in 2010.

The fighter is Cung Le, who returns to fighting on a short break from Hollywood, where he expects MMA fighters to break into bigger roles next year.

BIGGER HORIZONS: WEC has smaller fighters, bigger TV deal

The organization is World Extreme Cagefighting, the corporate sibling of the Ultimate Fighting Championship that has announced an expanded TV deal and plans for a pay-per-view card in the near future.

•Several MMA fighters have movie credits, but they're often cast as fighters with little to say.

Le has a couple of those films on his résumé, but he's taking bigger roles in higher-profile films now, so much so that he relinquished his Strikeforce middleweight title.

His 2009 release Pandorum, in which he's adrift in space with Ben Foster and Dennis Quaid, has recouped less than half of its $40 million budget in worldwide gross figures from IMDB and boxofficemojo.com.

But the 2010 release of Tekken, based on the video game, gives him a chance to get in front of a larger audience. Also, UFC fighter Quinton "Rampage" Jackson is filling the Mr. T role on a big-screen version of The A-Team, and Randy Couture is in Sylvester Stallone's The Expendables.

"There's going to be more opportunities," Le says.

Saturday, Le fights Scott Smith on a card that also has a lightweight title fight between Josh Thomson and Gilbert Melendez (10 p.m. ET/PT, Showtime).

•At the same time Saturday on Versus, WEC has a card with a rare non-title main event — lightweights Donald Cerrone and Ed Ratcliff — showing its depth at the end of its busiest year.

Next year, WEC begins a multiyear extension on Versus with two UFC cards and seven WEC cards. WEC also will work on compilations and other shows.

"We've looked at doing ancillary programming similar to The Ultimate Fighter," WEC general manager Reed Harris says.

Harris and WEC vice president Peter Dropick say their deal wasn't driven by the impending deal between Comcast and NBC that would bring Versus into the NBC family of networks, though Dropick hopes that deal might help resolve an impasse between Versus and DirecTV.

Could it lead to fights on network TV?

"You never know," says UFC President Dana White.

[GeneChing]

I was going to go to media day at Cung's gym, but my kid was sick so I had to stay home.


CUNG LE & JOSH THOMSON OPEN MEDIA WORKOUT QUOTES
Wednesday, Dec. 16, 2009,

Cung Le's Universal Strength Headquarters (U.S.H.) Training Center, Milpitas, Calif.

STRIKEFORCE: Evolution - This Saturday, Dec. 19, at HP Pavilion
In San Jose, Calif., Live on SHOWTIME at 10 p.m. ET/PT

SAN JOSE, Calif. (Wednesday, Dec. 16, 2009) - Cung Le and Jose Thomson, who will be featured in this Saturday's top two fights on STRIKEFORCE: Evolution at HP Pavilion in San Jose, Calif., live on SHOWTIME® (10 p.m. ET/PT, delayed on West Coast), participated in a open media workout Wednesday at Le's Universal Strength Headquarters (U.S.H.) Training Center in Milpitas, Calif.

The undefeated Le, one of the most dynamic fighters in MMA, will enter the cage for the first time since relinquishing the STRIKEFORCE middleweight (185 pounds) title to concentrate on an acting career. Le will face Scott "Hands Of Steel'' Smith, a hard-hitting puncher and contestant on season four of Spike TV's The Ultimate Fighter reality show, in the main event.

Thomson will square off with Interim Lightweight Champion Gilbert "El Nino'' Melendez in a long-awaited rematch to determine the undisputed king of STRIKEFORCE's 155-pound division. Thomson captured the lightweight crown by taking an upset, five-round, unanimous decision over Melendez at HP Pavilion on June 27, 2008.

In other SHOWTIME televised fights, "King Mo'' Lawal will make his STRIKEFORCE debut when he meets "Iron'' Mike Whitehead in a heavyweight match, and Matt "The Law'' Lindland will battle "Jacare'' Souza at 185 pounds.

Tickets, priced from $30, are on sale at HP Pavilion box office, all Ticketmaster locations (800-745-3000), Ticketmaster online (www.ticketmaster.com <http://www.ticketmaster.com/> ) and STRIKEFORCE's official website (www.strikeforce.com <http://www.strikeforce.com/> ).

Doors open at HP Pavilion at 4 p.m. PT. The first non-televised undercard bout begins at 5.

What the fighters had to say:

CUNG LE

"It's been two years (since my last fight). I'm very excited. I'm a martial artist first so, ready or not, here I come.

"I work ground and pound and my overall game and try to be a complete martial artist. Of course, my strength is my stand up, so I try to keep the fight standing.

"I expect Scott Smith to come hard. He's an exciting fighter and so am I so you can expect a train and a jet (to collide).

(On whether or not he's looking to fight conservatively as a precaution against Smith's powerful hands)

"I'm just going to blank out my mind and, whatever is open, I'm going to take it. I can't go out there (and be too concerned) with his power. I can't respect it. I just have to go in there and fight smart, fight my game and make him worry about what I'm doing."

(On whether or not this fight could lead to another run at the STRIKEFORCE middleweight title)

"Definitely, but one fight at a time. I can't overlook Scott Smith. He's in the crosshairs right now. I've just got to take my time and enjoy this. I'm just grateful to be a part of MMA and STRIKEFORCE.

"My body's holding up well. I've had some injuries and surgeries just like any other athlete. It's part of the game. I'm just going to continue doing my best until I can't do it anymore."

JOSH THOMSON

(On his expectations for Saturday's rematch with Gilbert Melendez)

"I don't expect it to be anything like the first one. I only hope the outcome is the same."

(On Melendez being chosen as his first opponent after a 15-month hiatus from competition due to injury)

"I was actually glad it was him. No one wants to see two belts (in the same weight class) in a promotion. I didn't want to fight anybody else first. I wanted to fight him and get the whole interim thing over with and move on with my career and get back to STRIKEFORCE having one (lightweight) belt."

(On training with Javier Mendez)

"I think the one thing he does is come in with a good game plan so we have an understanding of what's going to happen."

(On whether or not he feels his round kicks and push kicks he used in the first fight with Melendez will be effective in the rematch)

"I don't think they're going to work as well. I think I need to use my speed and keep my distance."

(On how he matches up overall with Melendez)

"I think I'm faster than him and I'm longer than him. It really just comes down to whoever follows their game plan best."

About STRIKEFORCE
STRIKEFORCE (www.strikeforce.com <http://www.strikeforce.com/> ) is a world-class mixed martial arts cage fight promotion which, on Friday, March 10, 2006, made history with its "Shamrock vs. Gracie" event, the first sanctioned mixed martial arts fight card in California state history. The star-studded extravaganza, which pitted legendary champion Frank Shamrock against Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu black belt Cesar Gracie at San Jose's HP Pavilion, played host to a sold-out, record crowd of 18,265. Since 1995, STRIKEFORCE has been the exclusive provider of martial arts programming for ESPN and, after 12 years of success as a leading, world championship kickboxing promotion, the company unveiled its mixed martial arts series with "Shamrock vs. Gracie." In May 2008, West Coast Productions, the parent company of STRIKEFORCE, partnered with Silicon Valley Sports & Entertainment (SVS&E), an entity created in 2000 to oversee all business operation aspects of the San Jose Sharks and HP Pavilion at San Jose.

[GeneChing]

The weigh-ins are open to the public.


* * * * * * *FREE OPEN TO PUBLIC WEIGH-IN* * * * * * *

STRIKEFORCE MMA STARS CUNG LE, SCOTT SMITH, JOSH THOMSON, GILBERT MELENDEZ & ALL OTHER FIGHTERS TO WEIGH IN
Friday, Dec. 18 at 4:30 p.m. PT at San Jose Marriott in Downtown San Jose, Calif.

WHO:
Undefeated Former STRIKEFORCE World Middleweight Champion Cung Le

Hard-hitting striker Scott Smith

STRIKEFORCE World Lightweight Champion Josh Thomson

Interim Lightweight Champion Gilbert "El Nino" Melendez

Former NCAA wrestling champion and undefeated MMA fighter "King Mo" Lawal

Two-time All-American College Wrestler Mike Whitehead

Former Olympic wrestling silver medalist Matt "The Law" Lindland

Submission expert "Jacare" Souza

& More

WHAT: All 16 athletes will participate in the final weigh-in on Friday, Dec. 18, just one day prior to the STRIKEFORCE: Evolution mixed martial arts (MMA) fight card on Saturday, Dec. 19, at HP Pavilion in San Jose, Calif., live on SHOWTIME® (10 p.m. ET/PT, delayed on West Coast). The weigh-in is OPEN TO THE PUBLIC, free of charge.

The undefeated Le, one of the most dynamic fighters in MMA, will enter the cage for the first time since relinquishing the STRIKEFORCE middleweight (185 pounds) title to concentrate on an acting career. Le will face Scott "Hands of Steel" Smith, a hard-hitting puncher and contestant on season four of Spike TV's The Ultimate Fighter reality show, in the main event of the evening.

Thomson will square off with Interim Lightweight Champion Gilbert "El Nino" Melendez in a long-awaited rematch to determine the undisputed king of STRIKEFORCE's 155-pound division.

Thomson seized the lightweight crown by earning a five round, unanimous judges' decision over Melendez at HP Pavilion on June 27, 2008.

In other SHOWTIME televised fights, Lawal will make his STRIKEFORCE debut when he meets Whitehead, Lindland will battle Souza at middleweight, and "Ruthless" Robbie Lawler will face an opponent to be determined.

[GeneChing]

They're working hard at pumping this up at STRIKEFORCE right now... I love Lindland's comment on politics.


SIX QUESTIONS WITH MATT LINDLAND WHO FACES STRIKEFORCE NEWCOMER "JACARE'' SOUZA ON DEC. 19, 2009, SHOWTIME® CARD
__________________________________________________ _______

Tickets For STRIKEFORCE: Evolution On Sale NOW!

SAN JOSE, Calif. (Dec. 17, 2009) - Former Olympic wrestling medalist Matt "The Law" Lindland, who recently took a stab at the world of politics, answered Six Questions recently posed to him regarding his highly-anticipated return to mixed martial arts (MMA) action this Saturday during the live SHOWTIME® telecast of STRIKEFORCE: Evolution.

Lindland (21-6) will take on submission expert "Jacare" Souza (10-2) at middleweight (185 pounds) on the star-studded fight card being headlined by Cung Le vs. Scott Smith at HP Pavilion in San Jose, Calif.

Lindland, the 2000 Olympic Games silver medalist in Greco-Roman wrestling, holds wins against Pat Miletich <http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Pat-Miletich-188> , as well as former champion Carlos Newton <http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Carlos-Newton-7> and Jeremy Horn <http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Jeremy-Horn-202> . Lindland is one of only two men to submit Brazilian jiu-jitsu black belt Travis Lutter <http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Travis-Lutter-4586> .

QUESTION: How's your training been going for Dec. 19?

LINDLAND: "How's my training going? I answer those questions every day. Can't you be a little more creative than that? My training is going good and if it wasn't I'd lie to you anyway and tell you it was."

QUESTION: OK. Fair enough. We'll get right into the politics questions. In 2008 you won the primary for a seat on the Oregon House of Representatives but were defeated in the general election. What did you learn from that experience and how active are you currently in politics?

LINDLAND: "You know, I'm really not that active. I'm an activist. I'm a registered Republican and I just felt it was my civic duty to run. I felt like we did not have a qualified candidate to run. Would I run for politics again if I had to? Yeah, absolutely. I would first try and find someone more qualified than me to do it and get behind them and support them instead but if I felt there wasn't anyone qualified then I would.

QUESTION: You must have learned a lot during your run in politics?

LINDLAND: "I did learn a lot about the political process. I learned it's not about valuables and principles but how much money you can raise. Politics is dirtier then NHB (No Holds Barred) when fighting was first starting and there were no rules. Politics has fewer rules than that."

QUESTION: Who is the toughest fighter you've ever faced?

LINDLAND: "I think it just really depends on what point of my career I was in. I mean, early in my career I faced the legend Pat Miletich <http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Pat-Miletich-188> (in 2003). Then I had to face Fedor Emelianenko (in 2007) who is the best heavyweight in the world. It just depends on where you're at in your career and when you're fighting these guys. But I guess the obvious answer would have to be Fedor. Everyone knows I've fought him and he's a phenomenal fighter."

QUESTION: You fought him in Russia. Was that tougher to do on his home soil than over here in the States? And would you like to face him again?

LINDLAND: "I think so. They don't make calls in Russia when guys grab ropes and stuff. He's in a different weight class now. It's a fight I don't need to take but I'll fight whoever. It doesn't matter to me."

QUESTION: Do your two children James and Robin like and participate in mixed martial arts?

LINDLAND: "Robin is a sop****re and doing track and field. As far as martial arts goes she's the highest ranked kid we've ever had come out of our kid's program. Both kids are pretty active in studying the martial arts. It's not something they're pursuing long term but I think teaching martial arts to kids, any combative sport, is a must. It teaches them a lot of good principles.

Tickets for Dec. 19, priced from $30, are on sale at the HP Pavilion ticket office as well as at all Ticketmaster locations (800-745-3000), Ticketmaster online (www.ticketmaster.com <http://www.ticketmaster.com/> ) and STRIKEFORCE'S official website (www.strikeforce.com).

Doors at HP Pavilion will open at 5 p.m. PT for the STRIKEFORCE: "Evolution" event presented by Rockstar Energy Drink and the first preliminary bout will begin at 6:00 PM, PT.

[Hebrew Hammer]

Lindlands comments were great in this interview...he sounds ****ed ready for a good fight. Don't get me started on our political corruption process....

Cung Le's fight is a good match for him, very bad for Smith...but it maybe a chance to see if Cung can take one on the chin. I caught Cungs fight on Strikeforce, the one before Frank Shamrock and he didn't look so good...hands were very low and chin was up. I like Cung a lot but someone may get inside and put him down.

[Cimaroon]

Anyone have a clue how much weight Cung has to cut?

[doug maverick]

watching this fight right now on showtime, cung is whupping homeboys ass....its sad man, he is doing movie moves on him.

had to amend that...cause cung just got knocked the **** out.

[MasterKiller]

Nooooooooooo!

[lkfmdc]

stuff happens, but what was funny was hearing about how the fight was a "work" and then the unexpected....

[goju]

GOD ****IT PIECE OF **** MOTHER ****ER ******** ******* **** **** ****!!!!!:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

[MasterKiller]

stuff happens, but what was funny was hearing about how the fight was a "work" and then the unexpected....

Well, you have to admit, Smith looked like a fish on the ground, and Cung wasn't even pressing him that hard. I thought maybe he had a broken rib from that spinning kick, but then he got up and I was like, wtf...is his ground game that bad?

[doug maverick]

cung wasnt really in tip top condition, and he wasnt really hitting scott hard.

[MysticNinjaJay]

It was really depressing seeing Cung Le get knocked out like that.

He put on a great performance standing but his cardio wasn't 100% and he couldn't finish Scott on the ground.

His head movement isn't very good either which is why he got caught.

I think Cung should retire. He had a great run but I don't think he can improve his game enough at his age to be a Top 10 fighter. He wants to be a movie star, that seems to be where his future lies.

Good luck to him.

It was great seeing Kung Fu applied effectively in MMA. I hope Cung Le inspires more fighters with a TMA background to attempt the transition. I never get tired of seeing spin kicks.

[doug maverick]

you do realize that cung had very little time to train, less then six weeks i believe. he was coming off making like four movies. and he was out of fighting shape.i dont think he should retire at all...but he cant do both, he cant fight and be a movie star...cant serve two masters.

[Xiao3 Meng4]

This is definitely a crossroads in his career(s.)

Will he face his knockout demon and defeat it, or will he make a deal with it?

[Hebrew Hammer]

cung wasnt really in tip top condition, and he wasnt really hitting scott hard.

LOL who are you kidding? He was kicking the crap out of him...ask Scott if he was getting hit hard. They were horrible on the ground.

[Hebrew Hammer]

Wow...I guess I called this one right...overall a crappy fight card I thought...after watching the WEC fights tonight, the StrikeForce fighter's just aren't as well rounded and technically sound as the WEC. Strikeforce seems to get some big names but most of the shows aren't as good as WEC in my opinion...the announcers aren't helping their cause much either...I really enjoy Frank Mir's fight commentaries.

[doug maverick]

yeah both sucked on the groundd, but why are we dwelling on that, when both fighters are known strikers...and like i said cung wasnt in his top condition... at least not in fighting condition.

[MysticNinjaJay]

Cung definitely looked out of shape. I could see him fighting for another 2 or 3 years IF he postpones his movies until after he retires. He can't afford to take long lay offs like the one he took after beating Shamrock.

I think Cung could have been a top MMA fighter if he was younger. His standup is great he just needs to work on his ground game. But he doesn't have a whole lot of time to improve at his age.

[MasterKiller]

LOL who are you kidding? He was kicking the crap out of him...ask Scott if he was getting hit hard. They were horrible on the ground.

Cung hits hard, but he doesn't have KO power. That's a fact.

[Cimaroon]

YEah, that was a bummer. Certainly not in tip top shape. I was really hoping, just for fun, that Cung would have tried for a submission attempt there on the ground. Seems like he will definatley have to totally commit to one career or the other after this.

As a Cung fan its hard to see him go out like that but to a guy good guy like Scott, makes it easier.

[Cimaroon]

There is something offf about Strkeforce. The entrances suck, the crowd didnt seam all that into it and the annoucers are lame.

[Fa Xing]

Cung hits hard, but he doesn't have KO power. That's a fact.

I agree 100%.

[Cimaroon]

Well, how do you respond to him having 6 (t)ko's prior to last night?

[Fa Xing]

Well, how do you respond to him having 6 (t)ko's prior to last night?

Look back on his fights, they were not those out-cold-stiff-as-a-mother****ing-board-KOs. They were usually from people who just couldn't defend themselves any further, but they weren't still lying there.

[Cimaroon]

Sure and so what. Lots of guys dont have that type of power. Anderson Silva hasnt excatly KTFO a pile of fighters, GSP, whoever.

Cung is capable of making you see stars and in the past, its been enough. Im sure if he had been training all along like he had in for his other fitghts, he wins last night no worries.

[MysticNinjaJay]

Look back on his fights, they were not those out-cold-stiff-as-a-mother****ing-board-KOs. They were usually from people who just couldn't defend themselves any further, but they weren't still lying there.

Cung Le does have KO power in his hands. What he does is stuns people and then rushes in for the finish.

Few people have the kind of KO power you describe (where the opponent looks dead or in a seizure).

Even Anderson Silva a reputed knockout artist catches people with flurries rather than knocking them out cold with one shot.

Where Cung Le falls short in MMA is with his ground and pound. He had Smith stunned with that first Spinning Back Kick but his GNP was very weak. After the Morgan fight Cung said that when he was pounding him he really felt the difference between San Shou and MMA. He said it felt like a street fight and thought to himself, "Wow! This sport is violent!".

Cung is a good finisher standing up. When he has you hurt he can usually put you away. Watch the Altman, Warren and Fryklund fights. Those fights displayed KO power.

Cung could have pulled off a decision in this fight if he had been more careful. I think he gassed and couldn't keep kicking Scott to the body. If he had just kept his distance for the last 2 minutes rather than trading shots he would have won.

[MasterKiller]

Cung could have pulled off a decision in this fight if he had been more careful. I think he gassed and couldn't keep kicking Scott to the body. If he had just kept his distance for the last 2 minutes rather than trading shots he would have won.

Or, if he would have had KO power, the fight would have been over in the first or second rounds, in which he landed multiple clean shots.

[MysticNinjaJay]

Or, if he would have had KO power, the fight would have been over in the first or second rounds, in which he landed multiple clean shots.

Scott Smith deserves credit for his chin. Remember that Cung knocked out 3 of his 6 opponents out with punches, two in the first Round and sent one to the hospital from a body kick (also broke Frank Shamrock's arm with a kick).

Those kicks definitely have power they're just hard to land flush. Smith admitted in a post fight interview that he was dazed from the first Spinning Back Kick.

Cung's kicks don't have the devastating KO power of someone like Mirko Crocop but they can hurt you.

Cung is good at finishing opponents standing. He didn't finish Smith on the ground because his ground and pound is weak.

[Li Kao]

It's his 1st loss, so I don't know why some of you are acting like he's washed up now... I will say Big John showed why he's the best ref in the business by allowing the fight to go on at the end of the 1st round -- a lot of other refs may have called it there. Tough loss for Cung after dominating early, but kudos to Smith for hanging in there.

[goju]

lol cung is a way more power and smooth kicker than cro cop

[Cimaroon]

"Where Cung Le falls short in MMA is with his ground and pound. He had Smith stunned with that first Spinning Back Kick but his GNP was very weak. After the Morgan fight Cung said that when he was pounding him he really felt the difference between San Shou and MMA. He said it felt like a street fight and thought to himself, "Wow! This sport is violent!".




True. You could kind of see that in Cung when he was trying to pound out SCott on the ground...like " Why the **** am I doing this". Cung does seem to real or too respectfull to want to put someone out like that. Not to hard to understand.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Guys, as any fighter will tell you, on ANY GIVEN DAY, ANYONE can get his lights knocked out.
It is just a fact of life as a fighter,period.
No matter how well a fighter maybe doing, at any given time it can turn like THAT *snap of fingers*.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Where Cung Le falls short in MMA is with his ground and pound. He had Smith stunned with that first Spinning Back Kick but his GNP was very weak. After the Morgan fight Cung said that when he was pounding him he really felt the difference between San Shou and MMA. He said it felt like a street fight and thought to himself, "Wow! This sport is violent!".

I gotta be honest, as someone that has fought "MMA", I am not sure where Cung got that from, if he said it.
The GnP CAN be very brutal but for the guy on top ( as was the case with Cung's comment) you are in close to total control and the extent of damage is in you hands, literally.
You can be as vicious or as controlled in the GnP as you want.
You can use it to GnP a submission or to set up a more "civil" submission by cokes and/ or locks.
Really, if Cung was insinuating that he wasn't "violent" enough to use the GnP to full benefit then he has had some pretty bad coaching.

[Dragonzbane76]

Guys, as any fighter will tell you, on ANY GIVEN DAY, ANYONE can get his lights knocked out.
It is just a fact of life as a fighter,period.
No matter how well a fighter maybe doing, at any given time it can turn like THAT *snap of fingers*.

100% truth...

[GeneChing]

...but still a great fight - lots of action and what a dramatic turn around. Thomson vs. Melendez was great too.

I've got an interview appointment in a few minutes, so I'm going to scan my newsfeeds, drink my tea and answer a few emails. After I clear my desk, I'll share my notes from being there here, including the undercard and the show in general. Plus I got a few pics, mostly of ring girls ;).

[GeneChing]

I'll leave a permanent redirect, but it's easier on the archive if it's all together (and y'all know what an archivist I am ;))

I've posted some photos on our MySpace (http://www.myspace.com/kungfumagazine) site which I'll reference here. I didn't post it on our Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/pages/Kung-Fu-Tai-Chi-Magazine/135964689362) because I was too busy to do both. Today, our MS has 1113 friends and our FB has 1161 fans so I figured I'd give our MS a boost.

So I got there just before 5 and the house was empty. I figured the season was a bad time to try to throw a fight - it was short notice and there wasn't as much publicity as many previous Strikeforce fights. They place my media seat in a different section than before, near the entrance glory ramp, too close the the pyro for my tastes. Now, unless you're ringside, it's really hard to get good shots, so I shot some entrances and some Ring Girls, just for fun.

http://c4.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/137/l_25f78da2a8f44b5cb47c0d20b4745a73.jpg

The pyro was intense to shoot through
http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/128/l_4fc92bf551ac469f87b98b0ccce63e9a.jpg

[GeneChing]

Alex Crispim def. A.J. Fonseca Unanimous decision all 30-27
Went the distance. Rd 2 had Crispim nearly sealing a guillotine. Rd 3 had Crispim landing solid knees to Fonseca's head.

Justin Wilcox def. Daisuke Nakamura Unanimous decision (I think... I was eating during the call :o)
Rd 1 - Nakamura had a weird guard, leaving his hand low and paying for it. There were a few knees but it was mostly a boxing match. Nakamura attempts a flying arm bar which was surprising but he failed to catch Wilcox's arm and wound up body slamming himself on the ground. Rd 2 - lots of left punches from both. Nak tries to outreach Wilcox but gets taken down towards the end of the round. A nice, yet inconsequential scramble ensues. Rd 3 Both came out swinging. Nak slips during a kick - many fighters slipped that night - and another good scramble ensues. Wilcox's face was really chewed up by the end, which surprised me because I didn't think Nak was landing so many.

Antwain Britt def. Scott Lighty Rd 1 TKO
Britt lands several heavy punches, knocking Lighty down several times and staying on top of his back. Lighty concedes after Rd 1.

Three were a ton of MMA celebs there: Diaz, Lashley, Rodgers, Liddell, Shields, Cyborg, Henderson, Herschel Walker and more.

http://c1.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/151/l_770b6b476bea4afb9693b9380696fad0.jpg
Here's a pic of Cyborg and Manny Melendez of Tiger Claw (http://www.tigerclaw.com/home.php). Unfortunately some fan nudged me during the shot. Cyborg was wearing these wicked stiletto heels and looking good.

[GeneChing]

King Mo defs. Mike Whitehead Rd 1 KO 3:08
King Mo enters like a WWE star with a bevy of writhing ring girls. Initially I was thinking that it was a little much, but he KOed Whitehead with some fearsome punches.

Jacare Souza def. Matt Lindland Rd 1 Triangle 4:18
This started with a flurry of punches but really livened up when it went to the ground at around 3:00. Some nice exchanges ensued and Jacare came out on top.

At this point in the show, the house was more full, but I was feeling like things weren't going well for Strikeforce. The first two bouts went too quickly. Matt Lawler was supposed to fight but they couldn't find an opponent. I was thinking things need to pick up for the rest of the broadcast....and they did.

http://c4.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/134/l_8f0e21cb724d404a8f1eadc3cdaf9a37.jpg
King Mo's entrance. he's back there somewhere in gold lame with a matching parasol. It was very Mardi Gras...

[GeneChing]

It's a 5x5 for the World Middleweight Championship and it goes the distance. Simply put, a great fight. Both fighters were scrappy as hell, unloading intense barrages of punches throughout the match while jockeying for position. It was lots of great standing and ground tactics from two fighters who know each other too well - very exciting all the way through. There were two breaks for Thomson: a shot to the gonads at Rd 2 3:47 and a thumb in the eye at Rd 4. Melendez picked at Thomson with left rapid punches and calf kicks. There were several falls due to the slipperiness of the floor.

http://c2.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/138/l_ed5a1791be6e43699400411a93544145.jpg
Melendez enters

http://c2.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/127/l_7dd74e6627724f5f9fc4e10e129a5629.jpg
Thomson enters

http://c1.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/121/l_0284fcfc93074544a1f24115c76d4a58.jpg
http://c4.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/127/l_ac4fcbd950ef47268556d52bb1128e73.jpg
http://c4.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/117/l_398a2b7138f642c0972ae1b5493dcc27.jpg

[GeneChing]

By the time of the main event, the house had filled up. After Melendez Thomson, the crowd was in a frenzy. The house was for Cung and when that bout started, Cung Le chants rose up repeated. Every time Cung knocked down Smith, the house cheered. Rd 1 was Cung's all the way, with him knocked Smith down repeatedly with an awesome array of kicks. I'm not sure how many of those kicks really rocked Smith. As mentioned earlier, the floor seemed slippery and there were many falls in previous bouts. Some definitely penetrated. I was on the floor near the edge and I clearly heard one of the shots to Smith's midsection. Smith seemed frustrated by it all and crushed Cung on the cage wall in Rd 2, taking the wind out of him. Rd 3 Cung looked weary. He was still landing kicks and dominating when Smith connected with that amazing shot to the jaw. Cung had ducked a punch and didn't bring his eyes back to Smith or his hands up in time. Smith, known for his heavy hands, landed a series of brutal jaw and face shots and it was done. The house went wild. What a come back. Unlike Carano/Cyborg (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=54184), where Cyborg was soundly booed after her win (that might have been about the 4:59 fight stoppage too), Smith was cheered for his stunning turn around.

http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/150/l_00da0ca9f58d4776b1773327592a78f6.jpg
Smith's entrance

http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/137/l_82d3bca26a964b86b0e085e7da91bfbe.jpg
Cung's entrance

I know Cung, of course, and I know a few people at Fairtex in Smith's camp. I'm happy to see these two men fought well and honorably. Cung seemed as gracious as he could be in defeat. Smith, the underdog, was overjoyed.

All in all, those last two bouts were highly entertaining, showing again that Strikeforce can deliver a great show.

[Lucas]

sh!t....this just proves that cung is a human after all and not a cyborg or a demi god.

it just means im that much closer to godhood

:D

[Lucas]

here is a link to the cung fight

http://www.hookedonmma.com/cung-le-vs-scott-smith-fight-video/

[Lucas]

man that back kick snapped hard.

great win for scott smith, he earned it. good fight though too.

[Iron_Eagle_76]

I really hope Cung fights again. I would hate to see him end his fighting career like that, even though he fought a great fight up until he got caught. My hope is that we get more fighters like Cung in the future, because let's face it, love him or hate him, no one I know who is a fight fan did not like watching Cung fight.

Watching an MMA match where a fighter is knocking down opponents with spinning back kicks and spinning hook kicks will go a long way to capturing fans for the sport. It's exciting and more entertaining than your standard MMA fighter with sub par boxing, ok wrestling, and ok submission. It would be awesome to see more guys with a background in Kung Fu, Taekwondo, or Savate fighting using more exotic kicks and techniques. Many people watch MMA and feel that all fighters are the same and it would make the sport exciting to have more Cung Le type fighters.

[Frost]

I really hope Cung fights again. I would hate to see him end his fighting career like that, even though he fought a great fight up until he got caught. My hope is that we get more fighters like Cung in the future, because let's face it, love him or hate him, no one I know who is a fight fan did not like watching Cung fight.

Watching an MMA match where a fighter is knocking down opponents with spinning back kicks and spinning hook kicks will go a long way to capturing fans for the sport. It's exciting and more entertaining than your standard MMA fighter with sub par boxing, ok wrestling, and ok submission. It would be awesome to see more guys with a background in Kung Fu, Taekwondo, or Savate fighting using more exotic kicks and techniques. Many people watch MMA and feel that all fighters are the same and it would make the sport exciting to have more Cung Le type fighters.

Of course you could argue that there is a very good reason we have only seen a handful of guys using spinning kicks etc and that most of the fights look the same even though MMA has been round for decades now and is a well established combat sport …..But seeing as how it is Christmas I won’t go there:D

[Iron_Eagle_76]

Of course you could argue that there is a very good reason we have only seen a handful of guys using spinning kicks etc and that most of the fights look the same even though MMA has been round for decades now and is a well established combat sport …..But seeing as how it is Christmas I won’t go there:D

LOL, not arguing there. I just think the sport would improve by having more Cung Le type fighters. But you bring up a valid point, those kicks are obviously dangerous and hard to pull off in MMA, but they are exciting as hell to watch.

[Frost]

LOL, not arguing there. I just think the sport would improve by having more Cung Le type fighters. But you bring up a valid point, those kicks are obviously dangerous and hard to pull off in MMA, but they are exciting as hell to watch.

Ok apart from the obvious smart arse answer that these techniques are flashy and don’t often work (unless you are Cung lee) There are several other reasons you don’t see these techniques on a regular basis.

1) Fear of losing, until promoters offer more money to fighters who use exciting moves regardless if they win or lose you will see them using safe techniques (well relatively safe this is a contact sport after all)

2) Skill set, it’s hard to develop anything other than basic bread and butter techniques when you have so much to train, Cung Lee did it because he was primarily dping stand up for years and did not need to learn the ground (probably the most time consuming area of MMA to train in). Modern fighters need to train the ground, clinch and stand up so they don’t have the luxury of developing anything other than high percentage moves

3) Generally p*ss poor level of stand up fighting in the USA (which does not lend itself well to people learning and pulling off low percentage flashy stuff). Most fighters in MMA coming from the USA have very average stand up but are good at wrestling, and people tend to stay with what they know, hence the really good levels of stand up wrestling and ground grappling in the USA. In the UK it’s the other way around, lots of good Thai boxers etc but generally cra*p wrestling and ground work

So until the above changes, you get a much better standard of stand up in the US, people start to get booked and rewarded for using crowd pleasing techniques rather than just winning etc you probably won’t see these techniques on a regular basis

[Iron_Eagle_76]

This is true, but the very nature of martial arts in to evolve, and through that evolution we may see more strikers using what is considered exotic and less standard to MMA striking as it is known.

In the late 60's, point sparring in the US, although much harder and better than today, was still limited because of the stupid limitations that come from point fighting. Many competitors got tired of this, resulting in the birth of American Style Kickboxing. Guys like Bill Wallace, Joe Lewis, and Benny Uriquidez branched out and this sport was born. Similiar to how after Royce Gracie won the first UFC, the sport of MMA took off.

What I would love to see is guys who are kickboxers or from a TMA who have trained this art for years, like Cung Le, who cross train in a grappling art and use what is considered to be TMA techniques. Remember, Cung was a decorated wrestler and although his ground game is lacking, his throws and take down defense is very good.

That being said, all things need to evolve and I think MMA will as well, which will be good for the sport.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Heavy hands make any fighter who has them, unpredictable.
They can change the course of any fight, as Cung learned.

Cung will come back and do fine, if he so chooses.

His flashiness, like GSP's, is an asset to the sport where fighters tend to be "blah".
Cung, Silva, GSP and such all add a nice mix of basics and the occasional flashiness that help sell the sport.

[MSphinx]

Scott Smith's a kind of Rocky Balboa fighter. He can take so many hits before coming back to win it's unbelievable. I read somewhere that his striking coach quit on him due to concerns about the damage his fighting style could cause.

Here's his most famous fight before Cung:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCcTAMoaIcI

Fast forward to about 8:15 in. Smith appears ruined by a hard liver shot, but manages to land a knockout hook moments before keeling over himself.

[dimethylsea]

The level of sportsmanship and mutual respect in this fight was OUTSTANDING!

If MMA matches were usually fought this way .. how awesome that would be.

Props to both men!

[Cimaroon]

I keep thinking about Cung...how fun it would have been to have seen him at 25 or 26 years of age embarking on a MMA career. Too bad the timing of the cosmos was off a click. He certainly would have worked his way up to all time great status.

[goju]

Ok apart from the obvious smart arse answer that these techniques are flashy and don’t often work (unless you are Cung lee) There are several other reasons you don’t see these techniques on a regular basis.
people that say they dont work cant do them :)


Skill set, it’s hard to develop anything other than basic bread and butter techniques when you have so much to train, Cung Lee did it because he was primarily dping stand up for years and did not need to learn the ground (probably the most time consuming area of MMA to train in). Modern fighters need to train the ground, clinch and stand up so they don’t have the luxury of developing anything other than high percentage moves

i im a very good kicker(and im not bragging so no one blow their top) and its not hard to develop your kicks or realy time consuming at all. the keys flexibility


Generally p*ss poor level of stand up fighting in the USA (which does not lend itself well to people learning and pulling off low percentage flashy stuff). Most fighters in MMA coming from the USA have very average stand up but are good at wrestling, and people tend to stay with what they know, hence the really good levels of stand up wrestling and ground grappling in the USA. In the UK it’s the other way around, lots of good Thai boxers etc but generally cra*p wrestling and ground work

actually i saw a cage rage dvd box set in britain recently and i thought the stand up was god awful much worse than anything in the states

i got so bored i didnt even bother to watch the other three dvds in the set

[Frost]

people that say they dont work cant do them :)

Well until you step in the ring/cage and show us them working we will just have to take your word for it :) its easy to say these things from behind a computer much harder to do, but of course you know better than the pro fighters :)




i im a very good kicker(and im not bragging so no one blow their top) and its not hard to develop your kicks or realy time consuming at all. the keys flexibility

Well until you step in the ring/cage and show us them working we will just have to take your word for it :) No one said its hard to develop them, its hard to develop the necessary timing to use them against someone who is looking to clinch, take you down or hit you with small gloves especially with all the other training you need to do, and if you are a stand up fighter the last thing you want to do is to start relying on techniques that present your opponent a change to take you down, you want to stick to techniques that make it hard for him



actually i saw a cage rage dvd box set in britain recently and i thought the stand up was god awful much worse than anything in the states

i got so bored i didnt even bother to watch the other three dvds in the set

Cage rage is low level, and MMA changes peoples fighting styles, doesn't change the fact that we have more thai gyms than you do, your guys go into wrestling ours into judo or Thai, there are more gyms and more guys fighting here and in Thailand etc

out of the 6 guys I know that have trained at my gym that have fought in the UFC/ or on the ultimate fighter only 1 has a grappling background the other 5 all had either Thai or full contact karate fights, and still fight and train in Thai

[goju]

Well until you step in the ring/cage and show us them working we will just have to take your word for it :) its easy to say these things from behind a computer much harder to do, but of course you know better than the pro fighters :)




Well until you step in the ring/cage and show us them working we will just have to take your word for it :) No one said its hard to develop them, its hard to develop the necessary timing to use them against someone who is looking to clinch, take you down or hit you with small gloves especially with all the other training you need to do, and if you are a stand up fighter the last thing you want to do is to start relying on techniques that present your opponent a change to take you down, you want to stick to techniques that make it hard for him



Cage rage is low level, and MMA changes peoples fighting styles, doesn't change the fact that we have more thai gyms than you do, your guys go into wrestling ours into judo or Thai, there are more gyms and more guys fighting here and in Thailand etc

out of the 6 guys I know that have trained at my gym that have fought in the UFC/ or on the ultimate fighter only 1 has a grappling background the other 5 all had either Thai or full contact karate fights, and still fight and train in Thai

no i dont know better than pro fighters im just not a guy with a few fights under his belt who thinks hes king kong :)

why? anderson silva, cung le, bones jones sakuraba, lyoto gsp and a few others have already shown they work:D me fighting wont prove anything new(though i would we heavy weight so perhaps that would be a bit different to see someone my size do them)


bones jones recently talked about his so called "flashy" techniques he uses and he stated that they arent hard to do or pull off you just have to train them alot and they become super easy to use:D

its simple the reason why they arent seen is one alot of coaches cant do them so what chances do the people learning from them have of preforming them

and two they dont stretch enough or ata ll in some cases

this doesnt just apply to mma but alot of martial arts as well i dont know how many tkd schools ive seen where the instructors or students cant kick to save their lives lol
:D


so more gyms doesnt mean anything its quality vs quantity my friend

[Frost]

no i dont know better than pro fighters im just not a guy with a few fights under his belt who thinks hes king kong :)

why? anderson silva, cung le, bones jones sakuraba, lyoto gsp and a few others have already shown they work:D me fighting wont prove anything new(though i would we heavy weight so perhaps that would be a bit different to see someone my size do them)


bones jones recently talked about his so called "flashy" techniques he uses and he stated that they arent hard to do or pull off you just have to train them alot and they become super easy to use:D

its simple the reason why they arent seen is one alot of coaches cant do them so what chances do the people learning from them have of preforming them

and two they dont stretch enough or ata ll in some cases



this doesnt just apply to mma but alot of martial arts as well i dont know how many tkd schools ive seen where the instructors or students cant kick to save their lives lol
:D


so more gyms doesnt mean anything its quality vs quantity my friend

Let’s wait until Jones fights a class fighter before using him as an example ok, and if you don’t see that he is a freak and an exceptional fighter then maybe you need to revaluate your thinking. Any way your point helps my case, if they need lots of training and can only be pulled off by the handful of guys you mentioned why bother with them?

I wouldn’t bother with the quantity quality argument here its silly, more guys from the UK fight at international level in Thai than the states, more guys from here go to Thailand to train and fight, more Thai’s came here to teach in the 1970’s so we have a longer tradition in it, why are you arguing, it would be like me arguing wrestling in not stronger in the USA, it’s a no brainer

Oh and You can’t say o they are no harder to learn or take no longer to develop than any other technique, then go quoting someone who says it takes a lot of training to do them easily, and then saying most coaches can’t teach them or do them properly.

Its either or…… either they are easy to do and don’t take much effort (in which case most teachers could teach them properly and more students would be good at them) … or they take lots of training to be able to pull off and they are difficult to teach properly, which one is it?

[goju]

oh lawd here we go again with the typical martial arts forum insult that he "never fought anybody"

lol i guess according to so many internet posters populating martial art forums no ones really ever really fought anyone:D

and of course then we have the freak of nature excuse as well
no jones is a just a great fighter who works his technique well and hard and didnt let some fool tell him it doesnt work:D

"I wouldn’t bother with the quantity quality argument here its silly, more guys from the UK fight at international level in Thai than the states, more guys from here go to Thailand to train and fight, more Thai’s came here to teach in the 1970’s so we have a longer tradition in it, why are you arguing, it would be like me arguing wrestling in not stronger in the USA, it’s a no brainer "

again so? for that you really dont see many uk guys coming over seas and wiping north americans out in mma or anything else


no my quote and what i said is not contradicting one another realisticallly you have ot train everything ALOT to be good at it

nothing comes easy no matter what technique it is if you want to be really good at it you have to work work work even with the simplest move

and my point still stands none of the guys who say those techniques work can do them

how can you say something doesnt work when

1. youve never learned them

2 you cant demonstrate them

alot of figthers have used kicks other than the round house successfully on numerous occasions so arguingthey dont work or are risky is bunk

also when i mentioned beinga heavy weigth kicker i forgot about the mowhawk sporting french man who accompanies gsp to the ring to fight hes a fantastic kicker for his size


:D

[sanjuro_ronin]

Hey Goju, when are you going to compete?

[goju]

Hey Goju, when are you going to compete?

if i cant find a good gym in the mean time to do kickboxing matches ill have to do the sabaki unless i move beforehand to vancouver

though ive heard you have to have a black belt and be part of a gym or dojo to compete in the sabaki challenge?

lol i was never given any belt being that i learned from a relative:D


things in canada at least should fall into place for me i dont want to leave a legacy of just smacking around shaolin doh guys:D

[Frost]

if i cant find a good gym in the mean time to do kickboxing matches ill have to do the sabaki unless i move beforehand to vancouver

though ive heard you have to have a black belt and be part of a gym or dojo to compete in the sabaki challenge?

lol i was never given any belt being that i learned from a relative:D


things in canada at least should fall into place for me i dont want to leave a legacy of just smacking around shaolin doh guys:D

Why wait can't you find a kick boxing smoker or a local MMA event to fight in, is there nothing near you?

[goju]

Why wait can't you find a kick boxing smoker or a local MMA event to fight in, is there nothing near you?

need people to spar and train with since i left the gym and it went out of bidness im by myself:(

[Frost]

need people to spar and train with since i left the gym and it went out of bidness im by myself:(

is there no kickboxing, boxing, taekwondo or anything where you are? man that sucks

[goju]

is there no kickboxing, boxing, taekwondo or anything where you are? man that sucks

theres one karate dojo close by but it doesnt look very good at all lol

theres another school that is a bit of a travel away the owners a william de thouars student but from what ive seen from william de thouars online doesnt look very good at all so im already prepared to be dissapointed

if that scholl doesnt work out im sol

everything else is way the hell out there from me or if its close its a mcdojo

[Frost]

theres one karate dojo close by but it doesnt look very good at all lol

everything else is way the hell out there from me or if its close its a mcdojo

scr*w it, if its the best you can find go to the bad schools and train there, spar and beat all the cr*p fighters there up, at the very least you will keep your skills sharp whilst you look for somewhere better and you might come across guys in the same boat you can train with

[sanjuro_ronin]

if i cant find a good gym in the mean time to do kickboxing matches ill have to do the sabaki unless i move beforehand to vancouver

though ive heard you have to have a black belt and be part of a gym or dojo to compete in the sabaki challenge?

lol i was never given any belt being that i learned from a relative:D


things in canada at least should fall into place for me i dont want to leave a legacy of just smacking around shaolin doh guys:D

Where the f do you live that you can't find a decent gym ??

[goju]

yes likely i will just say screw it and join the de thouars students place even if the de thouars silat looks more than a bit made up to me the school is supposed to have a reputation for sparring a lot which is good because i dont want my skills to deteriorate in between the time im here and i move

[goju]

Where the f do you live that you can't find a decent gym ??

wheatridge colorado:D

the two closest places ight now are the shaolin do place i went when i was fifteen ( and im **** well never going back there again lol) and a iffy looking karate dojo


there are some decent gyms in colorado but they (lucky for me happen to be way the hell out there)

theres a john painter guy here but hes hours away

nate marquarts gyms way out there

william cheung has student here but hes in the sticks

enshin is god awful drive

tiger kim is almost just as far and to make it worse his gym is rediculosuly expensive and he nearly threatened me to join when i went to go talk to him lol


unfortunatelyf or me most of the good stuff happens to be up in colorado springs or near it

[Iron_Eagle_76]

wheatridge colorado:D

the two closest places ight now are the shaolin do place i went when i was fifteen ( and im **** well never going back there again lol) and a iffy looking karate dojo


there are some decent gyms in colorado but they (lucky for me happen to be way the hell out there)

theres a john painter guy here but hes hours away

nate marquarts gyms way out there

william cheung has student here but hes in the sticks

enshin is god awful drive

tiger kim is almost just as far and to make it worse his gym is rediculosuly expensive and he nearly threatened me to join when i went to go talk to him lol


unfortunatelyf or me most of the good stuff happens to be up in colorado springs or near it


I could have swore we had this same conversation a few weeks ago and you said Nate Marquate's school was in your hometown but it sucked and that is why you didn't go:confused: I also thought you said you were from Denver, not whatever other small town you said. Now I have never been to Denver, but I would assume a city that size has tons of MA gyms. Sometimes the things you say just don't seem to add up.;)

[Cimaroon]

I hear the dude about being away from any good training. When Im at my normal home, im a good 2 hours from anything! There are some rez fighters, that self teach each other but no proper training

[couch]

I hear the dude about being away from any good training. When Im at my normal home, im a good 2 hours from anything! There are some rez fighters, that self teach each other but no proper training

A little autodidacticism is better than no training - that's what I say.

[sanjuro_ronin]

My current HK sifu is about 90 min away, so 3 hours total, his brother, who's speciality is SPM is in the same city.
I try to get out there at least once a month and spend the rest of the time perfecting what I am taught.
I don't think for a rookie that would work, but if you have a solid core and a place to train, you can do it.

As always, SOMETHING is better than nothing.

Remember, the core of ALL MA is physical conditioning and training the basics and we can all pretty much do that, to a certain extent, solo.
Don't need that much really.
As for sparring, he, every city has a boxing gym...

[goju]

I could have swore we had this same conversation a few weeks ago and you said Nate Marquate's school was in your hometown but it sucked and that is why you didn't go:confused: I also thought you said you were from Denver, not whatever other small town you said. Now I have never been to Denver, but I would assume a city that size has tons of MA gyms. Sometimes the things you say just don't seem to add up.;)

uh no nate marquarts gym is all the way in aurora which is more than an hour away from me ive said that numerous times

wheatridge where im currently at is one of the smallest cities in colorado and its neighbouring denver:D


you can google up a map of wheatridge and then look for the mma gyms in colorado and see for yourself that im not lying about gyms being far away

[goju]

actually i just found delgados boxing gym in arvada online :D they teach tkd as well so that woudl be nice:D

oh i didnt say marquarts gym sucked i just said i didnt like how he charged you up the ass for belt promotion in his gym:D

[sanjuro_ronin]

When the Chinese were looking for "hand work" when they were developing San shou /San da and a H2h system for the military, they looked at all the MA.
They choose Western Boxing ( and added some open hand stikes from "kung fu").
That says a lot.

That info was taken from Brian Kennedy's excellent book on CMA training Manuals.

[Iron_Eagle_76]

uh no nate marquarts gym is all the way in aurora which is more than an hour away from me ive said that numerous times

wheatridge where im currently at is one of the smallest cities in colorado and its neighbouring denver:D


you can google up a map of wheatridge and then look for the mma gyms in colorado and see for yourself that im not lying about gyms being far away

Don't care enough about you, Denver, or the gyms in the area enough to make that kind of effort. Just stating that you seem to condradict yourself a lot. The boxing/Taekwondo sounds decent, check it out.

[goju]

Don't care enough about you, Denver, or the gyms in the area enough to make that kind of effort. Just stating that you seem to condradict yourself a lot. The boxing/Taekwondo sounds decent, check it out.

god i really am heart broken i thought we were best friends and all:D

actually no i havent contradicted myself at all you just proved above you didnt read what i posted weeks earlier about gyms in co or didnt understand or pay attention etc etc

either way your own lack of memory of my previous statements isnt my fault nor does it allow you to make a rather absurd accusation that i make contradictions my dear boy:p

[SnowDog]

Goju

Dude, you make Wheatridge sound like it's off in the sticks somewhere. It's a suburb of Denver. 20min from downtown. (I was raised in Bailey......now that my friend is the sticks :) )

There are a ton of schools/ Clubs around the denver area if you're wanting to train boxing/ Kickboxing/ MT or MMA. You'll just have to be willing to drive a little.

Do a google search for the denver area (also some of the BJJ schools have MT classes as well).....Most will be downtown or in the I-25/ Colorado blvd or Broadway area. Not many fighting gyms tend to open in the suburbs......... soccer moms don't like little Johnny to really learn to fight and get hurt. They want the Wax on Wax off type McDojo "Masters".

And you also can attend many of the local MMA events around town and ask where people train, because some of the smaller gyms don't have websites.

I know there are a few scheduled for the begining of 2010..... If I find the details I'll post them for you.

[goju]

Goju

Dude, you make Wheatridge sound like it's off in the sticks somewhere. It's a suburb of Denver. 20min from downtown. (I was raised in Bailey......now that my friend is the sticks :) )

There are a ton of schools/ Clubs around the denver area if you're wanting to train boxing/ Kickboxing/ MT or MMA. You'll just have to be willing to drive a little.

Do a google search for the denver area (also some of the BJJ schools have MT classes as well).....Most will be downtown or in the I-25/ Colorado blvd or Broadway area. Not many fighting gyms tend to open in the suburbs......... soccer moms don't like little Johnny to really learn to fight and get hurt. They want the Wax on Wax off type McDojo "Masters".

And you also can attend many of the local MMA events around town and ask where people train, because some of the smaller gyms don't have websites.

I know there are a few scheduled for the begining of 2010..... If I find the details I'll post them for you.

i never said it was the sticks but the closet mma gym is marquarts(that i know of) and its any where from an hour and a half or more drive:D
and im certainly not going to drag my carcass that far unless its **** worth it :D

[sanjuro_ronin]

i never said it was the sticks but the closet mma gym is marquarts(that i know of) and its any where from an hour and a half or more drive:D
and im certainly not going to drag my carcass that far unless its **** worth it :D

He said you're 20 min from DT Denver, are you?

[goju]

He said you're 20 min from DT Denver, are you?
around there but again marquarts gym isnt anywhere that close mate lol

[sanjuro_ronin]

around there but again marquarts gym isnt anywhere that close mate lol

I am amazed that Downtown Denver has NOTHING to offer you for MA training, AMAZED !!!

[goju]

I am amazed that Downtown Denver has NOTHING to offer you for MA training, AMAZED !!!

sigh AGAIN you have no idea how far away places like the enshin dojo or marquarts are from where i live

i gave you the street i live on you can find out for yourself with a simple trip on google:Dand see im not lying

unless you wanna reccomend me to some more ussd studios to train at lol!

[sanjuro_ronin]

sigh AGAIN you have no idea how far away places like the enshin dojo or marquarts are from where i live

i gave you the street i live on you can find out for yourself with a simple trip on google:D

I did, I sent you the link, all you point out was the shaolin do and the ATA.
And the rest?
Dude, are you saying that nowhere in Denver is there even a boxing gym that is at like 30 min from you ???

[goju]

I did, I sent you the link, all you point out was the shaolin do and the ATA.
And the rest?
Dude, are you saying that nowhere in Denver is there even a boxing gym that is at like 30 min from you ???
yeah and i told you too look at those websites with the exception of delgados everything else was geared towards tiny tiger classes lol


delgados actually to my knowledge had closed down i didnt know till i found it a few days back it was still around

they years ago used to rent the space that t'sko fight club had took over and apparently sicne their move they dropped tkd and bjjj from the stuff they teach

[SnowDog]

Here I did a Google search and found some that train in Boxing/ MMA/ MT etc....
All of these should be no more than a 20- 40min drive

http://www.eastonbjj.com/ContactUs/tabid/90/Default.aspx -
They are a BJJ school but have MT classes and they have branches in Arvada and DT Denver area.

http://ironshinmuaythai.com/ - They are in the I-25 and Colo Blvd area

http://www.grapplers-edge.com/ - E. Denver on Colfax

http://www.gummbjj.com/ - In Littleton which is about 30min from Wheatridge.

http://www.denverboxingacademy.com/ - DT Denver

http://www.therockboxing.com/ - Lakewood 285 & Wadsworth

http://www.90and9.net/prophecy.htm - Federal and Dartmouth area

http://www.gymriki.com/ - DT Denver area


http://www.muaythaiofcolorado.com/index_files/Page266.htm - A little ****her, but still probably within a 40 -45min drive


And this was just from a quick Google search, some might be crap, some good......Just showing there are ones in the Denver area.

[goju]

Here I did a Google search and found some that train in Boxing/ MMA/ MT etc....
All of these should be no more than a 20- 40min drive

http://www.eastonbjj.com/ContactUs/tabid/90/Default.aspx -
They are a BJJ school but have MT classes and they have branches in Arvada and DT Denver area.

http://ironshinmuaythai.com/ - They are in the I-25 and Colo Blvd area

http://www.grapplers-edge.com/ - E. Denver on Colfax

http://www.gummbjj.com/ - In Littleton which is about 30min from Wheatridge.

http://www.denverboxingacademy.com/ - DT Denver

http://www.therockboxing.com/ - Lakewood 285 & Wadsworth

http://www.90and9.net/prophecy.htm - Federal and Dartmouth area

http://www.gymriki.com/ - DT Denver area


http://www.muaythaiofcolorado.com/index_files/Page266.htm - A little ****her, but still probably within a 40 -45min drive


And this was just from a quick Google search, some might be crap, some good......Just showing there are ones in the Denver area.


ive never heard of the gummbjj gym if its onlya 30 minute slog that would be great i wouldnt be willing to do much more than that back and forth

when i was a t t'sko we had a person coming all the way from steamboat springs to wheatridge just to train for an hour

[Pork Chop]

a friend of mine fights/fought out of i think grappler's edge.
over the past year or so he's been going back & forth between Texas and Colorado.
he's now the muay thai coach at the mma gym i used to work out at (the one my friend owns).
haven't talked to him in a while though, but next time i do i'll try to get some recommendations.
he's solid though and if he's any indication of his coaches i think you'll have fun.

[goju]

a friend of mine fights/fought out of i think grappler's edge.
over the past year or so he's been going back & forth between Texas and Colorado.
he's now the muay thai coach at the mma gym i used to work out at (the one my friend owns).
haven't talked to him in a while though, but next time i do i'll try to get some recommendations.
he's solid though and if he's any indication of his coaches i think you'll have fun.

oh yeah ive heard alot of good things about grapplers edge:D

[SnowDog]

ive never heard of the gummbjj gym if its onlya 30 minute slog that would be great i wouldnt be willing to do much more than that back and forth

when i was a t t'sko we had a person coming all the way from steamboat springs to wheatridge just to train for an hour


Actually I never heard of it either.......and I only live about 10 min from there now that I live on the S. side of town.

Yeah when you live in a small Mtn town there isn't much of a choice. Back in the early 90's when I was still living up in the Mtns I used to Drive over an hour each way just to train at the gym that I was learning MT at, but then again I didn't have much of a choice. Unless I wanted to learn Drunken Redneck Style from one of the locals sitting in the bar. :D

[goju]

Actually I never heard of it either.......and I only live about 10 min from there now that I live on the S. side of town.

Yeah when you live in a small Mtn town there isn't much of a choice. Back in the early 90's when I was still living up in the Mtns I used to Drive over an hour each way just to train at the gym that I was learning MT at, but then again I didn't have much of a choice. Unless I wanted to learn Drunken Redneck Style from one of the locals sitting in the bar. :D

lol yeah

the thing too is if im gonna travel 30 minutes to an hour to train im sure as hell not gonna go if they are gonna stick me in an hour long class with soccer moms lol


for that far i want them to train my butt till i pass out so its worth the trip

thats what annoyed me at the gym i was at the classes werent hard enough and i ended up having to go hoem and train a coupel more hours along with it

[Cimaroon]

Dosent seem like Cung has talked since the fight? Gene...anyone? Hear, see anything from Cung?