Actual Questions about Kung Fu.

[Kpower]

There has been a lot of discussion lately about the relative merits of different forms of training and/or conditioning. On the one side there seems to be a faction that believes weight training is the way to go and the other side feels something else is better. My first question is what is the something else? Is it more flexibility oriented or what? If it is just stretching tendons and what not I kind of find it hard to believe that it will make you as strong as someone who lifts weights every day. I'm not saying I am right but I would like to know more so I can make a decision on which way will be best for me.

There is a show on Nat Geo called Martial Science and they go about disecting specific attacks and sometimes they test them on areas of the body using a special dummy with sensors in it. I would be interested to see a study of these different methodologies in action. It would have to be a comparison of two men with the same starting body size who each have trained for a comparable amount of time in one methodology. They could strike a dummy several times each and see who generates more power. Speed would also have to be measured I suppose.

The reason I am asking is I have very few varieties of martial arts around me. There are about a million Karate and Tae Kwon Do schools but they just don't do it for me. There are a few MMA schools and there are a few that claim to teach shaolin styles. Then there is CKFA school that teaches Jook Lum Mantis. I am interested in mantis but I have seen some debates on the validity of Henry Poo Yee's teachings.
Does anyone have any knowledge of any differences between Henry Poo Yee's and Henry Sue's teachings? I ask because I saw some vids of Henry Sue's students on youtube and they looked pretty good.
Do these different schools teach internal training methodologies such as has been mentioned as a feature of Chow Gar?

I have two very young boys so my time is limited. I watch them every evening while my wife works so I am looking for something I can practice at home mostly and go to class once a week or so.

My fitness goals are to lower my BMI and increase my flexibility, strength and endurance.

[Frost]

If you are interested in increasing your flexibility, getting stronger and having better endurance and a lower BMI then I suggest you look into lifting relatively heavy weights, running/jogging/LSD in other words aerobic work), and stretch often, both dynamically and statically. Its not really hard all martial arts and all athletes have followed a similar process of training for years, old kung fu guys even did it: they lifted stone weights, heavy weapons and buckets filled with water (heavy weight training) they ran and did hours of training (aerobic work) and stretched and did variations of Yoga.

On the is this or that training best front, what I am about to say may shock you but it really doesn’t matter what you do or which is best, its what you can be consistant with that’s the key.
Lift weights, do dynamic tension sets, run fast run slow, do non or all of the above…..its all good as long as you enjoy it and it makes you healthy

On the southern mantis front that is a minefield of politics, there are debates about everyone’s legitimacy with those guys not just henry poo yee’s lol

What I would say is that he is acknowledged by a number of people as a very good master of southern mantis and his guys are always ready to challenge those that say otherwise, which is usually an indicator that they have good stuff and are not afraid to fight. But best advice I can give is go along and try the class, what’s the worst that can happen…. You find after a few weeks it’s not for you?

[kfson]

In the physical: 1 Flexibility and 2 Strength.

At present, I have stopped all practice except for Yoga and Golds Gym.
I have had injuries because of lack of Flexibility and Strength and I'm determined not to let that happen again.

From watching one particular fellow student, flexibility takes you miles rather than inches.

[Lucas]

If you are interested in increasing your flexibility, getting stronger and having better endurance and a lower BMI then I suggest you look into lifting relatively heavy weights, running/jogging/LSD in other words aerobic work), and stretch often, both dynamically and statically. Its not really hard all martial arts and all athletes have followed a similar process of training for years, old kung fu guys even did it: they lifted stone weights, heavy weapons and buckets filled with water (heavy weight training) they ran and did hours of training (aerobic work) and stretched and did variations of Yoga.

On the is this or that training best front, what I am about to say may shock you but it really doesn’t matter what you do or which is best, its what you can be consistant with that’s the key.
Lift weights, do dynamic tension sets, run fast run slow, do non or all of the above…..its all good as long as you enjoy it and it makes you healthy

On the southern mantis front that is a minefield of politics, there are debates about everyone’s legitimacy with those guys not just henry poo yee’s lol

What I would say is that he is acknowledged by a number of people as a very good master of southern mantis and his guys are always ready to challenge those that say otherwise, which is usually an indicator that they have good stuff and are not afraid to fight. But best advice I can give is go along and try the class, what’s the worst that can happen…. You find after a few weeks it’s not for you?

+1 qft
:D

[Lee Chiang Po]

If you are into MMA stuff, then heavy weights will give you that look. But you will need lots of tatoo work done too.
If you are interested in strength and flexability, along with stamina, use light weights and do lots of reps. It is really not how much you lift as it is how long it takes to lift it. If you use 30 pounds of dead weight, taking 2 seconds to lift it to full extension, then 3 seconds to lower it again, you will only be able to do a small number of reps and it will break down the muscle tissue more quickly and thuroughly. Builds muscle tissue. I think that large muscles tend to fill with blood and become a liability. Smaller muscles that have great strength tend to be far more efficient. If you are looking to become stronger and more flexible for your MA, I would avoid the real heavy stuff.

[Lucas]

hey now, to be fair, kungfu guys can get tats too. i have extensive work done and plan to get more. :p

[Xiao3 Meng4]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=weBmerBUKY8

[Kpower]

I was thinking about getting a tat related to the system I choose. My wife says I am too old to get one now.
I have a big build already so I don't really need to build. I just want to tone up and lose some weight in the process.

I think I will check out the Jook Lum school and see how that goes. It strikes a chord with me so I think it might work out. I am just leery because I will have to do private lessons and it will be fairly expensive compared to the other schools. This guy is listed on the CKFA website so I know he is legit at least as far as that's concerned.

As far as the politics are concerned, I don't really care I just want to learn the real deal. If these guys are willing to back up their kung fu by throwing down that says a lot to me. Hopefully its a good match for me.

[kfson]

I will soon get a tattoo on my forehead that looks like a cancerous mole about the size of a half dollar.

You want scary? You can't handle scary.

[Xiao3 Meng4]

Scary is when the guy in front of you goes "you wanna go? Ok, let's go" and proceeds to rip out his facial jewelery.

[Frost]

If you are into MMA stuff, then heavy weights will give you that look. But you will need lots of tatoo work done too.
If you are interested in strength and flexability, along with stamina, use light weights and do lots of reps. It is really not how much you lift as it is how long it takes to lift it. If you use 30 pounds of dead weight, taking 2 seconds to lift it to full extension, then 3 seconds to lower it again, you will only be able to do a small number of reps and it will break down the muscle tissue more quickly and thuroughly. Builds muscle tissue. I think that large muscles tend to fill with blood and become a liability. Smaller muscles that have great strength tend to be far more efficient. If you are looking to become stronger and more flexible for your MA, I would avoid the real heavy stuff.


WTF are you on about, what the feck are you on:confused:

[Dragonzbane76]

If you are into MMA stuff, then heavy weights will give you that look. But you will need lots of tatoo work done too.
If you are interested in strength and flexability, along with stamina, use light weights and do lots of reps. It is really not how much you lift as it is how long it takes to lift it. If you use 30 pounds of dead weight, taking 2 seconds to lift it to full extension, then 3 seconds to lower it again, you will only be able to do a small number of reps and it will break down the muscle tissue more quickly and thuroughly. Builds muscle tissue. I think that large muscles tend to fill with blood and become a liability. Smaller muscles that have great strength tend to be far more efficient. If you are looking to become stronger and more flexible for your MA, I would avoid the real heavy stuff.



I don't lift heavy to much anymore but i do do it sometimes. Best advise I ever got, "sometimes you have to 'shock' the body by doing different routines at times" I lifted heavy back in my college years and was pretty big, but then I found out that if was messing my back up so I laid off it for awhile. I came back and started lifting again but different routine of medium weight with higher rep. I'm still pretty big and have great flexibility but I stretch a lot. I can maintain a rubber guard and such and can kick with the best of them.
The biggest thing i think your saying is that big muscles cannot maintain distance which is true in some cases. Thing is a lot of times big guys don't train there cardio, they worry to much about building and not maintaining. I train my cardio every single day. I can grapple and spar non stop for long periods of time. When I trained for my last fight I was running 4-5 miles a day and doing ridiculous amounts of cardio and still fought in the heavy weight division. so saying that lifting heavy is not good for fighting is ridiculous you just gotta know how to mix in the right elements for building the correct body.

[Lokhopkuen]

Big and strong is a great starter kit:D
but

To be a well rounded martial artist you'd need to develop a balance of:
Stability
Mobility
Flexibility
Strength-abilty
Technique-abilty
Experience in Fighting-abilty.

Lifting weight is good but without flexibility you're just big and stiff.

You may recall me detailing these out for you once but I was summarily accused of "copying and pasting my school manual" LMAO:rolleyes:

[Lokhopkuen]

If you are interested in increasing your flexibility, getting stronger and having better endurance and a lower BMI then I suggest you look into lifting relatively heavy weights, running/jogging/LSD in other words aerobic work), and stretch often, both dynamically and statically. Its not really hard all martial arts and all athletes have followed a similar process of training for years, old kung fu guys even did it: they lifted stone weights, heavy weapons and buckets filled with water (heavy weight training) they ran and did hours of training (aerobic work) and stretched and did variations of Yoga.

On the is this or that training best front, what I am about to say may shock you but it really doesn’t matter what you do or which is best, its what you can be consistant with that’s the key.
Lift weights, do dynamic tension sets, run fast run slow, do non or all of the above…..its all good as long as you enjoy it and it makes you healthy

On the southern mantis front that is a minefield of politics, there are debates about everyone’s legitimacy with those guys not just henry poo yee’s lol

What I would say is that he is acknowledged by a number of people as a very good master of southern mantis and his guys are always ready to challenge those that say otherwise, which is usually an indicator that they have good stuff and are not afraid to fight. But best advice I can give is go along and try the class, what’s the worst that can happen…. You find after a few weeks it’s not for you?

What is BMI and LSD?

[Lokhopkuen]

WTF are you on about, what the feck are you on:confused:

I think he's talking about looking tough the MMA way. Personally I'd never tattoo myself.

[Kpower]

What is BMI and LSD?

BMI stands for Mody Mass Index and is a measurement of your fat to weight ratio.

LSD stands for Long Slow Distance. It is a program that encourages maintaining a moderate aerobic workout for a long period of time to burn more fat calories. The information I saw said that 75% of the calories burned will be from fat.

[Frost]

Big and strong is a great starter kit:D
but

To be a well rounded martial artist you'd need to develop a balance of:
Stability
Mobility
Flexibility
Strength-abilty
Technique-abilty
Experience in Fighting-abilty.

Lifting weight is good but without flexibility you're just big and stiff.

You may recall me detailing these out for you once but I was summarily accused of "copying and pasting my school manual" LMAO:rolleyes:

and flexibility without strength through the range of motion is a recipt for injury, you need both, but flexibilty can be trained with weights just as strength can be trained with certain flexibilty routines

[Frost]

I don't lift heavy to much anymore but i do do it sometimes. Best advise I ever got, "sometimes you have to 'shock' the body by doing different routines at times" I lifted heavy back in my college years and was pretty big, but then I found out that if was messing my back up so I laid off it for awhile. I came back and started lifting again but different routine of medium weight with higher rep. I'm still pretty big and have great flexibility but I stretch a lot. I can maintain a rubber guard and such and can kick with the best of them.
The biggest thing i think your saying is that big muscles cannot maintain distance which is true in some cases. Thing is a lot of times big guys don't train there cardio, they worry to much about building and not maintaining. I train my cardio every single day. I can grapple and spar non stop for long periods of time. When I trained for my last fight I was running 4-5 miles a day and doing ridiculous amounts of cardio and still fought in the heavy weight division. so saying that lifting heavy is not good for fighting is ridiculous you just gotta know how to mix in the right elements for building the correct body.

this point is so true, its why most pro teams have a pro S and C coach, the proper periodisation of training methods and knowing which training methods go together and which must be trained seperatly is vital to winning. Knowing how much training is needed to maintain a strength property and how much is needed to build it etc and questions that every fighter needs to know. You can't just train them all the different strength and conditioning methods together or neglect one area you need to properly plan your training for maximum performance

[uki]

you become how you train. :)

[Fa Xing]

Lifting weight is good but without flexibility you're just big and stiff.

That depends on how you lift.

[Dragonzbane76]

To be a well rounded martial artist you'd need to develop a balance of:
Stability
Mobility
Flexibility
Strength-abilty
Technique-abilty
Experience in Fighting-abilty.

Lifting weight is good but without flexibility you're just big and stiff.

You may recall me detailing these out for you once but I was summarily accused of "copying and pasting my school manual" LMAO
I agree you have to develop all those. You cannot just focus on one thing. You know I have nothing against TCMA I started in it and still maintain in it. "Its a great starter kit" :)

anyways i totally agree with just lifting and not maintaining flexibility. I've met plenty of power lifters that can lift a car but if they probably sparred more than 1 min. they would keal over for lack of oxygen. Takes a lot of gas to keep that engine going in a big body like that. I've sparred guys that are 300 or more lbs. and one thing about them is for the first min. if they get a hold of you then your in a heck of a perdicament. Gotta wearem down. It usually doesn't take long.

And you have a good memory. yes i did say that to you. and if you did copy and paste then if that was the curriculum then its a good one in my book. :)

[Yum Cha]

I just don't get it. So much left out.... Where do you accommodate the Dim Sim eating, and tea drinking????

Drinking, pot smoking and consorting with loose women?

...and lets not forget fornication....

I think surfing is in there too somewhere....

Incomplete, sorry, start again.:D

[Lee Chiang Po]

I have pretty much always weighed in around 200 and am not but 5'4" tall. Not much fat, but pretty thick muscle mass. I did not build it with heavy weight either, but with very light weight. Lots of reps and slow in doing it. I also did a lot of physical cardio work as a younger man. Don't much feel the need these days though. I do work out regularly, but lightly, just to keep the muscles from sagging. I have always been exceedingly strong. Stout as some call it. And I have my own tatoos. They are mostly hidden, and I have none on the face. I am an ugly man, and a tatoo on the face would make it even worse.
Tatoos should be placed stratigically, and not haphazardly. This tends to make you look awkward. Well placed tats make you look well balanced. Foon sui.

LCP

[Drake]

BMI is completely useless if you are even remotely athletic. It was a tool designed for sedentary people, and nothing more. However, people are running with it because it's easy, and they don't care about accuracy. They just want their empirical figure to justify whatever.

BMI has to be one of the most misused tools in medical history.

[Dragonzbane76]

BMI is completely useless if you are even remotely athletic. It was a tool designed for sedentary people, and nothing more. However, people are running with it because it's easy, and they don't care about accuracy. They just want their empirical figure to justify whatever.

BMI has to be one of the most misused tools in medical history.

dam that is so true. BMI is the lazy man's way of say hey i'm not fat. I weight 230 and most of it's muscle. according to BMI i'm obese wtf. I work cardio like it's not going to be around tomorrow. It's just a general index IMO. if your athletic your weight to mass ratio shouldn't matter if you keep in shape with some cardio and training.

[Lucas]

what do you guys think about stuff like this, as well as the testimonial, bunk or legit?

http://www.ryansrippedcombo.com/?cid=203&aid=2349

[Frost]

basically from what i can see its not workout or diet based just supplement based.. I call bullsh*t, whilst i am in no doubt that hollywood stars have access to supplements and PEDS that we can only dream about and never afford, most of their results come from not working out or supplements but from having the best chefs and nutritionists money can buy

and if the claims were true, where would he make the best money, selling to us over the web or going to hollywood or pro body builders/models (who live by their looks and for the most part would pay anything if the claims were true)

on a side note most supplements are cr^p, only sa handfull have been documented to work in any way shape or form

[Drake]

I just heard about this AWESOME new diet. Guaranteed to work. Has something to do with portion control, moderation, exercise, and eating natural foods. I hear it works wonders.

[Yum Cha]

... I am an ugly man, and a tatoo on the face would make it even worse.

In a fight, always worry about the ugly guy, he's not afraid of getting hit in the face. ;)

[Lee Chiang Po]

In a fight, always worry about the ugly guy, he's not afraid of getting hit in the face. ;)

This is true. And being big and ugly has it's benefits. It adds to the fear factor.

[Yum Cha]

This is true. And being big and ugly has it's benefits. It adds to the fear factor.

I HEAR you, Ugly Brother! LOL.


Ah yes, my Ugly fu is probably as good as yours....

[Lokhopkuen]

I just don't get it. So much left out.... Where do you accommodate the Dim Sim eating, and tea drinking????

Drinking, pot smoking and consorting with loose women?

...and lets not forget fornication....

I think surfing is in there too somewhere....

Incomplete, sorry, start again.:D

Dispensing secrets to the uninitiated? The Shaolin Ninja are en route to settle your account buddy boy:cool:

[KC Elbows]

I just heard about this AWESOME new diet. Guaranteed to work. Has something to do with portion control, moderation, exercise, and eating natural foods. I hear it works wonders.

Sounds like a fad. Anyway, this is a kung fu forum, everyone here is savvy to the fact that there can be no balance without tiger pen1s.

[Kpower]

Ok so I went to my first SPM class and it went pretty well. I thought I would have more problems with the stance than I did. Of course I haven't stayed in it for longer than a few minutes yet though either. I have something to practice now anyway. I have decided to commit myself to this style though. It is different from the way I would normally fight so it presents a challenge but what I have learned so far makes sense to me. Well some of it is different but some of it actually fits right in with my personal style of boxing. One of the harder things for me will be not blocking.