Grand master fred spencer

[hskwarrior]

Performing the Lau Bun lineage Sup Ji Kau Da Kuen

Sup Ji Kau Da Kuen (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oC9Wfleui9o)

[DMK]

It is nice to see Master Spencer demos.

[Fei Li]

No disrespect, but it seems to me he is not finishing his techniques,
or am I missing something?

[hskwarrior]

care to elaborate????

[TenTigers]

very often when we practice forms without going through full range of motion-"just going over" the forms, we shorten our movements (because we "know" the form, having done it forever..). This trains the neuro pathways-practice makes permanent. Then, add into the mix the adreneline dump, which often occurs when doing a demo, and you get tight, shortened movements.
The key to preventing this is to always practice the full movements.
CLF-particularly in BSCLF, the movements are very large, with full stretching of the joints. (a;though, this is also depending on how the individual plays the form., so it is not limited to BSCLF.)This maintains flexibility, and opens up the energy pathways. The chi-gung is woven into these sets, which is why they don't need to add separate chi-gung forms to the system.
We all do it from time to time. And yuo see it most prevelant in older practitioners.
Then it really blows our minds when we see a guy who is in his eighties, and his movements are full and strong. Can't remember who, but there is an old CLF guy, and also an old Hung Kuen guy who bangs out a beautiful form on youtube.
-and lets not forget that 95 yr old guy who looks like Miyagi, doing Bagua and double broadswords. I love the way he runs off the stage afterward, like a child. Such energy..

[once ronin]

Does his student train this way?

[hskwarrior]

CLF-particularly in BSCLF, the movements are very large, with full stretching of the joints. (a;though, this is also depending on how the individual plays the form., so it is not limited to BSCLF.)This maintains flexibility, and opens up the energy pathways.

i can tell you he wasn't taught by US to move that way. he is more of a chan family stylist.....they have shorter hands than Hung Sing and Buk Sing in my opinion.


Does his student train this way?

students tend to look like their teacher. by my sisooks ive been told they can see in my hands that i am my sifu's student. my senior students have seen my more jr ones develop my hands......so it may be safe to conclude that students tend to resemble their teachers.

[hskwarrior]

The chi-gung is woven into these sets, which is why they don't need to add separate chi-gung forms to the system.

TT,

my sifu always told us that after a certain amount of time you naturally build your chi gung....anyone would.

[TenTigers]

TT,

my sifu always told us that after a certain amount of time you naturally build your chi gung....anyone would.
it depends on the student, where their minds are at. Some just never turn inward, or develop that awareness of self.

[hskwarrior]

thats right.

[Fei Li]

@hskwarrior:

What I meant is, like Tentigers wrote too, that it looks to me, that he is beginning a new technique without having finished the one before.
It does not look like a masters presentation, but maybe tentigers is right and he was nervous…

After all I am just commenting this one video, I do not know him and form presentation and to be a master of your style is not necessarily the same thing.
:)

[Eric Olson]

Also, very little movement in the waist, as though his upper body is one solid column. CLF should be done with a "supple waist", because that is where the power transfers through from the feet.

EO

[hskwarrior]

oh ok....didn't know that

[Eric Olson]

oh ok....didn't know that

There's always something new to learn Frank....;)

[hskwarrior]

yes there is. you're very knowledgeable

[buddajoe]

Perhaps we just have the wrong idea! The performer has a formless horse, subtle and invisible waist and an incredible presence of genius. He has transformed a short arm form from a long arm one. his thirty years of kung fu living is WOW. its my misfortune that i did not look like this after so many years. Unfortunately I think the uniform is way over the top!!!:D

[hskwarrior]

perhaps you are right. perhaps you are incorrect.

BUT!!!!

i have a question.....who dictated that CLF should look a certain way for it to be called CLF? is CLF nothing but long reaching movements? or are there inside and short handed movements found in there as well? hhhmmmmmm makes you wonder.

but i guess beauty is truly in the eyes of the beholder....and the gung fu i know and see it as is really pretty!!!! (and not meaning the eye pleasing aspect either).

all in all....the man didn't look half bad for being an older gentleman.....

[TenTigers]

How old is he? Yes, I agree. Kudos for anyone still banging it out. We've all seen superb athletes in their teens and twenties, but when they get past forties, fifties, sixties, and onwards, we should always stand up and take notice. What will we be like at that age? I give him alot of credit for that. I only wish he had retained more of his range of motion. Not just for performance sake, but for his overall health and longevity.

[hskwarrior]

Well he has the flow of our hung sing...so to speak...but his hands resemble more of the chan family method than the way we do it.

Grand Master Spencer is a very kind man...with a great personality. He has to be over 50....my sifu is around 65 so he must be somewhere in there. you'll notice his movement is totally different than that of my sifu.

[TenTigers]

I'm 52, so I'm guessing he's in his 70's.

[hskwarrior]

its quite possible

[DutchJenkins]

Hi guys, I came across this thread and thought I would clarify a couple of things.

Fred Spencer is now in the upper 60's (about 66 or 67 I believe), but when he did that performance in the video he was in his late 30's (that performance was done in the 80's...about 30 years ago). So as far as the way he moves compared to his age...he should have been doing it much better...age cannot be an excuse there.

Also, in the 80's he was claiming to have studied with Jew Leong, and then later with Doc Fai Wong. He was never even introduced to the "Chan Family" version of things until the early 90's...and even then he only paid to have forms put on video and never trained or practiced with his then teacher Master Ng Fu Hang.

Again, at the time of the performance in that video, he would have only learned the Jew Leong or DFW version of CLF.

This was just to clarify points.

F.Y.I. Chan Family practitioners use long arms and techniques at the beginning levels, and then as they move to Intermediate and Advanced levels, the learn more 2nd gate and 3rd gate (medium range and short range) techniques.

Thank you!

[hskwarrior]

Clarifying age and version of CLF
Hi guys, I came across this thread and thought I would clarify a couple of things.

Fred Spencer is now in the upper 60's (about 66 or 67 I believe), but when he did that performance in the video he was in his late 30's (that performance was done in the 80's...about 30 years ago). So as far as the way he moves compared to his age...he should have been doing it much better...age cannot be an excuse there.

Also, in the 80's he was claiming to have studied with Jew Leong, and then later with Doc Fai Wong. He was never even introduced to the "Chan Family" version of things until the early 90's...and even then he only paid to have forms put on video and never trained or practiced with his then teacher Master Ng Fu Hang.

Again, at the time of the performance in that video, he would have only learned the Jew Leong or DFW version of CLF.

This was just to clarify points.

F.Y.I. Chan Family practitioners use long arms and techniques at the beginning levels, and then as they move to Intermediate and Advanced levels, the learn more 2nd gate and 3rd gate (medium range and short range) techniques.

Thank you!

MASTER SPENCERS MOVEMENT IS FAR FROM BEING INDICATIVE OF THE LATE PROFESSOR JEW LEONG'S TEACHING.

THE SET SHOULD LOOK MORE LIKE THIS THAT WHAT YOU SEE HIM DO.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwWPUhNZ5vo

[DutchJenkins]

Yes, that was a much better example of CLF. This showed not only power, but you can see he knew what he was doing in the form. So now anyone can compare the two and see the Spencer's version was just another example of empty kung fu.

[Eric Olson]

Also, in the 80's he was claiming to have studied with Jew Leong, and then later with Doc Fai Wong. He was never even introduced to the "Chan Family" version of things until the early 90's...and even then he only paid to have forms put on video and never trained or practiced with his then teacher Master Ng Fu Hang.

Yep, that's sounds about right.