Forum rules

[kfson]

Where are they?

[sanjuro_ronin]

The first rule of Kungfuforumsonline:
No one talks about kungfuforumsonline !!

[David Jamieson]

Where are they?

over at trollshido.

at least here, the don't rewrite your posts like they do there.

hahaha, couldn't resist taking another shot at trollshido...god I hate that craphole.
:D

[MasterKiller]

The first rule of Kungfuforumsonline:
No one talks about kungfuforumsonline !!

What the hell is kungfuforumsonline?

This place has been called KFM since Kung Fu Online (KFO) became a whacky "reality-based" forum.

Get with the program!

[kfson]

over at trollshido.

at least here, the don't rewrite your posts like they do there.

hahaha, couldn't resist taking another shot at trollshido...god I hate that craphole.
:D

Yes, I've had the smell linger for a couple days after visiting a few of the other m.a. forums. On one, I was given a nasty computer virus for a dis-favorable critique, inbreeding for the win.

Any way, how can people be expected to toe the line if none (line) has been established or is in a different location one sub forum to the other?

[sanjuro_ronin]

What the hell is kungfuforumsonline?

This place has been called KFM since Kung Fu Online (KFO) became a whacky "reality-based" forum.

Get with the program!

Someone just broke the first rule !!
http://people.ucsc.edu/~jasalvad/Pictures/01_Fight_Club.jpg

[MasterKiller]

Any way, how can people be expected to toe the line if none (line) has been established or is in a different location one sub forum to the other?

We're kicking it Old Skool. It's up to you to figure out your own applications, Grasshoper. But when you mess up, I'm going to hit you with a pebble!

[kfson]

We're kicking it Old Skool. It's up to you to figure out your own applications, Grasshoper. But when you mess up, I'm going to hit you with a pebble!

Really, that's how I like it.

[David Jamieson]

when he says "hit" he means it in the hip hop sense and when he says pebble, well, that's his nickname for his john thomas.

[KC Elbows]

It seems like the rules are pretty clear. If you follow people around from thread to thread continuiing flaming tht usually has nothing to do with the thread at hand, end of thread. I could be wrong, but that's what seems to be happening. Easier than banning all the people doing the following, make the members hate them, hand out torches and gasoline, and then laugh while drinking baby's blood.

[uki]

Where are they?this ain't the McMA...

[1bad65]

It seems like the rules are pretty clear. If you follow people around from thread to thread continuiing flaming tht usually has nothing to do with the thread at hand, end of thread. I could be wrong, but that's what seems to be happening.

That is not what happened.

We were discussing healthcare and entitlement programs and staying on topic. MK locked it because he said I was a racist. None of those posting in the thread said anything about racism, only MK. The others in the thread even backed me up. No one was flaming, name-calling, or being racist. I even asked Gene to read my post in question. He did not say I was spewing racism either.

In short, everything was just fine until MK showed up.

[GeneChing]

The last thing I want to do is review all of your posts for any reason, 1bad65. Don't make me. I've got research to do. :rolleyes:

You don't really want me to judge between you and MK at this juncture. MK does a lot of work for this forum. It's a ***** to moderate it all and I'm grateful to all our moderators who pitch in and help. They don't get compensated for their efforts. They just get more abuse. Frankly, I will support those that support the forum.

[KC Elbows]

Maybe if the regulars on this forum HADN'T been following each other from thread to thread crapping up all the threads with their self fulfilling flame wars, members other than them would be concerned about MK's behavior.

In short, why should I have sympathy when every possibly good discussion here got derailed by BD, you, Drake, et al, and y'all's ongoing stuff? Why should I believe that was not the case here, when I can't think of a single political discussion in the last six months here that that argument didn't derail?

I'm not saying that you're wrong about that ONE thread, but I know I'm right about all those others, and I'm not going to the line to bag on MK, who I can't recall ever being a big part of those flame wars, when a lot of the people complaining did.

Six months of stuff you could've been banned for, and you complain about two days of MK. The people who run this forum don't have to put up with people following each other from topic to topic for little more that harrassment tactics: even if MK were to choose to do the same, what leg do you have to stand on to complain at this point?

I'm not expecting answers to the questions, just annoyed with the bickering and crapping up threads on both sides, and more than happy to see it end, and amused that there's nothing the partisan flamers can do about it but complain.:p:D

[Drake]

What have I derailed? Please, PLEASE tell me... most of the time I run into threads at their 12th page with people already going back and forth. But let me get this straight... others on this forum are NOTORIOUS for derailing threads, yet you single me out, and I haven't even done this? STFU. Thanx.

[Drake]

You know... you can have your 50% locked OT forum. I'll just stick to the Southern KF and Main forums. Have fun with this mess.

Herding kittens with chainsaws...

[KC Elbows]

What have I derailed? Please, PLEASE tell me... most of the time I run into threads at their 12th page with people already going back and forth. But let me get this straight... others on this forum are NOTORIOUS for derailing threads, yet you single me out, and I haven't even done this? STFU. Thanx.


On other parts of the forum, you have good threads. On this forum, well, you already explained, you'd jump in on page twelve shenanigans, which has been the whole forum for the last six months. No one derails a thread alone, it's always the idiots and the normally reasonable people who don't get that the rest of the forum doesn't need protection from the idiots, we ignore them.

Trolls only work when you have troll hunters.

[1bad65]

The last thing I want to do is review all of your posts for any reason, 1bad65. Don't make me. I've got research to do. :rolleyes:

You don't really want me to judge between you and MK at this juncture. MK does a lot of work for this forum. It's a ***** to moderate it all and I'm grateful to all our moderators who pitch in and help. They don't get compensated for their efforts. They just get more abuse. Frankly, I will support those that support the forum.

I posted the post in question before. If I repost just that post, will you give your opinion?

Look, I appreciate the work the mods do, and the fact you have this forum for us to use. Obviously I hang out in the OT and MMA area. I don't crap up threads where I know nothing about the topic. But MK calling me a racist, when I was not spewing racism in any way is wrong, mod or not.

[1bad65]

You know... you can have your 50% locked OT forum. I'll just stick to the Southern KF and Main forums. Have fun with this mess.

Herding kittens with chainsaws...

I'd really like it if you stuck around. You contribute alot, and you're a level-headed guy. This should blow over soon.

[Drake]

I'd really like it if you stuck around. You contribute alot, and you're a level-headed guy. This should blow over soon.

What does this have to do with the Tim Tebow ad? :eek:

[GeneChing]

No, I won't. My opinion doesn't really matter in this situation. As an American publisher, I personally believe in the freedom of speech, and that actually includes racists. So the point is really moot. Besides, like I said, I'd have to review all your old posts to judge and that would be worse then rereading all of the rejected submissions to the magazine.

More to the point is that there's you are contributing to another petty flame war.

More to the point is that I have to take time away from posting news items here, examining sanjuro_ronin's latest posted pic, and selling items to pay the bills.

If you feel you've been wronged by one of our moderators, it's a big internet. Find another forum. You can just walk away.

[kfson]

No, I won't. My opinion doesn't really matter in this situation. As an American publisher, I personally believe in the freedom of speech, and that actually includes racists. So the point is really moot. Besides, like I said, I'd have to review all your old posts to judge and that would be worse then rereading all of the rejected submissions to the magazine.

More to the point is that there's you are contributing to another petty flame war.

More to the point is that I have to take time away from posting news items here, examining sanjuro_ronin's latest posted pic, and selling items to pay the bills.

If you feel you've been wronged by one of our moderators, it's a big internet. Find another forum. You can just walk away.

Are there freelance writers contributing to the mag, you're saying?
No, not me.

[MasterKiller]

http://kungfuqigong.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=5621&stc=1&d=1267678001

[Scott R. Brown]

We're kicking it Old Skool. It's up to you to figure out your own applications, Grasshoper. But when you mess up, I'm going to hit you with a pebble!

Or a chainsaw!

Or a kitten!

[sanjuro_ronin]

I like Drake and I Like 1bad, even though he can be an ass and closed minded towards AUTHENTIC TCMA (tm) !!:D
Why?
Well, even though I don't agree with many of their posts, they contribute OUTSIDE of the political crap ( though not as much as they SHOULD).
I don't recall boulderdog doing that, at all...
I am not taking sides, just stating a view.
If MA found reason to lock a thread, I support the pasty nazi 100%, even if he was wrong, LOL !


examining sanjuro_ronin's latest posted pic,
http://flisted.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/jessica-gomes-2009-sports-illustrated-swimsuit-issue-6.jpg

[SanHeChuan]

OT Forum rule number ONLY.

Do not hurl insults or make personal attacks.

If you feel you MUST you can only do so in the form of Shakespearean language.

Thine forward voice, now, is to speak well of thine friend; thine backward voice is to utter foul speeches and to detract.

:p

[David Jamieson]

If we don't let the racists speak, how will we get our laughs?

Think of the racists! Please, help a racist today. Now, more than ever, we need laughs and they can only be gotten from letting the racists speak.

call today, make your pledge to racism.

:D

This has been brought to you by "racist flakes - they're grate!"

[kfson]

If we don't let the racists speak, how will we get our laughs?

Think of the racists! Please, help a racist today. Now, more than ever, we need laughs and they can only be gotten from letting the racists speak.

call today, make your pledge to racism.

:D

This has been brought to you by "racist flakes - they're grate!"


That's just wrong, wrong, wrong.
http://www.arras.net/circulars/archives/McCarthy.jpg

[David Jamieson]

That's just wrong, wrong, wrong.
http://www.arras.net/circulars/archives/McCarthy.jpg

how so?

how is it wrong to laugh at racists?
I think it's perfectly apropos. :)

[GeneChing]

Absolutely. Here are our submission guidelines (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/about/guidelines.php). I should add a clause that says "no racist submissions accepted" ;)

[KC Elbows]

I like Drake and I Like 1bad, even though he can be an ass and closed minded towards AUTHENTIC TCMA (tm) !!:D
Why?
Well, even though I don't agree with many of their posts, they contribute OUTSIDE of the political crap ( though not as much as they SHOULD).
I don't recall boulderdog doing that, at all...
I am not taking sides, just stating a view.
If MA found reason to lock a thread, I support the pasty nazi 100%, even if he was wrong, LOL !




I like them both also, my point was that this forum, because the arguments between them were all over, was craptacular.

As for Boulder Dawg, the problem is in the assumption that only those who have something to contribute to the martial discussion should be allowed to be part of the community. It's just not that type of forum. If the good members compel THEMSELVES to argue with the bad members, the tone and content here will be defined by the bad members. Flaming happens, and is usually not serious at first, but it tends to get out of hand.

Additionally, it's not the staff's role to explain the rules so we know how to behave. The rules are additional to the unspoken "be an adult".

In fairness, I've looked over Drake's posts after what he said, and it seems that maybe his main involvement came after being called a baby killer, so I apologize. I don't agree with the whole suicide thing, but I would hardly blame him for the rest's six month annoying crap that no one, no one here really cares about, and I will take them to task for whining about the staff when the staff's only role here, lacking, for good reason, any idealogical base, is to keep the place entertaining and semi-useful, both of which those members were affecting adversely.

[GeneChing]

The rules are really token, as is the punishment of banning. What it really comes down to is who calls "foul." It's a lot like sparring practice. Sometimes you get a pair of sparring partners that will both play dirty and both be fine with it. Other times, you'll get a partner that cries 'foul' whenever he or she is hit too hard. More likely, that person will strike back in anger, and anger can be so contagious.

Just like in sparring, we don't want anyone to really get hurt. But if you don't walk away with a bruise or two, you're not really trying. ;)

[sanjuro_ronin]

As a former military man I understand where Drake is coming from.
If it wasn't for the military most of the people that have issues with the military would be hiding under their beds.
Still, I fought and bleed and did worse in the name of freedom and protecting innocents and people's rights to call us "babykillers".
That's ok because I still remember the cries of hope and joy from Musilms in Bosnia when we were there.

[KC Elbows]

As a former military man I understand where Drake is coming from.
If it wasn't for the military most of the people that have issues with the military would be hiding under their beds.
Still, I fought and bleed and did worse in the name of freedom and protecting innocents and people's rights to call us "babykillers".
That's ok because I still remember the cries of hope and joy from Musilms in Bosnia when we were there.

I wasn't trying to continue the topic, but I would say that you didn't fight in order to justify or feed a glottonous culture either, but we all know that some who send the military to fight have that in their heads, too.

If we only used the military to fight to protect freedom, you and Drake would be 100% right.

If we only sent them to feed our ability to recreationally ride on ATV's and Drive Hummers consequences be ****ed, have artificially low prices on limited quantity goods, et al, the other side would be 100% right.

My position is that the worst thing that could ever happen to the military man and civilian as well is the end of that self critical discussion.

[sanjuro_ronin]

No one knows better than military guys what is wrong with the military.
Believe me.

[Drake]

I wasn't trying to continue the topic, but I would say that you didn't fight in order to justify or feed a glottonous culture either, but we all know that some who send the military to fight have that in their heads, too.

If we only used the military to fight to protect freedom, you and Drake would be 100% right.

If we only sent them to feed our ability to recreationally ride on ATV's and Drive Hummers consequences be ****ed, have artificially low prices on limited quantity goods, et al, the other side would be 100% right.

My position is that the worst thing that could ever happen to the military man and civilian as well is the end of that self critical discussion.

Pithy, but inaccurate. Last I checked, we had zero profit coming out of Bosnia. I dated a Croatian girl while in Germany, probably around the time when Paul was over there. She used to tell me they were killing each other over there, neighbor vs neighbor, and nobody really knew why.

Same with Afghanistan. All they have to export is disgruntled expert fighters and religious dictatorship. There's no cash return for that place.

And Iraq (wait for it), was more about not even bad intel, per se, but misinterpreted intel, a job left half finished after Desert Storm, and a clever but ultimately self-defeating tactic by Saddam.

Believe me.... if I thought for a SECOND that I was working to secure oil, help people buy nice cars, or finish off old grudges, I would've dropped my paperwork months ago.

[KC Elbows]

I don't put the blame on the military. Even in Viet Nam, the actual guys who actually killed kids were likely so low down the totem pole, unstable people put in an unreasonable situation and acting predictably.

Some problems are political and cultural, but play out economically and militarily, or in other venues.

[Drake]

I don't put the blame on the military. Even in Viet Nam, the actual guys who actually killed kids were likely so low down the totem pole, unstable people put in an unreasonable situation and acting predictably.

Some problems are political and cultural, but play out economically and militarily, or in other venues.

Considering the nature of war, past behaviors of other armies, and the nature of Mao's insurgency doctrine, it's a wonder we performed as remarkably well as we did in Vietnam.

Let me tell you a story I heard from an old retired warrant officer who served there. He was part of a detail guarding an ammo depot, and a child approached their post. They warned the child to stay away, used hand signals, and finally had no choice but to aim their weapons at the child. The child kept moving towards them. They then, reluctantly, fired a warning shot. Child continued moving towards them. Finally, they had no choice, and they shot the child, a little girl. She exploded. She was rigged with explosives, and was sent in to destroy the ammo depot.

War is hell, and moral decisions become a hell of a lot more murky in these scenarios. I don't mind people making their armchair assessments about how we operate, because that is to be expected. However, unless you've been in those boots, and had to do something like that, then you really have no perspective to make a sound judgment.

[KC Elbows]

Believe me.... if I thought for a SECOND that I was working to secure oil, help people buy nice cars, or finish off old grudges, I would've dropped my paperwork months ago.

Stability in a region we only care about economically for one product requires footholds, this is not leftist theory, but neocon, real neocon, not "everyone on the right is a neocon". If Iraq yielded oil was less an issue than protecting our influence in the larger region of oil producing nations.

However, Bush, for all his flaws, was not a neocon, and the same for others, so the effects, as in many things in our system, become mixed blends of good and bad.

Since Reagan, there's been bluster about using our own oil, and no one on either side in the presidency thought it was worth real effort. The importance of stability in the region, our acts in the past that muddied it(rigging elections, etc), for us, it's mainly important because of one resource over all others that the region possesses,and secondarily important because of the possibility of open warfare spilling over, as far as policy goes.

I can agree that, regardless of the intel, and we can argue misinterpreted over nuanced, that Iraq would have liked nukes, that nukes pose a quandary, and that there is no one clear solution to that quandary, and so we can at least be certain that Saddam Hussein can never have nukes, being dead and all. Past that, when major people influencing the policy decisionmaking that lead to war based it on the idea of making sure we had a solid foothold in the oil producing nations, you cannot simply wipe away that aspect of it. Given that, it was not the only influence in policy, so again, things are not 100% one way, as is true in most US politics, or anywhere, for that matter.

From there, I would say that, using South Korea and Taiwan as examples, there have been succeses in forming democracies, and, while starting brutally, they did become more moderate. The question is, since both were based around local, semi-legitimate control, shall Iraq become the same, and can Afghanistan? I hope so, but this requires legitimacy and stability, only the latter of which we can hope to provide, as no people can legitimately be controlled when an outside power dictates too freely.

This has nothing to do with babies and soldiers, but how a nation acts on policy sometimes does, but not always, and, given that my nephew is a marine, I hope not here.

[KC Elbows]

Considering the nature of war, past behaviors of other armies, and the nature of Mao's insurgency doctrine, it's a wonder we performed as remarkably well as we did in Vietnam.

Let me tell you a story I heard from an old retired warrant officer who served there. He was part of a detail guarding an ammo depot, and a child approached their post. They warned the child to stay away, used hand signals, and finally had no choice but to aim their weapons at the child. The child kept moving towards them. They then, reluctantly, fired a warning shot. Child continued moving towards them. Finally, they had no choice, and they shot the child, a little girl. She exploded. She was rigged with explosives, and was sent in to destroy the ammo depot.

War is hell, and moral decisions become a hell of a lot more murky in these scenarios. I don't mind people making their armchair assessments about how we operate, because that is to be expected. However, unless you've been in those boots, and had to do something like that, then you really have no perspective to make a sound judgment.

This is no surprise. I'm leary of both freedom fighters and imperialists, and especially those on either side that coach their language in virtue while using any means to justify their ends. I'm also leary of citizens who tax their system with material demands that they relabel freedoms.

[1bad65]

I just think it's low class to insult ALL military personnel for the actions of a few. We owe 99.999% of them more thanks than we can give them. Every demographic has bad apples. To equate everyone for the acts of a few is wrong. And coming from a self-professed liberal, it was the ultimate in hypocracy. Liberals claim to despise all prejudices.

Thats where the word comes from, the word "pre" and the word "judge". Anyone saying all military personnel are rapists and murderers is prejudging all of them due to the acts of a few.

[1bad65]

From there, I would say that, using South Korea and Taiwan as examples, there have been succeses in forming democracies, and, while starting brutally, they did become more moderate. The question is, since both were based around local, semi-legitimate control, shall Iraq become the same, and can Afghanistan? I hope so, but this requires legitimacy and stability, only the latter of which we can hope to provide, as no people can legitimately be controlled when an outside power dictates too freely.

The problem with bringing democracy to any Muslim nation is that none of them has ever had a democracy. So in effect, they don't know what they are missing. For centuries, the citizenry in the Middle East (except Israel, the Jewish state) has never really had a voice. Democracy is a beautiful thing, but if you have never had it, it's hard to fathom how great it really is.

Look at how the average citizen lives in Israel, and how the average citizen lives in any of the other Middle East nations. Which people have it better?

[KC Elbows]

I thought Drake, Ronin, and I were discussing something, but it wasn't another member at this point, really, but a broader topic. I think everyone would like to keep it that way, please.

If, in discussing politics and policy, I am forced to always cite you and Boulderdawg, I swear, I will kill a baby and blame it on Drake. Don't you support our troops?

[KC Elbows]

The problem with bringing democracy to any Muslim nation is that none of them has ever had a democracy. So in effect, they don't know what they are missing. For centuries, the citizenry in the Middle East (except Israel, the Jewish state) has never really had a voice. Democracy is a beautiful thing, but if you have never had it, it's hard to fathom how great it really is.

Look at how the average citizen lives in Israel, and how the average citizen lives in any of the other Middle East nations. Which people have it better?

We rigged an election in Iran to install someone we wanted. An election.
Democracy. Middle East. We rigged it. Blowback, anyone?

[David Jamieson]

The problem with bringing democracy to any Muslim nation is that none of them has ever had a democracy. So in effect, they don't know what they are missing. For centuries, the citizenry in the Middle East (except Israel, the Jewish state) has never really had a voice. Democracy is a beautiful thing, but if you have never had it, it's hard to fathom how great it really is.

Look at how the average citizen lives in Israel, and how the average citizen lives in any of the other Middle East nations. Which people have it better?

all is relative.

driving through mexico on the way to chichenitza i couldn't help but notice how many people live in shacks in the forests.

many are quite happy in the simplicity of their lives, they know no different.

I think it would be in teh best interest of teh west to let the middle east have their Caliphate, minus Israel and anyone else who wanted out of that and we normalize relations with the Caliphate.

Done!

I mean, if America is the example of democracy, how is that appealing to anyone looking at the state of that country? lol

How about Canada? It's a democracy, but apparently a constitutional monarchy with some socialist aspects isn't considered a democracy.

exactly what was the plan? Oh yeah, there was NO plan. It was wanton, sloppy, not well thought out invasion and occupation as ordered by ...well you know who.

No exit plan and now Obama is in the liars chair as Iraq stays the same, afghanistan rages on and Gitmo, yep Gitmo is still open and still holding prisoners without habeus corpus!

yeah, lets be like america! not.

[Drake]

Oh yeah... we're holding folks in GITMO because we just want to, right? How about Canada help us out and adopt these poor, lost souls, eh? They ARE free to a good home. Too bad the rest of the world refuses to take them. Including your loving nation. Don't criticize if you're part of the problem.

[1bad65]

We rigged an election in Iran to install someone we wanted. An election.
Democracy. Middle East. We rigged it. Blowback, anyone?

We did not rig that election. Yes, the guy we wanted to win did win, but we did not rig that election. Now alot of people are saying that nutbar leader in Iran right now just won a rigged election.

And we did not rig the elections in Iraq either.

[1bad65]

yeah, lets be like america! not.

If they start crashing planes into you guys' buildings and killing thousands of your innocent civilians, I'm betting you would think differently.

[KC Elbows]

We did not rig that election.

Yes, we did.

[1bad65]

Which election are you thinking of? I don't believe the Shah ever won an election, but I could be wrong.

[KC Elbows]

Which election are you thinking of? I don't believe the Shah ever won an election, but I could be wrong.

I stand corrected, we overthrew the elected leader of Iran to reinstate the Shah, which still means that both 1) democratic institutions were in place in the region, and 2) We subverted them for our own interests.

The first is important, because it suggests that people in the region do have awareness of democratic principles, and even may be aware of value to them we don't, since we've not had our system so manipulated by outside forces, and second, that we, who should value them so much more, didn't, and so it isn't a given that our conception of democracy is more mature or better than theirs, just more free from outside interference, and less driven to extremes by fear of repeats. A similar argument, re:they don't understand why democracy is good, was often used against5 the Chinese, both nationalists and communists, but the reality was, most Chinese were not going to choose dependency on the US or other Western powers when most of them had quite recently adequately proven they couldn't be trusted in that role to look out for any but their own interests, and so most sided with the Communists, while Jiang, himself unable to control much of China, and never, before the departure to Taiwan, seen as much more than a warlord from an era of warlords, a description that, pre Taiwan, was spot on, had to cede the rest of the country.

On the flip side, any group that holds a fundamental and thus non-critical approach to following an ancient text is a danger to democracy. If someone's book says some moderate person I know is going to hell, should be persecuted, is an infidel, can be kept as a slave, and the followers are completely unable to either discount this as from a bygone era or simply expunge it from the book, I fail to see how they can take part in a functioning democracy. However, if two cultures that have such in their midst, in prominent roles, get in a tiff, neither can point the finger on that issue without cleaning their own house. Thus, an additional pressure during the sixties to establish greater equality for women and minorities was the stinging criticism from the soviets on those issues.

[David Jamieson]

If they start crashing planes into you guys' buildings and killing thousands of your innocent civilians, I'm betting you would think differently.

Dude, Canadians died in that hit. :mad:

It was the "world trade center" after all.

[MasterKiller]

OT Forum rule number ONLY.

Do not hurl insults or make personal attacks.

If you feel you MUST you can only do so in the form of Shakespearean language.

Thine forward voice, now, is to speak well of thine friend; thine backward voice is to utter foul speeches and to detract.

:p

http://i47.tinypic.com/2pyzthv.jpg

[MasterKiller]

http://i47.tinypic.com/t5prlv.jpg

[MasterKiller]

http://i46.tinypic.com/e7ngpt.jpg

[MasterKiller]

http://static.funnyjunk.com/pictures/expose_bosom.png