Test

[the art]

Hi all, it's been awhile, I think a month since I last posted here. Found my kung fu gym BTW. Or kwoon. Question, is anyone here not interested in testing? What if you are perfectly happy learning and working out and do not really want to test?

I'm totally forgetting moves and can't keep my balance so I guess for me this answer is easy - not ready to test!

But what about the rest of you - do any of you dislike the idea of "testing"?

Thanks!!!!!!

[David Jamieson]

testing?

what do you mean by testing?
you mean belt rankings where you do a little dance a couple of kow tows a how do you do sir and you get a shiny sash and a certificate?

well, in my opinion, that's a load of crap.

but testing your art? yes, you should. You should learn it, and then test it in a fashion that will reveal to you your own failing in understanding and where to improve that failing and to make the changes accordingly.

dance routines that cost a small fee and render unto you a useless rank are silly though. :)

[the art]

David,

Yes, a silly dance LOL. Actually, this particular place makes you work your arse off for the test. So the test is really a test, just one I don't wanna take.

I can see testing myself - we do that at home. And then practice or ask for help during the next class.

But like you say, I am really not interested in dishing out some cash just to get a pretty colored sash. I love kung fu. I love the training, I love the social aspect, love that it's helping me and my husband's relationship. Just don't want to test. No real desire there.

[KC Elbows]

If you don't want to work for rank, make that clear.

[Drake]

It's a way to quantify your progress. If you want to stay at the basic level your whole life, that's fine, and nobody will judge you for it. However, there should be some way of measuring your progress and how ready you are to move on. Don't expect to learn any super moves, though. Everyone I know agrees that punch/kick seems to work just fine, and if you are good at them, you'll win most fights.

[the art]

Hi,

I suppose my goals in kung fu are exactly as stated to the sifu, in this order, lose weight, have fun, learn kung fu.

It's not that I want to stay basic for the rest of my life, that's not my goal, but really I can't see attending this school longer than 6 mos. At that point we'd like to try something else. I know kung fu isn't learned in 6 mos. or a lifetime, that's just how long we want to spend doing it.

I thought I made it clear but maybe I didn't. I hardly get to talk to the sifu alone but if I get the chance I suppose I will bring it up.

Thanks for the responses. I'd love to hear from others too if they want to pipe up.

[MasterKiller]

Hi,

I suppose my goals in kung fu are exactly as stated to the sifu, in this order, lose weight, have fun, learn kung fu.

It's not that I want to stay basic for the rest of my life, that's not my goal, but really I can't see attending this school longer than 6 mos. At that point we'd like to try something else. I know kung fu isn't learned in 6 mos. or a lifetime, that's just how long we want to spend doing it.

I thought I made it clear but maybe I didn't. I hardly get to talk to the sifu alone but if I get the chance I suppose I will bring it up.

Thanks for the responses. I'd love to hear from others too if they want to pipe up.

Honestly, if you only plan on being there 6 months, you shouldn't waste the instructor's time with discussion of tests or promotions. Just show up, lose some belly fat, and don't bother the other people that actually plan on dedicating themselves to the art.

[hskwarrior]

If you're paying close attention to your own progress, for example, as you said you don't even have good balance yet, once you notice over time that your balance is getting better than you know you're improving. if you're sparring and you suck now, but notice you're a bit better 6 months from now, you know you're improving. if you can't sit in a horse 30 secs today, but can do 15 minutes 2 months later, you're improving. you can be your own best judge.

In our school, we don't test. never have. it's really an ego thing in my opinion. Yes, we all like to have our efforts recognized, but a test, trophy, belt, or certificate will never be the true judge of your skills. it's only a form of recognition of your hard work.

you display a belt around your waist, display a trophy on your shelf, or a certificate on your wall. but ask yourself, do you really need that to tell you you're good?

[David Jamieson]

Hi,

I suppose my goals in kung fu are exactly as stated to the sifu, in this order, lose weight, have fun, learn kung fu.

It's not that I want to stay basic for the rest of my life, that's not my goal, but really I can't see attending this school longer than 6 mos. At that point we'd like to try something else. I know kung fu isn't learned in 6 mos. or a lifetime, that's just how long we want to spend doing it.

I thought I made it clear but maybe I didn't. I hardly get to talk to the sifu alone but if I get the chance I suppose I will bring it up.

Thanks for the responses. I'd love to hear from others too if they want to pipe up.

Kung fu workouts aren't the best way to lose weight or have fun. lol
Lot's of time classes aren't structure in a way to move towards weight loss, the weight loss will happen in your own time with your cardio workout efforts, but with kungfu, a lot of it is anaerobic and won't help you lose weight.

also, just going to a kung fu school for 6 months is a total waste of time both yours and the teachers.

Your efforts would be better spent hitting a treadmill at a gym and getting into a healthier lifestyle.

Maybe return to Kung fu later when you actually want to learn Kung fu. :)

[hskwarrior]

Kung fu workouts aren't the best way to lose weight or have fun. lol

my student loved training traditional gung fu style. he came to me at 315 lbs, and went back home at 256 lbs. and he had fun.

[the art]

Honestly, if you only plan on being there 6 months, you shouldn't waste the instructor's time with discussion of tests or promotions. Just show up, lose some belly fat, and don't bother the other people that actually plan on dedicating themselves to the art.

Master: I totally 100% agree with what you've said. Only thing, HE'S the one pushing to test. So really he's wasting his time with us from that perspective. I expect to be pushed somewhat, not only with tests but with training, actually especially with training. But if someone keeps saying, I don't want to test well then back off!

And I do respect those that are pursuing kung fu as a life practice. Maybe I'll be one of those people after 6 mos., who knows? But for now, I'm so new I'm happy just practicing and working hard and losing belly fat. Which strangely seems to be taking forever but I am keeping a diary of food so that should help a lot.

[the art]

If you're paying close attention to your own progress, for example, as you said you don't even have good balance yet, once you notice over time that your balance is getting better than you know you're improving. if you're sparring and you suck now, but notice you're a bit better 6 months from now, you know you're improving. if you can't sit in a horse 30 secs today, but can do 15 minutes 2 months later, you're improving. you can be your own best judge.

In our school, we don't test. never have. it's really an ego thing in my opinion. Yes, we all like to have our efforts recognized, but a test, trophy, belt, or certificate will never be the true judge of your skills. it's only a form of recognition of your hard work.

you display a belt around your waist, display a trophy on your shelf, or a certificate on your wall. but ask yourself, do you really need that to tell you you're good?

Thanks for that. Funny after reading your post I thought of the multiple college degrees I have. How hard I worked for them. And yet the diplomas are in my closet. LOL.

So ego, yeah, I can see that. Maybe not for all, maybe some people really thrive over the sash thing and it pushes them to get better. For me it's kind of pointless.

And yep, I'm improving. I can now do THREE pushups LOL.

[the art]

I respectfully disagree with just about your entire post.

Not all schools are the same, no? Not all sifus are the same, no? Hence, maybe some schools aren't fun. This one is. The sifu has a great sense of humor. He's very good at pushing you when you need it, and laying off when you need it. The students are a great group. We laugh, talk, hang out for hours after class. So there's the fun part.

Losing weight? You must be joking. Now again, maybe some schools just have you sit in a horse stance for awhile and that's your workout. Not this one, oh freaking no, this is a class of hardcore training, basically calisthenics for about an hour and then another hour of training on forms. I have to wring my t-shirt out when I'm done and I'm really not that out of shape.

I also completely disagree with your statement about how I'm wasting my time and should go to a gym. Firstly, I've been "trying" to go to a gym for years now. Turns out, I hated it!! My husband hated it!! Why would you keep doing something that obviously is not working? Now we go together to class, actually look forward to class. Our relationship is def. improving. We've made friends. So no, I don't think it's a waste of time.

Lastly, we aren't just hanging out and laughing and screwing around. We work hard. We do take it seriously. And the fact that we paid this sifu for 6 mos. upfront should say something.


Kung fu workouts aren't the best way to lose weight or have fun. lol
Lot's of time classes aren't structure in a way to move towards weight loss, the weight loss will happen in your own time with your cardio workout efforts, but with kungfu, a lot of it is anaerobic and won't help you lose weight.

also, just going to a kung fu school for 6 months is a total waste of time both yours and the teachers.

Your efforts would be better spent hitting a treadmill at a gym and getting into a healthier lifestyle.

Maybe return to Kung fu later when you actually want to learn Kung fu. :)

[MasterKiller]

Master: I totally 100% agree with what you've said. Only thing, HE'S the one pushing to test. So really he's wasting his time with us from that perspective. I expect to be pushed somewhat, not only with tests but with training, actually especially with training. But if someone keeps saying, I don't want to test well then back off! He is probably pushing you for one of two reasons: A) he wants your money before you bail or B) he thinks if you get promoted, it will give you more motivation to stick around.

Either way, it's his class and he can run it how he sees fit. If you don't like the pressure, then exercise your rights as an American and stop paying to attend his classes. Personally, if a student told me in my classes to "back off," I'd give him some lessons in humility on the mat until he voluntarily left. Either accept his method or don't.


And I do respect those that are pursuing kung fu as a life practice. Maybe I'll be one of those people after 6 mos., who knows? But for now, I'm so new I'm happy just practicing and working hard and losing belly fat. Which strangely seems to be taking forever but I am keeping a diary of food so that should help a lot. Well, like DJ said, kung fu isn't the best option if that is your only goal. It's a tool, and like any tool, it's usefulness is heavily contextual.

[the art]

Yes, our pounds are coming off, slowly but surely. That is a great thing. My mood has improved greatly, I can handle work stress much better, I'm much more energetic throughout the day, I'm making smart choices about food when before I had a "screw it" attitude. And I sleep good and wake up good (minus the soreness!!)


my student loved training traditional gung fu style. he came to me at 315 lbs, and went back home at 256 lbs. and he had fun.

[the art]

Master: It's probably a mixture of both reasons for the pushing, I think.

I wouldn't tell him literally to "back off", that's a bit rude and it was just a phrase I was using to get my point across. We've paid him for 6 mos. and with that we decided to turn ourselves over to this school and do our best.

Yeah, I know I could go to the gym 5 nights a week for 2 hours and lose weight faster. I guess my thought on that is this: If I cannot stick to the gym because I absolutely hate it with a passion, then that route is really bad. As what would happen in that scenario (and has happened a million times before) is I burn out, because I hate it, fall off the wagon completely and then gain back whatever it was I lost.

The pounds aren't dropping magically, but I'd say I'm at an even 1-2 lb. loss a week. My goal is to lose 25 lbs. So doing the math I'd say in 6 mos. of kung fu and eating correctly I'd be able to meet that goal and beyond.


He is probably pushing you for one of two reasons: A) he wants your money before you bail or B) he thinks if you get promoted, it will give you more motivation to stick around.

Either way, it's his class and he can run it how he sees fit. If you don't like the pressure, then exercise your rights as an American and stop paying to attend his classes. Personally, if a student told me in my classes to "back off," I'd give him some lessons in humility on the mat until he voluntarily left. Either accept his method or don't.

Well, like DJ said, kung fu isn't the best option if that is your only goal. It's a tool, and like any tool, it's usefulness is heavily contextual.

[MasterKiller]

Yeah, I know I could go to the gym 5 nights a week for 2 hours and lose weight faster. I guess my thought on that is this: If I cannot stick to the gym because I absolutely hate it with a passion, then that route is really bad. As what would happen in that scenario (and has happened a million times before) is I burn out, because I hate it, fall off the wagon completely and then gain back whatever it was I lost. I understand this completely.

Your teacher has probably been around long enough to realize that people also get bored failry quickly only doing basics in class. Getting people motivated to test is a good way to keep them motivated to train because they have achievable, identifiable goals to accomplish.

Also, some material might be held back from you until you achieve a new rank, so that's something else to consider.


The pounds aren't dropping magically, but I'd say I'm at an even 1-2 lb. loss a week. My goal is to lose 25 lbs. So doing the math I'd say in 6 mos. of kung fu and eating correctly I'd be able to meet that goal and beyond. Eating properly is the real key. But the kung fu won't hurt, either. ;)


Good luck!

[David Jamieson]

I don't mean to rub you the wrong way but:

After you lose the 25 lbs you want to lose, what then? What have you got in place to ensure that you keep it off? Do you have a diet and exercise regimen in the works that will maintain your loss and perhaps even take you further to an even healthier version?

Because you need to do that.

Practicing basic kungfu will have some effect at first, especially if you don't exercise to begin with, but you will plateau quickly as far as weight loss goes and you will find that Kung fu isn't really going to help with that, but intense cardio, every day will and quite frankly, there aren't a lot of kung fu schools that do modern regimens of intense cardio workouts.

TO lose weight, Diet is totally important as is intense cardio workouts everyday.
You will not want to lose muscle mass and so you will need to also do resistance training (weights etc) and finally, you cannot spot lose or reduce fat on your body. When you lose weight, you loss overall mass and not just fat and that's why diet and resistance workout is also required.

Kung fu is martial art. It is about understanding yourself and your capabilities and it is about building up yourself to where you can attack and defend in a physical conflict. It's not really designed for weight loss or fun.

So, while you may disagree, I can tell you from direct experience that you are going to need a whole lot more than 6 months of kung fu and a small change in your diet.

[the art]

Thanks for helping me see the test in a new light. And yes, I think we are only going to get so much until we test. But for now I guess what we are learning is still really hard for us - like kick stances and balance, so no worry about testing anytime soon!

Our sifu is pretty good at mixing up the class. We do all kinds of stuff, things I never thought I could do like doing upside down pushups while hand standing on two cinder blocks. Crazy. But I like it. We do look forward to class. And limping out afterwards. LOL

I know about eating, I log my food in every day and that helps a lot.


I understand this completely.

Your teacher has probably been around long enough to realize that people also get bored failry quickly only doing basics in class. Getting people motivated to test is a good way to keep them motivated to train because they have achievable, identifiable goals to accomplish.

Also, some material might be held back from you until you achieve a new rank, so that's something else to consider.

Eating properly is the real key. But the kung fu won't hurt, either. ;)


Good luck!

[the art]

You didn't rub me the wrong way!

Well, we've thought about pursuing something else. Like yoga, or kickboxing, or even another kwoon. Diet is something that always goes well for us as long as we are active. It's a bad cycle. We stop working out, then eat crap food. But if we are working out, eating good is much easier.

25 lbs. is also a reasonable goal - it's not my ultimate goal but more of a reachable short term goal, you know? So what after the 25 lbs.? Maybe another 10! And then the goal becomes maintaining. For good.

I know that we will plateau, in which case I suppose we'll approach that when it happens.

Well, it's ok to disagree. That's why we are human. As to your last statement, you don't really specify. We are going to need a lot more than 6 mos. for what?

Whether kung fu is not designed for weight loss or fun I feel is a personal view. We personally find it beneficial for losing weight and we personally have fun. Maybe not others, but we do.

We realize we cannot spot lose weight. We are not doing that. This class is like a boot camp, not just practicing forms.


I don't mean to rub you the wrong way but:

After you lose the 25 lbs you want to lose, what then? What have you got in place to ensure that you keep it off? Do you have a diet and exercise regimen in the works that will maintain your loss and perhaps even take you further to an even healthier version?

Because you need to do that.

Practicing basic kungfu will have some effect at first, especially if you don't exercise to begin with, but you will plateau quickly as far as weight loss goes and you will find that Kung fu isn't really going to help with that, but intense cardio, every day will and quite frankly, there aren't a lot of kung fu schools that do modern regimens of intense cardio workouts.

TO lose weight, Diet is totally important as is intense cardio workouts everyday.
You will not want to lose muscle mass and so you will need to also do resistance training (weights etc) and finally, you cannot spot lose or reduce fat on your body. When you lose weight, you loss overall mass and not just fat and that's why diet and resistance workout is also required.

Kung fu is martial art. It is about understanding yourself and your capabilities and it is about building up yourself to where you can attack and defend in a physical conflict. It's not really designed for weight loss or fun.

So, while you may disagree, I can tell you from direct experience that you are going to need a whole lot more than 6 months of kung fu and a small change in your diet.