Ou-Der Kun Tao ???

[Yao Sing]

Anyone know anything about this style? Supposed to be Chinese based in Taiwan but doesn't sound like it to me.

I stumbled across a website for Traditional Temple Training (http://www.traditionaltempletraining.com/)and the bio says:

"I was greatly privileged to have been a student of Grand Master Frank Masiello, the highest ranking Master of the Ou-Der Kun Tao (Way of Military Virtue) style in the United States. He trained in Taiwan under the Head Master of the style (Hung Dai Shi), travelling China in the early 1960's, becoming a six province Mainland China Champion in full contact matches. I hold a 5th Degree Master rank in the Ou-Der Kun Tao style."

Anyone familiar with these names?

Also Lo-Chi-Shou, claimed to be a Shaolin style.

[cerebus]

Ou-Der Kun Tao? Way of the stinky fist? :D

[cerebus]

Travelling through mainland China fighting full-contact matches in the 60s? Not saying it isn't true, but.... there weren't ANY Americans being allowed into mainland China in the '60s, much less being allowed to go around fighting with/ beating up Communist comrades ....

[goju]

didnt the dethouars brothers largely bring that sttyle over here?

[Dale Dugas]

Wu De Kun Tao. Horrible pin yin transliteration.

Never have heard of it.

Lots of Grandmaster this and Grandmaster talk on the web page.

red flags a rising.....

[mooyingmantis]

Travelling through mainland China fighting full-contact matches in the 60s? Not saying it isn't true, but.... there weren't ANY Americans being allowed into mainland China in the '60s, much less being allowed to go around fighting with/ beating up Communist comrades ....

Very true, U.S. relations didn't open up with China until President Nixon's administration paved the way in 1970.

[Yao Sing]

I especially liked this:
"Grand Master Hardy is a phenomenal teacher, incredible fighter and healer. He was, is, and will always be my Shifu. He awarded me, with approval from China, my present rank."

China approved his rank.

[taai gihk yahn]

Ou-Der Kun Tao? Way of the stinky fist? :D

well, way of the stinky something...:eek:

[WC_Lun]

Also, in the 60's weren't full contact matches and showing you studied martial arts grounds to be put in prison in China? At least until the late 60's when the government decided to classify the arts as a cultural treasure. I might be off on my years, but I'm pretty sure fighting was very frowned upon.

[Dale Dugas]

I just received this email which detailed this thread.

It took the poster more than two years to contact me.

wow.

This message was sent from:
http://www.daledugas.com/contact.html
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Name of sender: brian
Email of sender: brian.ronin47@gmail.com
------------------------- COMMENTS -------------------------

I read your posting from a few years ago commenting on ou der kuntao. I am in the process of learning kuntao from grandmaster frank. I have spent my life like you learning martial arts, frank is the real deal he will only teach small classes and does not charge and what he has taught me in my very brief time spent with him is unlike anything I have seen. You were not disrespectful in your post, however before you comment about someone you should know what you are talking about. I could very easily look at what you claim and talk bad about you.

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Seems we have dissed the wrong Grandmaster.

My door is always open, I fly peac/ock feathers on my sun toi. That means I never have a problem with accepting challenge matches.

I always open to cross hands to show what I can do and what others cannot.

Im sorry but you need to learn to speak better Chinese. It is not Ou Der, but Wu De. Seems our GM has some issues with using Pin Yin versus his Pigeon Chinese.

[mickey]

Greetings,

If you read carefully you will see that they have a lineage link to Pai Lum.

Also, either the paragraph initially quoted was corrupted or the people made a correction, it says "traveling Taiwan" and not "traveling China".

And I do not know these guys and I am not defending them. But if you are going to tell it, then tell it right.

mickey

[TenTigers]

do they know Grandmaster Hung Dai Shi's full name? It sounds more like his title (Dai-Shi).

[bawang]

I hold a 5th Degree Master rank

WEE WOO WEE WOO WEE WOOo

[David Jamieson]

I've heard of Kun Tao before but not this.
Is it a dialect thing?

[Dale Dugas]

some rather weird pigeon chinese.

There is a website out there that has the Hanzi wrong and has the characters backwards.

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv155/Boston_Baguazhang/Kuntaosmall.gif from http://www.taiwaneseboxing.com/Main.htm

They do a bad job of writing them as well. Again amateurs who are trying to write Chinese who have no idea how to correctly write them nor can they pronounce them for people who supposedly received a complete system from a Master Hung in Taiwan.

No one in Taiwan or China says Kuntao that I know of. And your style is called Martial Virtue Kun Tao or Wu De Quan Dao?

Pai lum connections? Meh.

[TenTigers]

Kuntao is an Indonesian term...not that it isn't possible for it to have emigrated to Taiwan...just sayin'..

[Dale Dugas]

Coulda, woulda, shoulda,

Just very strange they talk about Taiwan and Chinese arts but use an Indonesian Moniker.

The site I linked to talks about Judo being the same in meaning as Wu De.

Red Flags flying high.

misinformation flying around.

[Shaolin]

I studied a Kun Tao for a short period years ago (I think in 2004-2005) under an instructor named Lu Robinson here in Phoenix. He trained under Arthur Sikes (http://www.nasda.net/gmhistory.htm). We didn't go into much history of the art other than it was Indonesian and was typically taught only to royalty in classic times. Sikes visited us a few times, he was an interesting fellow to learn from.