La clf

[LadySnow]

hey guys anyone have any info on these guys?

http://www.youtube.com/user/LABukXingGwoon

just saw them on youtube and im from LA, wanna know where they train.

[David Jamieson]

hey guys anyone have any info on these guys?

http://www.youtube.com/user/LABukXingGwoon

just saw them on youtube and im from LA, wanna know where they train.

They provide a link on that page to contact them.

[Syn7]

i couldnt find Los Angeles Buk Xing Gwoon with a google search... interesting... ne website link, nada... just a contact user button... guess its ur only option... :rolleyes::)

[LadySnow]

I was hoping someone had a website for their school that i could look at aswell. I guess I'll contact them on youtube profile.

thanks guys!!!

by the way does anybody have any info on this guy or this guy's master Tarm Sing?

[David Jamieson]

I was hoping someone had a website for their school that i could look at aswell. I guess I'll contact them on youtube profile.

thanks guys!!!

by the way does anybody have any info on this guy or this guy's master Tarm Sing?

Tarm Sing?

Tam Sam is credited with being the founder of the buk sing style of choy li fut in and around the 1920's.

Maybe that's who he's thinking of? I didin't look at any of the clips really, jsut a cursory glance.

there are Buk Sing Kwoons in Los Angeles though I would think.

And does it have to be Buk Sing? There are several kung fu styles available in ubiquity as well.

[brothernumber9]

it's right there in the video. The chart at the end of the vid illustrates Tarm Sing was Tarm Fei Peng's desciple and godson of Lun Chee, (I could be wrong because I am not a CLF student, but I think the Lacey Sifu brothers are of Sifu Lun Chee's line through Sifu Kong Hing). The sifu of this group, Sifu Raymond Chan is shown to be the desciple of his Sifu, Tarm Sing. Looks pretty straight forward to me and aesthetically(sp?) in line with other Buck Sing vids I've seen.

[deeperthantao]

Sifu Ray Chan is a disciple of Tam Sing coming from Tam Fei Pang's line( Tam Sam's son), he also learned from Lun Chee. Tam Sing is famous for being a full-contact fighter that competed in the South-East Asian Full Contact tournament in the 1970s

The Lacey brothers come from Kong On and Lai Chou's line through their Sifu's Kong Hing and Lai Hung, seperate from Lun Chee's line.

The Tam Fei Pang line is unique in its use of a modified running horse, and low kicks seen in the video, so a little different than other stuff that may have been seen.

[LadySnow]

Sifu Ray Chan is a disciple of Tam Sing coming from Tam Fei Pang's line( Tam Sam's son), he also learned from Lun Chee. Tam Sing is famous for being a full-contact fighter that competed in the South-East Asian Full Contact tournament in the 1970s

The Lacey brothers come from Kong On and Lai Chou's line through their Sifu's Kong Hing and Lai Hung, seperate from Lun Chee's line.

The Tam Fei Pang line is unique in its use of a modified running horse, and low kicks seen in the video, so a little different than other stuff that may have been seen.

Are there any other Sifus from Tam Fei Pang's line around apart from Sifu Ray Chan?

[jdhowland]

Are there any other Sifus from Tam Fei Pang's line around apart from Sifu Ray Chan?

Is Satori Science still hanging out here? He would be my first go-to guy for bak sing info. Vancouver, B.C. had some good bak sing action going but all the sifus I knew of are long retired.

I'm in the Tam Fei Pang line through Stan Mak but I'm no expert on the system since more of my clf training came from a student of Tse Wing Bun and Ho Ngau.

Rose Chan may have some students who teach.

jd

[deeperthantao]

Hi there,

Apart from Ray Chan,

There is Henry Suen in Saskatchewan, Canada who is still actively teaching. His student Robert James(Satori Science) is in Vancouver, teaching privately.

Rose Chan and Raymond Leung, both students of Tam Fei Pang, are in Vancouver also, but, they are long retired. Too my knowledge neither has students who are teaching in Vancouver, but, Chan Sifu, last time I checked has students teaching in Hong Kong and China.

In Winnipeg, a student of Henry Suen's classmate Barry Richardson(sp?) is teaching privately. In Seattle, I believe, there is another student of Tam Fei Pang, although I think he is retired. Also in Las Vegas, I believe there is another student of Tam Fei Pang, Bosco Young, or at least some of his students.

I am not sure if other students of Tam Fei Pang are teaching in hong kong, but, those are all that I know of.

[LadySnow]

Hi there,

Apart from Ray Chan,

There is Henry Suen in Saskatchewan, Canada who is still actively teaching. His student Robert James(Satori Science) is in Vancouver, teaching privately.

Rose Chan and Raymond Leung, both students of Tam Fei Pang, are in Vancouver also, but, they are long retired. Too my knowledge neither has students who are teaching in Vancouver, but, Chan Sifu, last time I checked has students teaching in Hong Kong and China.

In Winnipeg, a student of Henry Suen's classmate Barry Richardson(sp?) is teaching privately. In Seattle, I believe, there is another student of Tam Fei Pang, although I think he is retired. Also in Las Vegas, I believe there is another student of Tam Fei Pang, Bosco Young, or at least some of his students.

I am not sure if other students of Tam Fei Pang are teaching in hong kong, but, those are all that I know of.

thanks for the info.

[Eric Olson]

Nice reach with the Cheung Ahn Cheui!

EO

[Violent Designs]

Nice reach with the Cheung Ahn Cheui!

EO

Eric, are you still studying CLF? If not what are you doing now?

-V

[LadySnow]

Hey guys, i've asked a few chinese friends of mine to translate what this video is talking about, but because its in cantonese, and they don't do Gung Fu, they had trouble translating the terms.

is there anything interesting on this video?

http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/7MoINhbvsE4/

[nospam]

In my lineage of Bak Sing, we initially teach what we refer to as the traditional stance (Sai Ping Ma) which is wide and low although not extremely low as seen elsewhere. Once a student attains proficiency (intermediate level) in the traditional stance the premise of the stance is changed and the reasons behind it explained. It is vital that one spends much time and practise in the traditionally lower/wider stance first. The advanced stance is, in form, narrower.

Ding Ji Ma or the 'bow & arrow' stance is the most radically changed stance at the advanced or senior level: by form, function, and concept.

Our Tsap choi is never to be leaned into. The reasoning is paramount to the proper usage of our stances at the advanced level. When a student progresses from what we call the traditional to the advanced stances, they are almost starting over. Much practise is required for proper power and mobility; this is, in part, one reason as to why we do not lean into the tsap choi. With that said, an upright spine is very common throughout many gung fu styles.

We are constantly loosening the hip structure and working on generating power from the ground up~

nospam

[Syn7]

is it true the buk sing guys used to go compete against muay thai alot??? somebody told me they got a rep for being pretty hard by being one of the only styles that consistantly won against muay thai cats....

true or false???

[nospam]

True

nospam

[Drake]

is it true the buk sing guys used to go compete against muay thai alot??? somebody told me they got a rep for being pretty hard by being one of the only styles that consistantly won against muay thai cats....

true or false???

Buk Sing are pretty hard core in general...

[Violent Designs]

is it true the buk sing guys used to go compete against muay thai alot??? somebody told me they got a rep for being pretty hard by being one of the only styles that consistantly won against muay thai cats....

true or false???

Why can't you train in both?

The deception, accuracy and penetration of Buk Sing attacks and the brute force, smashing techniques of Thai Boxing make up a beautiful, beautiful, beautiful combination.....

Brings tears to my eyes. :cool:

[nospam]

Also, the 1 foot 8 inch square horse is correct..in today's Imperial measurement.

nospam.

[Syn7]

Why can't you train in both?

The deception, accuracy and penetration of Buk Sing attacks and the brute force, smashing techniques of Thai Boxing make up a beautiful, beautiful, beautiful combination.....

Brings tears to my eyes. :cool:

no reason why you cant...

but im referring to the style wars back in the day... muay thai kept destroying these chinese boxers, for the most part anyways, and the buk sing guys came along with the chinese banner and did very well... brought honor to the southern chinese styles after some setbacks in competition by other stylists... apparently lots of chinese boxers thought they could fight and found out the hard way that practicing against their own guys didnt really prepare them for the blunt brute force of muay thai... just what i heard... dunno how true it all is...

[Violent Designs]

no reason why you cant...

but im referring to the style wars back in the day... muay thai kept destroying these chinese boxers, for the most part anyways, and the buk sing guys came along with the chinese banner and did very well... brought honor to the southern chinese styles after some setbacks in competition by other stylists... apparently lots of chinese boxers thought they could fight and found out the hard way that practicing against their own guys didnt really prepare them for the blunt brute force of muay thai... just what i heard... dunno how true it all is...

hey, I'll ask around and see what I can find.

Regardless this has less to do with Stylistic failure and moreso the nature of the beast.... Muay Thai fighters all fight professionally and train 6 hours a day.

Even the "hardcore" gungfu guys back in the day, mostly were NOT professional fighters of any kind. They were tough-as-nails, gritty street fighters who worked during the day and fought and trained hard at night. **** good fighters but not professional level, that's another level.

Buksing is so **** effective because of the training method and how they are trying to evolve and constantly refine their fighting techniques.

Just the straight up conditioning of Muay Thai alone is enough to simply wade through most kung fu guys... taking full blow roundhouses to the body on the daily basis, fighting 300+ fights in their careers, training at the age of 5+, shins and bodies and elbows and knees hard as nails from all that bone clashing on bone.

You see professional Sanda fighters being able to go toe-to-toe with Muay Thai because they are also professionals and train just as hard.

Regards,

-V

[Syn7]

hey, I'll ask around and see what I can find.

Regardless this has less to do with Stylistic failure and moreso the nature of the beast.... Muay Thai fighters all fight professionally and train 6 hours a day.

Even the "hardcore" gungfu guys back in the day, mostly were NOT professional fighters of any kind. They were tough-as-nails, gritty street fighters who worked during the day and fought and trained hard at night. **** good fighters but not professional level, that's another level.

Buksing is so **** effective because of the training method and how they are trying to evolve and constantly refine their fighting techniques.

Just the straight up conditioning of Muay Thai alone is enough to simply wade through most kung fu guys... taking full blow roundhouses to the body on the daily basis, fighting 300+ fights in their careers, training at the age of 5+, shins and bodies and elbows and knees hard as nails from all that bone clashing on bone.

You see professional Sanda fighters being able to go toe-to-toe with Muay Thai because they are also professionals and train just as hard.

Regards,

-V



yeah i think anyone in any style will be a better fighter if they spar with as many other styles as they can... the more different styles you find to train against, the better off you'll be... generally speaking, of course...

i think alot of these guys only trained against their own guys and maybe didnt even spar all out... so when they were rushed by an aggressive muay thai attack they were overwhelmed... i see it all the time in my experiences... dudes show me all these great moves that work well when i do what they want me to do... then we spar and i use my own styles and they arent effective as they thought they were... its reality check, forsure... one that alot of MA stylists need to experience if they want to keep claiming their art is effective self defence in the street... you simply cant count on an attacker being a wreckless slugger that will be all predictable... grab ur collar, or take a wide swing or whatever else they train against... you need to as prepared as you can for anything... that means rounding out in your skills aswell as your sparring partners...

[Violent Designs]

Muay Thai guy can just wait for the CMA dude (whatever style he did) to attack and engage.... usually one clinch and a few knees is all it takes to drop someone who is not used to that intensity, pressure and level of pain.

[Syn7]

Muay Thai guy can just wait for the CMA dude (whatever style he did) to attack and engage.... usually one clinch and a few knees is all it takes to drop someone who is not used to that intensity, pressure and level of pain.

no doubt... with knees u crush right thru the defences of somebody who doesnt know how to break the plum... although if you trained for it, shortfist styles would have many many answers... its just about preparation... we agree... i dont know any longfist chinese boxing so i reserve judgement on that end...

[Violent Designs]

no doubt... with knees u crush right thru the defences of somebody who doesnt know how to break the plum... although if you trained for it, shortfist styles would have many many answers... its just about preparation... we agree... i dont know any longfist chinese boxing so i reserve judgement on that end...

We go back in a circle about the training method. The short fist style, long fist style, doesn't matter... CLF or Bajiquan or Xingyi or Bak Mei, doesn't matter... no matter how good it is the fighter would also need to match the Thai boxer in question's training regimen... or exceed it. They would need the body conditioning, the bone conditioning, and the level of cardio and energy required to go toe-to-toe, or at least hold his own. If you can dedicate to practicing 6+ hours a day 6 days a week of even zero form training and just HITTING AND HITTING AND HITTING bags, people, pads, more bags, more people, more pads... it's a vicious and repetitive cycle but that's what is needed to breed an ELITE fighter.

Muay Thai is like the battering ram of martial art styles, basically. Not many styles or people can go toe-to-toe and win in an even exchange, if it is a matter of exchanging blow for blow or a matter of toughing it out. You have to use your skills and movement and you can't trade... if you start trading (which is what I assumed most CMA guys did because they can't fight for one, and when they do it's just wild streetfighting aggressive stuff), you're ****ed.

[nospam]

Yet another reason many Bak Sing players were proven fighters...they fought! There is the endless drilling of basics, concentration on 2 person training and fighting/free sparring. There are patterns but they are for a purpose and the emphasis isn't on the amount of patterns, rather what one can find in them. And what can be found needs not more than 5 patterns at max.

In turn, each Bak Sing player turned the premise of the style into their own interpretation, but always of the same foundation...building blocks or blue print of lessons learned and ideas proven in the kwoon and on the streets and rooftops.

We look similar and yet are unique. There is a bond we all share through endless days and nights of blood and sweat; the days and weeks turning to years and decades. There is a bond all Bak Sing players share...you may notice it, but you will not understand it. You may be told but you will soon forget. This bond is what makes us better than all our opponents when the bell tolls~and yes..we are better than most!

nospam.

[Violent Designs]

I read that Lai Hung's saga of tournament/combat sport fighting back in his prime in Southeast Asia was against Thai boxers quite often.

And Lai Hung always have the utmost respect for their fighting style and ability.

Also, Lai Hung stated that most CMA guys, even the tough street fighters would not necessarily be able to win because they are mostly people that have lives, jobs, work, and cannot train 7 hours a day 6 days a week like professional fighters, and THAT he said, can cause a gap in skill/endurance/etc when it comes to a recreational fighter vs. professional fighter.

[CLFNole]

Chan Sau Chung's tai sing pek kwar guys had a well documented match with Muay Thai figthers in the 70s or early 80s and did rather well. I think they split several bouts if I recall correctly.

[Violent Designs]

Tai Shing Pek Gwar is the southern derivative of Northern Pek Gwar/Piguazhang correct?

[CLFNole]

No it is a northern system that combines the Tai Sing (Monkey) with Pek Kwar (Axe Fist). The system was created by Ken Dak Hoi. The majority of the sets are from the Pek Kwar system but for some reason the monkey sets always stand out becuase Chan Sifu was very famous for them.

[nospam]

..you are pitting professional fighters against non-professional fighters. Not the same bag-o-****. What's the chance of running into a professional fighter in the parking lot of Walmart at 8 pm Friday when for some reason I'm mixing it up with my fists? Get Real. Your perspectives are f'd. I'm more than likely going to run into a fat slob of a moron who isn't getting much at home or he's just po'd that I beat him to the parking spot closer to the doors by 30 seconds and now he's lipping off - then I choose whether it is worth it or not. Or some youth who has something to prove cuz I told him to F off after he cut me off...you know..road rage. Prof fighter? lol Get Real.

..if I do mix it up? Am I going to have to fight for 3, 2 minute rounds? MOre than likely he pulls a knife or a tire iron. Do I really have to worry my a$$ over the professional fighter to make my gung fu more real or valid? Get Real. When it does happen, it's fast and hard and over quick. Either I'm standing or he's standing. That's Real.

nospam

[CLFNole]

I agree with nospam to compare any type of professional fighter to someone who has a normal job and trains recreationally even if they spar a lot is not apples to apples.

[nospam]

..nor pecan pie to meat pie ::)

nospam.
:cool:

[Violent Designs]

..you are pitting professional fighters against non-professional fighters. Not the same bag-o-****. What's the chance of running into a professional fighter in the parking lot of Walmart at 8 pm Friday when for some reason I'm mixing it up with my fists? Get Real. Your perspectives are f'd. I'm more than likely going to run into a fat slob of a moron who isn't getting much at home or he's just po'd that I beat him to the parking spot closer to the doors by 30 seconds and now he's lipping off - then I choose whether it is worth it or not. Or some youth who has something to prove cuz I told him to F off after he cut me off...you know..road rage. Prof fighter? lol Get Real.

..if I do mix it up? Am I going to have to fight for 3, 2 minute rounds? MOre than likely he pulls a knife or a tire iron. Do I really have to worry my a$$ over the professional fighter to make my gung fu more real or valid? Get Real. When it does happen, it's fast and hard and over quick. Either I'm standing or he's standing. That's Real.

nospam

relax, I was pointing out to why a lot of CMA guys lots to fighters from Thailand. The Thai guys did this sh1t for a living while CMA guys were recreational.

a lot of CMA guys were also pretty **** arrogant always claiming they can beat this and that. with the training methods that most used, they didn't stand a chance against the people with more scientific/practical training methods.

NO YOU DON'T HAVE TO COMPETE WITH A PRO FIGHTER TO LEARN HOW TO FIGHT.

why are you arguing with me i'm not even refuting anything you said .

[nospam]

..cuz I felt like it.

nospam.
:cool:

[Monkey Magic]

..cuz I felt like it.

nospam.
:cool:

Wow... such a tough man. Who have you ever try your skills on anyway. You have had any real fight nospam :eek::rolleyes:

Truly do the clips you see from LABSCLF really look scary? ummm no. People wear protection vest and even move head out of way and be shy when they attack :rolleyes:

other BSCLF and HSCLF youtube more convincing

[nospam]

A shining example of one that has not experienced a Bak Sing fighter. Most people don't know how to react..can not react fast enough..when someone with even intermediate Bak Sing skill attacks.

nospam.
:cool:

[LadySnow]

Wow... such a tough man. Who have you ever try your skills on anyway. You have had any real fight nospam :eek::rolleyes:

Truly do the clips you see from LABSCLF really look scary? ummm no. People wear protection vest and even move head out of way and be shy when they attack :rolleyes:

other BSCLF and HSCLF youtube more convincing

And what scary style do you do?

[hskwarrior]

monkey magic is chan fam CLF

[Violent Designs]

monkey magic is chan fam CLF

Is THIS perhaps "Magic Monkey?" :eek::p

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGPwyQDLTkc

WHAT A DEADLY FORM HAHAHAHAHAHA