MMA & Steroids

[GeneChing]

I suppose this could go on either our Busted MMA fighters and fights (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=52219), Article about steroids in the UF (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47737)C or our MMA & Drugs (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47075) threads. Nevertheless, I want to start this anew, to specifically archive steroid use in MMA. It's such a stereotype, so when someone in the spotlight like Sonnen goes down, it really hurts the image of the sport.


Officials: UFC's Sonnen has positive steroids test (http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5gy-EX9EjHa8tEoXhW02bhULPexOQD9ID6A780)
By GREG BEACHAM (AP) – 22 hours ago

LOS ANGELES — The California State Athletic Commission suspended UFC middleweight title contender Chael Sonnen for one year on Wednesday after revealing he tested positive for steroids following a loss to Anderson Silva last month in Oakland.

CSAC executive officer George Dodd said Sonnen's drug test revealed an abnormally high testosterone-to-estrogen level, an indicator of steroid use. A second test showed similar results.

"The use of anabolic steroids and other banned substances are not tolerated by the commission," Dodd said. "Anabolic agents put the health and safety of both the user and his opponents at risk."

The suspension casts a pall on memories of perhaps the UFC's most exciting fight of the year to date. Sonnen was a trash-talking underdog who improbably controlled the first four rounds of his fight against Silva, but lost to the long-reigning middleweight champion on a dramatic fifth-round choke at UFC 117 in Oakland's Oracle Arena.

The suspension squashes the UFC's plans to match Sonnen against Silva in a rematch early next year. Steroid-related suspensions in mixed martial arts and boxing typically are honored by other states' athletic commissions, and the UFC won't schedule suspended fighters for new bouts.

Sonnen is expected to appeal the ruling within 30 days, but can't receive a hearing on his appeal until Dec. 2 in Sacramento. Sonnen hasn't commented publicly on the suspension, and his management team didn't immediately return phone calls.

UFC president Dana White wrote on Twitter that Silva's next fight will be against Vitor Belfort, the Brazilian former light heavyweight champion. Belfort was scheduled to fight Yushin Okami at UFC 122 on Nov. 13 in Germany, but will meet Silva instead — likely at UFC 125 in Las Vegas on Jan. 1.

Nate Marquardt will replace Belfort in the main event at UFC 122 against Okami, White said.
Personally, I'd like to see an MMA event where everyone had to take steroids. Put two steroidal maniacs in the cage - now that's entertainment. Just kidding. ;)

[sanjuro_ronin]

Typical hypocracy of sports bodies.
They want you to train like a maniac and be in shape and all that, then penalize you when you realize that you are human and need help to meet unrealistic expectations.

[GeneChing]

There's a vid - follow the link.

Is It Time for MMA to Accept Steroids? (http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2010/9/21/1703019/is-it-time-for-mma-to-accept-and)
by Luke Thomas on Sep 21, 2010 9:00 PM EDT in MMA Editorial

Watch the entire video before commenting, please.

I'll address the issue of whether or not steroids provide an "unfair advantage" in a later post. This one strictly deals with the health implications. As you can see in the video above, the idea that there is a mountain of clinical evidence that clearly links steroid use to what the general populace believes are obvious consequences - liver failure, heart attacks, death - is false.

That isn't to suggest there are no health risks associated with anabolic steroid use. There are. I've previously talked about this issue. Here's an interview with Jay Hoffman, a professor of health and exercise science at The College of New Jersey in Ewing, in an interview with Scientific American:

How long do the side effects of steroids last?
All of those side effects are reversible within four weeks of cessation, though women tend to stay masculinized after using steroids. And every athlete who has considered juicing (taking steroids) knows that. Athletes generally go on a steroid-taking cycle for six to eight weeks, and then they come off for about two months before going back on. And when they’re off, side effects revert back to normal.

The athletes who run into major health issues are body builders or wrestlers who get paid based on their external appearance. They can develop what’s known as muscle dysmorphia, which is basically reverse anorexia. Like a person who considers himself or herself fat all the time, body builders and wrestlers look in the mirror and see themselves as being small. Those are the athletes who never come off the cycle.

Are there other health risks from taking steroids?
Steroids could be lethal to someone with an underlying mental or cardiovascular disease. Anabolic steroids are like any other medication. If you have hypertension and your doctor prescribes you a certain medication, such as an ACE inhibitor, there may be contraindications for using that particular medication if you have, say, kidney disease. If an athlete is suffering from a mental illness like depression or bipolar disorder – which many steroid-taking high school athletes who commit suicide allegedly suffer from – anabolic steroids are the wrong performance-enhancing drug to use. But when given in a clinical setting, steroids are relatively safe.

How are steroids used in a clinical setting?
By themselves, steroids are a very effective clinical tool for treating muscle-wasting diseases such as cancer, AIDS, and chronic obstructive pulmonary disorders. Sports scientists around the world study changes in athletes’ testosterone and cortisol levels. Cortisol is a catabolic steroid produced by the adrenal glands above the kidneys and it breaks down lean tissue in the absence of carbohydrates needed for energy. It’s also released in times of stress. Through high-intensity training over the course of a baseball season, testosterone levels go down and cortisol levels go up. The athlete becomes testosterone-depleted, or hypogonadal, and fatigue sets in. That phenomenon is known as "overtraining syndrome."

One way to treat this is to restore testosterone levels using an exogenous (external) source. We do that with men over 50 who have a normal decline in testosterone, though not with the super-pharmacological doses that many athletes use. There’s a lot of talk amongst team physicians about whether it should be permissible to use exogenous testosterone to bring an athlete back up to normal levels. But the issue is not being approached right now, because of the witch hunt that’s going on. There’s such a kneejerk reaction in the sports media about steroids and these things get sensationalized. There’s such a lack of understanding about what steroids do. I think we need to look at this more scientifically.

And here was my ultimate conclusion

Hoffman eventually suggests (in team sports anyway) that steroid use should be lifted out of the hands of "gym rats" and into those of team physicians who are better able to monitor health effects over time and give proper medical advice.

Why bring this up? The notion that a mere handful of fighters in professional MMA use steroids is downright laughable. Here's a small anecdote that helps illustrate my point. Aside from testing standards in athletic commissions being "a joke", I had shoulder surgery last May. The surgeon who repaired my torn labrum happened to be a massive MMA fan and one-time physician for the Washington Redskins. This is a doctor with direct experience working with elite athletes. I'll leave the specific details about our conversations private, but suffice it say I asked him whether any notable fighters were, in his medical opinion, taking some form of steroids. He admitted he could only work from conjecture, but the number and status of names he believed are using some form of steroids were shocking to even a world-weary misanthrope like me.

I bring this up to make one final point: either we're going to properly test for steroids or we're not. And if we're not (by the way, we're not), then lifting steroid use out of the shadows of underground pharmacists and into the light of medical supervision is the only acceptable course of action. If steroids can be taken safely, why are we doing it dangerously?

If you're really against steroid testing, it's because you believe they are uniquely contributory to an unfair athletic advantage. If you're hanging your hat on concern for the physical welfare of athletes, you're only doing them a disservice by forcing them to use steroids outside the reach of accessible and helpful medical supervision.

What keeps fighters safe isn't the threat of raping their wallet. It's helping them make informed medical decisions under the watchful eye of board certified physicians. Being overly punitive about enforcement feels good to only the bloodthirsty. I can't speak for anyone else, but that's not a source of personal glee.
Come on and 'fess up, s_j. You're popping steroids now, aren't ya? It would explain a lot of your posts. :p

[sanjuro_ronin]

Actually, I have huge issues with taking steroids or any performance enhancing drugs, but that is JUST ME and I have NO issues with someone else doing it.
That is their business.
See, steroids have been with us for decades and now with things like HGH, performance enhancers are here to stay and just part of the package of being a pro athlete.
You CAN'T train like these guys do and NOT be on something.
You can't put your body through those types of stresses on a regular basis and be able to handle it without help.
ANYONE that has tried it a the higher levels, never mind the elite, knows this.

Dude, some guys go to the gym, shoot the **** for most of the time, actually work out for maybe 60 min or 90 and then say they were working out for 3 hours or more.

We've all seen it those guys and have even BEEN those guys at times.

I once trained for the N.American Kyokushin championships and in a space of 4 weeks I lost 20 lbs and I was already in shape to begin with, that is what intense training does to a body.


To train at high level and high intensity, you need something to help you recover and that is really all that enhancers do so, you know what? make em legal and make them, the athletes, take it under controlled conditions.

[Syn7]

is it possible for someone to naturally have an abnormally high testosterone-to-estrogen level??? cos they never actually found steroids in his body right???



maybe steroid use would help explain sonnens mouth before the fight... he trash talked a ton...

[donjitsu2]

[QUOTE=Syn7;1041176]is it possible for someone to naturally have an abnormally high testosterone-to-estrogen level???QUOTE]



Yes, but I've only heard of the condition associated with women. It is called polycystic ovarian syndrome.

Men mainly have a problem low levels of testosterone (if there is a problem at all).

[Syn7]

could working out real hard and taking any non banned ped or anything else thats not banned create these same conditions???


i mean, common sense says hes probably guilty... but its his career, you would think theyd need real proof to set somebody back like that... how reliable are these tests??? are all the conclusions based on this kind of situational reasoning? or is it just this one particular substance hes accused of or......??????



does this affect sonnens purse for that fight???

[Dragonzbane76]

1 year suspension and he'll be back and probably have a title shot waiting for him.

[Kevin73]

could working out real hard and taking any non banned ped or anything else thats not banned create these same conditions???


i mean, common sense says hes probably guilty... but its his career, you would think theyd need real proof to set somebody back like that... how reliable are these tests??? are all the conclusions based on this kind of situational reasoning? or is it just this one particular substance hes accused of or......??????



does this affect sonnens purse for that fight???

It said a second blood test showed the same results. When testing for those things, a "natural" level range is very wide (about 175-800ish). Doctors consider low test below 300 and the average at 500. When guys test positive like this their range is usually over 1000 and couldn't get that way by natural means.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Its not only how high the T level are, but the ratio of T to estrogen.
Of course some test can even detect the type of steroid.
The thing is that it is almost impossible to have a natural T level in a way that makes you fail the test.

[Syn7]

oh ok... thanx...

so the fact that he tested the same the second time is the clincher??? like it was possible to be there by fluke or a varied set of circumstances but the fact that the same results occured a second time at a later date shows it wasnt natural???


does he lose any purse money??? like when they dont make weight??? 20%???

[Frost]

Actually, I have huge issues with taking steroids or any performance enhancing drugs, but that is JUST ME and I have NO issues with someone else doing it.
That is their business.
See, steroids have been with us for decades and now with things like HGH, performance enhancers are here to stay and just part of the package of being a pro athlete.
You CAN'T train like these guys do and NOT be on something.
You can't put your body through those types of stresses on a regular basis and be able to handle it without help.
ANYONE that has tried it a the higher levels, never mind the elite, knows this.

Dude, some guys go to the gym, shoot the **** for most of the time, actually work out for maybe 60 min or 90 and then say they were working out for 3 hours or more.

We've all seen it those guys and have even BEEN those guys at times.

I once trained for the N.American Kyokushin championships and in a space of 4 weeks I lost 20 lbs and I was already in shape to begin with, that is what intense training does to a body.


To train at high level and high intensity, you need something to help you recover and that is really all that enhancers do so, you know what? make em legal and make them, the athletes, take it under controlled conditions.

what he said, make it a level playing field because at the moment in ALL sports the rich/ well sponsered have a big advantage, they can afford the masking agents and latest drugs and the proper doctors to ensure they dont get caught.

The arguement its for the athletes own good is stupid, its for their own good that you force them to go buy drugs from back market suppliers rather than getting them under controlled supervised conditions?

The whole its for the good of the sport thing is silly too, does anything think any major sport is not tainted by this stuff, football, athletics, rugby, boxing MMA they have all had cases of this happening, no one believes any sport is level and pure so just look after the athlets interests and make it legal and managable.


And nothing any high level athlete does to themselves is good for there body, the training the punishment and wear and tear is as bad long term as any drug they might take

[Syn7]

yeah but then if you allow all ped's you make it so most guys who want to keep it natural and stay away from the pharmasueticals dont have as much of a chance at success... like you have to do drugs to compete... what about people who train holistically??? they would fade into the back, behind a bunch of roid monkeys... it doesnt seem fair to me...

on the other hand:

i see what youre saying, they will do it anyways and thats even more unfair, and i agree... but i dunno if i feel deregulation is the answer... its not exactly the making of great role models either...

do you dope frost??? honestly???? have you ever???

i mean illegal agents, coz some ped's are allowed... even coffee is on the ped list... but its not a banned substance...

[Frost]

yeah but then if you allow all ped's you make it so most guys who want to keep it natural and stay away from the pharmasueticals dont have as much of a chance at success... like you have to do drugs to compete... what about people who train holistically??? they would fade into the back, behind a bunch of roid monkeys... it doesnt seem fair to me...

on the other hand:

i see what youre saying, they will do it anyways and thats even more unfair, and i agree... but i dunno if i feel deregulation is the answer... its not exactly the making of great role models either...

do you dope frost??? honestly???? have you ever???

i mean illegal agents, coz some ped's are allowed... even coffee is on the ped list... but its not a banned substance...

nope never have and never will, i dont like the stuff and have never competed at a level that needs them

BUT that doesn't mean I dont feel they should be legal, fact is its not a level playing field and never has been, guys like sherk, sonnen, Barnett, Gracie have been caught, its riff and unfortunatly its necessary for a lot of people trying to keep up with the best. So you either legalize it or ban everyone for life if they get caught (make the risk outweigh the reward)

Bannings not worked in any sport ever, football, baseball, athletices you name it it still goes on regardless of the penalties and will be even worse in MMA, with no organising body (the UFC can ban someone and off they go to japan to fight)

So legalize it, regulate it and at least then fighters will know what they are up against

[Syn7]

nope never have and never will, i dont like the stuff and have never competed at a level that needs them

BUT that doesn't mean I dont feel they should be legal, fact is its not a level playing field and never has been, guys like sherk, sonnen, Barnett, Gracie have been caught, its riff and unfortunatly its necessary for a lot of people trying to keep up with the best. So you either legalize it or ban everyone for life if they get caught (make the risk outweigh the reward)

Bannings not worked in any sport ever, football, baseball, athletices you name it it still goes on regardless of the penalties and will be even worse in MMA, with no organising body (the UFC can ban someone and off they go to japan to fight)

So legalize it, regulate it and at least then fighters will know what they are up against



if the anti doping agency had international jurisdiction and could impose fines on organizations we could work out some zero tolerance policy to make it more fair anyways... like you said, one time and your out... or first time a huge fine and a year or two and second time a lifetime ban... i'd be ok with the first offence lifetime ban tho... like DUI, if you arent guilty you shouldnt fear tough laws against it...

[brothernumber9]

I think part of the assumption here is of those that would or do, purposely use a drug for a competetive advantage. I think many people would'nt be entirely against the banning idea, first time and you're out.
But what about someone who would use something like an over the counter medication for a particular, maybe temporary ailment or condition, and that use resulted in a positive result for an illegal substance, eventhough the competitor did not realize the substance or compound was part of the active ingredients of whatever it is they used or took. Say for example, they touched some poison oak and got it on their face, causing it to rash a bit and swell. then a friend, or the pharmacist at CVS or wherever says, here use this, it will get rid of it in a few days. That person gets banned for life. Is that fair.

[GeneChing]

If MMA wants to continue to be taken seriously as a sport, it will have to adopt comparable standards. We all remember the fiasco with Barry Bonds and steroids. It's controversial in all sports and as MMA continues to gain status as a respectable sport, it will be controversial there too.

[Syn7]

I think part of the assumption here is of those that would or do, purposely use a drug for a competetive advantage. I think many people would'nt be entirely against the banning idea, first time and you're out.
But what about someone who would use something like an over the counter medication for a particular, maybe temporary ailment or condition, and that use resulted in a positive result for an illegal substance, eventhough the competitor did not realize the substance or compound was part of the active ingredients of whatever it is they used or took. Say for example, they touched some poison oak and got it on their face, causing it to rash a bit and swell. then a friend, or the pharmacist at CVS or wherever says, here use this, it will get rid of it in a few days. That person gets banned for life. Is that fair.

no, it isnt fair... i think if you have a zero tolerance policy you must put more emphasis on proving knowledge of the act and intent... if you can show that you didnt know or mean to, like with rash medicine, you still tested dirty and lose your match and get a temp suspension till its out of your system, but not a lifetime ban...

[SoCo KungFu]

If MMA wants to continue to be taken seriously as a sport, it will have to adopt comparable standards. We all remember the fiasco with Barry Bonds and steroids. It's controversial in all sports and as MMA continues to gain status as a respectable sport, it will be controversial there too.

You're talking as if the sport is its own entity. Its not like the NFL or one of the other mainstream sports that handles its own testing. Its not the sport that handles it. This is in the realm of the athletic commission. Now could UFC as an organization decide to do additional testing? Sure, lots of employers do that, I have to for working in a medical field. But then not every organization has to test equally, and there are A LOT of MMA promotions. Unlike say football that has NCAA and NFL...


NAC 467.850 Administration or use of alcohol, stimulants, drugs or injections; urinalysis or chemical tests; disciplinary action. (NRS 467.030)

1. The administration of or use of any:

(a) Alcohol;

(b) Stimulant; or

(c) Drug or injection that has not been approved by the Commission, including, but not limited to, the drugs or injections listed in subsection 2,

Ê in any part of the body, either before or during a contest or exhibition, to or by any unarmed combatant, is prohibited.

2. The following types of drugs, injections or stimulants are prohibited pursuant to subsection 1:

(a) Afrinol or any other product that is pharmaceutically similar to Afrinol.

(b) Co-Tylenol or any other product that is pharmaceutically similar to Co-Tylenol.

(c) A product containing an antihistamine and a decongestant.

(d) A decongestant other than a decongestant listed in subsection 4.

(e) Any over-the-counter drug for colds, coughs or sinuses other than those drugs listed in subsection 4. This paragraph includes, but is not limited to, Ephedrine, Phenylpropanolamine, and Mahuang and derivatives of Mahuang.

(f) Any drug identified on the most current edition of the Prohibited List published by the World Anti-Doping Agency, which is hereby adopted by reference. The most current edition of the Prohibited List may be obtained, free of charge, at the Internet address www.wada-ama.org.

3. The following types of drugs or injections are not prohibited pursuant to subsection 1, but their use is discouraged by the Commission:

(a) Aspirin and products containing aspirin.

(b) Nonsteroidal anti-inflammatories.

4. The following types of drugs or injections are approved by the Commission:

(a) Antacids, such as Maalox.

(b) Antibiotics, antifungals or antivirals that have been prescribed by a physician.

(c) Antidiarrheals, such as Imodium, Kaopectate or Pepto-Bismol.

(d) Antihistamines for colds or allergies, such as Bromphen, Brompheniramine, Chlorpheniramine Maleate, Chlor-Trimeton, Dimetane, Hismal, PBZ, Seldane, Tavist-1 or Teldrin.

(e) Antinauseants, such as Dramamine or Tigan.

(f) Antipyretics, such as Tylenol.

(g) Antitussives, such as Robitussin, if the antitussive does not contain codeine.

(h) Antiulcer products, such as Carafate, Pepcid, Reglan, Tagamet or Zantac.

(i) Asthma products in aerosol form, such as Brethine, Metaproterenol (Alupent) or Salbutamol (Albuterol, Proventil or Ventolin).

(j) Asthma products in oral form, such as Aminophylline, Cromolyn, Nasalide or Vanceril.

(k) Ear products, such as Auralgan, Cerumenex, Cortisporin, Debrox or Vosol.

(l) Hemorrhoid products, such as Anusol-HC, Preparation H or Nupercainal.

(m) Laxatives, such as Correctol, Doxidan, Dulcolax, Efferyllium, Ex-Lax, Metamucil, Modane or Milk of Magnesia.

(n) Nasal products, such as AYR Saline, HuMist Saline, Ocean or Salinex.

(o) The following decongestants:

(1) Afrin;

(2) Oxymetazoline HCL Nasal Spray; or

(3) Any other decongestant that is pharmaceutically similar to a decongestant listed in subparagraph (1) or (2).

5. An unarmed combatant shall submit to a urinalysis or chemical test before or after a contest or exhibition if the Commission or a representative of the Commission directs him to do so.

6. A licensee who violates any provision of this section is subject to disciplinary action by the Commission. In addition to any other disciplinary action by the Commission, if an unarmed combatant who won or drew a contest or exhibition is found to have violated the provisions of this section, the Commission may, in its sole discretion, change the result of that contest or exhibition to a no decision.

[Athletic Comm’n, § 54, eff. 4-25-78]—(NAC A 12-13-82; 12-2-97; R058-05, 12-29-2005; R090-07, 12-4-2007)

This is just for Nevada (since they do most of the pro fights). But every state has its own regs (well every state that has legalized MMA) and the kick to that is, its not always the Athletic Commission that handles it. For example here in SC, the commission regulates via ISKA.

[Syn7]

i think we need antidoping agency to have more jurisdiction and binding recomendations to organizations... every sport should have to register thru an official antidoping agency for all their testing... always 3rd party and always out of the promotors hands... in the states its done thru the athletic commissions so it shouldnt be too hard to coordinate...

the trick is getting promotors in other countries to play by the rules... lots of organizations take advantage of lax laws... lots of fight fixing and other organized crime type endeavors...

[BJJ-Blue]

i think we need antidoping agency to have more jurisdiction and binding recomendations to organizations... every sport should have to register thru an official antidoping agency for all their testing... always 3rd party and always out of the promotors hands... in the states its done thru the athletic commissions so it shouldnt be too hard to coordinate...

It's alot harder than it sounds. For example Texas does not test for steroids/PEDs, cocaine, or THC/Marijuana. They only test for AIDS/HIV and Hepatitis. While States like California do test for cocaine and THC, despite the fact those are not performance enhancing drugs. And in this case the UFC has actually went further than Texas law calls for and they mandate the fighters in Texas shows do get tested for steroids/PEDs despite not being forced to by Texas law.

[Syn7]

yeah, nick diaz lost a very awesome win because he tested positive for thc after the fight... sucks... shouldnt be testing for that...

[BJJ-Blue]

yeah, nick diaz lost a very awesome win because he tested positive for thc after the fight... sucks... shouldnt be testing for that...

What's funny about that is that Diaz is a pothead, yet he won that fight primary because he had much better cardio.