Stick Forms Training

[Reyth]

Hi everyone!

I have recently come to the point in my life where I need to have sticks for self defense.

I have searched online and found several excellent stick form training videos and plan to use this thread to post all of them. :D

I need some help with one of them:


EXCELLENT single stick techniques: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7C71c0_93T4

I was hoping someone could provide the translation for this video. I think I get the gist of everything he is saying but I am sure I am mising some valuable information... :confused:

Here are other videos I found, all of them are excellent:

Good all-around defense tactics: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2emmV6mvrU

Non-lethal knife defense: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGgaQ07D09Y

How to twirl a baton: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4WN_0tNKOzU

EXCELLENT stick forms (part one): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDSDdtLv3u4

EXCELLENT stick forms (part two): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwKPTMxo2QE

AWESOME single stick free-flow: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9gtkFIf1f8

AWESOME empty hand technique: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b9qrvkD1yfU&NR=1


I would like to find some information on stick vs. gun techniques.

I am aware that such a thing is not recommended, but I will be unable to carry a firearm and if I do meet one, I would like to at least have an option.

My philosophy is that if somebody pulls a gun, they are going to kill me (therefore meek compliance will not work).

I have been unable to find any instructive information on this online, although I know the techniques exist.

Can anyone provide any links towards this end?

Thanks!

[EarthDragon]

I have recently come to the point in my life where I need to have sticks for self defense.

Really? why?

[Syn7]

yeah, why?

what kinda stickfighting are you learning???

[Reyth]

Well, I'm going on vacation to another country. In this country, people from America have sort of like a "bullseye" as a target for robbery (or worse). :eek:

Having a couple of expandable batons on my hip should cover just about anything I might encounter. :cool:

I am just going to learn the classical forms in the videos I've found to give myself the "vocabulary" for stick defense.

Having studied Tai Chi, I am able to bring out "the tiger within" and should be just fine with the sticks. :D

[Chop Socki]

Uh... umm.... err.... what? :confused:

So... you're going to another country where you'll be in constant danger, but the combination of an openly displayed collapsable baton, some Tai Chi instruction and some self-taught stick fighting skills acquired from video tapes available to the public on the Internet will see you safely through any situation. Is that about it?

- CS

[goju]

theres this guy on here who knows the anus punch.... you may want to learn that as well.....:D

[GeneChing]

Expandable batons are called Keibo.

Black Manual Tokushu Keibo w/case (http://www.martialartsmart.com/19-05.html)
Auto Tokushu Keibo with Case (http://www.martialartsmart.com/19-01.html)

Note that Keibo are illegal in some states such as California, Massachusetts and New York. I'm not sure about their legality in other countries. I know they are illegal in Canada. Better check the local laws before packing them.

[Syn7]

Expandable batons are called Keibo.

Black Manual Tokushu Keibo w/case (http://www.martialartsmart.com/19-05.html)
Auto Tokushu Keibo with Case (http://www.martialartsmart.com/19-01.html)

Note that Keibo are illegal in some states such as California, Massachusetts and New York. I'm not sure about their legality in other countries. I know they are illegal in Canada. Better check the local laws before packing them.

you can get them here in vancouver no problem... i have mine, and ive never had a problem... granted its not hanging off my belt... but if a cop searched my bag, i doubt he'd take it...

[Lucas]

get a couple of those colapsable jian!!!!!!!

[GeneChing]

It could be a border issue. We have a lot of trouble shipping weapons to Canada. We've had shipments of staffs (http://www.martialartsmart.com/weapons-staffs-batons-staffs.html) get stopped at customs, which is really silly when you stop and think about it. We could probably ship baseball bats to Canada, but staffs?

FWIW, I can get all the martial arts martial arts weapons that are banned in California in S.F. Chinatown. ;)

Lucas - Extendable Tai Chi Sword (http://www.martialartsmart.com/45-52.html) - why didn't I think of that? That would be so much more appropriate for a taiji player! :p

[SanHeChuan]

A better idea would be to VACATION somewhere else. :rolleyes:

[Lucas]

A better idea would be to VACATION somewhere else. :rolleyes:

what ever, stop being realistic, this is the internet. i vacation in world war 3!

[Syn7]

It could be a border issue. We have a lot of trouble shipping weapons to Canada. We've had shipments of staffs (http://www.martialartsmart.com/weapons-staffs-batons-staffs.html) get stopped at customs, which is really silly when you stop and think about it. We could probably ship baseball bats to Canada, but staffs?

FWIW, I can get all the martial arts martial arts weapons that are banned in California in S.F. Chinatown. ;)

Lucas - Extendable Tai Chi Sword (http://www.martialartsmart.com/45-52.html) - why didn't I think of that? That would be so much more appropriate for a taiji player! :p

at the MA stores they have all the swords, waxwood staffs three section staffs etc etc... kama, sighs all of that...

no butterfly knives tho, they arent even allowed to exist this side of the 49th... for whatever reason i dont know... no switchblades either...

[Lucas]

man i wish you could still pick up a good sturdy steel spring bloody mary....

:(

i lost mine years ago, that i got from a really old guy.

i dont know if thats what they are called but they are just like a switch blade, except rather than the blade being sprung out from the side, it comes out straight vertically via spring and locks the blade into place.

anyone else ever had one of those kind of switch blades? maybe it was foreign, all of the american switches ive seen are side folding spring loaded blades.

[GeneChing]

I have a tiny tourist one from China that commemorates the 2008 Olympics (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=39275). I got it back to the U.S. tucked discreetly in my luggage, just before 9/11. It's tiny and didn't really work that well. I used it to open mail here for years, until it finally broke for good.

[Syn7]

I have a tiny tourist one from China that commemorates the 2008 Olympics (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=39275). I got it back to the U.S. tucked discreetly in my luggage, just before 9/11. It's tiny and didn't really work that well. I used it to open mail here for years, until it finally broke for good.

wait... what??? you have a 2008 olympic knife that you smuggled into the US before 9/11???

[GeneChing]

It's broken. :(

It was only like 2 1/2 inches long. Not really a knife. More of a toy. I got it in a street market in Dengfeng for a kuai or so.

[David Jamieson]

How about a reinforced sport sock with a jar of mustard in it. Or, use a can of peas if you need to get lots of strikes out of it...

one use only with the mustard, but hey, mustard is cheap...and you don't want the sock afterwards anyway.

:)

[EarthDragon]

reth
Well, I'm going on vacation to another country. In this country, people from America have sort of like a "bullseye" as a target for robbery (or worse).

Having a couple of expandable batons on my hip should cover just about anything I might encounter.

I am just going to learn the classical forms in the videos I've found to give myself the "vocabulary" for stick defense.

Having studied Tai Chi, I am able to bring out "the tiger within" and should be just fine with the sticks.

LMAO=, is this thread real? are we really replying this this question? hahah I have heard it all now.. here s a tip pratice MMA for 2 months before you go and you can beat up ANYBODY!:D

[Reyth]

Wow quite a few responses. Seems like none of you guys have been able to help with my two main questions however... :(

I don't mind the criticisms either but I would prefer serious alternative solutions to be included. :rolleyes:

To me its just logical. I cannot carry a gun. Knives are lethal weapons without exception. Batons are the best solution under the circumstances. I know Tai Chi and since the batons are really just an extension of my hands, I will be able to be effective with a minimal amount of training. :cool:

The expandable batons also have the added benefit of being easily concealable.

I just got my sticks today and have started training the Heaven 6. :D

[Lucas]

not sure how small or colapsable you are looking for.

i have a really cool metal baton that unscrews into nunchaku, super sneaky and fun.

but here, first and foremost, our most beloved supplier of things that kick much ass.

martialartsmart.com colapsable baton (http://www.martialartsmart.com/19-05.html)

a secondary source of basically the same thing.

buy me from martialartsmart instead though. (http://www.chiefsupply.com/Law_Enforcement/Self-Defense_Batons/Expandable/MD2502)

[Lucas]

i think it really depends on how compact you are wanting the tool as to what you are going to need to buy. the more it compacts the less stable its going to be usually though.

and most importantly you dont want to use a extendable weapon unless you KNOW its going to work. dont buy a piece of ****, because tahts what you'll end up with.

you may also be able to just get a couple of wooden/rattan sticks and create a holster in a backpack on the side that you can access easily. ive seen many kali guys do this.

are you backpacking? regular tourist kind of gig? cultural immersion?

[Lucas]

i dont for one second doubt that some taiji guy wants to go to a hostile foreign country and protect himself with sticks against guns and knives, murderers and thieves.

just tell em your canadian.

i really dont understand trolling though. who has that kind of freaking time to waste. and more importantly that is that freaking sad.....lol seriously. i dont think with a trolling brain so i rarely think people are trolling. for some reason i take what people type as what they mean.....go figure. i must be crazy.

[Reyth]

Well no I'm not going backpacking but if I was, I would really like your idea for escrima sticks in the pack.

In this case I'm going into a city with about 1 million population in a country which is notorious for targeting Americans. Frankly though, with two sticks, I feel quite able to handle multiple opponents. Also, because of the length of sticks (21"), I am also confident facing a knife. The likelihood of facing a gun is considered remote.

I just think its the most prudent choice I have available to me under the circumstances.

Funny though, the thread has taken a whole different turn from the direction in which I launched it:



EXCELLENT single stick techniques: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7C71c0_93T4

I was hoping someone could provide the translation for this video. I think I get the gist of everything he is saying but I am sure I am mising some valuable information... :confused:


I would like to find some information on stick vs. gun techniques.

I am aware that such a thing is not recommended, but I will be unable to carry a firearm and if I do meet one, I would like to at least have an option.

My philosophy is that if somebody pulls a gun, they are going to kill me (therefore meek compliance will not work).

I have been unable to find any instructive information on this online, although I know the techniques exist.

Can anyone provide any links towards this end?


Not that I mind the dialogue... ;)

[David Jamieson]

Well no I'm not going backpacking but if I was, I would really like your idea for escrima sticks in the pack.

In this case I'm going into a city with about 1 million population in a country which is notorious for targeting Americans.

Albuquerque?

[EarthDragon]

lucas,


i really dont understand trolling though. who has that kind of freaking time to waste. and more importantly that is that freaking sad.....lol seriously.

Lucas, meet knifefighter, queen of the trolls with short man syndrome

[Reyth]

LOL that's funny. You're right many of the US cities have the same risk and frankly If I lived in one of them, I probably would be carrying the batons on a daily basis. Although, this trip has the added risk of appearing as a foreigner.

[David Jamieson]

LOL that's funny. You're right many of the US cities have the same risk and frankly If I lived in one of them, I probably would be carrying the batons on a daily basis. Although, this trip has the added risk of appearing as a foreigner.

why would you bother going to a place where you feel there is an iminent threat to your life?

that sounds like a terrible vacation idea. lol

[taai gihk yahn]

You go girl! Stick forms and tai chi... an unbeatable combination.

lol - don't tell, everyone will open a new school and start teaching it...

[David Jamieson]

lol - don't tell, everyone will open a new school and start teaching it...

then they'll throw those sticks on the ground in a youtube video while challenging someone and foaming at the mouth!!! :eek:

[Reyth]

Well I wouldn't call it imminent (adjective: close in time; about to occur); I would call it a significant risk instead.

You are right it is definitely a "risk vs. reward" situation. :D

Btw, up until this point I have been ignoring all of the "fun-spirited jabs" and want to make the following point:

If a person has knowledge of a martial art, that knowledge can be used to facilitate new learning and expansion into different related areas.

Carry on.

[Lucas]

ok, i cannot provide a translation.

i dont know what you know but personally, if i had sticks and someone had a gun, you have basically two main scenarios;

you are out of range, or in range.

if you are out of range you either; run, comply, charge or take cover if possible. thats all you have.

now this is just me personally, but if someone pulls a gun on me and I am within physical range, and if I actually plan or was forced to engage someone weilding a firearm, i would not use sticks.

you will not already have your sticks out, and if you do thats a pretty strange scenario, again if in range, drop the **** sticks.

if you are going to engage someone with a firearm, your primary concern is isolating and controling that weapon. the likely hood of you attacking someone with strikes from a stick when they have a gun and disarming them/disabling them is very low. again if you actually plan on fighting someone who pulls a gun, you must close the distance, and control the firearm immediately, thats up to you if you can control the persons limb, and if you know how and what to do depending on what type of gun they have...

okay but seriously though, why not a knife? is it legal ramifications based on where you will be, if you caught with a blade will you get arrested? or is it something else. if you cant bring a gun to a gun fight, at least bring a knife and try to stab a futher mucker.

[Reyth]

As far as I am concerned I consider the sticks to be more effective than a knife (greater range and just as deadly/disabling).

I guess there are several potential scenarios and the ones I am interested in would revolve around the stick vs. gun disarm techniques which DO exist.

Thanks for your post btw, it is getting me thinking. ;)

[Syn7]

As far as I am concerned I consider the sticks to be more effective than a knife (greater range and just as deadly/disabling).

I guess there are several potential scenarios and the ones I am interested in would revolve around the stick vs. gun disarm techniques which DO exist.

Thanks for your post btw, it is getting me thinking. ;)

oh they exist... they just might get you shot... better off trying if you gonna get shot anyways tho...

[Reyth]

My thought exactly. Thankfully, the chances of seeing a gun should be remote.

EDIT: Just starting training "Heaven & Earth" too. :D

EDIT: So far training:

1) Heaven 6
2) Heaven & Earth
3) Heaven with scissors
4) Ninja 6

[ironfenix]

You're going to mexico aren't you?

[Reyth]

Very good guess! I hope to go to Mexico one day but that is not the country I am going to...

Boy I'm glad I'm training now -- my arms and shoulders are aching. I didn't realize it takes muscle power to whip those steel sticks around... :D

[bawang]

i recommend K-Y® INTENSE™

[taai gihk yahn]

My thought exactly. Thankfully, the chances of seeing a gun should be remote.

EDIT: Just starting training "Heaven & Earth" too. :D

EDIT: So far training:

1) Heaven 6
2) Heaven & Earth
3) Heaven with scissors
4) Ninja 6

when u hav graduated to the more advanced Running With Scissors, post some vids;

also, it's not Ninja 6, it's Ninja 7; you better stop now as incorrect practice will cause your Spleen to invest in a shady real estate deal...

[EarthDragon]

muzt be the middle east, no worries mate my boy lives in afganastan, and its nothing like the news says it is, its much safer the news like to scare people

[Reyth]

when u hav graduated to the more advanced Running With Scissors, post some vids;

also, it's not Ninja 6, it's Ninja 7; you better stop now as incorrect practice will cause your Spleen to invest in a shady real estate deal...

Thanks for the invite. After my vacation I will be buying a webcam and will be making some vids for my friend who used to be a Karate instructor. I was thinking of posting the vids here too. ;)

The forms I am training are here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDSDdtLv3u4


muzt be the middle east, no worries mate my boy lives in afganastan, and its nothing like the news says it is, its much safer the news like to scare people

Thanks. Well, I am visting a friend and they told me its not safe and that I am a natural target because I am an American. There are also fanatical Muslims there and if THEY target me (doubtful), I will be facing at least one gun. At that point I will just force them to shoot me. :D

[EarthDragon]

reyth,
well it depends on exactly where you are. There are some towns not even afgans go, but dont beleive the hype.
M my dear friend is doing work for the UN and goes out all the time even at night and has no worries about being kidnapped or targeted o ANY thing like that.

You must BE somebody important for them to even bother to take that risk, ie a high profile political person, military personel.... along that line.

As I said my friend works for the UN and is in no danger, the news will always show the bad stuff and scare you, its what the media thrives on.

Have fun enjoy your time just dont look at the women, they do frown on that, most are covered by blue burkas anyways

[Reyth]

Thanks. Its not a Muslim country but there is a subversive element there but even so, the chances of encountering THEM would be slim.

UPDATE: New video! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b9qrvkD1yfU&NR=1

This is an excellent technique video for the empty hand (one stick).

[David Jamieson]

there is no magic solution to any sort of violent encounter.

If you ahven't been training these for a while and don't fully grasp their use, there really is no point in starting now with such short notice.

you'll just be provocative walking around with an exposed weapon.

[taai gihk yahn]

you'll just be provocative walking around with an exposed weapon.
that's how thes wimins likeses its....

[Reyth]

there is no magic solution to any sort of violent encounter.

If you ahven't been training these for a while and don't fully grasp their use, there really is no point in starting now with such short notice.

you'll just be provocative walking around with an exposed weapon.
The weapon will not be exposed until I deem it necessary.

You are correct that it is short notice and I will have maybe a month of daily training before I arrive "in country" (and then daily training from there) but I would disagree that there is "no point". I am finding that the sticks are a wonderful compliment to my existing MA knowledge BECAUSE I have that knowledge.

There are depths of technique that will be impossible for me to gather in only a month of stick training and in that you are undoubtably correct.

[teetsao]

ryeth; if sticks are your choice and you are going to carry a collapsable baton, there is only 1 name you need to know,The DOG BROTHERS. i am a kali practitioner and llove it,very practical,and when we speak of practicality, the dog brothers are king.
pm me i may have something for you.

[Reyth]

Thanks TS. Man my arms and shoulders hurt so much! :(

I want to train more but I gotta back it off so my muscles can recover. :mad:

UPDATE: My arms, wrists and shoulders have recovered now and I have gained strength. I've added the Reverse 6 to my training now and it is by far my favorite.

So now training:

Heaven 6
Heaven & Earth
Heaven with Scissors
Ninja 6
Reverse 6

WOOT!