sweeping during sparring

[solo1]

Just asking. Are you guys allowed to or encouraged to sweep your opponent during in class sparring? A guy in my office trains in another system was sparring with a higher belt a few weeks ago and got swept. On november 8th he had his knee and ACL rebuilt ,his martial arts career is done, forever. Needless Im a bit concerned watching my guys lighting up this technique in class? thoughts?

[David Jamieson]

Just asking. Are you guys allowed to or encouraged to sweep your opponent during in class sparring? A guy in my office trains in another system was sparring with a higher belt a few weeks ago and got swept. On november 8th he had his knee and ACL rebuilt ,his martial arts career is done, forever. Needless Im a bit concerned watching my guys lighting up this technique in class? thoughts?

There is risk in martial arts.

One wrong move and it's over for you.

Just be mindful of that.

[kungfoozer]

There is risk in martial arts.

One wrong move and it's over for you.

Just be mindful of that.


That's some non-specific advice.


Sweeping can be dangerous. I don't do it because the people I spar with don't have any experience doing break falls. I think that sweeping is a good thing to drill but in sparring it isn't a good idea. In competition yeah.

[Hebrew Hammer]

In my opinion, you should train for it during sparring, if you don't it will probably not be effective in either tournaments or in real life situations. You or the students will not have confidence using this skill...and when it comes time, you use what you know best.

What happened with your friend was unfortunate and you can't or shouldn't train based on fear, lots of things could have contributed to his knee going out, including genetics, and lack of skill applying this technique. What you can do is apply steps to ensure a couple of things, make sure students are properly warmed up and include lots of stretching and flexibility drills. Two: work the techniques at slower controlled speeds and build up from there, covering the potential injury factors with the students and three talk to them about how to protect themselves using martial techniques, foot work, cat stance, and or break falls and the like.

[Iron_Eagle_76]

Tore my ACL at a point style Karate tournament due to a "bad" sweep about ten years ago. Injuries can and will occur in training and in competition. Learning to break fall is what should be taught first and foremost in martial arts classes, especially one where sweeps and takedowns are taught in a fully resistant environment.

[lkfmdc]

I know this guy, once he walked out of his house and tried to cross the street

A truck hit him and killed him

So you should never leave your house

Most definitely never try to cross the street

[Golden Arms]

That's some non-specific advice.


Sweeping can be dangerous. I don't do it because the people I spar with don't have any experience doing break falls. I think that sweeping is a good thing to drill but in sparring it isn't a good idea. In competition yeah.

It appears you have answered your own question. To work sweeps, work with people that can fall, or teach them how to. Use some control when working with others, utilize equipment (one can sweep a heavy bag standing upright on the ground for instance, or a tire for example) to develop power in the technique.

[hskwarrior]

I know this guy, once he walked out of his house and tried to cross the street

A truck hit him and killed him

So you should never leave your house

Most definitely never try to cross the street

EXACTLY!!!!!! :D

Nah, seriously, sweeps are something you need to take some time in getting to know before you try them. One wrong move and you're done. for example, i've seen some people try to sweep you at your ankle only to get his toe jammed into the guys foot and it hurt like a mudda chukka. he was out of order for weeks.

What i have my guys do is methodically go through there sweeps focusing on correctness. keep drilling it till your sweep takes the guy down each time. then when their ready tell them to include sweeps in their sparring. they know about not wanting to jam their toes so i always tell them to aim like around mid calf or just a little highter to get the knee to buckle.

[kungfoozer]

It appears you have answered your own question. To work sweeps, work with people that can fall, or teach them how to. Use some control when working with others, utilize equipment (one can sweep a heavy bag standing upright on the ground for instance, or a tire for example) to develop power in the technique.


It wasn't my question. I was answering another guy's post. I'm so confused. Help me , god

[xcakid]

Just asking. Are you guys allowed to or encouraged to sweep your opponent during in class sparring? A guy in my office trains in another system was sparring with a higher belt a few weeks ago and got swept. On november 8th he had his knee and ACL rebuilt ,his martial arts career is done, forever. Needless Im a bit concerned watching my guys lighting up this technique in class? thoughts?


We sweep and do various takedowns in class. Only in intermediate/advanced class though. We don't even spar in beginner classes. No injuries so far. (fingers crossed) Sparring injuries we have had was not due to sweeping. We've had broken collar bones, dislocated fingers, fractured toe(me personally), fractured ribs(again me) and a hyper extended elbow. And of course the usual busted lip.

Heck I get injured more doing forms. So far I have stabbed myself with a sword :( long story. Torn an MCL and severely sprained an ankle.

[kungfoozer]

We sweep and do various takedowns in class. Only in intermediate/advanced class though. We don't even spar in beginner classes. No injuries so far. (fingers crossed) Sparring injuries we have had was not due to sweeping. We've had broken collar bones, dislocated fingers, fractured toe(me personally), fractured ribs(again me) and a hyper extended elbow. And of course the usual busted lip.

Heck I get injured more doing forms. So far I have stabbed myself with a sword :( long story. Torn an MCL and severely sprained an ankle.

You injured yourself doing forms? I feel sadness for you. Bless you child for you must have sinned to be hurting yourself doing forms. Stabbing yourself with a sword doesn't really count though. Hurting yourself doing forms would be like tripping over your own feet or yelling the tiger sound too loud causing you to lose your voice.

[xcakid]

You injured yourself doing forms? I feel sadness for you. Bless you child for you must have sinned to be hurting yourself doing forms. Stabbing yourself with a sword doesn't really count though. Hurting yourself doing forms would be like tripping over your own feet or yelling the tiger sound too loud causing you to lose your voice.

Yeah I know. The torn MCL was recent, in our snake form there is a part where you execute a jump spinning crescent and drop to a splits. The drop to a splits was not the most gracefull. :o The sprained ankle was a butterfly kick gone awry.

[kungfoozer]

Yeah I know. The torn MCL was recent, in our snake form there is a part where you execute a jump spinning crescent and drop to a splits. The drop to a splits was not the most gracefull. :o The sprained ankle was a butterfly kick gone awry.

Jump into a split? Anyone with a pen!s should not be doing that! That's Saturday Night Fever, not kung foo.

[mooyingmantis]

Yes, we practice sweeps (to the back of the leg or ankle) during sparring. Never seen an injury from it. It is one of the first five techniques I teach beginning students.

[TenTigers]

our beginner's curriculum begins with breakfalls and then sweeps.
Anyone who does not teach their students how to take a proper fall, is doing them a diservice.
I tell my students that if they learn nothing else from me, they will learn how to fall.
You may never get into a fight, but you will always fall.

[lkfmdc]

It has been quite obvious from TT's posts that he has never learned the "real falling" and the way he teaches people to fall is just glorified judo, not that there is anything wrong with that mcdojo stuff, but in the secret TCMA way to break fall, which I learned but will not describe to you, well, it's just so much better ;)

Yeah, basicly teach them to fall, the rest takes care of itslef

[YouKnowWho]

It's also important to train how to escape out of a sweep when you have 25%, 50%, and 75% weight on your front leg.

[Lucas]

knowing how to fall should be taught to everyone imo. in life the only people that tend to never/rarely fall have good self body awareness and balance as well as reflex and reaction if the balance is lost.

regular people fall down all the time and they actually get hurt from just falling. now if they knew how to fall....

no real point in reiterating the responses in this thread as to when is best to start using sweeping in sparring, but i will add this:

its really funny to watch someone try to sweep if they dont know how...especially if they fall down trying. :D

[kungfoozer]

our beginner's curriculum begins with breakfalls and then sweeps.
Anyone who does not teach their students how to take a proper fall, is doing them a diservice.
I tell my students that if they learn nothing else from me, they will learn how to fall.
You may never get into a fight, but you will always fall.

IMO falling only works in a curriculum if throwing/takedowns are also being taught. Otherwise people will just scratch their heads and wonder why they are falling. Your reasoning is sound for teaching regular people how to fall. Boxers don't learn break falls. Millions of people get hurt in car accidents every year. The best thing to do is to relax in a collision. Because of this should we teach martial arts students to sit relaxed for long periods of time during class?

[SPJ]

er qi jiao

2 high jumps, one leg after the other

defense against a low leg sweep.

or tumbling either forward or backward as pointed out.

:)

[SPJ]

So far I have stabbed myself with a sword :( long story. Torn an MCL and severely sprained an ankle.

I cut myself plenty of times when I first started to learn how to use straight sword

but never stab myself.

keep fingers crossed.

:eek::)

[Ford Prefect]

I know this guy, once he walked out of his house and tried to cross the street

A truck hit him and killed him

So you should never leave your house

Most definitely never try to cross the street

Yes. There is a possibility for injury in any athletic endeavor whether it be recreational martial arts, soccer, flag football even... It comes with the territory.

[lkfmdc]

Yes. There is a possibility for injury in any athletic endeavor whether it be recreational martial arts, soccer, flag football even... It comes with the territory.

you and Frank win the prize :p

(of course the prize is a cruise together, but you can discuss it in the green room)

;)

[IronWeasel]

. The best thing to do is to relax in a collision. Because of this should we teach martial arts students to sit relaxed for long periods of time during class?


We're all practicing that right now, as we type on the forum.

[IronWeasel]

I know this guy, once he walked out of his house and tried to cross the street

A truck hit him and killed him

So you should never leave your house

Most definitely never try to cross the street


This is actually good advice in Manhattan.

[TenTigers]

IMO falling only works in a curriculum if throwing/takedowns are also being taught. Otherwise people will just scratch their heads and wonder why they are falling. Your reasoning is sound for teaching regular people how to fall. Boxers don't learn break falls. Millions of people get hurt in car accidents every year. The best thing to do is to relax in a collision. Because of this should we teach martial arts students to sit relaxed for long periods of time during class?
BTW-studies have shown that people who participated in contact sports,i.e. Hockey, Football, Martial Arts, etc had higher auto accident survival rates due to the fact that their bodies could withstand trauma. The fascia,connective tissues etc were strengthened from the impact training.

[solo1]

thanks guys. I think Im going to have the conversation with my master. Since its being done I want to be taught to deal with them