Great Lakes Kung Fu, Shuai Chiao and San Shou Championships [Archive]

ginosifu

12-11-2010, 06:14 PM

It's time again to start preparing for the Great Lakes Kung Fu Championships.

Saturday April 9, 2011 in Cleveland, Ohio at Case Western Reserve University. All the Kung Fu Forms and Weapons Divisions you want, Continuous Sparring, Shuai Chiao, San Shou and Internal Divivisions.

Contact John Ervin:
School 216.431.4991 / Email jervinsifu@att.net
Contact me:
440.585.4900 / Email ginosifu@shaolininstitute.com

or you can go to my website: http://shaolininstitute.com

anyone wanting tourney flyers either call or email me with your address and I will put you on the list when it is ready.

ginosifu

ginosifu

12-29-2010, 04:01 PM

Anyone that wants to give a seminar at Great Lakes Tourney (Seminars are done on Sunday) is welcome to let me know. All you have to do is be a judge at the tourney on Saturday.

All CMA styles / techniques welcome.

ginosifu

ginosifu

12-29-2010, 04:42 PM

Another thing we are working on for Great Lakes is Advertizers and Sponsors. We need sponsors for different areas of the tourney. If you are interested in sponsoring a part of it or advertizing your self or business, please contact me ASAP

ginosifu

lkfmdc

12-29-2010, 06:06 PM

Ginosifu,
Can I ask you two questions? First, now even the IWUF has dropped the "continuous strikes to the head" rule from sanshou. So why do you keep it?

Also, as your event is NOT a IWUF event, why do you prohibit knees? As a person with Shuai Jiao background (I think that is correct) why wouldn't you want knee strikes?

I am always looking for places to take my fighters, but the no head strikes and no knees format just makes it impossible for us to compete

ginosifu

12-29-2010, 06:17 PM

David,
The ruleset comes from Dr. Chi Hsiu Weng. I am not sure if it is thru his connections in China or Taiwan that he bases the ruleset from. But it is part of the U. S. S. A. (United States Shuai Chiao Association).

If you want to discuss this with my teacher John Ervin (tournament promotor) He can explain it better than I can.

The head stuff is 2 consecutive strikes to head is ok, after 3 hits to the head you gotta go somewhere else. Like 2 head then round kick to thigh then back to head again. I think they are trying to reduce head injuries.

You can go my web for complete San Shou rules here: http://www.shaolininstitute.com/institute/Tournament

ginosifu

ps. can your guys tone it down a bit to come play with our guys?

lkfmdc

12-29-2010, 07:00 PM

The head stuff is 2 consecutive strikes to head is ok, after 3 hits to the head you gotta go somewhere else. Like 2 head then round kick to thigh then back to head again. I think they are trying to reduce head injuries.

This rule did exist in IWUF competition but it has been abandoned for more than 10 years now. It is, in the opinion of many, hard to say "we do full contact" and yet restrict punches like this. IE if you don't want to get hit in the head, don't do full contact.

There was also a feeling the only reason the IWUF used this rule was the Chinese were really bad boxers!

I know Dr Weng. I know he was involved in the IWUF stuff here in the US so I guess that is where he got the rules from, but like I said, they abandoned the head shot rule over 10 years ago

I also personally like knees, and again, in China, they have changed the rules.

We are just used to hitting people in the head and kneeing them

ginosifu

12-30-2010, 12:51 PM

David,
I spoke with my teacher about the head issue and continuous head is a possibility, but no knees...

if that helps any

ginosifu

Syn7

12-30-2010, 03:23 PM

so where do you draw that line between full contact VS limted contact???

to me when i hear full contact right away i assume it means headshots and knees are allowed... i never took full contact to mean you hit harder lol, i thought it meant you could hit anywhere with any limb... nutts not included ofcourse...

where do you draw that line??? just curious...

can i find any of the tourneys matches on youtube???

edit: found one...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K0Nn1cfbe7Y

ginosifu

12-30-2010, 04:08 PM

Our San Shou is not that different than any other. However the ruleset states no more than 3 consectutive hits to the head, then change for one hit somewhere else. Then you can go right back to the head! It's really not a big deal when your fighting... you'll never really notice the difference as a fighter. We just don't have knee attacks.

Here's some clips of fights:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEIgtT2C7p0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbyDQBzv6Xk&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVACKPtXipo

ginosifu

mjw

01-02-2011, 10:02 AM

I wish this was closer to Chicago......

Iron_Eagle_76

01-06-2011, 11:29 AM

TaichiMantis

01-06-2011, 08:15 PM

ginosifu

01-07-2011, 05:42 AM

One other rule I dislike about the GL tournament is the push out rule, if you get pushed out of the ring twice you lose the round, resulting in losing the fight. If someone is deliberately going out of the ring to engage I can see this, but what happened to me and other matches I saw is when someone was getting beat the other guy would bull charge them out of the ring resulting in a win.

I personally think this needs to be changed as well.

There is a specific throw that we teach to counter the "Push Out". I don't know if I can explain it well here.

As he is pushing you backwards, Stop, turn and allow him to continue his forward momentum. As you turn stick one of your legs out and trip his legs. Continue turning and pull him out of bounds while you stay stationary.

ginosifu

TaichiMantis

01-07-2011, 07:36 PM

There is a specific throw that we teach to counter the "Push Out". I don't know if I can explain it well here.

As he is pushing you backwards, Stop, turn and allow him to continue his forward momentum. As you turn stick one of your legs out and trip his legs. Continue turning and pull him out of bounds while you stay stationary.

ginosifu

Pretty much along the same line I was thinking. We have similar moves in mantis;)

brazilusa

01-08-2011, 01:14 PM

TaichiMantis

01-08-2011, 03:52 PM

Hey! Will ask if any of Sifu Ly Yen Hoa's students want to go...I still say you should move to GR!!!;)

ginosifu

01-08-2011, 04:14 PM

I will be at the tournament again this year :) Any carpoolers? Share hotel costs...etc? Hey TaiChiMantis...

Also Sifu Gino.... I am a traditional guy but due to lack of more traditional kung fu in my area and my need to keep in shape I have been training with a sifu of modern wushu. I saw one wushu guy there last year.

Maybe we can due a seminar?

What is your feeling on a self defense seminar or maybe Krav Maga???

I would definately like some flyers!!!!!!!!!

I can not guarrantee you will due well in traditional kung fu divisions if you do a modern wushu form. Some of the Judges are kinda old school. But some are more modern and may judge you by your skill level and not penalize for the wushu form you perform.

If you would like to due a seminar please... you are welcome. Just have you or your Sifu call the tournament promotor John Ervin and talk with him about it.

U. S. Shuai Chiao Academy 216.431.4991

John's Cell 216.410.8785

or send me a line at my website: http://shaolininstitute.com/institute/contact.php

send me your hard address and I will put you on the flyer list.

ginosifu

ps. that goes for everyone else, send me your hard address if you want a flyer

ginosifu

02-01-2011, 05:45 AM

We are in the process of sending out flyers... anyone want to get one? Send me your street address and I have one sent your way. EarthDragon... send me your address and I will send one to you.

also:
Mooying Mantis - Richard Tolson will do a seminar on Mantis techniques.... on Sunday following the tournament. This might be a chance for that meeting of the kung fu forum? anyone interested in hooking up? we can chat and stuff while Richard does his seminar and maybe after go out to lunch?

ginosifu

Dale Dugas

02-01-2011, 05:59 AM

I would love to come and meet and greet as well as give a seminar.

School is my life until I graduate in August.

After that I will be an acupuncture and martial arts machine.

ginosifu

02-01-2011, 06:11 AM

Dale...
Good luck with school. After you graduate you are always welcome to come (I meant to give) a seminar. There probably always be another Great Lakes Tourney as well.

ginosifu

EarthDragon

02-01-2011, 07:17 AM

gino, please check your PM

ginosifu

02-01-2011, 02:49 PM

Mooying Mantis - Richard Tolson will do a seminar on Mantis techniques.... on Sunday following the tournament. This might be a chance for that meeting of the kung fu forum? anyone interested in hooking up? we can chat and stuff while Richard does his seminar and maybe after go out to lunch?

ginosifu

I just finished speaking with tournament promoter John Ervin (my sifu). I told him about our meeting of the kung fu forum and stated he would consider paying the bill at a local Chinese restaurant, if we got together here in cleveland on april 9.

ginosifu

ginosifu

02-07-2011, 02:49 PM

For everyone who has been waiting: Registration forms are down loadable at my site:
http://www.shaolininstitute.com/institute/Tournament.shtml

Mooyingmantis and EarthDragon are doing seminars on Sunday April 10.... anyone else want in?

ginosifu

baldmantiz

02-16-2011, 10:52 AM

ginosifu,
Where did you purchase your shuai chiao top? I am looking to purchase one (or a few). I will be at the tournament with my sifu, Earthdragon. Thanks,
Andrew

ginosifu

02-16-2011, 01:34 PM

ginosifu,
Where did you purchase your shuai chiao top? I am looking to purchase one (or a few). I will be at the tournament with my sifu, Earthdragon. Thanks,
Andrew

Dr. Weng ... he is out of California... Call me if you need some. We will probably have a few for sale at the tourney.

ginosifu

EarthDragon

02-18-2011, 02:20 PM

Just got fliers in the mail thank you Gino, passing them out to the schools in WNY this weekend

brazilusa

04-07-2011, 05:23 PM

I am heading from Michigan to Cleveland, OH for the tournament. Welcome to ride with me. Carpool.....maybe share hotel room???

mooyingmantis

04-07-2011, 06:29 PM

Look forward to meeting u Brazilusa!

Iron_Eagle_76

04-08-2011, 06:21 AM

Have fun and good luck to all competitors and Richard hope the seminars you and Earthdragon give go well. Sorry I can't attend this year, family obligations.:(

mooyingmantis

04-10-2011, 01:25 PM

Friends,
Here are links to photos from the Great Lakes Kung Fu Tournament and seminars:

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=298897&id=750549480#!/photo.php?fbid=10150168456644481&set=a.10150167811699481.298897.750549480&theater

The first picture features Gino Belfiore (Ginosifu), Mike Haley (Earthdragon) and myself.

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?id=750549480&aid=298897#!/photo.php?fbid=10150167811759481&set=a.10150167811699481.298897.750549480&theater

The second picture features Shaolinrasta, Earthdragon and myself. Shaolinrasta has the thickest and longest dread locks I have ever seen. They almost touch the floor. He is a heck of a forms demonstrator and fighter. Earthdragon and I were privileged to judge the ring Shaolinrasta demonstrated and fought in.

ginosifu

04-10-2011, 02:26 PM

On behalf of my teacher John Ervin (tournament promoter) and myself, I would like to thank everyone who participated, helped out, judged, fought and worked their butts off to make the 2011 Great Lakes Kung Fu Championships a sucess!

Shifu Mike Haley and Shifu Richard Tolson both did tremenous jobs this weekend. They both help me judge forms, weapons and sparring and then today they both gave awesome seminars in which all of my students that attended were truly impressed!

ginosifu

EarthDragon

04-11-2011, 07:24 PM

thank you sifu Gino for the hopitality, it was a pleasure to meet you, help out, judge as well as share a little of my knowledge with you and your students. It w3as great time for us.

next yer we gotta work on doing a forum member meet and greet, maybe some of the forum members can get together and cross hands? would be great to see more of you all there next year. this is a great event! bravo!

Shaolin Rasta

04-16-2011, 10:18 PM

Thank you, Shifu Tolson, for those kind words. I am the one who was honored to have been judged by people of your caliber & notoriety. I have seen or heard of several of you gentlemen in print and online, and it was really great to have the opportunity to meet you all.
Thank you also to Shifu Haley and of course Shifu Gino for the hospitality and patience shown. Our whole small group is grateful to have competed there. I learned a lot about where I am at this stage. Not too far!

ginosifu

04-17-2011, 06:31 AM

Shaolin Rasta:
I would like to thank your school for coming. All of you did great. My students who seen you you perform were amazed at your ability to work your long hair! I really enjoyed your Shao Hung Chuan (Small Red Fist), Very sweet, you can tell you train hard!

Thanks again
ginosifu

ps Shifu Richard was looking to tag you in some FB photos. He wanted your real name? Maybe you PM him.

EarthDragon

04-17-2011, 07:28 AM

editing and photos will be done soon and I will post the links....

mooyingmantis

04-17-2011, 02:25 PM

editing and photos will be done soon and i will post the links....

sweeeeeeet!

YouKnowWho

04-18-2011, 10:43 PM

ginosifu

04-19-2011, 05:10 AM

I have heard some complains from this tournament.

1. You are told that there will be competers in your weight division, so you fly down there, rent a car, check in hotel, and pay your competation fee. During the tournament, you find out that you don't have anybody in your weight class. Instead of getting your competation fee refund, you get a gold metal instead.

2. You bring your students to compete in that tournament. During the tournament, since you are not competing yourself, you have to pay spectator fees.

Sifu Wang:

Having no one in your weight division occasionally does happen. If there is no one in your weight you have a couple of options.

#1 Ask for a refund. You will most likely get it if you speak with myself or Sifu Ervin.

#2 Take your Gold in your division and do nothing.

#3 Take a chance and fight up a weight. You will get to roll around with someone and plus there is a chance to win that division. You will still get your Gold in your original division.

#4 No matter what happens I will make sure you get to roll around with someone. I agree that traveling a long distance and not fighting at all is not fun.

As far as spectators go. If you are not Judge or Competitor, you are a spectator. If you bring your students and you want to get in for free... become a Judge !

ginosifu

EarthDragon

04-19-2011, 05:42 AM

YKW,
one of the reasons most events like this can occasionally not fill every single event, is not enough participation.
This is one of the best run events on the east coast IMHO. But I personally would always like to see more particiapants. There were over 500 people in attendance for this years event and yet there are many thousands of MA in the surrounding states that did not come.
I would ask that to prevent this form happening we help promote the event, enroll our students and support each other and this event for next year. I personally would love to meet more of the members form this board there.

I would love to have a forum memeber get together for lunch or perhaps sunday like we did this year and exchange ideas techniques and share.

If we make our minds up about somethign that we have not yet expereicned we have short changed ourselves ..........

PS the shuai jiao competions were great and your students would have really enjoyed it... see you next year?

lkfmdc

04-19-2011, 06:51 AM

As far as spectators go. If you are not Judge or Competitor, you are a spectator. If you bring your students and you want to get in for free... become a Judge !

ginosifu

Absurd and why people don't support events. You bring 20 students at what $60 a head and thus the event makes $1200 and they want you to pay extra to be there as a spectator?

If you don't see that is wrong, wow

EarthDragon

04-19-2011, 07:49 AM

Dave Ross,
the point is many teachers and coaches like to enter thier students in events like this but dont want to help out with judging. This has been a problem since I used to fight in ISKA in the 80's....... many teachers think selfishly when it comes to these types of events.

If you bring your students to compete then you should at least offer to judge or referee to support the event and do your part. If you want to bring in your school and you are only there for your students or yourself and no one elses, then yes you should have to pay. If you dont agree then simply offer to help out.

BTW it is a mere $10 bucks to spectate..........

ginosifu

04-19-2011, 07:54 AM

Absurd and why people don't support events. You bring 20 students at what $60 a head and thus the event makes $1200 and they want you to pay extra to be there as a spectator?

If you don't see that is wrong, wow

This is common for all National events. If you go to any major tournament this will be the case 99% of the time. Now I have heard a few smaller venues where they just let coaches and sifu in for free but, for the larger scale tourney's, everyone paying is normal.

David: whether you see this as wrong or not does not change the fact that larger scale events have other factors to look at such as:

Every body and there brother is a Sifu and wants to get in for free.

Larger events have a larger price tag and what you don't know behind the scenes is that many promoters have other costs, such as; higher venue cost, paying VIP travel and hotel costs, higher and higher liability insurance etc etc.

In the long run, without spectators, large scale events will go down the tubes. Why can't you just buck up and pay the $10 to support your kung fu brothers?

ginosifu

lkfmdc

04-29-2011, 04:42 PM

Every body and there brother is a Sifu and wants to get in for free.

I am not talking about some dude with no students calling himself "sifu" I am talking about someone that is making YOU a lot of money and then nickle and diming him

I"m sorry, but when I bring students, they are fighting, and I am too busy wrapping hands, warming them up and cornering them to watch guys in PJ's do forms, but I sure as hell am not paying to bring my students to you.....

ginosifu

04-29-2011, 06:57 PM

I am not talking about some dude with no students calling himself "sifu" I am talking about someone that is making YOU a lot of money and then nickle and diming him

I"m sorry, but when I bring students, they are fighting, and I am too busy wrapping hands, warming them up and cornering them to watch guys in PJ's do forms, but I sure as hell am not paying to bring my students to you.....

David,
If you brought 10 or 20 students to support our tournament, I bet you my teacher would let you in for free, you are right... your support would ne appreciated. On a whole though, many peeps walk in and say I am a sifu.... let me in for free. Also my student here.. they are a sifu also, bla bla bla blaaah. That's big problem we have had to deal with here for the last 20 years that I can remember.

Send some fighters next year and I will personally see to it that you get in for free!

On a another side of the story... similar to the state of NY, the Ohio athletic commission is trying to take over all martial arts tournaments. If they take over, they will stop all tournaments unless they follow thier rules. This means you will have to give them their cut... use their doctors, use their insurance etc etc. (they called and said they were going to send undercover agents to our tourney to see what we were doing and possibly shut us down).

ginosifu

lkfmdc

04-29-2011, 07:00 PM

David,
If you brought 10 or 20 students to support our tournament, I bet you my teacher would let you in for free, you are right...

we used to have a saying when we went to kung fu tournaments "10 sifu and between them 3 students"....

everyone is a sifu, not what I am talking about

I took 25 guys to the Arnolds one year, each paid $60 and then they wanted to charge me $40 to enter. That's just messed up.

lkfmdc

04-29-2011, 07:01 PM

PS; Ohio is the WORST commission in the US, they suck

bawang

04-29-2011, 07:02 PM

you should form your own organization and event thats not corrupt. i would join

lkfmdc

04-29-2011, 07:05 PM

you should form your own organization and event thats not corrupt. i would join

we did. china boycotted us :D

true story

bawang

04-29-2011, 07:11 PM

*sheds single tear

YouKnowWho

04-29-2011, 07:12 PM

we did. china boycotted us :D

true story
What was their reason?

I tried to stop the modern Wushu people from competing in the TCMA event. I was removed from my TCMA form judge seat since then. :(

lkfmdc

04-29-2011, 07:56 PM

What was their reason?

I tried to stop the modern Wushu people from competing in the TCMA event. I was removed from my TCMA form judge seat since then. :(

With the USKBA, we started a world championship with rules that didn't favor one team or country

The decisions were fair

The athletes and coaches were well treated

So it got very popular and many international teams came (russia, egypt, brazil, lebanon, georgia, japan, korea, etc etc many teams)

This threatened the IWUF in Beijing who sent out letters saying "do not go to this event"

When it comes to combat sport, teh current government thinks the way to win is to cheat