NYC Choy Li Fut School [Archive] - Kung Fu Magazine Forums

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 02:51 AM

ok. what do we discuss?

May be we can look at Sifu Wong plus Chen Yong-Fa's student's video with Chui Gwongyun's video and see if we can figure out how Jeung Yim co-founded CLF with Chan Heung. Sifu Chui and his student Chan Kam-Fai made the claim and Frank promotes this idea here in the forum.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wH643oYW0s&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CywiYdRAGGs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2Jni955xqI&feature=related

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 07:07 AM

You are off topic again and got the info wrong because it is Futsan who changed the date to make Jeung Yim look older so they can claim Jeung Yim co-founded CLF when in fact Chan Heung taught him as a boy.

Lets look at the videos and tell us what is so different about Futsan Hung Sing to Chan Heung's CLF. I don't see any, apart from the skill levels and which one is better doesn't matter here, they are all CLF.

Drake

03-23-2011, 07:08 AM

Always good to see a new CLF school opening.

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 07:40 AM

Yes, I am going to say that because you cannot tell the difference between skill level and techniques and mistaken them as different sorts of "energy", whatever that means.

For example, a downward block can be done with a straight arm without any forearm rotation (0,29 in Chiu's video) or at a higher level with a slightly bent arm and a little twist of the forearm (0.05 in Wong's video), they are not a different technique but a different skill level of execution.

The former is called Ngoi-lim-shou (outside-of-the-curtain hand) and the latter is called Noi-lim-shou (inside-of-the-curtain hand) and there are tons of examples like this in the videos.

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 08:50 AM

"Meng Kuen Yat Li", "10,000 fists have one principle" but there is a definite CLF flavor just as there is a definite WC flavor. That is what makes us CLF.

No one said forms are a test of combative skill here, I only mentioned there is a difference in skill of execution and not technique one can see visually in the videos and you have mistaken them for being a different CLF, which is not so in my opinion.

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 08:56 AM

It is still a hot dog!

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 09:07 AM

Sure, that is why it is called a CLF hot dog, in memory of Chan Heung's three teachers who all studied Fut Gar Kung Fu and that is where the Fut in Choy Lee Fut came from.

Drake

03-23-2011, 09:15 AM

I sure am glad more CLF schools are opening...

hskwarrior

03-23-2011, 09:16 AM

I sure am glad more CLF schools are opening...

sure. it's a good thing. I'm actually impressed with the guy in new york.

Eric Olson

03-23-2011, 09:41 AM

May be we can look at Sifu Wong plus Chen Yong-Fa's student's video with Chui Gwongyun's video and see if we can figure out how Jeung Yim co-founded CLF with Chan Heung. Sifu Chui and his student Chan Kam-Fai made the claim and Frank promotes this idea here in the forum.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wH643oYW0s&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CywiYdRAGGs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2Jni955xqI&feature=related

I don't think any of these videos are Choy Lay Fut because they don't have a gangsta rap soundtrack. Frank?

EO

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 09:53 AM

If you have fut gar in your lineage it came from Ching Cho via Jeung Hung Sing when he reunited with Chan Heung in Hong Kong between 1864 and 1867.

SUCKA.

Sure, it could have come from Ching Cho (Green Grass), but not via Jeung Yim but via Choy Fook. Any one who knows their Chinese characters would see the obvious, Choy Fook is "Green Grass" because Choy Fook's sure name, Choy or Cai, means "wild grass" and wild grass is always "ching" or unadulterated as being pure in character, unlike cultivated grass. It is just the right alias for a Buddhist monk whose surname is Choy.

http://chinalanguage.com/dictionaries/?pageID=Ch-En/Query&query=蔡

PS: url don't link, here is what the dictionary says:
Cai 蔡 = [1] wild grass [2] Cai state [3] big turtle

hskwarrior

03-23-2011, 09:56 AM

Sure, it could have come from Ching Cho (Green Grass), but not via Jeung Yim but via Choy Fook. Any one who knows their Chinese characters would see the obvious, Choy Fook is "Green Grass" because Choy Fook's sure name, Choy or Cai, means "wild grass" and wild grass is always "ching" or unadulterated as being pure in character, unlike cultivated grass.

Ok so we can all Choy Fook "Grass Cutter Fook"

V.O.R.

03-23-2011, 10:05 AM

Hello Eric,

I seem to remember some time ago you threatened hskwarrior and some fella named K-No. From the pictures of you I've seen you don't look much to be afraid of.

Consequently, I've never heard hskwarrior brag about being a "gangsta" how you put it. Just because he listens to a type of music you wouldn't, was raised around those you couldn't, mixed with the fact that he has always kept it real with who he is, his teacher is, and so forth doesn't make him a gangsta or even a wannabe.

I think you're jealous. hehe

CLFNole

03-23-2011, 10:24 AM

XJ:

Trying to get back on topic...who is Chan Fu Yeen 陈富燕? I have not heard his name before. Was he one of Chan Yiu Chi's children?

Thanks.

bawang

03-23-2011, 10:44 AM

theres a lot of sexual tension between u clf guys

hskwarrior

03-23-2011, 11:17 AM

help us to relieve some of that stress bawang

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 11:33 AM

XJ:

Trying to get back on topic...who is Chan Fu Yeen 陈富燕? I have not heard his name before. Was he one of Chan Yiu Chi's children?

Thanks.

Chan Fu-Yeen is 4th generation from King Mui (not one of Chen Yiu-Chi's children but studied with him) and he is one of the prime movers after the normalization in China at the beginning of the 1980s.

In 1986 he helped to re-establish the King Mui Ancestral School which was shut down for nearly 30 years and taught there so the 5th generation can carry on.

In the 1990s, he helped to collect a large sum of money to set up training schools around the Sunhui district and trained many of the younger generations of CLF outside King Mui in the nearby towns.

He is quite old now and I am not sure if he is still alive. I have only met him once.

PS: He passed away in 1998.

CLFNole

03-23-2011, 11:45 AM

I assume Chan Sun Wui taught in King Mui as well, no?

My current sifu met with him there when they visited several years ago. He looked a lot like Chan Yiu Chi so I assumed he was Chan Wun Hon's brother, correct?

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 12:02 PM

Do you mean Chan Sun-Ciu? We called him Gow Shuk (Uncle Number 9) and he is not really into Kung Fu like his older brother Wun Hon. Chan Kit-Fong (Ng Fu-Heng's mother) is their sister.

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 12:09 PM

help us to relieve some of that stress bawang

Well, he sucked bigtime, he had no later movement, no head movement, his guard was atrocious, his footwork horrific and he didn't know how to work the corners.
In short, he sucked the sweat of a dead man's balls.

And I'm pretty positive that's not going to taste too well hahahahaha

Since he is pretty positive, I think that is what Frank would do to relieve some of his sexual tensions - sucking balls dead or alive, hahahahaha! :eek::D

CLFNole

03-23-2011, 12:20 PM

XJ:

Yes you are correct my bad on the last part of the name. I know he was there at the Ancestral School when they visited and I have seen him in pictures when Wong Doc Fai visited and was looking at the kuen po, so I just assumed he taught or was involved in some capacity at some time.

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 12:27 PM

Sorry CLFNole, I am having fun here walking my dog for the day...

At least my shaboinker still rises with the sun ......OLD MAN. :D

My shaboinker is more forthright than you EJ.....he doesn't lie.

Hi Frank,

A shaboinker that does not lie is not a real shaboinker, what yopu have there is just a sunriser. :D

CLFNole

03-23-2011, 12:28 PM

Enjoy!!! But play nice you two.

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 12:32 PM

You know I am always nice to my ferocious pit bull who just won't let go...:D

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 12:38 PM

Yeah, you sure dropped a lot of them!:p

extrajoseph

03-23-2011, 12:47 PM

Looks like you like to smell that stuff as well as sucking balls. :eek::D

Fei Ling Skool

03-23-2011, 12:51 PM

So yeah about CLF NYC... thanks for posting the link.

Anyone looking for good CLF in NYC is welcome to come check us out.

Peace.

hskwarrior

03-23-2011, 12:52 PM

So yeah about CLF NYC... thanks for posting the link.

Anyone looking for good CLF in NYC is welcome to come check us out.

Peace.

this is a bad place to advertise anything!!!! LOL

taai gihk yahn

03-23-2011, 12:55 PM

So yeah about CLF NYC... thanks for posting the link.

Anyone looking for good CLF in NYC is welcome to come check us out.

Peace.

where is your school located? your guys' stuff looks really nice, actually some of the best CLF I've ever seen;

Fei Ling Skool

03-23-2011, 01:20 PM

this is a bad place to advertise anything!!!! LOL

the best advertisement here would be for the throwdown between you and XJ. You guys should think about it, there's probably some good money in it.

hskwarrior

03-23-2011, 01:24 PM

the best advertisement here would be for the throwdown between you and XJ. You guys should think about it, there's probably some good money in it.

I know right?!?!?!? hahahaha..

Sadly, the only thing i'd use my fists to do against EJ would be to throw the book that i'm writing at him!!!!! :D

its only history that we bug out over.

Fei Ling Skool

03-23-2011, 01:28 PM

where is your school located? your guys' stuff looks really nice, actually some of the best CLF I've ever seen;

Thank you.

We're in the Bay Ridge area of Brooklyn.

you can hit us up at choyleefut@choyleefutusa.com if you want to come check us out.

LSWCTN1

03-24-2011, 04:02 AM

Dont wanna cause mischief, but...

Why is it named Hung Sing if it is Chan Heung lineage? Asked out of genuine ignorance..

extrajoseph

03-24-2011, 04:03 AM

the best advertisement here would be for the throwdown between you and XJ. You guys should think about it, there's probably some good money in it.

You might not be aware of this, what goes on between me and Frank is one of the reasons why your Sifu is in NY teaching King Mui CLF, why your Sikung Chen Zhong-Jie and others made sure that CLF became an officially recognized intangible heritage of China:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dtl_n3HJkY

and why he organized this conference (Choy Lee Fut Origin and Development) with Chui Kwongyuan, Chan Kam-Fai and Futan Hung Sing in attendance to clarify our history face to face:

http://www.chinachoyleefut.com/clf.php?cmd=4571e79d72529

It is not about money, it is about our tradition and our heritage. Truth will prevail over time but we have to work at it and up hold what is righteous with patience and tolerance. That is the reason why I kept going here with Frank for the last 10 years, so people can see both sides of the story and not be misinformed.

My best wishes to Sifu Wong and the success of your school.

extrajoseph

03-24-2011, 04:45 AM

Dont wanna cause mischief, but...

Why is it named Hung Sing if it is Chan Heung lineage? Asked out of genuine ignorance..

That is because some people like Frank gave the impression (more like deliberate misinformation) that Hung Sing is exclusively Futsan when in fact Hung Sing is the name of the first ancestral school set up in King Mui by Chan Heung. The Chinese characters changed over time for various reasons but they kept the same sounds because we belong together, operating in different areas of China at different times by different teachers.

What distinguish Sifu Wong's school is not the words "Hung Sing" but the words "Chi-Jo-Gwoon" (the Ancestral School), which means it is a direct lineage continuation of the ancestral school first set up by Chan Heung in 1836 in King Mui, now operating in NY.

Eric Olson

03-24-2011, 05:55 AM

the best advertisement here would be for the throwdown between you and XJ. You guys should think about it, there's probably some good money in it.

My money's on the old man.

EO

lkfmdc

03-24-2011, 07:42 AM

Every morning I get up and I just thank G'd that CLF is that one Chinese martial art where no one bickers like little children, thank G'd! :rolleyes:

hskwarrior

03-24-2011, 07:45 AM

Every morning I get up and I just thank G'd that CLF is that one Chinese martial art where no one bickers like little children, thank G'd!

WOW me too dude :eek:

Thank G'd you never argued over the Green Cloud character huh?

lkfmdc

03-24-2011, 08:00 AM

Frank
It's funny you bring up the green cloud / clear cloud issue because it is very similar

In that someone who doesn't speak Chinese and has no idea how it works tries to argue with someone who DOES

Frank, you obviously have no idea how funny you sound arguing about "hung sing"

It has been suggested to you before that since you don't have any background in the language, culture or history that you don't have the basic tools to write a book about this!

But please feel free to continue to argue for pages and pages :rolleyes:

extrajoseph

03-24-2011, 08:18 AM

This 洪勝 name is a synonym of a 4 character phrase used by the Hung Mun. And monk Ching Cho was a Hung Mun co-founder. When my book comes out, you will see that connection. The exact name was also used by one of the tongs in the Guangxi Mountains which proves that the name wasn't our own creation.

Even the word "勝" is a triad word, one obviously missing from Chan Heung's "洪聖" Hung Sing name.

What makes you think "勝" (Sing - victory) is a triad word exclusively used by the Hung Mun or Futsan? Many Chinese have that character in their personal or business names. For example, Chen Yong-Fa's clinic is called Wing Sing Tong 永勝堂 (Hall of Eternal Victory) passed down from Chan Heung who had that name for his first clinic in King Mui, and it has nothing to do with the Hung Mun or Futsan or Jeung Yim for that matter.

Also Hung Sing with these two characters 洪勝 was never used in any of the CLF branches, because it would have invited all sorts of unnecessary troubles from the Ching government, since it means Victory to the Hung Mun and Hung Mun was trying to overthrow the Ching dynasty.

A Gwailo with little knowledge of the Chinese language is trying to tell us to suck eggs. LOL.

extrajoseph

03-24-2011, 09:02 AM

Where did i say "EXCLUSIVELY"?

you may feel free to contact any of these tongs and find out for yourself : Hop Sing Tong (合勝堂), Suey Sing Tong (萃勝堂), Hip Sing Tong (協勝堂), Wo SING Wo (和勝和). How many of these were not Triad connected?

I can think of quite a few without the character "Sing", so your theory that it has to have "Sing" in a triad organization don't hold: “天地會”，“三合會”，“哥老會”，“小刀會”， “金臺山”，“明論堂”， “致公堂”，“興中會”，“大陸山”，“精忠山”， “築青山”，“興漢會”。

extrajoseph

03-24-2011, 09:04 AM

How do you know why Chan Heung chose to call his clinic that? Why ETERNAL VICTORY? Victory over what? LOL.....:D you don't know do you hahahaha.

Victory over disease and sickness, what else do you do with a medical clinic? hahahaha.

extrajoseph

03-24-2011, 09:15 AM

Quote:
Victory over disease and sickness, what else do you do with a medical clinic? hahahaha.
Oh really? do you have anything to support that claim? I got LOTS to support mine.

Just call Chen Yong-Fa and ask him, or email your secret contact there. :D

extrajoseph

03-24-2011, 09:18 AM

But i am a member of one of those tongs you posted. And i bet you couldn't tell me half as much about it as i could tell you. You know that 4 character phrase that i mentioned that contains the Hung Sing synonym? one of the set of characters you just posted actually uses it. :D

Big deal Frank, you are a Tong member. What has that got to do with CLF?

hskwarrior

03-24-2011, 09:19 AM

Just call Chen Yong-Fa and ask him, or email your secret contact there.

hahaha. If Chan Yong Fa had knowledge of the inner workings of the Chinese Secret Societies i'd love to talk with him. My secret contact? uhhh, did you want to know his name? :confused:

extrajoseph

03-24-2011, 09:29 AM

So you belong to a Ching Cho lodge means everyone in Futsan is doing Ching Cho CLF. Wow, love your logic!:eek::D

hskwarrior

03-24-2011, 09:32 AM

So you belong to a Ching Cho lodge means everyone in Futsan is doing Ching Cho CLF. Wow, love your logic!

can you quote me? PLEASE?

However, EVERYONE who supported the Canton area Hung Mun was involved with Ching Cho's lodge. INCLUDING Chan Heung.

extrajoseph

03-24-2011, 09:37 AM

However, EVERYONE who supported the Canton area Hung Mun was involved with Ching Cho's lodge. INCLUDING Chan Heung.

How do you know? Show us the evidence.

hskwarrior

03-24-2011, 09:39 AM

How do you know? Show us the evidence.

:D NO! It's not my place to educate you on this subject. do some research.

extrajoseph

03-24-2011, 09:41 AM

There it goes, round and round in a circle or baseless claims!

extrajoseph

03-24-2011, 09:47 AM

I have found it already and you have to tell me what it is. :eek:

Have you ever thought of doing a course on logical thinking?

extrajoseph

03-24-2011, 09:57 AM

Sorry Franky Doggy, but the walking session in circles is over for the day, I have to do some work. Be nice and don't make this place too smelly, someone can pick up your sh1t for the day. Cheerio!

hskwarrior

03-24-2011, 10:14 AM

Sorry Franky Doggy, but the walking session in circles is over for the day, I have to do some work. Be nice and don't make this place too smelly, someone can pick up your sh1t for the day. Cheerio!

I like Cherrio's! :eek: