Who studies Xing Yi Quan here?

[shaolin_allan]

Hello I was just curious to see who all the practicioners of xing yi quan here and what style of it you study under what lineage? Also what style did you come from or what drew you to xing yi? After the recent light now shining on Baji and it becoming seemingly more popular, it almost seems like xing yi is one of the lesser trained styles unless its along with bagua at the same school.

[Violent Designs]

I wouldn't say Bajiquan is more popular than Xing Yi... both are still quite difficult to find.

[YouKnowWho]

Most of the "pure" Taiji, XingYi, or Bagua guys won't stay in this forum but Rum Soaked Fist forum or Emptyflower forum. We may have people who cross trained XingYi here and I'm one of them.

After I have seem my teacher to use his XingYi 橫拳(Heng Qhuan) to knock a young challenger 45 degree up in the air like a flying bird, I had totally faith in his XingYi system. I have seen people been knocked down to the ground. That was the first time that I saw someone was knocked 45 degree "up" into the sky. That young challenger's body flew up and then went back down. It was a very strange feeling. Too bad that I didn't have chance to record it.

[shaolin_allan]

After I have seem my teacher to use his XingYi 橫拳(Heng Qhuan) to knock a young challenger 45 degree up in the air like a flying bird (before that I didn't know to knock someone up in the air was even possible), I had totally faith in his XingYi system.

That's an awesome story. i personally know some of the Hebei style which I have just started practicing again, just now getting through the first 3 elements. It seems like zuan quan would be good for sending someone upward. I love the style but plan on learning baji or a shaolin system as well

[YouKnowWho]

When you train the XingYi system, you don't get tire that easy. May be there are not that many kicks in it. But I think the way that the XinYi system forms were designed in such a way that could make your body feel more comfortable to do it. The Sung (no body tension) may be the main factor there.

[shaolin_allan]

When you train the XingYi system, you don't get tire that easy. May be there are not that many kicks in it. But I think the way that the XinYi system forms were designed in such a way that could make your body feel more comfortable to do it. The Sung (no body tension) may be the main factor there.


Yeah I agree. From an audience standpoint the other related arts look more fun to do or are more regularly available already such as taiji. Hebei xing yi in appearance can look very slow to others. it does feel comfortable for me to do and ive tried a lot of kung fu styles but have come back to xing yi. what style of xing yi did u learn youknowwho?

[YouKnowWho]

what style of xing yi did u learn youknowwho?

Hebei xing yi from Baoding, Hebei.

[Violent Designs]

There are many similarity between Xing Yi and Baji? Both seem to focus a lot on generating explosive power to a target point.

[YouKnowWho]

There are many similarity between Xing Yi and Baji? Both seem to focus a lot on generating explosive power to a target point.
XingYi Fajin is less noticeable than the Baji. It's easier to see the power in Baji Fajin, It's not that easy to see the power in XingYi Fajin. In other words, the Baji Fajin may be more exaggrete than the XingYi Fajin. Of course if you cross train both systems, you may integrate both idea and make it hard to distinguish.

In

- Baji, you compress to the maximum, you then release to the maximum (your mind is in compress and release).
- XinYi, you don't compress to the maximum and release to the maximum, but you have all your body behind it (your mind is in body unification).

One Baji master once made a joke about his own style. He said, "Al Baji guys have bad temper. We try to kill our opponent in every single strike. When our opponent move back faster than our advance, we feel unsatisfied".

The XingYi master may make comment such as, "I'll try to destroy everything in my moving path. If my opponent keeps out of my way, it won't bother me a bit."

Maybe others can explain the difference better than me.

[shaolin_allan]

to me the differences seemed like people assume that the most weight is on the front leg when u strike in xing yi but the weight is still more on the back foot where in baji they seem to come through on the front leg. also the power generation in baji looks more like a whipping motion to me to generate the power from the hips. i could be wrong

[doug maverick]

ive studied various arts but i was studying fu jow pai, before becoming enthralled with the economy of motion that is xing yi chuan. the simple directness of it was amazing. the teacher i trained with, was not a teacher by trade and only had about four students and we met every twice every two weeks. he trained with wang ji wu on the mainland, as a kid till he was a teen, and then studied with wang shu jin in both taiwan and later in japan, finishing his xing yi/yi chuan. and also studying tai chi from the hefty man. so my style is kind of a mix, you have the traditional side of it with wang ji wu's xing yi, also incorporating his famous ni gong, which i believe a book was written on the subject, which was called 16 nei gong exercises, mine is closer to 20 different nei gong movements. and then you have the brutalness of wang ji wu's style, wang's xing yi uses more of a walking step and not the half step or slidding step of other xing yi styles. there is more twisting of the body to unleash maximum power. i like the marriage of both those methods. not to mention all the yi quan stance work and moving meditation. i havent seen my teacher in a few years as he took a really good job in brazil. so im still just training on my own.

[GeneChing]

I loved it. Sadly (for me) Sifu Tony moved on, so I haven't done much with it since.

I wrote a few articles on it at the time:
Serpent Power: The Slinky Qi of Snake Style in Hung Gar, Taiji and Xingyi 2001 March/April (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=259)

Chicken Fu - The Underrated Animal of Xingyi 2003 July/August (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=351)

Xingyi's Dadao: The Lost Legacy of the Big Blade Troop 2006 March/April (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=646)

The Traditional Art of 5 Elements Long Pole 2006 May/June (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=650)

We even did a Special Xingyi Issue - 2008 November/December (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=789)

I think that's all that I've written personally, but there may be more. There's a lot that other people have written for us over the years.

[BillSmith]

Hi allan

I practice TST Hsing-I. MY instructor is John Price.

What I love about hsing-i is that it is a no nonsense fighting art. Good solid techniques and the exercises that help you develope great power and speed along with the ability to feel what your opponent is going to do almost before he does it.

It has given me everything that good kung fu is supposed to.

[doug maverick]

I loved it. Sadly (for me) Sifu Tony moved on, so I haven't done much with it since.

I wrote a few articles on it at the time:
Serpent Power: The Slinky Qi of Snake Style in Hung Gar, Taiji and Xingyi 2001 March/April (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=259)

Chicken Fu - The Underrated Animal of Xingyi 2003 July/August (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=351)

Xingyi's Dadao: The Lost Legacy of the Big Blade Troop 2006 March/April (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=646)

The Traditional Art of 5 Elements Long Pole 2006 May/June (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=650)

We even did a Special Xingyi Issue - 2008 November/December (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=789)

I think that's all that I've written personally, but there may be more. There's a lot that other people have written for us over the years.

tony chen doesnt teach anymore? think he was the only baji guy around state side.

[GeneChing]

So no, he doesn't teach anymore. :(

[shaolin_allan]

what is TST xing yi? Does everyone else here also study Hebei style besides me? How do you guys think I am doing content wise for me having only had two lessons?

[Juan Alvarez]

I study Hebei, Tianjin lineage.

[shaolin_allan]

cool Juan for how long now?

[Punch.HeadButt]

I study Hebei Xing Yi as well.

It's strange for me to see so many that practice Hebei XY. I was under the impression that Shanxi (sp?) was much more popular.

[Juan Alvarez]

5 or 6 years now. What I really like is the directness of the style.

@PHB: I don't know many Xingyi practicionners, but those I know seem to be split 50-50 in Shanxii and Hebei. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Hebei is the most popular lineage in China.

[Lucas]

i met someone today who will start teaching xingyi in a month when they get back into town...any good links or references for someone to start scholarly studies on this style?

thanks in advance!

[Punch.HeadButt]

@PHB: I don't know many Xingyi practicionners, but those I know seem to be split 50-50 in Shanxii and Hebei. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Hebei is the most popular lineage in China.

Interesting, must just be some kink in my exposure. Either that or I'm just not paying enough attention! I have no idea what's popular in China, though.

Lucas, there's a lot of good Xing Yi footage on the DPGDPG Youtube channel. Though I'm sure it's well known around here, here's the link:

http://www.youtube.com/user/DPGDPG

Not aware of any good literary links, though.

[shaolin_allan]

I have found many similarities to wing chun in the Hebei Xingyiquan i've been taught

[YouKnowWho]

I have found many similarities to wing chun in the Hebei Xingyiquan i've been taught

Someone made comment as, "In XingYi, the body leads the arm. In WC, the arm leads the body". I don't think "20ch 6dfv" and "snake engine" can apply to XingYi at all. :D

[shaolin_allan]

lol that is very true

[Lucas]

Thanks for the link punch :)

[Punch.HeadButt]

I have found many similarities to wing chun in the Hebei Xingyiquan i've been taught

I've noticed that people usually compare Xing Yi and Wing Chun, usually commenting on "centerline strategy". I don't really get it. Offensive pressure on the centerline is hardly an uncommon trait. I don't know why parallels get drawn between any martial art and Wing Chun based purely on centerline strategy or use of a Sun fist. Note I'm not suggesting that you're basing your comparison on that, it's just a bit of a curiosity to me that your comment brought to mind. Admittedly, I have no experience in training in Wing Chun, so I may be missing some key element in the comparison.


Thanks for the link punch

:) You're welcome!

[doug maverick]

So no, he doesn't teach anymore. :(

that sucks gene, i might be bi coastal soon, and i would love to start training some baji quan which i believe sifu chen also taught although i could be getting mixed up. only one guy teaches it here in ny but you gotta learn mantis first which im not interested in.

[Ray Pina]

Hsing-I seemed like the most natural, practical and reasonable system I've ever studied. It changed my life. I use the mechanics everyday for some task while thinking practically and efficiently. Good stuff. Powerful.

[shaolin_allan]

to me it seems like the mechanics of xing yi can be applied when needed to all the other styles which is really cool

[Hardwork108]

. i havent seen my teacher in a few years as he took a really good job in brazil. so im still just training on my own.

Just a quick question. If you don't mind me asking, what part of Brasil did your teacher go to?

[doug maverick]

he works for an engineering firm in rio.

[Foiling Fist]

I practice Sun Lu Tang Hsing-i. Sun Lu Tang learned Hupei (Hubei) branch then added his theories and modified the sets so it is like a sub-branch of Hupei. The elements are fundamentally the same.

You can see Jet Li doing Hsing-i, and Ba Gua while he is chains, in the movie The One.

The new book Axe Hand; Hsing-i & Internal Strength Workout gives a good foundation in San Ti Stance, and the Five Elements. Aids independent study with moving adjustments that allow you too feel your own center, root and Qi, as well as test it.

Energy cultivation with:
Five move Tai Chi form,
Standing Pole (Embrace the Moon or Hold the Ball)
shifting the water and rising-expanding/sinking-contracting;
Fore-arm Throw double set, dynamic drill, adjusting moving root,
responsive blocking enabling the same move for offence and defense,
center of Qi as it moves through oneself and
the center between two people;
Hsing-i San Ti: standing and moving for Qi and Fa Jing.

Hsing I Five Elements detailed with step by step photos, Twelve Animals steps written descriptions.

http://www.lulu.com/product/paperbac...rkout/15063347
****
i met someone today who will start teaching xingyi in a month when they get back into town...any good links or references for someone to start scholarly studies on this style?

thanks in advance!

[shaolin_allan]

wow im surprised to see so many good responses! us xing yi guys need to stick together.

[Lucas]

wow im surprised to see so many good responses! us xing yi guys need to stick together.

thank you for the reference !!

i have to say i am excited to have an opportunity to study this style. i will learn more about the lineage when the teacher returns to the states.

[BillSmith]

what is TST xing yi?

I've been told that TST Hsing-I is Hebei Hsing-I.
TST stands for the organization that teaches it, Tang Shou Tao.

[shaolin_allan]

I've noticed that people usually compare Xing Yi and Wing Chun, usually commenting on "centerline strategy". I don't really get it. Offensive pressure on the centerline is hardly an uncommon trait. I don't know why parallels get drawn between any martial art and Wing Chun based purely on centerline strategy or use of a Sun fist. Note I'm not suggesting that you're basing your comparison on that, it's just a bit of a curiosity to me that your comment brought to mind. Admittedly, I have no experience in training in Wing Chun, so I may be missing some key element in the comparison.
!

I should have been a bit more specific. The style of wc i studied is leung ting lineage. They use a cat stance with most of the weight on the back foot. The san ti stance feels very similar to the stance I was taught in wing chun. The water element could easily have the lower arm being a bong sao with the upper hand being a hammer strike. The turning stance is also the same and/or similar to the pigeon toed stance in wing chun. When I said they seemed similar to me I actually wasnt referring to the use of the phoenix fist or the centerline theory, but I agree with what you said otherwise.

[Violent Designs]

If you try to blend too many things you may confuse yourself and not do any one set of principles "properly" while learning.

[Hardwork108]

he works for an engineering firm in rio.

Thank you. Please check your PM.:)

[Punch.HeadButt]

I should have been a bit more specific. The style of wc i studied is leung ting lineage. They use a cat stance with most of the weight on the back foot. The san ti stance feels very similar to the stance I was taught in wing chun. The water element could easily have the lower arm being a bong sao with the upper hand being a hammer strike. The turning stance is also the same and/or similar to the pigeon toed stance in wing chun. When I said they seemed similar to me I actually wasnt referring to the use of the phoenix fist or the centerline theory, but I agree with what you said otherwise.

Fair enough, and again I didn't mean to imply that you were comparing them based on centerline strategies or fist-shapes. Just a comparison I see/hear often that I was reminded of (it mostly just makes me curious as to why it's always Wing Chun that is used for the comparison...maybe its popularity). For my own part, there are quite a few postures in Ba Gua, Xing Yi, and Sun Tai Chi where I've paused and thought to myself "this looks kind of Wing Chunny" based purely on shape. But again, I have no Wing Chun background, so I can't draw any comparisons beyond that.

[Lucas]

I am no expert on wing Chun dev. But doesn't wc have base roots in shaolin. Scatterd in shaolin material u will see some similarities to wing Chun. I first noticed this after taste testing wc after study shaolin and again on practice and review of my material. Def wc has dev. Much in its evolution but there will always be the roots...shaolin tree is very broad so many of the offshoots have entertwining roots.

[donjitsu2]

Hello I was just curious to see who all the practicioners of xing yi quan here and what style of it you study under what lineage? Also what style did you come from or what drew you to xing yi? After the recent light now shining on Baji and it becoming seemingly more popular, it almost seems like xing yi is one of the lesser trained styles unless its along with bagua at the same school.

Hebei style...kinda.

Though my teacher spent time with Alan Pittman he was also heavily influenced by Yiquan and Lin Kong Jing - So, we pretty much spent most of our time standing and doing the 5 xing. I was taught most of the animals but now I only train one (Tiger).

So, my Xingyi training now consists of a lot of San Ti, a very simple 5 Element form, and I throw in some work on Tiger xing pretty regularly.

[shaolin_allan]

punch headbutt i was just wondering what style(s) it is that you study? I do agree with what you said many people make simple comparisons between wc and xing yi based on the centerline theory when the truth is many kf styles attack on the centerline.

[Punch.HeadButt]

punch headbutt i was just wondering what style(s) it is that you study? I do agree with what you said many people make simple comparisons between wc and xing yi based on the centerline theory when the truth is many kf styles attack on the centerline.

Ba Gua, Xing Yi, and Sun Tai Chi lol. At least that's what I'm currently getting formal instruction in. Most of my own practice prior to coming under my current Sifu was basic stand-up stuff (boxing hands w/ elbows for good measure, basic kicking, rudimentary take-downs). My Sifu was a Hung Kuen/BSL guy for most of his life, and all my classmates have either Hung Kuen or BSL backgrounds, so I get decent exposure to viewpoints coming from those methods, too.

I think the comparison is always drawn with WC because of a) its popularity and b) how obvious its centerline pressure is generally presented. It's just one of those little things I always notice when looking at Xing Yi clips and seeing the commentary on them.


I am no expert on wing Chun dev. But doesn't wc have base roots in shaolin. Scatterd in shaolin material u will see some similarities to wing Chun. I first noticed this after taste testing wc after study shaolin and again on practice and review of my material. Def wc has dev. Much in its evolution but there will always be the roots...shaolin tree is very broad so many of the offshoots have entertwining roots.

I agree. By my (limited) understanding, WC does have Shaolin roots so it's easy to appreciate similarities in shape popping up between movements of different styles. Actually, as Ba Gua has no Shaolin roots (at last not my lineage) and I'm still seeing such similarities I suppose it's just a body mechanics thing. We can only move so many ways, right?

[KTS]

hebei xingyquan here.

guess there is more than you thought.

i have a healthy amount of respect for the TST program. it is quite a full program and seems to do pretty well in systematically developing fighters. though i may be partial having learnt from the same source one generation removed.

bill smith - yeah, the tang shou tao is hebei xingyi, but with a slight bagua twist some say. it all comes from hung i-hsiang, which is my grandteacher who developed the tang shou tao system of study.

as far as i know, tang shou tao is more of hung's systematic teaching method more than it is an association - though i am not denying that it is an association. i have just seen it as more of his personal way of developing a well rounded fighter from beginner to advanced.

[rielski]

Most of the "pure" Taiji, XingYi, or Bagua guys won't stay in this forum but Rum Soaked Fist forum or Emptyflower forum. We may have people who cross trained XingYi here and I'm one of them.

After I have seem my teacher to use his XingYi 橫拳(Heng Qhuan) to knock a young challenger 45 degree up in the air like a flying bird, I had totally faith in his XingYi system. I have seen people been knocked down to the ground. That was the first time that I saw someone was knocked 45 degree "up" into the sky. That young challenger's body flew up and then went back down. It was a very strange feeling. Too bad that I didn't have chance to record it.


where did you study xingyi at

[YouKnowWho]

where did you study xingyi at
From my teacher.

[Razaunida]

From whom did you study Xing Yi?

[YouKnowWho]

From whom did you study Xing Yi?
Are you asking who my teacher was? He passed away 25 years ago. I don't like to mention his name too often. I'm honored to be my teacher's student. I Just can't live under his reputation for the rest of my life.