What level is your Wing Chun at?

[LoneTiger108]

Simple question really. :D

Do you have a grading/assessment system that explains what level your are training at and what you are aiming for?

Who assesses you?

[couch]

Simple question really. :D

Do you have a grading/assessment system that explains what level your are training at and what you are aiming for?

Who assesses you?

I have an internal compass that leads me in the direction I'm going.

Then, I stop every so often and make sure I'm on that path or if it's even time to change directions.

[LoneTiger108]

So, in effect you assess yourself right? But who taught you to do that? Was it through your Wing Chun teaching or not?

I also hear many people say they assess themselves through fighting others, but really? Is that the only way to assess your Martial Art skill?

[couch]

So, in effect you assess yourself right? But who taught you to do that? Was it through your Wing Chun teaching or not?

I also hear many people say they assess themselves through fighting others, but really? Is that the only way to assess your Martial Art skill?

Who taught me how to do that? I did. I know me better than anyone else. It's a personal journey, no one else can walk it for me.

Depends on your goals. If it's forms, you can enter competitions. You can get people who have been practicing forms to critique the forms. If it's about fighting, you have to test yourself in your own personal way - whatever that "skill" you speak of looks like to you.

Again...all personal. Nobody can determine either points you bring up except for the practitioner themselves.

[jesper]

Simple question really. :D

Do you have a grading/assessment system that explains what level your are training at and what you are aiming for?

Who assesses you?

When I fight people from outside my club I win more often then I loose.
Though I dont fight that much anymore, since at age 42 it takes a hell of a time to heal back up :p

Why would I need a belt to tell me the same ?

[Buddha_Fist]

I also hear many people say they assess themselves through fighting others, but really? Is that the only way to assess your Martial Art skill?

Yes. :D

More importantly, it's the only way you can examine whether your training actually translates into something that works in a fight.

[anerlich]

Assessment system? Yes.

Assessors? My instructors and training buds.

Those whose opinions of my skill don't matter? Video critics and the vast majority of internet forum members.


I also hear many people say they assess themselves through fighting others, but really? Is that the only way to assess your Martial Art skill?


I heard that too ... from you on your other thread for example!

[cobra]

I'm doing as good as I can based off of my understanding, training and experience at this time and always thinking about better ways to do what I do based oFf of what I'm thinking about, right now that's how to go to sleep.

[dottydots]

My level of WC? Bwahahaha...
Newbie in WC, so, be prepared to laugh ===>

.I am able to do and understand Little Idea, first part.
.Chum Kiu and Biu Jee is still new
.Both arms feel tired when I am doing the double sticky hand, very wrong, I know
.Bong Sau position is ok these days but 'overstayed' when I paused and wondered what should be my next move
.Pak Sau is mean but at times, I missed :( and therefore, BIG ouch to my palm whenever I hit the partner's elbow instead of arm
.I love to do Huen Sau, the circling hand but, I was told that I have no power and therefore, it didnt hurt :(
.Alot of times, too many infact, I didnt observe my Centre Line well during free sparring and you know what happened thereafter
.Weak interchanging of hands between attack and defence... Sigh
.Lousy side steps
.A lot of fearsss .... I missed "rushing in" whenever there are openings as well as, I didnt "pursue" sufficiently when I have an advantage

I am not sure if I have made myself clear :P
I saw this post right after a practice session with my colleague and I am still laughing at my own mistakes, made just 10 mins ago....

"""OMG, What the hell were I thinking of!!! I used TWO hands to check his ONE arm!!! Oh god help me !!!"""

/facepalm

[LoneTiger108]

My level of WC? Bwahahaha...
Newbie in WC, so, be prepared to laugh ===>

I aint laughing ;) Thanks for being true to yourself and it's good to examine yourself the way you have imho, but as a self confessed newbie does your Sifu or his Sifu have anything to do with your assessment?

[LoneTiger108]

When I fight people from outside my club I win more often then I loose.
Though I dont fight that much anymore, since at age 42 it takes a hell of a time to heal back up :p

Why would I need a belt to tell me the same ?

I'm not really talking of belts, just someone looking through what you have done and testing your ability in an easy to understand way. Certified, yes, but no belts please.

Do you assess your ability through any other activity than fighting?

[LoneTiger108]

Again...all personal. Nobody can determine either points you bring up except for the practitioner themselves.

I understand. But I'm a little bewildered that you have no contact with any seniors or a Sifu that you can trust to assess your ability in WING CHUN. Must be a lonely path for you my friend :(

[Cdr.Instigator]

My WC has no level.. if there is a rank from 1 to 10- 10 being a Sifu Sidekick.. I'm a -1...

I have no formal WC training.
My training consists on reading WC book, watching and studying martial arts moves in movies, hitting my punching bag with some High, Med and Low kicks... both to center of mass straight and side kicks.
I imagine a punch coming at me, I imagine blocking and hitting multiple times to center and upper mass of punching bag. I do round house kicks and I can hit a ball that's 6 feet high behind me and send a soccer ball across the street. The last time I fought in the street was in 5th grade.. I'm about to be 46 years old, so fighting to me is a last resort as I'm too old to play that way. I'm mostly looking at it for self defense as I don't want to have to use my G23 for any fight that might arise.

I have no idea what I'm doing so, I SUCK at Wing Chun!! :D

[TenTigers]

I've been told I'm certifiable....

[couch]

I understand. But I'm a little bewildered that you have no contact with any seniors or a Sifu that you can trust to assess your ability in WING CHUN. Must be a lonely path for you my friend :(

Here's the neat thing about all of this:

I talk and get together with folks just like me: lonely souls who follow their own personal path. We compare 'notes' and my life doesn't feel so isolated anymore. :)

Secondly, I do still see my Sifu. Once to twice a year I get to see him. But he's on his path and I'm on mine. We've talked to great lengths about this and both respect each other in where we want to take our Wing Chun. Again, we get together, compare notes and both leave feeling like we've gained something from each other's company.

[Grilo]

First you have to assume the people "teaching" you are better than you to accept their criticisms. Second you have to want to get better and want to learn or if you just practice the stuff one person passes on you will only have a body of select movements, not knowledge.

My level of wing chun is where it is. no higher. no lower. No one can tell me different. It is mine. Do I feel proficient in my wing chun. no. But that also does not mean I could not help someone else with theirs, given point one. The other issue with my level of wing chun is that I have a pretty different back ground when it comes to MA and that what I know and have put into my wing chun is not the same as my Sifu and what he may be looking for while comparing his wing chun to mine. I am lucky my Sifu is about the same size as me. If he was a different size than me and was criticizing my kicks yet de doesnt kick that is not really fair.

It is all about one thing YOUR wing chun.

On the same note let me ask you how you over easy egg flipping level is. or your free hand drawing.

My wing chun is where it is due to the passion and time I put into it. Does that mean it is where I want it to be. Heck no. Does it mean I am neglecting it. Heck no. Life has one priority Time. Choose what means the most and fill your day with it. but fill it with what you love or you will spend time asking others where their level of love is at.

[LoneTiger108]

Here's the neat thing about all of this:

I talk and get together with folks just like me: lonely souls who follow their own personal path. We compare 'notes' and my life doesn't feel so isolated anymore. :)

Secondly, I do still see my Sifu. Once to twice a year I get to see him. But he's on his path and I'm on mine. We've talked to great lengths about this and both respect each other in where we want to take our Wing Chun. Again, we get together, compare notes and both leave feeling like we've gained something from each other's company.

Again, as I've said this before, it looks like we have more things in common than I first thought.

I may be lucky enough to see my Sifu a little more regular, but it sounds like we have had similar discussion as I had when I set up The Yum Yeurng Academy and Flystudio. Although I was passed the curriculum my interpretation is my own.

I do still get a little pressure to return to my teachers fold though and teach under his Jun Mo banner but I couldn't give him the time required to do a decent job for him! Maybe in the years to come...

[LoneTiger108]

My level of wing chun is where it is. no higher. no lower. No one can tell me different. It is mine.

I'm hearing that a lot, especially on here.

Thanks for posting. :)

[Cdr.Instigator]

This is my Wing Chun, there are many like this... but, this one is mine!!:D

[LoneTiger108]

This is my Wing Chun, there are many like this... but, this one is mine!!:D

Hmmm :confused:;)

[Cdr.Instigator]

Shamelessly stolen from the movie, "Full Metal Jacket" :p

[LoneTiger108]

Shamelessly stolen from the movie, "Full Metal Jacket" :p

Aha! Nice :D

[Tom Kagan]

Shamelessly stolen from the movie, "Full Metal Jacket" :p

Nope.

......

[CFT]

Nope.

......Paraphrased:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093058/quotes


Recruits: [chanting] This is my rifle. There are many others like it, but this one is mine.

[Tom Kagan]

Paraphrased:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093058/quotes

lol. Still nope, plus your myopia is now amusing me.

[couch]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rifleman's_Creed

In popular culture

The creed has been featured in many different types of popular culture offerings. Most prominently, it has been depicted in war films about the Marine Corps, including Full Metal Jacket and Jarhead, set in the Vietnam War and Gulf War respectively, and both which depict recruit training.

The creed is heard in songs by Fear Factory ("Crisis"), Combichrist ("This Is My Rifle"), Suicidal Angels ("Battlefield") and Killarmy ("Under Siege"). It has received mention in several novels, including Cryptonomicon and Old Man's War.

In the real-time strategy game StarCraft II: Wings of Liberty, one of the Marine's quotes is the first line of the creed.

In 2010, Colombian artist "9000" created a piece entitled "Turing Creed", based on the Rifleman's Creed with "computer" substituted for "rifle".

[Wayfaring]

lol. Still nope, plus your myopia is now amusing me.

well, your one line trolls are doing a good job of amusing me.

[shaolin_allan]

just to directly answer your easy and polite question since most people on these forums give smart comments or just avoid any direct answers. my school has a grading system I tested and passed my level 1 rank. since then ive slacked on testing with other students so they are higher levels but i have learned siu num tao and chum kiu, lot sao drills and my footwork is starting to get decent. actually most of my progress has been through my kicks and forward motion im learning while focusing on power in each chain punch instead of punching as fast as I can which I see a lot of ppl do in person and on youtube.

[Hardwork108]

Simple question really. :D

Do you have a grading/assessment system that explains what level your are training at and what you are aiming for?

Who assesses you?

I can't speak for myself, but it seems that most people who post in this forum are Wing Chun grandmasters, or at least they act like it.:D

[HumbleWCGuy]

Simple question really. :D

Do you have a grading/assessment system that explains what level your are training at and what you are aiming for?

Who assesses you?

It's called win full-contact fights. For lower ranks just spar well in class. For an instructorship, at least one smoker.

[Sihing73]

Hello,

Rank has little meaning, imho, outside of your own kwoon. Kind of like a Black Belt does not translate equally across the board. A BB in one system may be only a high ranking brown in another.

FWIW; While I trained in WT I was officially ranked as a Primary Level Technician after having passed all 12 student grade levels. I was trained to my third level but never tested past the Primary. Partly due to some of the requirements, such as having your own school and promoting students to instructor level as well. Ranking seemed more about promoting the system than in attaining skill, of course that is just my opinion. I never really had a great interest in teaching anyone else.

The one good thing about the ranking structure was that you could go to any other WT school in the world and the program would be pretty close for your rank or grade, with minior differences.

Having said that, just knowing the requirements for the rank did not necessarily equate with greater skill. I remember when I returned to the U.S. from Germany and one of the guys in AZ asked me about my primary instructor in Germany and what rank he was. I replied that the guy I trained with in Germany was a second level to which this guy replied that he was a third level. I told him that the guy in Germany would eat him for breakfast and this was confirmed after some of the German guys visited the U.S. The difference was more in how they trained than in what they knew.

Under Sifu Chow I never wore any of the rank he gave me and I think, after time, he gave up on me being ranked ;). I used to be the only guy on his site who was not a fully certified instructor but authorized to teach under his banner.

I used to like attending some of his classes without any rank and messing with some of the guys there. It was also funny to see how some of the other students would react to me when I am hardly ever there due to distance, etc and they think I am a newbie. A lot is revealed when I hang out with the senior guys, but it is fun to mess with people, part of my devilish nature I guess. :D Does not work so much now, but then again I have been in GA for almost four years now so I am sure a lot of people no longer know me.

[LoneTiger108]

It has been an eye-opener for me to see the various experiences and attitudes towards assessment in Wing Chun, but I think this last post from Dave nailed it for me:

"Rank has little meaning, imho, outside of your own kwoon"

Isn't that a shame? Especially when you consider that we are all one family under the name of Wing Chun... :(

[HumbleWCGuy]

It has been an eye-opener for me to see the various experiences and attitudes towards assessment in Wing Chun, but I think this last post from Dave nailed it for me:

"Rank has little meaning, imho, outside of your own kwoon"

Isn't that a shame? Especially when you consider that we are all one family under the name of Wing Chun... :(

Every place has different standards. There is no way to know what a rank means from one place to the next. Everyone has seen instructors who they wouldn't have promoted beyond white sash and so on. Sometimes it's because the practitioner is all around bad or because the areas of emphasis are too different to be promoted from one place to the next.

[bennyvt]

ranks are about money.
MY teacher only got the sifu papers from the association due to insurance stuff. Had a real hard time too as barry doesnt like the VTAA and is registered, he had to get Cliff Au yeung and David Peterson to vouche for him as they are members.
Barry still doesnt like the title sifu. I always have fum when I see him as some of senior guys and I call "sifu,sifu,sifu" like the old kung fu movies and he gives us the look, (the "if you don't stop I will kill you" look).
I actually invented ranking for the kids classes I did as the kids need it for motivation, confidence and it makes them feel good. In our class we just train.

[LoneTiger108]

There seems to be some of you that have 'ranking' systems, like Karateka, and I'm actually very interested in who decides the set-up for such things?

Most seem to come up with their own, and then there's the Leung Ting guys too who have a very structured way to progress through the art (IF you stay in WT school!) I have also seen grading books from the Moy Yat family :)

There is also mention of the VTAA, so can anyone give me an idea on how that process is done?? Can you become a certified instructor just on the word of another well known member?? Or is it just a financial exchange?! Isn't anyone in HK responsible for wuality control?? Touch hands with new members for example???

Has anyone here ever been supported by their local Chinese Embassy or Government Sport & Cultural body?? I read that Jim Fung in Austrailia had programs like this when he was alive, so are they still at work? And what do you think of such things??

:confused:


Do you have a grading/assessment system that explains what level your are training at and what you are aiming for?

Who assesses you?

[anerlich]

Especially when you consider that we are all one family under the name of Wing Chun

No, we're not.

[anerlich]

Has anyone here ever been supported by their local Chinese Embassy or Government Sport & Cultural body?? I read that Jim Fung in Austrailia had programs like this when he was alive, so are they still at work? And what do you think of such things??

I can't see the Chinese embassy here giving a d*mn. There are other business and cultural organisations that do that sort of thing for some.

It's not especially difficult to get backing from Sport and Rec here. Jim Fung had good programs related to this, but he was hardly on his own. William Cheung and (I'm pretty sure) the WT organisation here run similar programs.

My own school has government sponsorship for a small number of fulltime students, as do many others, though you are expected to be studying for some sort of academic qualification as well.

To be honest, this was a bit of a racket and open to rorting in the beginning, not suggesting that any individual or org mentioned was involved in that.

Australia (to be more correct, Australian state governments) also have accredited training programs with certificates and diplomas for sports coaching, which you can hook into via martial arts. It is getting to a stage where you will need something like this plus police checks, first aid, etc. to be able to conduct classes on government premises like school halls, police youth clubs, etc. and especially where kids are involved (actually, this may already be in place - I haven't kept up as all my training and teaching for the last 20 odd years has been in private premises).

Most of these are run by private accredited training organisations rather than the goverment itself, like this:

http://www.acsd.com.au/martial-arts-industry.html

Both my instructors (WC and BJJ) have top level accreditation. I plan to take this up so I too am fully qualified when I stop full time IT work.

Not perfect perhaps, but a lot better than claims to be training "authentic" TCMA by persons who won't identify themselves or their instructor but still feel qualified to criticize those with actual legitimate qualifications.

[Vajramusti]

Isn't that a shame? Especially when you consider that we are all one family under the name of Wing Chun... :(
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What????? We are a family????? Nah! That is...Stretching the term beyond recognition- given the extent
of dysfunction.

[GlennR]

I can't see the Chinese embassy here giving a d*mn. There are other business and cultural organisations that do that sort of thing for some.

It's not especially difficult to get backing from Sport and Rec here. Jim Fung had good programs related to this, but he was hardly on his own. My own school has government sponsorship for a small number of fulltime students, as do many others, though you are expected to be studying for some sort of academic qualification as well. To be honest, this was a bit of a racket and open to rorting, not suggesting that any individual mentioned was involved in that.

Australia (to be more correct, Australian state governments) also have accredited training programs with certificates and diplomas for sports coaching, which you can hook into via martial arts training and coaching. It is getting to a stage where you will need something like this plus police checks, first aid, etc. to be able to conduct classes on government premises like school halls, etc.

Most of these are run by private accredited training organisations rather than the goverment itself, like this:

http://www.acsd.com.au/martial-arts-industry.html

Both my instructors (WC and BJJ) have top level accreditation. I plan to take this up so I am fully qualified when I stop full time IT work.

Not perfect perhaps, but a lot better than claims to be training "authentic" TCMA by persons who won't identify themselves or their instructor but still feel qualified to criticize those with actual legitimate qualifications.

FWIW., i did my Level 1 & 2 NCAIS years (many years)ago and found it of some value

One thing i did like though, was that it weeded out the fringe dwelling charlatans that wouldnt dare risk exposing themselves to critique.
And theres where it has worth from a new students point of view.... if one had to choose between 2 schools to go to id recommmend the one with accreditation

GlennR

[anerlich]

The basic level stuff is OH&S, first aid, stuff like that that everyone teaching physical skills to others should know.

Also basic principles of modern sports training, injury prevention etc. which directly contradict some of the "ancient, authentic" practices.

Why anyone would want to bypass the demonstration of basic competency in such obvious areas escapes me. I wouldn't go to an unqualified doctor for medical treatment for a serious health issue, or send my kids (if I had any) to be taught by an unqualified school teacher without bona fides.

Some don't like the sporting model for MA, but IMO it's a better and healthier fit than the combination of religion, occult practice, and circus act that some seem to want to promote.

[Frost]

The basic level stuff is OH&S, first aid, stuff like that that everyone teaching physical skills to others should know.

Also basic principles of modern sports training, injury prevention etc. which directly contradict some of the "ancient, authentic" practices.

Why anyone would want to bypass the demonstration of basic competency in such obvious areas escapes me. I wouldn't go to an unqualified doctor for medical treatment for a serious health issue, or send my kids (if I had any) to be taught by an unqualified school teacher without bona fides.

Some don't like the sporting model for MA, but IMO it's a better and healthier fit than the combination of religion, occult practice, and circus act that some seem to want to promote.

post of the year maybe?

Sensible, coherent, logical and makes perfect sense.....And on the wing chun forum too who would have thought it?

[bennyvt]

thats why I did my diploma in fitness, then the year after I did it they started the dip in MA. The assocaitions are a bit dicy though. Faco was the big one and had some tight resrictions especially on morals and legal history considering the guy who ran it did an armed rob in newcastle years back. The dip in fitness was the only thing I could find except for coaching accreditation but could only do the coaching princibles as you to be do a specific sport and MA wasn't one of them. FACO got into trouble when it got all the PCYC's and government places saying that they were the only association and people had to be a part of them. I know that a fellow student that teaches TKD went through the TKD association. The problem was that it was a monopoly and not allow in Aus so they had to make offical statements in Blitz etc. That was when the dip in MA came up.

[anerlich]

Yeah Benny, unfortunately there isn't a great track record here. About 25-30 years ago there was a thing called the martial arts council, but that got canned when it came to light that certain individuals (including a certain WC Sifu) were rorting it and only accrediting their mates, siphoning off the funds, etc.

At least with the newer orgs you've got some reasonably honorable people involved like Tino Ceberano, John Taylor, etc.

A couple of grapplers I know got around the MAIA sh*tstorm by claiming to coach the sport of wrestling, rather than MA.

[LoneTiger108]

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What????? We are a family????? Nah! That is...Stretching the term beyond recognition- given the extent
of dysfunction.

:eek: Okay Joy! I getchya

Maybe I should have used 'dysfunctional family'??? :D

[LoneTiger108]

The basic level stuff is OH&S, first aid, stuff like that that everyone teaching physical skills to others should know.

Also basic principles of modern sports training, injury prevention etc. which directly contradict some of the "ancient, authentic" practices.

Why anyone would want to bypass the demonstration of basic competency in such obvious areas escapes me. I wouldn't go to an unqualified doctor for medical treatment for a serious health issue, or send my kids (if I had any) to be taught by an unqualified school teacher without bona fides.

Some don't like the sporting model for MA, but IMO it's a better and healthier fit than the combination of religion, occult practice, and circus act that some seem to want to promote.

This is exactly what I was hoping someone would point out! :D And in all fairness this was one of the reasons I, and my Kung Fu Bro, joined the BCCMA when we left our Sifu. Their Wushu sports model was already recognised and the basic level 2 Coaching Award was set up to satisfy certain criteria for NVQs, almost exactly as you suggest here.

It was very interesting doing the courses, meeting other Martial Artists that also wanted to teach well, and safetly! BUT there is also a problem with the BCCMA. Too much focus on the sports coaching models for fighters (Sanshou) and Form competitors (Taolu) has drawn them away from certain Traditions, like Lion Dance and language for example. And do you know how easy it is to pass a Level 2??!! Which means that some assessed to 'Sifu' or Coach levels haven't got the experience let alone skillset of a teacher who has trained for over 40 years! And most of them will refuse such 'silly' assessments too!!!

I've always been of the opinion that most, if not all Martial Arts will have elements of Art, Sport and Culture and so should be supported by governmanet at local and national levels. Not saying that government should be too involved in the assessment process, but they should know who's who, especially in the Chinese communities our beloved Wing Chun comes from!! ;)

[anerlich]

And do you know how easy it is to pass a Level 2??!! Which means that some assessed to 'Sifu' or Coach levels haven't got the experience let alone skillset of a teacher who has trained for over 40 years! And most of them will refuse such 'silly' assessments too!!!

I don't know how easy it is to pass a level 2. We go to a level 4 here, FWIW. My WC instructor had been teaching for 25 years, my BJJ instructor had black belts in multiple TMAs before he started the first BJJ school in Sydney. Both of them though obtaining the quals were worthwhile. I'd have to question the motivation of those that refused assessment. Some people think they're above the constraints that affect their fellow citizens, perhaps.

Ive been in IT for nearly 40 years, did assembler and COBOL on IBM mainframes and DEC PDP-11's back in the day. Unfortunately I have to keep doing the same certifications all the young mofos do to remain employable. Teachers, doctors, etc. have it no different. Experience counts, but you're still only as good as the last batch of students you produced.


I've always been of the opinion that most, if not all Martial Arts will have elements of Art, Sport and Culture and so should be supported by governmanet at local and national levels. Not saying that government should be too involved in the assessment process, but they should know who's who, especially in the Chinese communities our beloved Wing Chun comes from!!

Ideally perhaps, realistically you have to put your eggs in the most likely basket. There's more support for sport than for art and culture - the former is regarded as good for public health, the latter, perhaps unjustly, smacks of elitism. Lots of people sign their kids up for sport MA or self defence, not much demand for Chinese calligraphy or lion dancing.

In my experience the Chinese communities here haven't done much to spread TCMA except within that community itself, and to a considerable degree they have kept it to themselves. Real propagation has been done by individual businessmen, and in my experience most of those are very good at making money for themselves, but far less keen to share it or invest in the community. There's no law against that, but I'm not expecting a flood of TMA-teaching philanthropists to appear any time soon.

[wolf3001]

I just graded actually I am Level 8 I guess I don't remember the levels. I have technically completed the Biu Jee form and the dummy but have been absent for some time so I am ahead of where I am at in the school. Although I have learned most of what I need to know to become a first level instructor I still have a couple of gradings to go and I wish I was better. I have been at this for 10 years several years were spent training on my own while I was in school.

[LoneTiger108]

In my experience the Chinese communities here haven't done much to spread TCMA except within that community itself, and to a considerable degree they have kept it to themselves.

Totally similar here in the UK in most Chinese systems, although there will always be at least 'one' decent western student originating from within this Chinese community. But again, none of us should be judged by our Sifus behaviour or commercial teaching, but it has happened and will continue to happen.

In the UK our old NVQ training has recently been replaced and offers Levels 1-6 and I totally see what you're saying about keeping up with these young mofos! :D ;)

Personally for me, experience in the hall actually teaching/coaching is a must for any wannabe instructor but some do tend to 'teach for the first time' when they open their own schools. I don't think that should be accepted as the 'norm' for Wing Chun people. You should look for a teacher that can offer you some sort of apprenticeship, so you can be assessed 'while' you're helping your teacher to teach!

Only my personal view, but one which influenced my mind tpo start this thread in the first place.

Now I've been teaching for 7 years independently (kind of!) and my own Sifu is interested to see me more these days and catch up. Assessing where he thinks I'm at and advising on what I can do to develop even further.

I only wish I had taken the time more seriously (business wise) as I have only had a handfull of students due to my growing family and work committments. :( Hence, why my Flystudio promotions will only ever be minimal until a new team/troupe is developed.

[wolf3001]

Totally similar here in the UK in most Chinese systems, although there will always be at least 'one' decent western student originating from within this Chinese community. But again, none of us should be judged by our Sifus behaviour or commercial teaching, but it has happened and will continue to happen.

In the UK our old NVQ training has recently been replaced and offers Levels 1-6 and I totally see what you're saying about keeping up with these young mofos! :D ;)

Personally for me, experience in the hall actually teaching/coaching is a must for any wannabe instructor but some do tend to 'teach for the first time' when they open their own schools. I don't think that should be accepted as the 'norm' for Wing Chun people. You should look for a teacher that can offer you some sort of apprenticeship, so you can be assessed 'while' you're helping your teacher to teach!

Only my personal view, but one which influenced my mind tpo start this thread in the first place.

Now I've been teaching for 7 years independently (kind of!) and my own Sifu is interested to see me more these days and catch up. Assessing where he thinks I'm at and advising on what I can do to develop even further.

I only wish I had taken the time more seriously (business wise) as I have only had a handfull of students due to my growing family and work committments. :( Hence, why my Flystudio promotions will only ever be minimal until a new team/troupe is developed.

Just thought I would jump in here. My Sifu from what I understand went from Kansas to Australia many times to learn Wing Chun under William Cheung. Im not sure when he actually started teaching but what I understand he and his wife spent a lot of time going there to learn. We don't have many Chinese here mostly Vietnamese an Laotians now some Burmese. My Sifu is Master Jerry Bolding he is a local farmer im guessing he is from the area but im not really sure. There are no martial arts schools really other than Karate around here. My school when I started doing Wing Chun had several people who were at instructor level. It was required for anyone above Chum Kiu to help teach at times lead drills and such. I feel you have to learn to teach. I had to lead class many times and I now help teach in our own little school. Our Sifu could no longer keep the school open and my friend and I have been working hard to keep it alive.

[LoneTiger108]

There are some insightful posts here, so thanks for sharing your experiences :)

I was recently sent a link to this clip on Youtube which is promoting a model of assessment/learning which I found very interesting. From Sifu Leung Tings teachings I believe, so has anyone gone though this sort of thing??

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZA9MmE5uS0

"Sifu Martin Dragos introduces himself and his Wing Tsun Masters Academy Bootcamp - the intensive way of learning the complete WingTsun-System within 7-10 days. This video is also an invitation to all WingChun /WingTsun enthusiasts to join the Bootcamp Introduction Workshop (Villingen-Schwenningen(Germany) and London) for free."