Rattan Ring

[Xian]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxuGuCMsySI

I dont know much about whats shown but it seems to belong to one of the Siu Lam Weng Chun Families. This is would make it none Young Spring Boxing but Everlasting Spring Boxing.


Kind Regards,
Xian

[LoneTiger108]

Very basic approach to the Rattan Ring imo not at all what I would suggest. Looks like it's a drill of a few things thats been made into a form for Wushu competition ;)

[Phil Redmond]

At around 1:40 in the clip below is my take on the rattan ring for Wing Chun
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfOfpdn75RA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J2ZwYDbSK1k

[LoneTiger108]

At around 1:40 in the clip below is my take on the rattan ring for Wing Chun
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfOfpdn75RA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J2ZwYDbSK1k

I will look through my Flystudio clips coz I'm sure that I have yapped about how I approach the rattan ring when I was entertaining my martial cousins from Germany and Austria!!

Mind you, lately on here I get the impression that everything I post is being jumped on by the WSL PB Brigade :eek::D

Sad but true...

[Graham H]

Mind you, lately on here I get the impression that everything I post is being jumped on by the WSL PB Brigade :eek::D

Sad but true...

There is a bloody good reason for that mate!!!

Rattan rings are good for hanging clothes on and a like. Not for Ving Tsun Kung Fu!!! ;):D

GH

[LoneTiger108]

Rattan rings are good for hanging clothes on and a like. Not for Ving Tsun Kung Fu!!! ;):D

Wow :confused: You're becoming oh sooooooooo predictable ;)

What is it they say?

You don't miss what you don't know :D

[k gledhill]

Wow :confused: You're becoming oh sooooooooo predictable ;)

What is it they say?

You don't miss what you don't know :D

You dont miss what you don't know.
So you add flag waving, rattan rings of death, grappling pole ,
And more !

[trubblman]

You dont miss what you don't know.
So you add flag waving, rattan rings of death, grappling pole ,
And more !

I don't think that's the issue at all, the way I see it. I have never
used the rattan ring; I have seen one lineage that uses the rattan
ring. Master Mijiwang I think his name is. I think the real issue is, does using the rattan ring improve either
wing chun skill or fighting skill. I do not know the answer to that.

[k gledhill]

I don't think that's the issue at all, the way I see it. I have never
used the rattan ring; I have seen one lineage that uses the rattan
ring. I think the real issue is, does using the rattan ring improve either
wing chun skill or fighting skill. I do not know the answer to that.

does the rattan ring improve VT skills ? no

Does Spencer also do flag waving, rattan rings of death, pole grappling and more ? yes :D

[trubblman]

does the rattan ring improve VT skills ? no

Does Spencer also do flag waving, rattan rings of death, pole grappling and more ? yes :D

You did not say that it does not improve fighting skill. I know nothing of pole grappling, flag waving etc. Sounds very ceremonial though.

[LoneTiger108]

does the rattan ring improve VT skills ? no

Does Spencer also do flag waving, rattan rings of death, pole grappling and more ? yes :D

Ok you're so funny :D Boring but funny! :rolleyes:

No point in even trying to shed any light on the purpose and benefits of actually training with the rattan ring. Not here anyhow.

One thing though, if you're a 'line' man or a 'triangle' man then you should look into the 'circle' man! The Tungwan (rattan ring) assists in this training, but I will keep it safe with my fire flags and lightning blades!! :p :D

[LoneTiger108]

You did not say that it does not improve fighting skill. I know nothing of pole grappling, flag waving etc. Sounds very ceremonial though.

Yes, I guess it is very 'cultural'. Something my own Sifu takes much pride in teaching and sharing. And believe it or not, it's all Wing Chun! :)

[k gledhill]

You did not say that it does not improve fighting skill. I know nothing of pole grappling, flag waving etc. Sounds very ceremonial though.

It does not improve VT fighting skills. If you watch the clip you will see that the guys elbows are so wide just so he can keep the thing from falling off...:D

[LoneTiger108]

http://www.youtube.com/user/FLYstudio108

Granted, I'm only messing about with my Wing Chun cousins but I try to explain a little about the rattan ring! Experimenting I guess ;)

[k gledhill]

http://www.youtube.com/user/FLYstudio108

Granted, I'm only messing about with my Wing Chun cousins but I try to explain a little about the rattan ring! Experimenting I guess ;)

Did Lee Sing teach you that ?

[LoneTiger108]

Did Lee Sing teach you that ?

Oh so funny :D

But no he didn't. It was my Karate Sensei when I was ten :p

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3iDHot8fm20

"FLYfilm No.4
Wing Chun Rattan Rings

Another little discussion with my European cousins where I try to explain the Wing Chun Rattan Ring! In the short time we had I feel that enough was done to put across the idea at least. Of course, this is all just speculative for most Wing Chun people, beacuse the Ring is usually used in a different manner, and in most cases not at all.

Holding a rattan ring is just as important as understanding its limitations. They vary in size, so be aware of the changes to distance. I personally see many empty-hand examples of this equipment method within the second form, Chum Kiu."

For anyone who wants to discuss what I'm sharing, I'm here.

But for those who just seem to be stalking me on here with negative and sometimes personal attacks, just go play with your self for a while. You know you want to.

[LoneTiger108]

Wow! Checking Youtube to see how my clip was doing and I found more Rattan Ring clips :)

They're more popular that I initially thought but I have yet to check out what everyone is doing...

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=wing+chun+rattan+ring&aq=f

Let us know what you think

[k gledhill]

Spencer the circle punching ? Like a hoola hoop, fun, but no practical value.

[WC1277]

Oh so funny :D

But no he didn't. It was my Karate Sensei when I was ten :p

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3iDHot8fm20

"FLYfilm No.4
Wing Chun Rattan Rings

Another little discussion with my European cousins where I try to explain the Wing Chun Rattan Ring! In the short time we had I feel that enough was done to put across the idea at least. Of course, this is all just speculative for most Wing Chun people, beacuse the Ring is usually used in a different manner, and in most cases not at all.

Holding a rattan ring is just as important as understanding its limitations. They vary in size, so be aware of the changes to distance. I personally see many empty-hand examples of this equipment method within the second form, Chum Kiu."

For anyone who wants to discuss what I'm sharing, I'm here.

But for those who just seem to be stalking me on here with negative and sometimes personal attacks, just go play with your self for a while. You know you want to.

Two concerns/questions for you lonetiger, please don't take wrongly because I have respect for your passion of wing chun

- it appears that punching with that develops bad habit of hammer punching and not straight punch

- you have the right concept of punching out and pulling other arm back at same time with equal tension but with the rattan ring your arms are side by side for a second which cancels out the idea.

Also if the ring is supposed to represent the center line when doing other techniques, it inherently causes you to not be facing with your triangle structure which causes you to rely on arms alone which makes it more just gung Fu and less wing chun

[Eric_H]

Some lineages use the Rattan ring to develop "whirlpool energy." I have no idea what that is, but have seen it referenced a number of times.

For my money, Iron rings are where it's at.

[k gledhill]

Besides the fact that the fist dont travel directly on the line as a ring would make one do...hammering. Hammering leads to elbow issues, injuries.......

[Grumblegeezer]

Some lineages use the Rattan ring to develop "whirlpool energy." I have no idea what that is, but have seen it referenced a number of times.

WC whirlpool energy? Next time you go to the loo just pull the lever!

Now regarding the rings. Am I the only one that noticed that you could accomplish the same type of "linked wrist" training with handcuffs on? Just a thought next time you have a problem with the law... or want to try something new with your girlfriend/wife/whatever!

Seriously though, it looks pretty cool, but I have to agree with Kevin regarding his comment on "hammering". The lineage I trained in doesn't use the ring and it would not suit many of our movements.

[Vajramusti]

WC whirlpool energy? Next time you go to the loo just pull the lever!

Now regarding the rings. Am I the only one that noticed that you could accomplish the same type of "linked wrist" training with handcuffs on? Just a thought next time you have a problem with the law... or want to try something new with your girlfriend/wife/whatever!

Seriously though, it looks pretty cool, but I have to agree with Kevin regarding his comment on "hammering". The lineage I trained in doesn't use the ring and it would not suit many of our movements.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
One of the founders of a hsing-I style- developed his powerful punches while hand cuffed in prison!

joy

[LoneTiger108]

Two concerns/questions for you lonetiger, please don't take wrongly because I have respect for your passion of wing chun

- it appears that punching with that develops bad habit of hammer punching and not straight punch

Yes it develops 'lien wan chong choi' continuous revolutions of hammer fist. Also with lapsau too. A drill specific to Chum Kiu, so imho no bad habits there at all ;)


- you have the right concept of punching out and pulling other arm back at same time with equal tension but with the rattan ring your arms are side by side for a second which cancels out the idea.

That's what I cal 'Jik Sin Kuen' or straight line fist, out from the shoulder lines. Specific to Pien San or angled/slant body alignment. Again, only what I learnt and the clip WAS just messing around and 'off the cuff' for my guests. Why look into it so much?


- Also if the ring is supposed to represent the center line when doing other techniques, it inherently causes you to not be facing with your triangle structure which causes you to rely on arms alone which makes it more just gung Fu and less wing chun

Triangle structures within angling are key to understanding the main 3 alignments in Wing Chun. The square and circle are just as importamt too.

What Rattan Ring have you been taught?

[LoneTiger108]

Besides the fact that the fist dont travel directly on the line as a ring would make one do...hammering. Hammering leads to elbow issues, injuries.......

See my previous post Kev :D

FWIW Hammer Fist was a signature of Lee Shings teaching and an excellent method. Been doing it for years with no elbow damage at all ;)

[WC1277]

Yes it develops 'lien wan chong choi' continuous revolutions of hammer fist. Also with lapsau too. A drill specific to Chum Kiu, so imho no bad habits there at all ;)



That's what I cal 'Jik Sin Kuen' or straight line fist, out from the shoulder lines. Specific to Pien San or angled/slant body alignment. Again, only what I learnt and the clip WAS just messing around and 'off the cuff' for my guests. Why look into it so much?



Triangle structures within angling are key to understanding the main 3 alignments in Wing Chun. The square and circle are just as importamt too.

What Rattan Ring have you been taught?

Wasn't looking into it too much, thought you wanted to discuss it. I don't use rattan ring.
Disagree with some of your points but no need to discuss further....

[k gledhill]

See my previous post Kev :D

FWIW Hammer Fist was a signature of Lee Shings teaching and an excellent method. Been doing it for years with no elbow damage at all ;)

What can you do with a hoola hoop ? did LS show any moves ? :D the hip thrust attack for close quarters , I think its a dance too :D

[Lee Chiang Po]

The ring needs to fit the practitioner. It should be as wide as his nipples. It was used for younger students that had difficulty keeping the elbows properly alligned. Sometimes they would practice hand drills while doing footwork, sort of putting them together to improve their timing somewhat. It is not a fighting aid, and probably does not give one an edge in any way, but for someone that is still uncomfortable with the elbow allignment it can help. I don't know what the problem here is, as the rings have been used by most of the earlier lineages of wing chun. I never learned the butterfly knives or the pole, but simply because it was not applicable for modern times. I suspect that the rings were just laid aside and now lots of lineages simply don't use them. No biggie, but they don't really teach bad habits if used for what they were supposed to be used for.

[k gledhill]

The ring needs to fit the practitioner. It should be as wide as his nipples. It was used for younger students that had difficulty keeping the elbows properly alligned. Sometimes they would practice hand drills while doing footwork, sort of putting them together to improve their timing somewhat. It is not a fighting aid, and probably does not give one an edge in any way, but for someone that is still uncomfortable with the elbow allignment it can help. I don't know what the problem here is, as the rings have been used by most of the earlier lineages of wing chun. I never learned the butterfly knives or the pole, but simply because it was not applicable for modern times. I suspect that the rings were just laid aside and now lots of lineages simply don't use them. No biggie, but they don't really teach bad habits if used for what they were supposed to be used for.

Why wide as his nipples ?

[anerlich]

FWIW Hammer Fist was a signature of Lee Shings teaching and an excellent method. Been doing it for years with no elbow damage at all

Hammer fists are a signature of everyone's lineage. Do the knife form without knives.


One of the founders of a hsing-I style- developed his powerful punches while hand cuffed in prison!

Legend has it much of capoeira was developed similarly.


The ring needs to fit the practitioner. It should be as wide as his nipples.

Not a fan of nipple rings myself, but it's a free world.

[Lucas]

to fit his frame

[CFT]

One of the founders of a hsing-I style- developed his powerful punches while hand cuffed in prison!Guo Yunshen (Cantonese: Kwok Wan Sum) - Half Step Beng Chuan.

http://www.xingyimax.com/guo-yunshen/

[LoneTiger108]

Wasn't looking into it too much, thought you wanted to discuss it. I don't use rattan ring.
Disagree with some of your points but no need to discuss further....

No worries. It's okay to disagree dude, everyone has their own experiences.


It was used for younger students that had difficulty keeping the elbows properly alligned. Sometimes they would practice hand drills while doing footwork, sort of putting them together to improve their timing somewhat.

... I suspect that the rings were just laid aside and now lots of lineages simply don't use them. No biggie, but they don't really teach bad habits if used for what they were supposed to be used for.

You're probably right. Nobody uses them because it's a lost/disappearing tradition. People 'experiment' with what they think they may be used for. Maybe even copying some tricks from the movies! But there is method to all the madness of the Rattan Rings, and I was lucky to be exposed to them through my Sifu. No form as such, but they do help to cultivate postures and alignment as they are a yum yeurng training aid; they assist in the combining of left and right sides, pull/push, lift/drop etc and especially (what I refer to as) Sap Jee or cross arms methods that should be familiar with Wing Chun students as we do this at the beginning of all forms.

The double rings were used in my day as a precursor to the knives, and my Sifu still teaches this way today. In fact all of our dulien/interactive stuffs are not common in other lineages, including most Ip Man branches. I think the older traditions are more connected to Ip Mans Foshan days and earlier.

Didn't Ip Man or one of his friends have an old kung fu shop in Foshan at one time?? Seen pictures of one in Ip Man Tong with loads of rattan rings hanging outside... :)

[Graham H]

Nobody uses them because it's a lost/disappearing tradition.


Which is a good thing! ;)

Those punching exercise things you are doing in that video are not correct Ving Tsun punches according to my lineage. In fact the rattan ring encourages many bad habits which is why we don't use. Good for showing off and pulling wool over peoples eyes though!!! :D

GH

[LoneTiger108]

Those punching exercise things you are doing in that video are not correct Ving Tsun punches according to my lineage.

There is no point in me attempting to 'discuss' this sort of thing with you guys. Your tiger eye is understandable, but unfortunate at the same time ;)


In fact the rattan ring encourages many bad habits which is why we don't use. Good for showing off and pulling wool over peoples eyes though!!! :D

Says the sheep to the wolf :D

If that's seriously what you think then I actually feel a little sorry for you. Inproper use of the knives and pole also causes the same serious bad habits dude, and it is the same with the ring/s I agree.

WSL, and in fact many of Ip Mans HK students were never exposed to this training aid and it has had a knock on affect towards your own generation. But as the old saying goes, you can't miss what you don't know.

[LoneTiger108]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ya3Pgv4GZM0

Best demo I have seen is from one of the member here that does black tiger.

That would be Master Wong! The Wing Chun 'Marmite Man' :D

Love him or hate him makes no difference as it's obvious from the clip that he's just messing about imho

[Vajramusti]

Guo Yunshen (Cantonese: Kwok Wan Sum) - Half Step Beng Chuan.

http://www.xingyimax.com/guo-yunshen/
-----------------------------------
Yup. Thx. Chee

joy

[Lee Chiang Po]

Why wide as his nipples ?

It doesn't necessarily have to be as wide as the nipples, but people tend to be of different frame, and if you are skinny a smaller ring would be in order or it would be like working a hoola hoop. I am very wide across my shoulders, and my elbows will only go in a certain distance until I cripple my movements. I find that if the hoop is lined up with my nipples my elbows will be in the right positon while doing the forms.
I once taught two brothers that were so skinny my watch band would have worked for them, and neither one of them could keep their elbows in. They always looked like they were hooking, with the elbows outside. I had them play with the rings and pretty soon they did get comfortable with it. It is like putting braces on your teeth to get them to go into position. Not everyone will need to use the rings, but they can help you if you need them.

[trubblman]

Not of my lineage but here is a link (http://5.hidemyass.com/ip-1/encoded/Oi8vd3d3LnlvdXR1YmUuY29tL3dhdGNoP3Y9M1FTZzItemFaaW smZmVhdHVyZT1yZWxhdGVk) of a rattan using Wing Chun group in China

[k gledhill]

that clip hardly encourages using one ...

[Graham H]

WSL, and in fact many of Ip Mans HK students were never exposed to this training aid and it has had a knock on affect towards your own generation. But as the old saying goes, you can't miss what you don't know.

Booooom Boooom!....as Basil Brush would say! :D

GH

[Graham H]

Spencer? Post a clip of you and your students/training partners making some Gor Sau/Sparring!! Showing clips of rattan rings and stuff doesn't make much sense to me. How these things come out and are shown in your fighting will be better me thinks.

Any idiot can stand there making funny shapes with a piece of wood!! I want to see how Ving Tsun looks with all this stuff in I don't know about!!! ;)

GH

[LoneTiger108]

Spencer? Post a clip of you and your students/training partners making some Gor Sau/Sparring!! Showing clips of rattan rings and stuff doesn't make much sense to me. How these things come out and are shown in your fighting will be better me thinks.

Any idiot can stand there making funny shapes with a piece of wood!! I want to see how Ving Tsun looks with all this stuff in I don't know about!!! ;)

GH

Those who ask should share first dude! ;)

Besides, I want to know what your VT looks like when it has none of this 'stuff' in it at all... but at least it has the simple stuff eh? :D

[Graham H]

Those who ask should share first dude! ;)

Ahhhhhhh! How did I know you were going to write that!!!:rolleyes:



Besides, I want to know what your VT looks like when it has none of this 'stuff' in it at all... but at least it has the simple stuff eh?

There are videos of me on YouTube. There have been for ages. I'm not scared to put stuff on the internet of any relevance.
You hopping up and down around your 20 ft dummy didnt do it for me boss! Get some better stuff up and put your sparring where your theories and rattan rolling are!!!!

BTW......simple thinking = intelligent fighting! You may think that all this stuff you have in your system is a good selling point but I don't! I was attracted to VT by it's simplicity because I now that when two guys are fighting in the street there is only so much one can do! Most fights are over in a matter of seconds and how we can maxmise the bodys potential to survive in that short situation is what I feel VT has covered. Anyway we should all know that its not the dog in the fight that makes it...its the fight in the dog. We can talk about how fantastic our systems are all day long on the internet but until I punch you and you punch me we are mostly just internet tags!!

GH

[Phil Redmond]

Around 1:40 in the clip below shows why I personally wouldn't use a rattan ring.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfOfpdn75RA

[LoneTiger108]

There are videos of me on YouTube. There have been for ages. I'm not scared to put stuff on the internet of any relevance.

So, give us all a link dude. Don't yap about it. Give us a clip of you destroying your training partner in a decent sparring session please. Thanks in advance! :)


BTW......simple thinking = intelligent fighting! You may think that all this stuff you have in your system is a good selling point but I don't!

Now I would argue that I AINT SELLING anything. I'm not interested in SELLING anything. My Flystudio project is just that. A little project to share experiences and have fun, that's all.

And let's face it, you sound like you were attreacted to Wing Chun because you like to fight. I, my friend, do not. I like to train and train hard and research and learn more about the family I come from.

One day you may see why Wing Chun IS simple (to us westerners!) and how Ip Man done what he done. Until then, carry on fighting dude. It will get you absolutely nowhere imho.

[Graham H]

And let's face it, you sound like you were attreacted to Wing Chun because you like to fight. I, my friend, do not.


Nuff said!!

GH

[LoneTiger108]

Nuff said!!

GH

Really G? :confused: Kind of convenient for you to just dismiss me now isn't it? Without sharing your link to your clip too!!! ;)

Liking fighting and being able to fight are two different things my friend...

[Graham H]

Really G? :confused: Kind of convenient for you to just dismiss me now isn't it? Without sharing your link to your clip too!!! ;)

Liking fighting and being able to fight are two different things my friend...

Dismissing YOU Spencer!.....not IT!! You have made me understand where you are coming now so no point in me interferring with your ways and theories anymore.

Generally Wing Chun doesn't impress me too much and I would sooner direct somebody to a good boxing club than waste their time trying to sense energy and divert chi...You can keep your TCWC's...It's all cr$p IMO!!!...........Each to their own huh?

GH

[LoneTiger108]

Generally Wing Chun doesn't impress me too much and I would sooner direct somebody to a good boxing club than waste their time trying to sense energy and divert chi...You can keep your TCWC's...It's all cr$p IMO!!!...........Each to their own huh?

You see. That's also where we share a common opinion. ;)

I find a lot of Wing Chun I see quite embarrassing. Too many beginners putting out clips and arguing over fixed, outdated ideas. Not enough unity among elder generations. So I too would recommend a good boxing club over a WCK club, especially if all you want to do is spar and fight.

BUT if you want to learn pole or knives?? Going to a boxing/BJJ/Judo/Muay Thai club is simply just silly too!

Definitely each to their own. :D But good luck wit your own progression in Wing Chun. If you even believe that you CAN progress dude.

[GlennR]

I find a lot of Wing Chun I see quite embarrassing. Too many beginners putting out clips and arguing over fixed, outdated ideas. Not enough unity among elder generations. So I too would recommend a good boxing club over a WCK club, especially if all you want to do is spar and fight.


So whats embarrassing about what you see??

If you feel that beginners cant get together and discuss video clips then why have you done Flystudio? Should there be a "seniors only" caveat?

And why should there be unity amongst the elders??
Personally, id prefer competition..... that way the cream would rise to the top.

Just like BJJ, MT etc....

But then, Wing Chun isnt about fighting for you so i guess im wasting my breath ;)

[Graham H]

So whats embarrassing about what you see??

If you feel that beginners cant get together and discuss video clips then why have you done Flystudio? Should there be a "seniors only" caveat?

And why should there be unity amongst the elders??
Personally, id prefer competition..... that way the cream would rise to the top.

Just like BJJ, MT etc....

But then, Wing Chun isnt about fighting for you so i guess im wasting my breath ;)

Wow I've totally agreed with glenn again. It's all to common now. Me no like! :D

[LoneTiger108]

So whats embarrassing about what you see??

I already said it was beginners arguing over fixed ideas. And there seems to be an overwhelming amount of elder students who still do that too, especially on here :rolleyes: including me.


If you feel that beginners cant get together and discuss video clips then why have you done Flystudio? Should there be a "seniors only" caveat?

Flystudio is a project designed for Lee Shing family and further research into the variations among our own generations. It's definitely not for beginners and I can't recall ever saying that it was.


And why should there be unity amongst the elders??
Personally, id prefer competition..... that way the cream would rise to the top.

Just like BJJ, MT etc....

But then, Wing Chun isnt about fighting for you so i guess im wasting my breath ;)

Not wasting your breath, you have a right to want what you want but tell me what makes you think fighting competitions between eachother is the way forward? This has all happened before, especially in the late eighties in the UK and it caused nothing but arrogance and disrespect among the families from what I have seen.

Still, if elders do not respect eachother and make no attempt to share or exchange with eachother, then don't be an elder. Carry on on your own because many before us did exactly that and survived. Even Ip Man.

[GlennR]

Still, if elders do not respect eachother and make no attempt to share or exchange with eachother, then don't be an elder. Carry on on your own because many before us did exactly that and survived. Even Ip Man.[/QUOTE]



Youre so hopelessly lost

[LoneTiger108]

Youre so hopelessly lost

What's the matter now?? I'm 'lost' because I have high expectations of my own elders and of the general older generation of the Wing Chun community?

Man, that was all shattered when I first posted here dude. Life is full of disappointments :o

[GlennR]

What's the matter now?? I'm 'lost' because I have high expectations of my own elders and of the general older generation of the Wing Chun community?

Man, that was all shattered when I first posted here dude. Life is full of disappointments :o



No, youre lost because its all based on the past.... elders, lineage, legend etc

EVERYTHING you speak of is based on the past.

You would have been side by side with your chinese brothers when they charged the British in the Boxer Rebellion.... they too believed in the unbelievable as well

[GlennR]

Wow I've totally agreed with glenn again. It's all to common now. Me no like! :D


**** of Graham ;)

[Graham H]

you would have been side by side with your chinese brothers when they charged the british in the boxer rebellion.... They too believed in the unbelievable as well

Nice!!! :))))))))

[Graham H]

**** of Graham ;)

I'm assuming that contained 2 "F"'s Glen??? lmao

[GlennR]

I'm assuming that contained 2 "F"'s Glen??? lmao


One P, one I and a couple of S's

[Graham H]

One P, one I and a couple of S's

Put that dictionary down and get on with your homework you fool!!! :)

G "tool" h

[LoneTiger108]

No, youre lost because its all based on the past.... elders, lineage, legend etc

EVERYTHING you speak of is based on the past.

Well, if it is then what's it doing in my foreign devil head?


You would have been side by side with your chinese brothers when they charged the British in the Boxer Rebellion.... they too believed in the unbelievable as well

No. That would have been the 'Heaven & Earth' type sects who thought 'Iron Shirt' actually stopped bullets ;):D

[Graham H]

Well, if it is then what's it doing in my foreign devil head?


D

Because you have been fooled like the masses!!!;);)

[LoneTiger108]

Because you have been fooled like the masses!!!;);)

Dude, if anyone doesn't fit in with your view on your VT, they've ALL been fooled! ;)

Luckily I can see my Wing Chun in your VT, but it's a shame you can't see yours in mine but that's generally what I have experienced for years...

[SwanseaMike]

Here is a little clip explaining the some basic ideas associated with Jook Wan training in our Wing Chun. I hope this helps
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVmrE2jd340

[k gledhill]

Here is a little clip explaining the some basic ideas associated with Jook Wan training in our Wing Chun. I hope this helps
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVmrE2jd340

advanced hoop work....

[LoneTiger108]

Here is a little clip explaining the some basic ideas associated with Jook Wan training in our Wing Chun. I hope this helps
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVmrE2jd340

I think it's great to see some of uncles elder generations share some equipment stuff! Big up to you guys in Wales :)