View Full Version : Once Upon a Time....

02-04-2001, 12:51 AM
I have read on many occasions that the old masters used to have a very limited number of students and that there traing did not only involve learning to fight. This training seemed to include traditional medicine, bone setting, acupunture and the like. Westernisation of martial arts seems to have removed most of this type of training, at least where I can see.
In Australia martial arts schools seem to be popping up everwhere and many have instructors with little or no skills to treat or understand injuries. I'd like to know what other countries are like, and some suggestions that could relieve the situation. I have been thinking along the lines of trying to get a course of some desciption started which is purely for martial arts instructors and that deals with common injures and treatment regimes, just as a first step. Bear in mind that I am not an instructor myself and have limited knowledge of what instructors would like to know in this regard.
Thanks for your input.

Fu Manchu
02-04-2001, 11:27 AM

I'm Dr. Fu from New Orleans. I run a very profitable chi realignment clinic for all my students with weak chi.

the reason why old masters don't teach students how to fight is because they are too old to do so. They know that a newbie student will kick the crap out of them anytime. So they end up teaching relaxation and meditation.

Put it this way, there are those who break the bones and there are those with broken bones. Tell me, which of the two arts is likely to survive through the centuries?

Maybe in Australia people don't know much about Kung Fu. Afterall it is very far away from America. Are you still having floods?

02-04-2001, 01:03 PM
Fu is this a joke?
A chi realignment clinic! I'd be very impressed if chi realignment can help a sprained ankle, twisted knee, stress fractures etc.
I'll asume your joking because otherwise this is just too stupid.
The old masters I was refering to are the people like Yip Man, Wong Shun Leung, Chojin miyagi, Gogen Yamaguchi to name but a few. I didn't mean old in age, I was just refering the people who mastered the arts in the "old days". They could fight very well but were also skilled in the types of medicine I mentioned in my post.
To answer your question, there are some people here who know about kung fu as there are some in America, there are also alot that pretend to know, just like in America.
The floods you spoke about are subsiding, at least you were on the money there.

02-04-2001, 07:31 PM
WCFish, America has its experts and its non-experts.

For example, I practice kung fu but don't know the healing side - though I did attend American medical school.

To truly understand kung fu, one must have some sort of working knowledge about the human body.

The merits of Eastern medicine are being scrutinized at a faster pace than most people realize - at least that was so in my medical school.

It's nice to see many of the Eastern traditional therapies holding up to the most rigorous Western scientific testing methodologies.

fiercest tiger
02-04-2001, 11:50 PM
i teach in western sydney kung fu, my sifu was a great bone-setting doctor in china town and kung fu master. i studied in hongkong as well and learnt basic dit dar medicine, for martial art injuries sprains, fractures etc. but also for training the kung fu. it works hand in hand.

good luck in your training. :D



Shaolin Master
02-05-2001, 02:57 AM
Interesting ... how you arise at such observations

Choy Li Fut - Chen Yong Fa(TCM/Herbalist)
7 Star Mantis - Paul Beech (TCM/Acupuncturist)
Dragon Style - Rob Chan (TCM/Herbalist)
Shaolin - Li Bi Ching (TCM/Herbalist)
.....There are many others..that may not be TCM doctors but have studied injuries or therapeutics such as FT of Yau Kung Mun.

In my own case I studied acupuncture at UTS, and have also studied specialist methods with Masters as well whom have all had knowledge of healing injuries both internal and external methods.

I guess it depends on where one looks. But traditionally chinese medicine and martial arts amongst other things goes hand in hand.

My students study fundamentals of chinese medicine as they train which helps them understand concepts and to deal with simple situations in due time. They are not training to be doctors, although some are TCM university students or are planning to do so, but they will hopefully gain a richer understanding both theoretically and experience wise with medical and martial arts.


Shi Chan Long

Fu Manchu
02-06-2001, 11:25 AM

Things have become more specialised now. People train martial arts for self defence and they may get their health checked with their family physician.

In the old days, people who know martial arts would have a fair idea ( compared with the average bloke) about physiology and would therefore be in a position to advice others.

However, medicine has evolved a long way since the old days and we have much more sophisticated treatments.

Although, i run a Chi realignment clinic, most of the people around town see "Western" physician. I cater for the niche market who prefer to try something different.

Quite frankly, when I get sick, I take Western medicine rather than my herbal remedies. Nevertheless, I have an endearing group of patients who refer me to as "Fu the Fixer" as i provide more for their emotional support.

I do assist with the local dojo down the road, as I have a fairly good knowledge of first aid and have popped back dislocated shoulders from time to time. They do come to me for acupunture treatment and dit dar medicine.

My wife is a Cajun witch and she helps in the preparation of Chi realignment spells and the book keeping of the business.

02-08-2001, 09:08 AM
Fu, I think you have a funny idea of the distribution of martial arts expertise.

Just because we are a long way from the States doesn't mean we are a long way from martial arts expertise. In fact, we are closer to the source 8^). I have also heard a lot of stats that indicate that there are almost as many kung fu masters in Australia as there are in Hong Kong (dunno how true that is).

Getting back to the original question though:

The old masters taught medicine etc. first because the philosophy was to learn to heal before you learn to hurt. If they were to get their butts kicked by newbie students, they wouldn't be considered masters.

My opinion is that instructors should have a basic understanding of western first aid techniques first and foremost, and any traditional Chinese techniques are a bonus. Instructors should also know when each is appropriate.

My instructor has had extensive training in Chinese medicine (mainly herbs and massage) and I have seen him work miracles on injuries.

For most students though, I think they would be more reassured if instructors were qualified in standard first aid.

Fu Manchu
02-08-2001, 03:11 PM

My country of origin is Tibet where I learned much of the secrets of Eastern methods from the masters. My late mother is French and from her I was exposed to the wonders of Western technology at an early age.

The conflicts of East and west you allude to in you post,I have spent much of my life meditating upon.

Remember, the further you travel West the closer you'll meet the East and the further East you go you'll find the West. Don't you see, they are all one and the same expressing the universal truth.

As of now humanity must arrive at a balance between biological ecosystems and technology. Our chi must be reformatted for our specise to survive.

ABandit, as a doctor and a martial arts brother, i urge you to be still and let the truth reveal itself. Purge the conflict that is within and your chi will be aligned to the natural rythms of the universe.

My wife seeks the balance between the light and dark forces within her. If you wish, she could consult her Book of Shadows for your destiny whose contents are revealed to us in our dreams.

02-10-2001, 12:06 PM

Sorry, maybe we misunderstood each other somewhere along the way :). I took your comment about being a long way from America as suggesting that all martial arts knowledge resides in America. Obviously that is not what you intended.

I agree with you on the East/West conflict. I believe that the optimum is the middle ground, particularly in medicine. I think each medical tradition has it's strengths and weaknesses and by combining the two you make the practitioner more rounded.

As a child I suffered badly from asthma and was treated by a doctor who was knowledgeable in both Eastern and Western medicine. Sadly, he has since passed away, but I have yet to find another doctor who could match his skill in helping me with my health.

I am quite happy to receive traditional Chinese treatment for any ailments I have, but not everyone shares my views. My point is that the majority of people in Australia would feel safer in a martial arts class if they knew the instructors were trained in basic (Western) first aid.

Fu Manchu
02-11-2001, 11:21 AM

May I ask what style of Kung Fu you're studying?

Some of the harder styles that use a build up in chest pressure may cause hernias in the lower abdomen if it is not practiced properly.

Soft styles like Tai Chi allow you to sense the universals energies in other living things. As a Dr. of Chi realignment I feel that the softer styles lead to better health.

But remember to use Dit Dar otherwise superficial bruises may progress to irreparable damage later on.

Prhaps there are Dit Dar sifus in Australia that can assist you with realigning your chi? Have you had your strength of your chi measured?

02-11-2001, 11:38 PM
I train mainly in Northern Shaolin, but also do a bit of WuJi.

Haven't had my Qi 'measured' as such but have had energy healing done. I guess that encompasses realignment?

02-12-2001, 04:17 AM
Okay, I think we can surmise that Fu ain't Chinese and probably doesn't do Kung-Fu either. (probably a granola-head) Back to the topic. We also teach Kung-Fu and we heal. We are not a commercial school, but a very traditional mo-gwoon. Bone setting, or dit da yee go hand in hand,a board for sharing info is definately in order.Let's do it, and Dr. Fu? You are welcome to join in, you might learn something.

Fu Manchu
02-12-2001, 01:57 PM
My Brothers

Testing your chi strenght doesn't mean that you need to have it re-aligned. If your chi is weak, re-alignment may actually cause you internal ailments. You're chi should be moderately strong before you can hope to align it to make it even stronger. Traditional herbs and meditation techniques would help. You can also try some Cajun magic or Darcri-Sam-Rum.

Although I'm not strictly chinese, having a Tibetian Father and French mother, I have learned much from the great masters of the East, before travelling to New Orleans. It was in my travels that I met my (now) wife, a Cajun Witch who inspired me to set up a Chi realignment Clinic.

I would like to heal the world of great suffering and instil harmony between the organic and technological order. This can only be accomplished if our chi is reformatted to the will of the Universal Conciousness where all things came to being.

I practice Tai Chi where I can softly subdue the most aggressive opponent. I have seen many amazing things in my travels in Northern China and the Tibetian regions. Monks can maditate for hours and live on nothing more than vegies and water. It is amazing the wonders that can be accomplished in a simple life. Without motorised transport, monks walk for hours before sitting down to meditate.

Tell me the style of KF that you practice Ten Tigers and my wife a Cajun witch will put a spell on you.

Peace Brothers. From your post, it's as though I know you since birth. Must be a spiritual communion I am experiencing.

Excuse me please, I have to meditate.