qi? what is it

[EarthDragon]

this is form another thread and i just have to ask you personally what you think the defination or what is qi, chi, ?

seems that we have a huge ignorance on this board of so called martial artists who think you can have a seperation of martial arts or anythign for that matter and qi, or a seperation of life and qi.

I cant believe that so many people are ignorant to such a basic understanding of energy. its the very fabric of exsistance and beleive it or not it is all connected....

so please post your understanding of qi, please dont say mystical super powers or we will put you in the firing line and shoot you

[Taixuquan99]

I think calling people ignorant, and then using a definition that acts as though the Western divide between matter and energy was involved in classical explanations of chi, is a hard stance to support.

Chi as energy is energy as it relates to matter, not simply energy. It does not trump matter's part in the whole, it is in symbiosis with it.

Displaying good chi must involve displaying good body mechanics. Displaying bad body mechanics is displaying bad chi. The issue comes in as "good or bad body mechanics for what?" What is good in one sense may be bad in another.

If, as a fighter, you do not waste kinetic energy and potential energy that is involved in a fight, and you do it in a way that works well with your frame, you have good chi. If you do not, if you cannot master energies that you can feel most easily, then no metaphysical energy that you can't feel as easily is going to give you that.

Anyone, in any style, who does the former, has good chi in relation to the activity they are doing.

[sanjuro_ronin]

I think the better question is what did "QI" mean when it was first used?
What did it mean 1000 years ago, 500, or even 100.

[mig]

this is form another thread and i just have to ask you personally what you think the defination or what is qi, chi, ?

seems that we have a huge ignorance on this board of so called martial artists who think you can have a seperation of martial arts or anythign for that matter and qi, or a seperation of life and qi.



I am not quite sure we can tell about people being ignorant as not all the information you find out there is always accurate or clear to many of us and the teachings are sort of esoteric rather than descriptive in knowledge. Keep in mind that the term QI, CHI, CH'I, KI is very Chinese and implies different terminology proper to their culture, medicine and martial arts. There are other physical factors as air pressure, magnetism and certainly other physics explanations that can be considered as energy and we may have different explanation. Again, I don't think you can define this term without taking into consideration the way is defined in Chinese.

My 0.0001 energy

[bawang]

qi are demons. in qigong u inhale demon spirits

[MasterKiller]

http://i.imgur.com/PqxKi.jpg

[Taixuquan99]

I think the better question is what did "QI" mean when it was first used?
What did it mean 1000 years ago, 500, or even 100.

2000 years ago, in reference to humans, there was no divide between matter and energy, so that, when Confucius spoke of it, it related to proper health in the body, etc.

For the mystical Taoists, and then the Buddhists, you get the miraculous BS.

In the philosophical Taoists, not so much.

Modern scholars do not use a different definition. And let's be honest, when discussing Chinese philosophy UNTIL the last century, it's by scholars for scholars, f the rest of you, enjoy your mystical Taoism offshoot of older local religions, we've got the well thought out stuff.

Arguing the mystical stuff is arguing about the philosophical dregs left some guy starving in the mud, not the foundations of Chinese thought.

That said, it was theoretically possible for anyone to become a scholar, but it was still by scholars for scholars. And those scholars were highly conservative, so that some things remained remarkably consistent until the last fifty years and new discoveries. Once one accepts that Chinese thought did not accept a divide between matter and energy, there is no escaping the implication, no historical case of relevance that changes the fact that the translation of qi as energy utterly lacks the division that the Western educated automatically assign the term. And it always did among scholars.

[bawang]

of course belief of qi is connected to the supernatural. its like asking is the sky blue.

most americans reject religion, so its not surprising to have american kung fu people having trouble accepting supernatural "primitive" aspects of kung fu.

the moral of american kung fu is, keep your mouth shut sifu, and entertain us.

[YouKnowWho]

When you run, if you feel that your legs are

- tired but your breathing is normal, you have strong Qi.
- not tired but you are out of breath, you have weak Qi.

Either you are there or you are not there. Whether you understand Qi or not is not going to help you for your running. Just "keep your mouth shut" and run.

[teetsao]

here is a pretty good demo of qi manipulation

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Fc0bI5CPuk

[Taixuquan99]

of course belief of qi is connected to the supernatural. its like asking is the sky blue.


It's a bit of a vague area. To the Confucians, it was often metaphysical, but lacking in supernatural attributes. Mystical Taoists and Buddhists, yeah, of course, lots of supernatural associations.

[mig]

of course belief of qi is connected to the supernatural. its like asking is the sky blue.

most americans reject religion, so its not surprising to have american kung fu people having trouble accepting supernatural "primitive" aspects of kung fu.

the moral of american kung fu is, keep your mouth shut sifu, and entertain us.

I don't how belief is connected with questioning and when you believe you don't ask questions.
I don't know where you live in the americas but here in the us people don't reject religion, they eat, breath and talk only about religion. Look when the president says, in god we trust, and everybody follows even those who are not believers. Look in every city, there are churches in every corner. This country was built from armed forces and religious beliefs.

[David Jamieson]

Qi is life force.

It's that which pervades you while you live and that which is gone when you are dead.

Trying to explain it succinctly has not been achieved by anyone, ancient or modern, but denying that a life force exists? Folly, it is as obvious as the sky above isn't it?

[bawang]

I don't know where you live in the americas but here in the us people don't reject religion, they eat, breath and talk only about religion.

religion is a way of life. its not lip service.

[mooyingmantis]

Qi is life force.

It's that which pervades you while you live and that which is gone when you are dead.

Trying to explain it succinctly has not been achieved by anyone, ancient or modern, but denying that a life force exists? Folly, it is as obvious as the sky above isn't it?

David,
So you are saying that:

Qi is to Chinese metaphysical life force, as Soul is to Christian Theological life force?

Not a challenge, just asking for clarification. :)

[mooyingmantis]

this is form another thread and i just have to ask you personally what you think the defination or what is qi, chi, ?

seems that we have a huge ignorance on this board of so called martial artists who think you can have a seperation of martial arts or anythign for that matter and qi, or a seperation of life and qi.

I cant believe that so many people are ignorant to such a basic understanding of energy. its the very fabric of exsistance and beleive it or not it is all connected....

so please post your understanding of qi, please dont say mystical super powers or we will put you in the firing line and shoot you

Mike,

Having a paradigm of how the universe works that differs from the Chinese paradigm does not equate to ignorance.

I was taught and have since studied the Chinese concept of Qi, Yin-Yang, Tai Chi, etc. I understand the concepts. I understand how their concepts probably arose and why they developed the way they did.

However, that doesn't mean that I have to accept them as my own philosophy. :)

[David Jamieson]

David,
So you are saying that:

Qi is to Chinese metaphysical life force, as Soul is to Christian Theological life force?

Not a challenge, just asking for clarification. :)

No.

Soul is the ethereal individual self. A conscious energy form.
Qi propels you through life, it is not conscious or exclusive to a single being.

[EarthDragon]

Ok perhaps sqying igrnorant was the wrong word.

I just posted this thread because of the lack of understading of qi from the IP thread. There we have people trying to say your not using qi to break brick sand I guess I was wondering how many people understood qi or even excepted its eixsistance in ou and the universe that surrounds us.
Seems that on a martial arts board more people would be hip to it, but supirse supirse

[SPJ]

qi is not mystical.

you have it, if not, you are dead.

the other is blood or xue.

qi and xue are both necessary for sustaining your life.


gong on the other hand is more unattainable.

there are so many myths about all the gong methods or gong fa.

if your light skill is so good, you may walk on the wall and fly on roof top, fei yan zhou bi.

if your body conditioning is so good, it is like a golden bell cover. jin zhong zhao.

if your head is so hard, it is like iron or diamond, see all the bumps on buddha's head

--

there are more myths about gong than qi.

so what is gong?

gong, what is it?

--

:D

[EarthDragon]

gong is simply skill, something gained when reapeating a certain thing, i.e painting, pottery, kung fu, cooking etc etc thats my two cents

[Scott R. Brown]

if your head is so hard, it is like iron or diamond, see all the bumps on buddha's head

And here, all this time, I thought those were his corn rows!:eek: