Matsuda's monkey dvds

[bodhi warrior]

I was wondering if anyone had purchased or seen any of michael matsuda's monkey kung fu dvds? I am aware of his history and i'm not concerned about that. Just curious what the dvds were like.
Thanks

[David Jamieson]

They're like a dude who thinks that pointing his ass at the sky is martially applicable in some way.

It's called, "ass to the sky"


Nothing at all like "carry the moon" like the rest of us do.

So, you know who he is, where he's from and what they're involved in and your still interested?

Isn't that like spending your last 30 bucks to go to a Lady GoGo show with the backup performer Beyondsay?

p.s yes, I CAN spell. :D

[MightyB]

I think they are a MUST HAVE for all practitioners of Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. :)

[lkfmdc]

now Jamieson, if you were ever going to close a thread, THIS would be the one to do it :D

[David Jamieson]

I think they are a MUST HAVE for all practitioners of Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. :)

Surely you mean Bridezillion JuJube Sue?

[David Jamieson]

now Jamieson, if you were ever going to close a thread, THIS would be the one to do it :D

wait, I"m having fun first.... :p

[lkfmdc]

I have to admit the titles are well done

"michael matsuda's magic monkey dung paw vol 1"

"michael matsuda's manic monkey depressed broadsword with anal wipe tassel"

[bawang]

who is michael matsuda

[ginosifu]

who is michael matsuda

Tai Shing Pek Kwar - Sifu

http://www.monkeykungfu.com/menu.htm

His Sifu is Paulie Zink... Some say there lineage is questionable. Paulie Zink is kinda wierd with his flexiblity he likes to stick his as$ up in the air a bit too much for me.

Pic of Paulie Zink - http://www.redoxx.com/Assets/Images/tbimages/Articles-Images/Forwardfold.jpg

ginosifu

[lkfmdc]

His Sifu is Paulie Zink... Some say there lineage is questionable.



just everyone who knows anything about real kung fu....

[taai gihk yahn]

Tai Shing Pek Kwar - Sifu

http://www.monkeykungfu.com/menu.htm

His Sifu is Paulie Zink... Some say there lineage is questionable. Paulie Zink is kinda wierd with his flexiblity he likes to stick his as$ up in the air a bit too much for me.

Pic of Paulie Zink - http://www.redoxx.com/Assets/Images/tbimages/Articles-Images/Forwardfold.jpg

ginosifu

well, he's now moved into teaching "Taoist Yoga" retreats and workshops to the new age crowd, so I think he's moved beyond the whole MA thing (w the new agers, no one challenges you to fight, they just dump their childhood traumas on u in a passive aggressive manner; but their $'s usually good...)

[Lokhopkuen]

But he's very trong

[lkfmdc]

But he's very trong

he shoots
he scores!

good one!

[Mulong]

He is definitely Paulie Zink's student: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNDMMfN6zks

Then why is he putting him down?

Tai Shing Monkey style kung fu
Commonly called Tai Shing Pek Kwar, the actual term is "Tai Shing," "Pek Kwar" has nothing whatsoever to do with Monkey. It is an axe fist style very similar to Choy Li Fut. Because one instructor mastered both styles, he referred to the school by both names. Tai Shing is the youngest of all three styles. It was created around 1911 by Grand Master Kou Sze, and is the only style to be based upon five monkey characteristics (lost, tall, drunken, wooden and stone). No other monkey style uses these five foundations. It is an extremely brutal art designed with strong and powerful striking techniques. It was never designed as a performance art. There are no Indian or Taoist Yoga movements in the art, these contortionist movements were used by a competitor to iTai Shing Monkey style kung fu

Commonly called Tai Shing Pek Kwar, the actual term is "Tai Shing," "Pek Kwar" has nothing whatsoever to do with Monkey. It is an axe fist style very similar to Choy Li Fut. Because one instructor mastered both styles, he referred to the school by both names. Tai Shing is the youngest of all three styles. It was created around 1911 by Grand Master Kou Sze, and is the only style to be based upon five monkey characteristics (lost, tall, drunken, wooden and stone). No other monkey style uses these five foundations. It is an extremely brutal art designed with strong and powerful striking techniques. It was never designed as a performance art. There are no Indian or Taoist Yoga movements in the art, these contortionist movements were used by a competitor to impress tournament judges years ago (this led to some confusion about people thinking extreme flexibility was actually part of the monkey art, it is not). Grand Master Chan Sau Chung is the only living Grand Master of the art and the only individual who can rightfully use the title of "Monkey King." (Tai Shing has five forms plus a staff form)
mpress tournament judges years ago (this led to some confusion about people thinking extreme flexibility was actually part of the monkey art, it is not). Grand Master Chan Sau Chung is the only living Grand Master of the art and the only individual who can rightfully use the title of "Monkey King." (Tai Shing has five forms plus a staff form)

[Lokhopkuen]

Tai Shing Pek Kwar - Sifu

http://www.monkeykungfu.com/menu.htm

His Sifu is Paulie Zink... Some say there lineage is questionable. Paulie Zink is kinda wierd with his flexiblity he likes to stick his as$ up in the air a bit too much for me.

Pic of Paulie Zink - http://www.redoxx.com/Assets/Images/tbimages/Articles-Images/Forwardfold.jpg

ginosifu

He was a Northern Shaolim student many years ago.

[mooyingmantis]

It is sad that on his website he makes no mention of the man who brought him to where he is today. He rode the coattails of his teacher, then dumped him.

Though without the articles Matsuda wrote, few would have heard of Paulie Zink either.

Once again martial politics rears its ugly head. :(

[Mulong]

Yeah, I found that interesting.... :p

[lkfmdc]

He is definitely Paulie Zink's student: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNDMMfN6zks

Then why is he putting him down?



maybe he realized that Zink's story is completely bogus, too many people know it to be bogus and he'd better distance himself from it

[Lebaufist]

But yet continue to sell his special brand of tripe anyways? You'd think he'd just quit and sell something else. :rolleyes:

[David Jamieson]

maybe he realized that Zink's story is completely bogus, too many people know it to be bogus and he'd better distance himself from it

I think Chan Sau Chung - THE monkey king and current Head of the Da Sheng Pi Gua Kung Fu (Tai Sheng Pek Kwar) set us all straight about this some years ago.

Bottom line. I would take a pass on pretty much most if not all offerings from these guy.

In some societies it is considered ok to lay low and start up again.
Some people don't lay low long enough in my opinion.

And that's pretty much where it's at.

[lkfmdc]

I think Chan Sau Chung - THE monkey king and current Head of the Da Sheng Pi Gua Kung Fu (Tai Sheng Pek Kwar) set us all straight about this some years ago.



Several times I have posted the ENTIRE Zink story. One of my hing-dai is the person that got all three of Chan Sau Chung's books for Zink and gave it to him. Before that Zink knew nothing about the Dai Sing Pek Gwa system

After Zink got the books, his history suddenly got in line with the Chan Sau Chung books, but it was worse, in Zink's books he actually COPIED pics and diagrams from the Chan books

There is even more to this story, but that is the short of it

[Mulong]

We know that Zink is a phony; who claim to fame came from competing at Ed Parker’s Long Beach International Karate Championships which led to getting a book published by IKF and then Panthers videos, as David well know that they were a joke; they were a product of bad Shaw Brothers’ movies meets the open circuit hijinks. However, what is so funny is that Matsuda discredit Zink, not by name, but with his well known personal; however, the irony is that he posted an IKF cover that consisted of both of them back in the days.

But sadly, Chan Shifu isn’t totally honest about the style either; very few individuals ever learn the monkey sets, and if they do- it seems to be only one set.

Question, are they actually set or simply theories/techniques pieced together in improvisation routine? :(

[lkfmdc]

But sadly, Chan Shifu isn’t totally honest about the style either; very few individuals ever learn the monkey sets, and if they do- it seems to be only one set.




How much kung fu has died because teachers kept it secret? I've heard TONS of stories about this. I suspect that at least HALF of what was of value died in the past 100 years from teachers not wanting to give away the "good stuff"

[Mulong]

So true! Within the last 30 years so much has been lost; they are few elders left, who knew what was "real deal," and sadly a lot them kept it themselves.

[bawang]

I suspect that at least HALF of what was of value died in the past 100 years from teachers not wanting to give away the "good stuff"

this is not true. there are traditional styles teaching 8 , 13, techniques total. more is not better

[lkfmdc]

Well, you know a lot about me, I wandered around with CTS and the conversations about things that we would have......

[lkfmdc]

this is not true. there are traditional styles teaching 8 , 13, techniques total. more is not better

Yes and no....

problem #1 is everyone is looking for the "secrets" and forget that strong basics is really the style

BUT, there ARE some things that are being lost rapidly, because no one is teaching them

[bawang]

the things lost are hardly "secrets"

from shaolin 20 questions and answers, dodging and evading is a secret skill in hung ga. that explains why these days southern kung fu teaches everybody to stand still and try to bridge.secret? no. stupid cantonese? yes.

[ginosifu]

But sadly, Chan Shifu isn’t totally honest about the style either; very few individuals ever learn the monkey sets, and if they do- it seems to be only one set.

I have studied with Chan Sifu. He told me that I would have to learn all of the Pek Kwar system before I could learn any of the "REAL" monkey sets.


How much kung fu has died because teachers kept it secret? I've heard TONS of stories about this. I suspect that at least HALF of what was of value died in the past 100 years from teachers not wanting to give away the "good stuff"

I heard many stories but this one comes to mind: Master Marr of the Mi Tsung Lohan style took 75 forms to his grave. On his death bed he stated regretting not giving them out but he felt no one deserved at the time.

ginosifu

[Mulong]

Ginosifu, if I may ask, did you go to Chan Shifu with intent to learn Tai Shing, or the Piquaquan?

[Mulong]

Like David stated: the basic. I became conscious of primary movements when I got my tush handed back to me by a good exponent of karate/kickboxing, who was my friend's student. My friend was cool about it- he didn't put down CMA as not being good, but simply told me that I should focus on the basic of each element of fighting which would be the four attacks: striking, kicking, seizing, and throwing.

Sadly, CMA stylist spend to much time on secondary, and tertiary theories/techniques that may never work in an actual situation, especially with no good foundation which is gain from good basics.

The secret is simply- practice the basics; however, some of the secondary and tertiary concepts are valid and should be preserve. ;)

[lkfmdc]

The "secrets" are chi blasts that blow up chickens but they do exist

But they exist at all high levels

You don't think Dan Gable has ways of setting up and doing a double leg that is better than the local high school wrestling coach?

Wrestling is the PERFECT EXAMPLE

What works in high school doesn't work at the college level

A junior college guy gets OWNED by a division 2 wrestler

A division one wrestler own Div 2

All Americans, or NCAA Div 1 champions, or Olympians, world champions, whole different level

But, ironically, different level of SAME TECHNIQUES

[bawang]

the difference is chinese secrets keep the student from being able to fight period.

chinese secret is so secret the students dont know how to hold a fighting stance

[Mulong]

So true... :p

[lkfmdc]

I don't always agree with John wang, and I know tons of people get turned off by some of his posts, but if you read them carefully you'll see info he got directly from Chang Dung Sheng which makes the entire difference whether something works or not

It has nothing to do with "internal" or "chi" or even with techniques no one has seen, they have to do with the SAME TECHNIQUES EVERYONE IS LEARNING

What angle dose my foot have to be, where am I in relation to the person being throw, in what direction am I throwing him, where is my grip, is my grip pulling pushing lifting or sinking?

[Mulong]

LoL, the myth of Qi; never ending, especially that it has been proven countless of time it doesn't exist in real-time, i.e., fighting. :(

[bawang]

you are 100% right david ross.

i think the biggest irony is in mma there are knockouts with flying kicks. and mma fighters have very rooted and stable footwork that kung fu guys always mention but can never get to work.

the only way to make kung fu work is to not train kung fu.

[lkfmdc]

What is an "MMA technique"?

Where does it come from?

TCMA is supposed to be the most advanced and complete art/tradition in the world

So doesn't it have these techniques?

You think in 5000 years no one in China learned how to use their knees or elbows (that is only "Thai boxing")?

No one in all of China ever wrestled, or tripped or swept someone?

Oh! YOU DO HAVE THOSE TECHNIQUES! Well, why can't you use them? :o

Do you think if you stand in your horse stance one year longer your fighting skill will improve?

Or maybe if you learn the next form?

Original Lion's Roar NO FORMS

Hop Ga, three forms

"Natural style" NO FORMS

Wing Chun three forms

Hung Ga, originally two fighting forms, one internal set

But no one sees it today, why? :eek:

[bawang]

we need to stop doing forms, then kung fu will be saved

i can see the light david ross, thank you

[ginosifu]

Ginosifu, if I may ask, did you go to Chan Shifu with intent to learn Tai Shing, or the Piquaquan?

I just wanted to learn the Monkey sets

ginosifu

[Mulong]

Ginosifu, thank you for the reply; I’m honestly curious how it felt being misled. Usually one goes to a well known shifu searching for some particular skill or form, but what happens when it isn’t taught? In your case I gather, you walked away, but what happens to the rest that get led on for years for something they may never get.

The worst part- his Piguaquan curriculum isn’t small.

[ginosifu]

Ginosifu, thank you for the reply; I’m honestly curious how it felt being misled. Usually one goes to a well known shifu searching for some particular skill or form, but what happens when it isn’t taught? In your case I gather, you walked away, but what happens to the rest that get led on for years for something they may never get.

The worst part- his Piguaquan curriculum isn’t small.

You are right.... 128 forms I think, if remember correctly.

ginosifu

[lkfmdc]

The worst part- his Piguaquan curriculum isn’t small.

according to YC Wong, who learned from Gan Duk Hoi (Chan Sau Jung's sifu)

everyone had to learn Pek Gwa as base before learning the monkey sets

it was THREE hand sets, one dou (broadsword), a spear set

Gan had ONE black tiger set, I think it came from his wife or his sifu's wife (?)

Today I understand they say in Chan's organization there are like 25 pek gwa/pu qua sets

How'd that happen? :rolleyes:

[Mulong]

In this day in age that is simply crazy!

How long did you trained?

[lkfmdc]

You are right.... 128 forms I think, if remember correctly.

ginosifu

wow, I walked away from the wu lin in the 1990's and back then it was only around 25

now it's 120ish!

the kung fu system grew 500% in just 20 years, that's "astounding" :rolleyes:

[Mulong]

Do we know how supposedly Chan, learned the secret monkey sets? :rolleyes:

[bawang]

the forms grew like tumors on a sick man.

*stroke beard

[ginosifu]

In this day in age that is simply crazy!

How long did you trained?

He was in Vancover British Columbia for a while so I flew out a couple times and learned several sets. He was charging like $400 a form. It got to be too expensive. I live in Cleveland and it was getting too hard with travel expenses going with gas prices and such.

ginosifu

[lkfmdc]

Do we know how supposedly Chan, learned the secret monkey sets? :rolleyes:

I don't think there is any doubt he learned all 5

he was NOT the only one, he was just the student who was given the "inheritance" to run the organization

CTS had a friend in HK who also knew the monkey sets, there were (back then at least) many people who learned the sets from Gan Duk Hoi

But "back then" apparently you only had to learn 4 empty hand sets and two weapon sets before you learned it

how it became 128 sets is the real question

[Mulong]

That is a pretty penny for each set; dare I ask was the material worth it and how in-depth was the teaching?

[lkfmdc]

That is a pretty penny for each set;



I know someone who paid $1000 (back in the 1990's) to learn Min Loi Jam. All he got was the sequence, no explanation at all. Yet, stranger still, he was just happy to learn it, like he actually thought he had acquired something valuable

that is the kung fu mindset at it's worst

[Mulong]

David, we both know one well known shifu in NYC that was famous selling sets for mega bucks back in the days. :eek:

[ginosifu]

That is a pretty penny for each set; dare I ask was the material worth it and how in-depth was the teaching?

I got to learn a couple of basic Pek Kwar sets and Dao. No applications. Was not really worth the time and money. Here is a clip of me doing "Pek Kwar Kau Da" at his school:

http://shaolininstitute.com/institute/media_viewer2.shtml

ginosifu

[lkfmdc]

Being Chinese :p YC Wong and his students did not put up the whole sets but here are the Pek Gwa roads

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTuGLxjTbqA

what IS shown is shown in correct sequence

does any of this look familiar to you

[lkfmdc]

here are chan sau jung's versions

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocLpo5BosZY&feature=related

the guy did them as one form, sorta weird

[Mulong]

Ginosifu, truly appreciate your candidness on the matter. It saddens me hearing this, but I was awaiting this kind of response; it is the norm and this hurts CMA greatly to the point that it discourages individuals from learning and simply walk away from CMA.

[ginosifu]

Being Chinese :p YC Wong and his students did not put up the whole sets but here are the Pek Gwa roads

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTuGLxjTbqA

what IS shown is shown in correct sequence

does any of this look familiar to you

I have #2 of the Pek kwar sets and the way I was taught flowed like Anthony Wongs form. I'm not sure what the other guy was doing? - Just re watched the 2nd guy... almost but like you say wierd.

ginosifu

[Mulong]

Thanks David, you do see the difference of flavor; it is obvious Wong Shifu version would possess southern flavor. ;)

[Mulong]

David, you still have video of Wong Shifu doing it? :cool:

[David Jamieson]

here are chan sau jung's versions

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocLpo5BosZY&feature=related

the guy did them as one form, sorta weird

1st guy had better understanding in his body.

2nd guy looked like he was trying to remember what to do.

No biggy.

It looks like Bak Sil Lum! I mean, I know it's not, but dang! lol

[Mulong]

Sadly, it seems most Northern styles mutated when they got to Hong Kong; they all lost the openness and liveliness flavor and became more upright and stiff. :(

[Brule]

1st guy had better understanding in his body....................


so much is said in this part of DJ's post.

[Mulong]

Jamieson, how so? I am seeing a Northern style being played by a Southern stylist without understanding the Northern flavor or worst basics. :confused:

[David Jamieson]

so much is said in this part of DJ's post.

Only if you're a martial artist a gymnast or a dancer though... :)

[lkfmdc]

Thanks David, you do see the difference of flavor; it is obvious Wong Shifu version would possess southern flavor. ;)

2nd guy was just plain BAD at it... but his "version" was different also

YC Wong's teachings obviously have a hung influence, but still a good version none the less

[lkfmdc]

David, you still have video of Wong Shifu doing it? :cool:

no, one of the many things stolen over the years

[lkfmdc]

It looks like Bak Sil Lum! I mean, I know it's not, but dang! lol

it's all "bak"

and I am not really big on the "sil (should be SIU!) Lam" thing anyway

[David Jamieson]

Jamieson, how so? I am seeing a Northern style being played by a Southern stylist without understanding the Northern flavor or worst basics. :confused:

Here is a Bak Sil Lum set called plum flower:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qA1q8nVU4ng

Here is the Pek Kwar sets again:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTuGLxjTbqA

You don't see similarity in these?

fwiw, I am not 100% certain, but I am somewhat certain that our southern shaolin broadsword set comes from Pek Kwar.

[David Jamieson]

it's all "bak"

and I am not really big on the "sil (should be SIU!) Lam" thing anyway

I understand that, but still...

How do you feel about Shaolim?

[lkfmdc]

Of course they are all similar, and probably got even more so when it was all being taught in the same area by people who all know eachother

TCMA in an incestuous cluster ****, always has been and continues to be

[lkfmdc]

I understand that, but still...

How do you feel about Shaolim?

siu lam/shaolin is tossed about for things that never were shaolin in the first place. And even the stuff that was IN shaolin mostly originated outside it anyway, apparently Gene's book "Shaolin Trips" talks about this, but I haven't gotten a copy yet

maybe he will LINK to the product now

[Mulong]

Don't worry; I'll search for them. I know I have first form, and one our dear buddies has the second form on video. ;)

[lkfmdc]

Don't worry; I'll search for them. I know I have first form, and one our dear buddies has the second form on video. ;)

ah......

ten characters

[Mulong]

LoL, indeed...

[David Jamieson]

Of course they are all similar, and probably got even more so when it was all being taught in the same area by people who all know eachother

TCMA in an incestuous cluster ****, always has been and continues to be

tcma is not alone in it's incetuous clusterhumping.

boxing, mma, wrestling, karate, tkd etc etc.


mma is getting really ****genous now.

boxing has been for a while. It's the totally unorthodox boxers that seem to get something going on at the start, but it gets checked when the others bump hip.

[Lokhopkuen]

according to YC Wong, who learned from Gan Duk Hoi (Chan Sau Jung's sifu)

everyone had to learn Pek Gwa as base before learning the monkey sets

it was THREE hand sets, one dou (broadsword), a spear set

Gan had ONE black tiger set, I think it came from his wife or his sifu's wife (?)

Today I understand they say in Chan's organization there are like 25 pek gwa/pu qua sets

How'd that happen? :rolleyes:


The story gets even better with every retelling? Chop up, chop down, chop left, chop right, seriously how much can you say about chop chop?

[Lokhopkuen]

the difference is chinese secrets keep the student from being able to fight period.

chinese secret is so secret the students dont know how to hold a fighting stance

You my friend have the second sight as the seventh son of a seventh son?
What will happen if you keep revealing all of the 108 un-revealable secrets of the 72 un-revealable secret sercrets?!??!?!?





(((((((ha ha ha ha ha!!!))))))

[Lokhopkuen]

I understand that, but still...

How do you feel about Shaolim?


北少林功夫:D:rolleyes:;):p

[mooyingmantis]

Though it may sound like it, the following questions are not meant to stir up a hornet's nest, nor disparage Sifu Chan.

However....

Other than himself or his students, has anyone else attested that Sifu Chan is the lineage holder for tai shing pek kwar?

If others studied the art during Sifu Chan's time of study, who is to say it was not passed on to Cho Chat Ling and that he did not pass it on to Paulie Zink?

How does the fact that Sifu Zink received three books on TSPK from a friend of Sifu Ross' squash any chance that PZ didn't also study the art with Cho Chat Ling?

I think many of us here have seen enough martial arts politics to know that many "masters" lie, inflate the truth, or are looking out for their own best interests. Could this be an example of this? How do we know whose version of the story is more credible?

In an earlier post there was a photo of PZ with CCL, does anyone know if this is credible?

I know that Sifu Chan has produced good fighters in the past, starred in a movie (maybe more), trained others who became actors, wrote a few books and was featured in numerous articles. So, he certainly has been successful in promoting himself. But does this really make his version of events more credible than anyone else's?

I would love to hear what Y C Wong has to say on the subject, since he must know both parties involved in the debate.

BTW, does anyone know if Sifu Wong learned the monkey sets?

[Lokhopkuen]

1st guy had better understanding in his body.

2nd guy looked like he was trying to remember what to do.

No biggy.

It looks like Bak Sil Lum! I mean, I know it's not, but dang! lol

Pak qwar is one of the eighteen (hands) root martial essences of Bak Siu Lum.
I see many techniques from several Bak Siu Lum advanced practice forms.
Thanks for sharing.

[Lokhopkuen]

Here is a Bak Sil Lum set called plum flower:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qA1q8nVU4ng



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VSaIGDd8jg&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[Lokhopkuen]

Here is a Bak Sil Lum set called plum flower:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qA1q8nVU4ng

Here is the Pek Kwar sets again:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTuGLxjTbqA

You don't see similarity in these?

fwiw, I am not 100% certain, but I am somewhat certain that our southern shaolin broadsword set comes from Pek Kwar.

Similarity in essence of technique but not in the construction of the practice set.
The plum flower group attack formation where players assault five against one from 2, 5, 6, 7 and 10 O'clock positions. Moi Fa Kuen trains to break out of the deadly plum flower ambush array.

[lkfmdc]

Other than himself or his students, has anyone else attested that Sifu Chan is the lineage holder for tai shing pek kwar?



Gan Duk Hoi's will, Lam Jo, about 100 sifu who are from HK, most of the wu lin, I don't know, pretty much everyone




If others studied the art during Sifu Chan's time of study, who is to say it was not passed on to Cho Chat Ling and that he did not pass it on to Paulie Zink?



"Cho Chat Ling" is a fictional person who doesn't exist. But other than that.....




How does the fact that Sifu Zink received three books on TSPK from a friend of Sifu Ross' squash any chance that PZ didn't also study the art with Cho Chat Ling?



Prior to my hing-dai giving Zink the books, Zink only called what he did "monkey style", he said his teacher was a secret, didnt apparently know there were 5 monkey sets, oh the list is long




I would love to hear what Y C Wong has to say on the subject, since he must know both parties involved in the debate.



I could tell you what YC Wong thinks of Zink's "pek kwar" but I'd probably get banned for foul language

[Mulong]

That I personal know Wong Shifu didn’t learn Di Sheng and only a few sets of Piguaquan.

Again, one tale is that Chan learn the Di Sheng, because he married his shifu’s daughter which will make sense, i.e., keeping it in the family.

Chan Shifu did develop fighters in Hong Kong, but sadly when they came to fight in Hawaii they didn’t fair so well back in 70’s.

[lkfmdc]

That I personal know Wong Shifu didn’t learn Di Sheng and only a few sets of Piguaquan.



YC Wong didnt' learn any monkey, he learned the three pek gwa hand sets, the broadsword and the spear. Back then, that was it....

Other people learned the monkey sets... Chan Sau Jung is NOT the only one

[Mulong]

That's good to know, but sadly their lineages aren’t well known which gives Chan Shifu exclusively.

[lkfmdc]

That's good to know, but sadly their lineages aren’t well known which gives Chan Shifu exclusively.

it's another cluster-you-know-what because the guys who learned it who aren't Chan aren't supposed to teach it

Of course, many have, but they aren't supposed to

typical kung fu silliness

[Mulong]

Indeed, but lately we have been seeing these lost lineages remerging which adds new introspective to varies disciplines, and actually rewriting the history books. ;)

[lkfmdc]

Pak qwar is one of the eighteen (hands) root martial essences of Bak Siu Lum.




that is interesting and useful info