Omei Bak Mei - Yum Yeung Jik Bo Kuen DVD

[lungyuil]

Omei Bak Mei - Sifu Garry Hearfield is releasing the 1st DVD on the systems core set Yum Yeung Jik Bo Kuen, check it out!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRfnw_M_KKY&feature=channel_video_title

[Mulong]

If I may say, couldn’t he have taped somewhere else then his own living room; a bit unprofessional. :mad:

[lungyuil]

You can say that, but it is more about the information than the living room.
I have seen many so called professional dvd's that are crap with no real information.

Anyway each to their own..

[Mulong]

You forget to take into account we need to see his footwork which is crucial to generate the ging.

[lungyuil]

What you are seeing are clips of the DVD only. you cannot criticize until you see the whole DVD.
Those who know my Sifu know that it will be completely informative with all the breakdowns for anyone to be able to understand and actually practice the form.

I guarantee no-one will be disappointed!!

[Mulong]

This isn’t anything personal; however, when marketing an instructional DVD, one should take into account production. For example, how much he is selling the product for? If he is selling more then $20 then this crucial!

I’ve personally been involved in martial arts video market for 20 years and I seen a lot of strange tapes out there; my favorite ones are the ones produce in golf courses in China. At the end the product has to be assessable to buyer; not a student.

As a student you only see yours shifu’s ability, but the buyer sees other things which go beyond the material and sadly that’s what count in an open market.

Personaly I haven’t commented on his ability or material which I could, but I'm focusing on the most obvious error which is the location of shot which wasn’t a good ideal.

[Faruq]

Omei Bak Mei - Sifu Garry Hearfield is releasing the 1st DVD on the systems core set Yum Yeung Jik Bo Kuen, check it out!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRfnw_M_KKY&feature=channel_video_title

Hey, Sifu Garry promised me a copy when it came out. I still haven't received it though. Could you ask him when he'll send it please?

[Yao Sing]

Waiting on LKMF to comment on the Doo and spark things up around here.
:eek:

"White Eyebrow Kung Fu of Omei Mountains belonging to the Doo Family"

[Frost]

Waiting on LKMF to comment on the Doo and spark things up around here.
:eek:

"White Eyebrow Kung Fu of Omei Mountains belonging to the Doo Family"

Ross has left this forum now, and i think we all know what Doo is full of and by association what this dvd will be like :)

[TAO YIN]

What will it be like? What did you want it to be like?

Been looking for Frost,s DVD for years now...

This whole idea of guilty by association is among the most idiotic things this world has going for it. I am guessing that you are not a fan of Ghandi, right?

[Faruq]

Hey, any form breakdowns done by Garry Hearfield are gonna have solid combat applications. Everyone I've ever heard touched hands with him has said he's a solid martial artist. He's never said he was God's gift to martial arts, he's just doing his part, and I want my copy of the DVD. If you guys aren't into it, you obviously won't purchase it. So let's move on....

[Yao Sing]

Well, I think with the Doo Wai association he needs to show something much more substantial than that trailer before I would consider buying the DVD.

What I saw from the Doo clips during the David Ross show here on the forum didn't spark my interest at all. Neither did the material presented in the trailer for this DVD.

He showed how he telegraphs his punches with his power generation principle (reminded me of the way modern WuShu jazzes up moves), showed a bunch of block&punch from a single straight punch attack. The music covered up his explanations so whether he was saying anything worthwhile we won't know without buying the DVD but the visuals weren't enough to generate any interest.

I won't dismiss him offhand but it's not looking too good right now. Maybe someone more familiar with the material or style can shed some light. I know zero about Bak Mei and Omei Kung Fu (other than Luo Li's O-Mei WuShu (http://learnwushu.com/)).

[diego]

Well, I think with the Doo Wai association he needs to show something much more substantial than that trailer before I would consider buying the DVD.

What I saw from the Doo clips during the David Ross show here on the forum didn't spark my interest at all. Neither did the material presented in the trailer for this DVD.

He showed how he telegraphs his punches with his power generation principle (reminded me of the way modern WuShu jazzes up moves), showed a bunch of block&punch from a single straight punch attack. The music covered up his explanations so whether he was saying anything worthwhile we won't know without buying the DVD but the visuals weren't enough to generate any interest.

I won't dismiss him offhand but it's not looking too good right now. Maybe someone more familiar with the material or style can shed some light. I know zero about Bak Mei and Omei Kung Fu (other than Luo Li's O-Mei WuShu (http://learnwushu.com/)).

I know Doo Wai trained for like a year and a half in Vancouver in the 70's or early 80's and learned up to Ying jow...there was mention he said he learned more BM from a family friend or something?...I'm curious if there is original video of his "other" lineages.

[Golden Arms]

Wow, an ENTIRE year and a half? Where do I sign up?:rolleyes:

[LaterthanNever]

It can't be genuine Bak Mei...Gee-Shung Grandmaster James Patrick Lacey isn't performing the form!! :eek::p:confused:

And did I mention he's on some secretive council of "Sokeship"?(whatever the f--k that is--lol)

[TAO YIN]

Sifu Garry is a very competent martial artist. I know this from studying with various masters of many arts throughout the world, from studying with various Bak Mei masters, from being Sifu Garry's student for many years, from my own fighting, and from my own teaching of Yau Kung Mun. I have yet to meet anyone with the same power and practical application that Sifu Garry has. He can stand and roll, and explain everything that is going on, that should go on, and can do both. The video is a detailed instruction of the first form Straight Step Fist.

Bak Mei may look I guess a little wushuish from the power generation and body movement, but anyone who knows about its delivery system knows that is not what is happening. Few can properly express the movements, especially if they have large frames. He can express it and has internalized it. It's not easy to do, but it's easy to do. Would be happy to discuss it or show it.

Doo Wai, never studied in Vancouver. He learned in Changsha and Huizhou from his father, moved to Hong Kong and learned there, then Macau and Taiwan, then immigrated to America in the 60s. Bruce Lee credited his art in his book. Ali respected him. Other stories occurred and are other stories, his skill and movement declined, and well, sheet happens...

In any case, I am sure that whoever purchases this tape would be glad with their purchase simply because of the insight and body mechanics that Garry can put into simple terms and show. He puts his heart into what he does and expects his hard work to show in what he does. He might have gone off a few dozen times here, but who hasn't.

Yao Sing, just for arguments sake, I am sure that the average martial artist would get just as much or more out of this tape than anyone would from buying anniversary demos from your temple there on Goldenrod.

I have to stick by my thought on guilty by association. I work everyday with ridiculous people, but I don't set out to be ridiculous.

[Faruq]

I'm not looking at it as Bak Mei as much as learning more short hand fighting from a guy who loves to get in there and test his skills. That's my interest in it. There's no proving anything about Doo Wai through internet sources even in Chinese to my knowledge, and I have no interest in him. It's all Garry Hearfield's sound reputation that makes me want the DVD.

[Yao Sing]

Wah Lum anniversary demo tapes don't make any claims of instruction. They are nothing more than entertainment for folks that like to watch Kung Fu.

I'm not telling anyone not to buy the DVD, just saying I don't see anything in the trailer that suggest it's worth buying. If there is some good stuff in there it's not showing in the trailer.

And the Doo Wai link sets up a red flag from what I've seen of his stuff.

So what's the relationship between Bak Fu Pai, Bak Mei and Yau Kung Mun? What and who did this guy learn from?

[Faruq]

And the Doo Wai link sets up a red flag from what I've seen of his stuff.

So what's the relationship between Bak Fu Pai, Bak Mei and Yau Kung Mun? What and who did this guy learn from?

You gotta talk to Douglas Wong or Terry Dunn about that stuff. They were his first U.S. students, weren't they? Unless scouring the Chinese net'll yield you something...

[diego]

Wow, an ENTIRE year and a half? Where do I sign up?:rolleyes:

I heard he said he learned when he was a kid from an alternative BM lineage...he only trained in Vancouver at my school for like a year and a half...I've been there almost two years and still know very little.:D

[TAO YIN]

Yao Sing,

I didn't say that the anniversary tapes were instructional or claimed to be, I said that someone would get just as much or more out of the other.

The promo vid has no voice. You don't know what he is pointing out, or even talking about. And I am guessing that you don't study Bak Mei or know Jik Bo Kuen. He is covering its intricacies in the tape. If you notice the willow leaf palm, yin yang hands, and double Phoenix ascending to heaven, you can clearly see what he is on about. It is not wushu, it is short power. And short power and fighting with it works a certain way.

You have seen Doo Wai stuff that was done a few years ago, while in his mid eighties. Stationary hand forms with very quick hands, and yes, a ridiculous sword form. Aside from that, there is nothing more than rants on the net.

I have no interest in defending him. I just look at the history of all of it. He was regarded by Ark Wong, is regarded by Share Lew, by Ali and other boxers...Bruce regarded his art as effective and included it in his Tao of Jeet Kune Do.

He isn't on Cheung Lai Chen's successor chart, but apparently had studied with him Through his father after his father passed.

Yau Kung Mun was opened up by Har Hon Hung, one of Cheung Lai Chens earliest and top students. Har Hon Hung is on Clcs chart, even though CLC was not cool with the break up. Har Hon Hungs top student were his son and Sigung Leung Cheung. Sifu Garry studied with bot Har's son, Ha Kwok Cheung, and also his teacher for many years, Leung Cheung. He was regarded by both as a Sifu and closed door disciple.

Sifu Garry has also studied many other arts has competed in Mt, judo, and BJj and won many times...worked as a doorman and psych ward officer, etc etc...He knows what he is going on about.



Diego,

You are from Doucet's? Cool. This story of Doo Wai training in Canada goes back to a TV show in Canada about 13 years ago froma man named Richard Shergold. He claimed White Tiger and Bak Mei as one in the same on this show, or something another, and claimed to be a disciple of Doo Wai...

About the same time, this story came up, either on Doucet's pakmei.net website or here whe it was kungfuonline, that Doo Wai was actually named Wilkie Woo. That he studied in Canada from you alls Sigungs there, and that he only studied for a few months. Then fled to America because his wife and child were murdered by triad gangsters. The funniest thing about that is that there is actually a man named Wilkie Woo in Canada who is pak mei Sifu.

Doo was here training with these respected West Coast Sifus in the 60s and was on the cover of Inside Kung Fu in either 71 or 72. Point is, the stories about this Vancouver thing, him back then being named Wilkie Woo, and etc, just don't match up.

Just for truth as I know it sake, he is not kined to the Du of Shanghai who was the gangster millionaire navy holder backing the Chinese army, same surname though. I had heard that one too, but this was another, story.

Gossip is something you like as long as it is about someone you don't like.

Cheers,

Tao

[TAO YIN]

Yao Sing,

Just because I am curious, isn't your Sifu the one who said that his teacher as an old man did Dim Mak a Yang stylist much younger and paralyzed him? Did your teacher go behind closed doors at the Shaolin temple and perform 18 kicks, which no one is allowed to learn, and then become a successor to Shaolin with a shrine? Was in his lawn one day when the water hose went off and he jumped around kicking eight feet into the air and scaring the neighbors, performed light skill and jumped out of a second floor window when someone dropped a challenge in Boston? Swam to hong kong from mainland, and then from boat to Boston? Threatened Shi Guilin and Shi yanming with his iron finger by pointing at them and hollering at them? And could fall down into pushup position just on his index fingers?

Or are these all just gossip stories?

[diego]

Lol Tao Wilkie Wu is my Sifu hes been teaching in Vancouver for like 40 years..doo enrolled in my sigung Yip Chi Sums school in the late 70s early 80s after meeting Sifu Wilkie when they went to school at UBC. Doo said he got BM from his family and trained at my school for less than 2 years.

[Faruq]

Yao Sing,
Yau Kung Mun was opened up by Har Hon Hung, one of Cheung Lai Chens earliest and top students. Har Hon Hung is on Clcs chart, even though CLC was not cool with the break up. Har Hon Hungs top student were his son and Sigung Leung Cheung. Sifu Garry studied with bot Har's son, Ha Kwok Cheung, and also his teacher for many years, Leung Cheung. He was regarded by both as a Sifu and closed door disciple.

Sifu Garry has also studied many other arts has competed in Mt, judo, and BJj and won many times...worked as a doorman and psych ward officer, etc etc...He knows what he is going on about.

Gossip is something you like as long as it is about someone you don't like.

Cheers,

Tao

Well Tao Ying, could you ask Sifu Garry if he's still gonna send the DVDs to me he said he would?

[Golden Arms]

Diego,

You are from Doucet's? Cool. This story of Doo Wai training in Canada goes back to a TV show in Canada about 13 years ago froma man named...

Cheers,

Tao

Diego does not train with Sifu Doucet.

[TAO YIN]

Diego,

Did you just read my post? I have been following this ignorance for over 15 years. This place used to be called kungfuonline, and before that it was Mousels or some such. The storie went, either on Doucet Sifu's site or here, that Doo Wai was really named Wilkie Woo, that he studied for only 2 months in Vancouver, that he got cross with some Triads, and that his wife and son were killed because of it...That was the gossip spread over ten years ago. No one knew who Wilkie Woo was back then, and so just went along with it. Richard Shergold claimed Bak Mei on Canadian TV, and some dude named Simon claimed it in some way or another. This made Bak Mei elders angry there. Especially since Shergold was a video student of one of Lacy's video students...Pitiful junk on all sides.

Doo Wai has been teaching Bak Fu Pai and Bak Mei since the mid to late 60s in this country. His father was known and respected by CLC, and apparently died in the war. Check on YouTube the old slow mo vid from Douglas Wong, him doing Bak Mei in 1971.

I just said this same junk before, but he was respected by Ark Yuey Wong, Share Lew, Bruce Lee, Ali, Ed Parker...why? I guess just for face...

He made a tape of Bak Mei forms that were apparently of another line that his father learned from the same monk that fought CLC. Convenient, yes. He offered this tape and system for 40,000. Perhaps for gullible for Gwei Los, or simply to cash in on the MA video crazy that was going on in that 80s and 90s.

This other Bak Mei, is softer and Rushier, going all over the place, with much more hands going on than regular Bak Mei. Better? No. Similar? Yes.

All of the above is the junk, the truth stranger than fiction, that I have objectively noticed while quietly studying. I shake my head in disbelief about all of the gossip, the spewing, and the nonsense that goes on from all of this.

From what I have seen, this Bak Fu Pai stuff was pretty good material until the Internet came out. That is the stuff that was being taught in the 70s and 80s before Panther made the Kung Fu world go insane.

In any case, I have no idea why I defend any of this...I guess I just like to point out the objective truth as I have seen it.

To add, none of this has anything much to do with Sifu Garry. He had skills before any of this and still does. He won't steer anyone in the wrong direction MA wise.

Faruq,

I will ask Sifu Garry about this next time I chat with him.

Cheers again,

Tao

[Faruq]

Faruq,

I will ask Sifu Garry about this next time I chat with him.

Cheers again,

Tao


Thanks, Tao. I guess part of everyone's fascination with Doo Wai is the mystery he created with all his crazy stories and stuff, lol. That and the fact that you can't find any documentation on him or his family in China anywhere. There was a post or article somewhere several years back about an Asian guy alleging to be selling the routines of a whole martial arts system on video for $50K, but without any techniques or breakdowns of any of the forms he demo'd in it. Now after your post, I'm wondering if that was DW, lol.
Though I'd think the friendship of the people you mention would say something about his knowledge; in spite of his gangster mindset and morals lol. I dunno.

His mindset and morals kind of (well really, "exactly") remind me of this David Ross post: "My teacher, like a lot of Chinese teachers, felt that those who mattered always knew the real deal and those who didn't know the "real deal" never mattered. A sifu in the martial arts community (Mo Lum) knows exactly how a real Baai Si (adoption) ceremony takes place. If you say you were adopted and don't have the right things, a real person in the Mo Lum is going to laugh his azz off at you and take you for a clown. Of course, most Americans don't know thing #1 about this sort of stuff

A real Baai Si is a public event. It is usually announced, often in newspapers. Mine was.

A fortune teller is consulted to find the right date, you must submit to your sifu your date and time of birth.

A real Baai Si must have witnesses, at least one a MAJOR figure in the Mo Lum. My #1 Baai Si witness was Sifu Frank Yee (Yee Chi Wai) of the Dang Fong Hung Ga lineage.

My other two witneses were a Choy Lay Fut teacher and a member of one of the associations.

A real Baai Si involves you receiving a reb paper books which has important Kuen Po and which is signed by you, your sifu and the witnesses.

To my knowledge, my sifu did four Baai Si in China before coming here. He did three official Baai Si in the US, all done in the Mineola school myself, Gus Kapros and Michael Parrella opened.

I bring this up because my sifu, like many sifu I know, was also capable of turning to someone and telling them "hey, you got $500? I'll adopt you. Come to my house on a Thursday night with teh cash and BOOM you're adopted!"

The senior students had a huge issue with Sifu Chan over this sort of stuff. My sifu always scoffed and laughed. He said that anyone who mattered, ie real people in the Mo Lum, would never take someone claiming to be adopted from one of these "late night cash sessions" seriously.

And if another ignorant American believed someone was an adopted disciple because of this? WHO CARED. They didn't matter anyway...

It was also common knowledge that my sifu had A, B, C, even D versions of everything he taught. Like I said previously, usually in 5 minutes he figured out whether you had potential or not. If you didn't, he never bothered to even try and show you the real stuff...

This is why, from time to time, you'll see some whining SOB claim that Chan Tai San didn't know anything. He'll inevitably claim he studied with him and learned crap. Of course, that doesn't mean Sifu Chan didn't know anything, it meant he never showed YOU anything of value. There is a difference....."
__________________
All The Best Tao

[diego]

when did bruce meet doo?.

[Yao Sing]

Yao Sing,

Just because I am curious, isn't your Sifu the one who said that his teacher as an old man did Dim Mak a Yang stylist much younger and paralyzed him? Did your teacher go behind closed doors at the Shaolin temple and perform 18 kicks, which no one is allowed to learn, and then become a successor to Shaolin with a shrine? Was in his lawn one day when the water hose went off and he jumped around kicking eight feet into the air and scaring the neighbors, performed light skill and jumped out of a second floor window when someone dropped a challenge in Boston? Swam to hong kong from mainland, and then from boat to Boston? Threatened Shi Guilin and Shi yanming with his iron finger by pointing at them and hollering at them? And could fall down into pushup position just on his index fingers?

Or are these all just gossip stories?

Apparently you know more about the gossip than I do so I'm at a loss to answer. I do know he has, and studied, Dim Mak manuals that I believe came from his teacher. This is only second hand from one of the older Sifus that saw it directly.

Whatever happened behind the closed doors of the Shaolin Temple I have no direct knowledge except from some who speaks chinese and was outside and overheard the monks talking as they came out.

I have heard from others who witnessed MC do some amazing stuff not knowing I was his student. Actually he was relating what he saw to the instructor of a Pai Lum school I was visiting. I overheard the discussion.

I've seen MC do a few things myself in my time at the Temple. So no, I don't thinks it's all a bunch of gossip but I'm sure there's a whole lot of exxageration going on as the stories make the rounds. Oh, and he was really po'd at Yan Ming which made for some major controversy at the tourney and Shaolin Temple back in '98 and he had a whole lot to say but I never heard a threat. Maybe it was in Chinese.

Where are we going with all this? Just trying to confirm the stories?

[Yao Sing]

Well Tao Ying, could you ask Sifu Garry if he's still gonna send the DVDs to me he said he would?

Are you familiar with the material? Can you give us your impression if/when you get the DVD?

Southern short hand styles are totally foreign to me. That power generation looks cool and all but doesn't look practical in a live situation (hate to sound like a MMA nutrider).

[TAO YIN]

Faruq,

I totally understand what you mean, and I personally think that all of it is ridiculous and convenient at the same time. Brief story, while traveling in Changsha, I met some people with the Du surname. Since Du speaks Cantonese with a Changshanese accent, I talked to these people briefly and asked if they had any relatives that practiced Gong Fu. They didn't know of any. I talked to some of their relatives as well, and the didn't know any. Nothing big. I also searched for information on him in Huizhou. Clcs hometown. Nothing. Whampoa military college, lor far mountain, also nothing, and not much at all about CLC, but everyone knows about him... But all of that means nothing. Trying to track someone down in China, especially if they don't want to be tracked down, is near futile. His name in mandarin is Du Wei, and the Wei he uses is a name that people are not even named hardly at all anymore.

I don't know his story aside from the common sense I can place of his time in America. I did find it interesting asking about various people in China. A person would need a whole lot of time to really fin out the sure truths about all of these individuals, especially ones who passed.

Yao Sing,

I was just curious. I have heard a lot of stories about a lot of masters. Your Sifu told the dim mak story on a tv show, secret of the warriors power, so I was just curious. Nothing more than wondering what the truth is. Some of those other stories I heard from others. Big M, never told stories though.

I know that question wasn't directed at me, but Jik Bo Kuen is a training and development form IMO. It is there to train the FCTT for proper body mechanics, like Sam Bo Gin, but in a different manner altogether. Nothing really big I guess in the end of it all, lead hand, rear, lead hand, rear. Or cross. It is a great form for understanding how the body will float and sink, swallow and spit over time. Done slowly and relaxed, it really opens the body up. In depth, it has a lot going on with it, including Iron Body because of the dip gwat gung, the spinal movement, and fascia stuff going on with it. I dont like to train it much anymore because it makes my elbow numb with the big right not hitting anything...Cheers.

Tao

[Yao Sing]

Big M likes to stay low key. If you talk to him ask about when we were building the roof on the side of the Temple and the rafter swung loose and almost hit MC. Skill comes out under pressure. Poor Andy though, not quite as fast or agile. ;)

TF got caught with a Dim Mak finger once when he angered MC according to my KF brother who was there when it happened. I got there late that day.

[Faruq]

Faruq,

I totally understand what you mean, and I personally think that all of it is ridiculous and convenient at the same time. Brief story, while traveling in Changsha, I met some people with the Du surname. Since Du speaks Cantonese with a Changshanese accent, I talked to these people briefly and asked if they had any relatives that practiced Gong Fu. They didn't know of any. I talked to some of their relatives as well, and the didn't know any. Nothing big. I also searched for information on him in Huizhou. Clcs hometown. Nothing. Whampoa military college, lor far mountain, also nothing, and not much at all about CLC, but everyone knows about him... But all of that means nothing. Trying to track someone down in China, especially if they don't want to be tracked down, is near futile. His name in mandarin is Du Wei, and the Wei he uses is a name that people are not even named hardly at all anymore.

I don't know his story aside from the common sense I can place of his time in America. I did find it interesting asking about various people in China. A person would need a whole lot of time to really fin out the sure truths about all of these individuals, especially ones who passed.

...Cheers.

Tao

Yeah, especially since it wouldn't be hard to change your name, create a new identity and buy corroborating identity documents before applying for asylum in the U.S. back in the 60's or whenever he came.

[QUOTE=Yao Sing;1150755]Are you familiar with the material? Can you give us your impression if/when you get the DVD?

Southern short hand styles are totally foreign to me. That power generation looks cool and all but doesn't look practical in a live situation.[QUOTE]

Yeah, I will if I receive it. But you can tell already how I feel about Garry Hearfield's knowledge and products already from my posts.

[Golden Arms]

Faruq,
...His name in mandarin is Du Wei, and the Wei he uses is a name that people are not even named hardly at all anymore...
Tao

Have people already forgotten that this is the same person that, if I recall correctly, claimed to be able to make insects and rodents come back to life after having their heads taken off on youtube, and showed "chi/qi" by rubbing his fingers together and making smoke come off them like that old magic trick? This isn't stuff I heard about, I have seen the videos before LOL.

As in all things, I suppose its simply a case of buyer beware.

[Faruq]

Have people already forgotten that this is the same person that, if I recall correctly, claimed to be able to make insects and rodents come back to life after having their heads taken off on youtube, and showed "chi/qi" by rubbing his fingers together and making smoke come off them like that old magic trick? This isn't stuff I heard about, I have seen the videos before LOL.

As in all things, I suppose its simply a case of buyer beware.

Yeah, it's that "let me pull one over on someone, and make a couple grand at the same time" kind of Asian gangster mentality with Doo. But not just Asian, drug cartels rip people off and kill them all the time too if they're not high connected. Garry can fight and I'm interested in the hand techniques, the hei gung and other stuff is of no interest to me. Plus, I've never seen Garry Hearfield make such a claim Arms.

[Golden Arms]

Yeah, it's that "let me pull one over on someone, and make a couple grand at the same time" kind of Asian gangster mentality with Doo. But not just Asian, drug cartels rip people off and kill them all the time too if they're not high connected. Garry can fight and I'm interested in the hand techniques, the hei gung and other stuff is of no interest to me. Plus, I've never seen Garry Hearfield make such a claim Arms.

Having trained some in the past with someone that was well connected in that aspect of the Chinese community, that was not my experience. They are concerned with protocol, respect due, not losing face, and how money flows (and all the good and bad that goes along with that).

The videos I described above come from a dishonest, con-man mentality if I had to label it, and I have no respect for it personally. As for the DVD's and all that, never seen them, never met the guy, and I will stay out of that aspect of the discussion.

[Yao Sing]

Well I still stand by my opinion that covering technical info and descriptions with music is a caveat. He could be describing total nonsense for all we know.

So that's a -1.

If it's intended as an entry level offering I then I guess I missed it but I'm really over the old "someone throws a punch so you block like this then punch back like this" material. Been done to death, doesn't take much skill or knowledge. Most people do that much on their own these days, don't need to fork over hard earned bucks for it.

That's another -1.

I mentioned the power generation, looks cool no info on applying it real world without the telegraphing shown in the video. Maybe it's just a power development exercise, don't know, music cover the explanation.

-1 again.

Holding someone in high esteem that is a suspected fraud with little to no evidence available proving he's worth high esteem therefore linking yourself to all his baggage is a big red flag.

I'd give that one a -2.

If he's as good as the claims he won't be sweating the negatives but if he wants to sell DVDs he better pay attention to the feedback.

Carry on.

Edit: Did you see the Baji apps demo on the main forum? That got me (and others) interested. This DVD not at all.

[Faruq]

Yeah, what are you really gonna learn from a demo DVD of an arts concepts and training methods. Just a demo. You'd have to go train with the guy or have him come to you to really learn. I think the people that purchase it probably do so for comparison or out of interest as fans of martial arts.

[TAO YIN]

Golden Arms,

You are right about that bit for sure. Bat sheet craziness IMO. I have nothing to say about all of that. I am only interested in the practical applications and health development, no matter the art. You are the cat, and you got my tongue on that one.

Yao Sing,

I totally see your point about the music being left out. He isn't talking about the block punch basic stuff you are talking about. He is explaining how the Bak Mei body works from the beginning.

He isn't going fast in the promo, he does show it fast in the DVD though. At first, if a person goes fast, they will totally lose the Bak Mei body. Anyone can go fast, not telegraph, and come up with good combos and that with a little practice. That is totally not the point here though because the power generation and body needs to be there to really make the art come alive.

What you mention as telegraphing, becomes faster and faster and tighter and tighter (all while retaining softness and flexibility) as a student progresses. For the art to be extremely effective, this Bak Mei body has to be in and of itself at a higher level. Top half like a dragon, bottom half like a tiger. Machine gun attacking every which way one can. When attacking, take in the biggest breath you can, and go off a hundred different ways all at once, while slowly letting your breath out and relaxing while paying attention to what you are doing simply through feel rather than thought...and retaining cotton belly and all of the other ingredients, all at the same time.

This is all easy for me to write, and like I said, it is easy to go fast. It is a whole different thing to go fast with Bak Mei body welded to it. It simply has to be developed a certain way.

It's minutely like this...when you do E-bay, as you call it, what are you really doing? What is your spine doing, your hips, knees, teeth, neck, etc... What is your mind, heart, spirit, doing? What is happening geometrically with regards to physical movement?

As far as the rest of it with Doo Wai and that, I personally am just over this idea of guilty by association. These are two different people living in two different countries.

Sifu Garry isn't some mindless robot follower. He simply respects the art of it all, and believes that it is worth preserving. At least he will preserve it right.

I don't know why I get a little frustrated with this guilty by association. I guess it's my American Indian and English ancestry. I am so mad at the one for losing, but so happy with the other for winning...How guilty.


Cheers,

Tao

[Yao Sing]

There's a saying "It's not who you know but who your seen with". Like it or not, who you associate with has a lot more influence on how you're perceived than most people like. That's your public personna. I don't like it either but that's just the way it is, it's just a part of being human I guess.

Oh, and I had a bit of trouble trying to figure out a guy with a Yau Kung Mun background teaching Bak Mei and giving props to the GM of Bak Fu Pai (giving the impression that's his teacher maybe???).

I'm a bit leary of stuf like that, just like the schools that will teach whatever style you want to learn.

[TAO YIN]

Yao Sing,

I was New Yearsing it a bit...

I have made my comments on Doo Wai and his public-ness. Nothing much more to say.

As far as the other, what Sifu Garry is doing is no different than many teachers who teach Xing Yi, Tai Chi, and Bagua together, for example.

He sees the bigger picture as far as "Bak Mei Type Arts," for lack of a much better name...is concerned. The few arts that he teaches all relate to each other in some way, all enhance each other, and are all useful. That is it.

He is trying to make it better for himself, to enhance the all of it, not only for himself but also his students. Whether the arts needed enhancing or not is insignificant. Evolution occurs, whether it needs to or not.

Cheers,

Tao

By the way, I am not really sure what Yang Tai Chi, Mok Gar, and Wah Lum have in common. Would you mind telling me? Thanks.

[Faruq]

Well, it looks like a solid beginning DVD in his art.

[Yao Sing]

Tao Yin

Mok Gar was Master Chan's family style. It's not really incorporated into Wah Lum but there is one set that's taught. As far as the Yang style Tai Chi it's commonly offered in KF schools to appeal to the older folks or the people who don't go for the hard core arts. MC has never (that I know of) claimed any lineage or Masters expertise other than knowing enough to teach it. I've seen him chase away a Tai Chi class because the Kung Fu guys needed the area to practice so you can see his priorities (apoligies to the Tai Chi guys). I know to open a school and teach Wah Lum I had to learn Tai Chi so I could offer that instruction as well. It's required for Wah Lum teachers.

I can see what you mean by "Bak Mei Type Arts," as all the southern short-hand styles seem the same to me. It doesn't seem right to me though that expertise in one would qualify you to teach the others. Hence my question about the styles associated with this DVD. If I'm wrong just tell me. It sounded like praise for his teacher, Doo Wai (who teaches Bak Fu Pai), that would make him a Bak Fy Pai stylist, and I saw a reference (not sure where now) to him learning Yau Kung Mun so of course I wondered how he could be teaching Bak Mei.

I suspect you really don't want to drag on with this and you have made your opinion clear so you really don't need to reply.

Edit: If we're comparing my teacher to yours I don't know exactly where MC leaned the Tai Chi he teaches and like I said Mok Gar was his family style. Wah Lum was handed to him since he was the youngest student of LKS. All his older kf brothers (basically uncles since LKS was brought in to teach the extended family, and village in general (MC's father was the village "mayor"), plus offer protection) passed to him what they learned so he would have all of it.

So then how does a YKM guy teach BM and why dedicate a BM DVD to a BFP master? Sorry if I'm touching a nerve that's best kept secret.

[lungyuil]

Yao Sing,
As has been explained before in this thread
The external sets of Yau Kung Mun are Bak Mei sets excluding our Ying Ching set. Our Great Grand Master Ha Hon Hung was a disciple of CLC before branching out on his own. We have our Internal Art which is the true Yau Kung Mun.

That is what would qualify my Sifu to teach Bak Mei.

Thanks

[TAO YIN]

Yao Sing,

Hi. The reason that I terribly named it "Bak Mei Type Arts," is because Sifu Garry's main focus is and has been on these arts. The founder of Yau Kung Mun, Ha Hon Hung, was Cheung Lai Chen's (Bak Mei Sijo) disciple. Even Ha's first school was called something like Pearl River Bak Mei Gung Fu Association. They had a split.

YKM has the Bak Mei material inside its curriculum. Sifu Garry learned this. He also learned other Bak Mei in Hong Kong and Guangzhou. And he studied Bak Mei from Doo and Bak Fu Pai. All of these things are so closely related, both historically and physically...Sifu Garry is simply looking for every single piece of the puzzle. So on the vid he is giving credit to Wai Sifu because he is teaching his Bak Mei on that particular video.

I don't think that this is much different than some of your Si Hing who have studied every other style of NPM that they could get their hands on. It's no different than Dragon people who study Bak Mei and vice versa, or Hung Gar people who study Southern Praying Mantis or vice versa...

I am not comparing anyone. I know enough about Master Chan's abilities. I even asked him about Doo Wai before believe it or not. One morning there, I did a Bak Fu moving meditation while warming up. Chan Sifu didn't like that and neither did Tu Sifu, and man if I didn't get the picture quickly...Later we did Yang Tai Chi though...to be 18 again. :D

[TAO YIN]

Lungyuil,

What's up bro? Cheers!

Tao

[Frost]

What will it be like? What did you want it to be like?

Been looking for Frost,s DVD for years now...

This whole idea of guilty by association is among the most idiotic things this world has going for it. I am guessing that you are not a fan of Ghandi, right?

When I want to start ripping off people ill start doing dvds in my living room and correspondence courses for people to pay for ok :rolleyes:

Doo is a fraud and possibly deranged, I think the law suit he lost in china and the way the bak mei elders suggested he stop using their styles name or else (in connection to white tiger speaks volumes about him, why anyone would learn from him is anyones guess but I for one have no wish to learn a secret style from one of his students because it sets my b*llsh*t detector off like no bodies business

[TAO YIN]

Frost,

Hello. Aside from what I have already written...ALL of it sets of my BS detector...

Wai called it Bak Fu Pai, at least since he started teaching it in America.

This Bak Mei elders telling him not to call it Bak Mei? When? In the 60s? So he originally called it Bak Mei in the 60s, then changed it to Bak Fu Pai? Or he changed it to Bak Fu Pai for Bruce's book, simply to set himself apart, or???

And the lawsuit bit. Some family in China asking him not to use the Mew/ Miu/ Miao name, Even though he never did but his student did...and taking him to court over it, in China no less...when was this also...

About the Bak Mei elder bit, I don't care, I can put two and two together on that. But on this other lawsuit thing...where? What province at least? Names...City would be helpful. I go to China frequently and travel. Would be happy to stop by this court and ask...

All of it, and I mean all of it, equally ridiculous.

[TAO YIN]

Okay, this is mildly tiring. Let's be objective about this.

There is a lot of controversy, truths, half truths, and whatever else about Doo Wai...he was respected by many, he has some simple and effective arts, and he is very weird...No one here has ever seemed to know jack sheot about him..including me.


Sifu Garry is a respected martial artist in Yau Kung Mun, Guangzhou Pak Mei, and Wun Yuern. He learned some kind of Bak Mei from Doo Wai, and made a DVD about it. I guess he liked it for some reason. Maybe it is good stuff, or maybe it is to him...

Who cares? Don't buy it? Happy? Buy it! Happy?

Is this what this thread needed? Good, there then. Fixed that for you.

Lastly, and most objectively, why learn any martial arts from anyone who wasn't or isn't a true warrior with many many kills? Crickey!

And, Frost,

Do you like Ghandi?

I almost forgot to add, in the end of it all who gives a flying furck? (Waits for someone to say, "obviously you do.")

[Yao Sing]

We were offered to check out the trailer for a training DVD. That would imply comments (the reason for this forum is to talk about these thing). Just because we didn't grovel in amazement at his skill and knowledge is not the problem of the forum or the posters.

Feedback about the video, not about the person, was also offered (filming in living room, music covering descriptions, etc) and like it or not he needs to know why the KF public is not responsive to his offering.

Plus some good info, for me at least, came out of this thread.

[Faruq]

Frost,

Hello. Aside from what I have already written...ALL of it sets of my BS detector...

Wai called it Bak Fu Pai, at least since he started teaching it in America.

This Bak Mei elders telling him not to call it Bak Mei? When? In the 60s? So he originally called it Bak Mei in the 60s, then changed it to Bak Fu Pai? Or he changed it to Bak Fu Pai for Bruce's book, simply to set himself apart, or???

And the lawsuit bit. Some family in China asking him not to use the Mew/ Miu/ Miao name, Even though he never did but his student did...and taking him to court over it, in China no less...when was this also...

About the Bak Mei elder bit, I don't care, I can put two and two together on that. But on this other lawsuit thing...where? What province at least? Names...City would be helpful. I go to China frequently and travel. Would be happy to stop by this court and ask...

All of it, and I mean all of it, equally ridiculous.

Doo claimed that Fung Doh Duk also took complete notes on the systems of each of the other 4 elders, and copied the forms of each of their systems in that huge yellow pages-sized kuen po his dad passed down to him. That's how he explained his knowledge of Bak Mei.

[Faruq]

When I want to start ripping off people ill start doing dvds in my living room and correspondence courses for people to pay for ok :rolleyes:

Doo is a fraud and possibly deranged,....

Yes, excessive qigong/meditation practice produces a high incidence of psychosis. Hence all the strange martial arts people running around, and all the stories of crazy or weird monks, even if they were amazing fighters. Then if you add in how some Asian masters might fancy smoking illegal substances and choking from it in their videos, and partying with certain Hollywood celebrities and rappers....well you can multiply the whole deranged effect exponentially...

[Frost]

Okay, this is mildly tiring. Let's be objective about this.

There is a lot of controversy, truths, half truths, and whatever else about Doo Wai...he was respected by many, he has some simple and effective arts, and he is very weird...No one here has ever seemed to know jack sheot about him..including me.


Sifu Garry is a respected martial artist in Yau Kung Mun, Guangzhou Pak Mei, and Wun Yuern. He learned some kind of Bak Mei from Doo Wai, and made a DVD about it. I guess he liked it for some reason. Maybe it is good stuff, or maybe it is to him...

Who cares? Don't buy it? Happy? Buy it! Happy?

Is this what this thread needed? Good, there then. Fixed that for you.

Lastly, and most objectively, why learn any martial arts from anyone who wasn't or isn't a true warrior with many many kills? Crickey!

And, Frost,

Do you like Ghandi?

I almost forgot to add, in the end of it all who gives a flying furck? (Waits for someone to say, "obviously you do.")

well if you didnt care you wouldnt be posting so much would you :)

It really doesnt matter to me im staying well clear of his products and simply replied to another poster as to why Ross wasnt on the thread and what i thought of the guys teacher: he was sued, he is considered by large parts of the chinese community a fraud and a joke, he is ripping people off and that sure as h*ll doesnt bode well if he is the instructor on the guy making the clips does it

But hey if you are happy with what you are getting have fun, just dont get upset when others dont agree with your opinion of the guy, its a free country afterall

[TAO YIN]

Yao Sing,

I agree, and that is expected. I think any comments made, especially those you pointed out, are good. I don't think anyone, especially myself, expected any grovelling. All comments are good.

Faruq,

Well, we know that didn't happen of course.

[Faruq]

Faruq,

Well, we know that didn't happen of course.

I would still like to have that encyclopeadic kuen po translated anyway though, lol. Who knows who wrote all that stuff it? lol......

[lungyuil]

Tao,
How are you going bro? How is the family?

cheers

[lungyuil]

Yau Sing,
100's of people including kung fu sifus of bak mei & other systems have bought the dvd and have all given sifu great feedback.
This information helped them understand bak mei in a new light!

[Faruq]

Lungyuil, would you ask Sifu Garry when he's gonna send me a copy?

[TAO YIN]

Frost,

I mentioned your first sentence there, "waiting for someone to say you obviously do?".

Other than the fact that you don't have to, why not respond to what I posted?

I am not getting in any way about it. I am just off work and typing here on an Internet forum. I am typing the truth as I see it as a rational person.

Answer these for me, and I will agree, shut up, and never post again.

Why did,so many respect him?

Did he change the name in the 60s or?

Can I please have verifiable evidence of these charges? (On this one, I will post it for the world. Any expenses you need for it, let me know.)

Again, as you didn't read what I wrote. All of it sets of my bs filters...all of it...

I really couldn't care. I just think its funny that no one can ever reply truthfully in either direction. Here, I will make up a new one, probably will be spewed on forums in a couple of years...doo watched it as a child in hong kong. Watched it taught behind closed doors, and remembered it, and then taught it to unsuspecting Lao wai. At least that is more believable...

[Yao Sing]

Sounds like a Tai Chi story I once heard. :D