"gun to the head while kneeling defense" (vid)

[IronFist]

Would you actually attack someone who had a gun?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1C3XNDyVXRg&feature=fvwp&NR=1

[Fa Xing]

Depends on what they want. I have always thought that if I knew they were going to kill me anyways, then I might as well go down fighting.

[goju]

i hit someone with my car who had a gun pointed at me lol

yes i would they may kill me might as well go into defense mode

[hskwarrior]

yes. if you know this guy is going to shoot you you should FIGHT for your and not just let someone take it from you.

[taai gihk yahn]

Would you actually attack someone who had a gun?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1C3XNDyVXRg&feature=fvwp&NR=1

well, if they have u kneeling execution style, u may as well go for it; but get real - u think that from ur knees u will move faster than he can pull the trigger, esp when he's primed and motivated to end u? gimmie a break...

[hskwarrior]

well, if they have u kneeling execution style, u may as well go for it; but get real - u think that from ur knees u will move faster than he can pull the trigger, esp when he's primed and motivated to end u? gimmie a break...

Nope, but you can move fast enough to at least grab an arm and go for the gun. Its been proven many many times when a gun is pulled on you if you charge the guy he most likely wouldn't shoot you cause of the threat of you coming at him. lots of video proof as well.

if you're gonna get shot, at least make him work for it.

[taai gihk yahn]

Nope, but you can move fast enough to at least grab an arm and go for the gun. Its been proven many many times when a gun is pulled on you if you charge the guy he most likely wouldn't shoot you cause of the threat of you coming at him. lots of video proof as well.

if you're gonna get shot, at least make him work for it.

well, sure, I mean, if u can grab the arm, ok; but I think it's a matter of mindset: if someone doesn't really want to shoot u, they may hesitate; but if the guy is just itching to do it, and he;s a seasoned killer, don't think u've got much chance; but sure, make him work for it, why not, lol...

[hskwarrior]

well, sure, I mean, if u can grab the arm, ok; but I think it's a matter of mindset: if someone doesn't really want to shoot u, they may hesitate; but if the guy is just itching to do it, and he;s a seasoned killer, don't think u've got much chance; but sure, make him work for it, why not, lol...

i agree with you there. some will pull the trigger without hesitation. but if you break that mindset he has early on you foil his plans. he doesn't have a plan B and if you get his gun from him he knows you may kill him.

have you ever had someone pull a gun on your TGY?

here's a video of a young guy trying to go for the gun. where he went wrong was running away instead of wrestling the guy down. in the end he pays with his life for it....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyM9bBIQYtg (@1:35)

[Lee Chiang Po]

well, sure, I mean, if u can grab the arm, ok; but I think it's a matter of mindset: if someone doesn't really want to shoot u, they may hesitate; but if the guy is just itching to do it, and he;s a seasoned killer, don't think u've got much chance; but sure, make him work for it, why not, lol...

You come on like a victim. You would be exactly what an armed thug would look for. Just go into begging mode or **** yourself? Make some sort of **** sound so he will think you have crapped yourself maybe? That might get a laugh and while he is amused you can run or hope he doesn't kill you.
There are some things you might be able to do. If he is being paid to shoot you maybe not, but if it is a robbery, you can always start begging and tell him he can have all the money and the dope. Short reprieve maybe. Giving you time to think of something. If you can catch the gun pointed away for a second you could grab it and crowd him, biting him in the face or something. Two hands can take a gun from a single hand real easy, and once you have it, shoot him in the face. And if he kills you, he was going to kill you anyway. And if he don't kill you, it is only because you gave it your best shot.

[taai gihk yahn]

i agree with you there. some will pull the trigger without hesitation. but if you break that mindset he has early on you foil his plans. he doesn't have a plan B and if you get his gun from him he knows you may kill him.
fair enough - the issue is, how can one know that? probably would require having had the experience repeatedly and seeing how the shooter reacts - probably not something most people have experience with...


have you ever had someone pull a gun on your TGY?
nope, which is why, in general, I tend to be highly skeptecal of most people who talk about successfully defending against a gun without ever having to do it (same w knives - everyone and their grandma teaches knife defenses like it's no big deal; personally, I think it's unethical to teach defense against something u've never been exposed to for real); I mean, I gotta imagine that the margine of error is small - and why my sense is that it's more the shooter's midset than anything else that matters...


here's a video of a young guy trying to go for the gun. where he went wrong was running away instead of wrestling the guy down. in the end he pays with his life for it....
wow; well, yep, logic would dictate getting in really close or being super far away - anywhere in the middle is kill zone...

[taai gihk yahn]

You come on like a victim. You would be exactly what an armed thug would look for. Just go into begging mode or **** yourself? Make some sort of **** sound so he will think you have crapped yourself maybe? That might get a laugh and while he is amused you can run or hope he doesn't kill you.
There are some things you might be able to do. If he is being paid to shoot you maybe not, but if it is a robbery, you can always start begging and tell him he can have all the money and the dope. Short reprieve maybe. Giving you time to think of something. If you can catch the gun pointed away for a second you could grab it and crowd him, biting him in the face or something. Two hands can take a gun from a single hand real easy, and once you have it, shoot him in the face. And if he kills you, he was going to kill you anyway. And if he don't kill you, it is only because you gave it your best shot.
did u stop taking ur meds this week?

[hskwarrior]

fair enough - the issue is, how can one know that? probably would require having had the experience repeatedly and seeing how the shooter reacts - probably not something most people have experience with...

fair enough. I've had a gun pulled on me more than once. those times were someone trying to protect themselves. they didn't want to shoot but they would have. in most cases, you have to just go for it. your life is on the line. plus you can move faster than the mind can react sometimes. so you just may have half a chance at success.


nope, which is why, in general, I tend to be highly skeptecal of most people who talk about successfully defending against a gun without ever having to do it (same w knives - everyone and their grandma teaches knife defenses like it's no big deal; personally, I think it's unethical to teach defense against something u've never been exposed to for real); I mean, I gotta imagine that the margine of error is small - and why my sense is that it's more the shooter's midset than anything else that matters...

there are video's out there of real life stuff caught on tape. people rushing the gun holder and end up getting it from them or making them flee.

on the knife part i agree. lots of people do that without any knowledge. neither do they practice it in a realistic manner as well.

and yeah, the middle zone you're fukked. unless you know how to keep moving. i remember watching this lawyer on film being shot at point blank range. he kept moving side to side near a tree and the gunman kept missing. he was eventually tackled from behind and subdued.

tough subject indeed. i think its how much do you value your life? enough to fight for it? (not you, just in general).

[IronFist]

Nope, but you can move fast enough to at least grab an arm and go for the gun. Its been proven many many times when a gun is pulled on you if you charge the guy he most likely wouldn't shoot you cause of the threat of you coming at him. lots of video proof as well.

if you're gonna get shot, at least make him work for it.

Link to vids?

[hskwarrior]

Link to vids?

I'm sorry bro, i don't feel like digging for them. if you ever watch those cops shows, or the ones that show the crimes, you see many many people fighting back against people who have guns pointed at them. if i come across them i'll post them. you have to remember, these people are not trained. they just want to live, ya feel me?

Here's one where the guy was shooting point blank range at a lawyer who hid behind a tree.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9zy37-_0LU

ok here is a video of a gun pointing a gun directly at the face of a victim...watch what happens:

http://bcove.me/ztd4lfql

here's a news story...no video

http://www.mv-voice.com/news/show_story.php?id=4577

http://www.tcpalm.com/news/2011/aug/12/stuart-gunman-pistol-whipping-boynton-beach-robber/


Metarie, Louisiana

From New Orleans’ WWLtv.com of June 18, 2007

Teen turns tables, shoots robber after taking away gun

A 44-year-old man who was trying to rob a teenager and his mother in a fast food drive thru was shot several times after the teen grabbed the gun from him and fired back, according to Jefferson Parish Sheriff Harry Lee.

The incident occurred around 1:30 a.m. at the Arby’s drive-thru located at 3845 Veterans Blvd. in Metairie.

According to Lee, the victims were in their car waiting to place an order when 44-year-old Carl Chestnut of Kenner walked up to the vehicle and pointed a gun at them.

Lee said Chestnut tried to get into the car and was attempting to pull out the 53-year-old mother when the teen fought with him over the weapon, grabbed it away and then fired several times, striking Chestnut.

Chestnut was hit in the head and torso, but the injuries aren’t believed to be fatal.


Police: Carjacker wounded by teen an accused murderer

A suspected carjacker who was shot while allegedly trying to rob a mother and son at a fast food restaurant is an accused murderer, Kenner Police said Tuesday.

Police said 44-year-old Carl Chestnut is one of two men suspected in the murder of 60-year-old Odrey Bordelon. Bordelon, the manager of a Kenner trailer park, was found strangled June 5.

Chestnut remains in the hospital following the shooting early Monday at a Metairie Arby’s. According to authorities, the victims were in their car waiting to place an order when Chestnut walked up to the vehicle and pointed a gun at them. The women’s teenage son was able to pry the gun away and shot Chestnut several times.

Chestnut’s injuries were not life-threatening, police said. He’s expected to be booked with murder once he’s released.
Chestnut’s alleged accomplice in Bordelon’s murder, Wayne Hayden, remains on the loose.

[B]LOOK LIKE HE ENDS UP DYING ANYWAY[:

Would-be carjacker dies months after failed attack

A would-be carjacker who was shot at a Metairie fast food restaurant in June died Thursday from medical problems related to the injury, the Jefferson Parish Sheriff’s Office said.

According to Col. John Fortunato, a sheriff’s office spokesman, 44-year-old Carl Chestnut was shot several times while attempting to rob a mother and her 17-year-old son at an Arby’s drive-through.

Fortunato said the victims were in their car waiting to place an order when Chestnut walked up to the vehicle and pointed a gun at them. The women’s teenage son was able to pry the gun away and shot Chestnut several times, wounding him in his head and torso.

Chestnut was taken to East Jefferson Hospital immediately following the shooting, but was eventually transferred to Earl K. Long Hospital in Baton Rouge on September 7 for additional medical help. Chestnut died September 13 at the hospital. /B]


Police: Clerk Wrestles, Fatally Shoots Armed Robber

A convenience store clerk wrestled a shotgun away from a would-be robber and then shot and killed him, police said.

Balch Springs police said the attempted robbery took place at about 9:30 p.m. Wednesday at the Big 5 grocery store on the 1400 block of Peachtree Road near Bruton Road.

Police said an armed man walked into the store but was soon wrestling with the clerk. During the struggle, the clerk shot and killed the armed robber, police said.

The identity of the suspected robber has not been revealed.

Police said the investigation into the shooting will continue but that they do not expect to file any charges against the clerk.

[donjitsu2]

Would you actually attack someone who had a gun?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1C3XNDyVXRg&feature=fvwp&NR=1


I would if he was going to kill me anyway.

He can have my wallet/cell phone/car...it's when he wants to take away my son's daddy that we have a problem.

[donjitsu2]

Link to vids?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r90w-AXESIk&feature=related

[IronFist]

I'm sorry bro, i don't feel like digging for them. if you ever watch those cops shows, or the ones that show the crimes, you see many many people fighting back against people who have guns pointed at them. if i come across them i'll post them. you have to remember, these people are not trained. they just want to live, ya feel me?

Here's one where the guy was shooting point blank range at a lawyer who hid behind a tree.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9zy37-_0LU

ok here is a video of a gun pointing a gun directly at the face of a victim...watch what happens:

http://bcove.me/ztd4lfql

here's a news story...no video

http://www.mv-voice.com/news/show_story.php?id=4577

http://www.tcpalm.com/news/2011/aug/12/stuart-gunman-pistol-whipping-boynton-beach-robber/

The only vids I've seen have been the gun vs. knife ones where they're talking about distance, drawing your gun and the 21 foot rule or whatever.

[hskwarrior]

This video shows the gun in the guys face.

http://bcove.me/ztd4lfql

[Hardwork108]

well, if they have u kneeling execution style, u may as well go for it; but get real - u think that from ur knees u will move faster than he can pull the trigger, esp when he's primed and motivated to end u? gimmie a break...

I believe that if you have practiced the disarming technique for long enough, and manage to keep a cool mind, you will have a better chance. I would suggest that in such a situation when you think that getting killed is inevitable then you should go for the disarm but NOT BEFORE distracting the person momentarily by perhaps glancing to his side as if there was someone else approaching,etc. The momentary lapse on his part will more than double your chances of pulling of your well trained technique.

Just my thoughts...

[Lee Chiang Po]

The reason I was talking about begging and making comments like money and dope is because most robbers are only interested in money and dope, and when you go to begging it gives him a real strong sense of confidence that you are terrified and pose no return threat to him. He is more likely to make a mistake or to make that one move that exposes him to attack. You have your life at stake, and way too often lives are lost for absolutely nothing. Cooperating with an armed robber does not assure you will not be killed. You have to do something. You can not just stand there or kneel there and let it happen.
Depending really on where you live. If your state has no death penalty, the perp will get no more for killing you than he will for robbing you. In the state of Louisiana you will likely get life, which means life. You die there. So when they did away with the death penalty in the 60's, you could only serve a life sentence, so killing you was free, and it might just keep you from getting caught too. If you were robbed you were usually shot dead too.
The store robbery in the Dallas area, I worked in that same store a long time ago. It was under a different name at the time. A young kid came into the store one night and I was sitting where I could not be seen until you stood by the checkout, and he was carrying an M1 carbine. I immediately stepped out and took control of the situation. I took the gun and called the cops and everything, but they let him go. He came later when I was not there and killed the clerk. The clerks name was Cecil. Had a new wife and 2 children under 5 years old. The boy wanted money for heroin, and did not want to get caught.
The death penalty does not deter murder in many cases, but it almost assures it in most cases if it doesn't exist.

[bawang]

the death penalty in america does not deter murders because executions are not public.

[sanjuro_ronin]

IN the DBMA video series of "die less often", they have a DVD on the interface between Gun and knife and they show actual clips of "fights" between armed people ( one with a gun - a cop typically and one with a knife).
The guy with the knife is NOT at a disadvantage, certainly not as much as one would think.
Many times it is because of the gun being holstered of course but other times it is because of the guy with the blade knowing how to fight with a knife and the gun person NOT knowing how to fight with a gun.
Gabe Suarez is in those DBMA videos and he trains people with guns on how to fight with them.

[Lucas]

the death penalty in america does not deter murders because executions are not public.

the death is also too nice. it just puts them to sleep...not enough pain and fear. also we keep people on death row so long that by the time execution comes, they are happy to die.

justice should be swift, severe and ruthless.

[David Jamieson]

As a Canadian, i can honestly say that I don't have a real need to deal with this.

I think anything like this needs a very simple tech with a lot of emphasis on speed, distance and probability.

I think if I lived in the Middle East, I would probably train this sort of thing regularly.

[JamesC]

the death is also too nice. it just puts them to sleep...not enough pain and fear. also we keep people on death row so long that by the time execution comes, they are happy to die.

justice should be swift, severe and ruthless.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_1luLRXKoJM8/Sc4rTB5XnMI/AAAAAAAAPiU/6L3n5DN0KaM/s400/Sylvester-Stallone_Judge_l.jpg

[sanjuro_ronin]

justice should be swift, severe and ruthless.

Like getting a blowjob from a hooker with buck teeth and an overbite.

[David Jamieson]

Like getting a blowjob from a hooker with buck teeth and an overbite.

Good old "shescrape" from the low track. I remember her.

[Lucas]

Like getting a blowjob from a hooker with buck teeth and an overbite.


OMFG!!!!!! :eek:

[Lucas]

judge dred is cool

[sanjuro_ronin]

Good old "shescrape" from the low track. I remember her.

You can really push a 2 dollar crack wh0re !
:D

[rett]

Would you actually attack someone who had a gun?

I've never had a gun pointed at me but I'm told it feels like you turn to willess jelly. Maybe training can help against that.

As others said, if it's a question of being kidnapped and tortured, or just murdered, like in many conflicts, then you might as well try. If you're going to try, that vid looks like a very good approach.