Which clip looks like the Kung Fu you would want to have?

[MasterKiller]

1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owFfXYcBVYQ

2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CC7TKALpWyc

[EarthDragon]

the 2nd one..... it looked flashier and more like a real representation of the past centuries of masters teaching from China would want us to showcase thier art just like that in 2011. :D

[Dragonzbane76]

I couldn't even finish the second one. Nice kick on the first one. I'd have to say neither look like what I train because there was no grappling. But the first one was in a cage so I'm guessing they had grappling just was over before any happened.

[David Jamieson]

Neither!

the first one is just fighting, the second one is a train wreck of convoluted ideas regarding what kung fu is...

But THIS (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rr88_FHhSa4), well that's the kind of kung fu I'd like to have because it would appear that it can still eb done when quite old and long in the tooth.

I'm 47 and could give a sh1t about competition. I'm more interested in continued health, firmness and quality of life. If I gotta fight, well, I think I'd be just as well off with old man kung fu as with anything else. :)

If you are simply asking which is a more worthwhile pursuit, then I would pan the tru2form just because it is a ridiculous expression of teh art form. It is completely ass backwards and not representative in any way of something valid as far as I'm concerned. A young person would get more out of the 1st pursuit. The second clip is a huge waste fo time for a martial artist, unless of course that person is happy with that sort of nonsense.

I mean, there's ballet for fat chicks too, but no one goes to watch it.

[mickey]

Greetings,

David Jamieson, this is really weird.

I was thinking on my way to work about the best representation of Pole star/Seven star boxing and the answer I received was not Tai Chi Chuan at all. It was Hung Men. And then I see your link......

I did remark on another thread about one of the fighting postures of Lam Sai Wing some time ago as being the representation of the Little and Big dippers. No one connected with what I was talking about.

mickey

[lkfmdc]

I'm 47 and could give a sh1t about competition.



complete straw man

ok, maybe YOU aren't personally interested in competition

but if you are interested in what WORKS you want to do technique that has worked in competition

Maybe 10% of a school competes, but the fact they do validates what the other 90% is doing

If it has NEVER worked in competition, you have to wonder why you would be doing it?

And by "competition" I am casting an open net to include anything real, including fights/challenges/self defense situations

[Ray Pina]

First video was impressive from an ability standpoint... but I would trade that in an instant for a sound system that controls the other completely before attempting any strike.

Didn't even watch the second video once I saw it was a True 2 Form .... STEP

[David Jamieson]

complete straw man

ok, maybe YOU aren't personally interested in competition

but if you are interested in what WORKS you want to do technique that has worked in competition

Maybe 10% of a school competes, but the fact they do validates what the other 90% is doing

If it has NEVER worked in competition, you have to wonder why you would be doing it?

And by "competition" I am casting an open net to include anything real, including fights/challenges/self defense situations

Yes Dave, I personally am not into it. It's not a straw man. I really am not interested in competition. But if put in the position where I had to cave someones head in with a baseball bat, I could do it. I could also not do that and make a new friend as well, or perhaps I could just ignore whoever is being petulant...lol

What works is only found through competition? well, i guess, but fighting has been around for a lot longer. We all know that a punch in the face will probably hurt without ever having to feel that. lol

Anyway, competition isn't the only measure of truth in Kung Fu.
Kung Fu is beyond and over that. Competitive fighting is one aspect of Kung Fu. It's a good aspect, especially for younger guys getting direct experience.

After time, that desire goes away and there is still a need to continue, but without all the drama and spectacle of competition.

So, yeah of course it's my answer about me. Why you would frame that as a staw man is beyond me. lol

I'm guessing cause it is counter to your whole bread and butter line of thinking about martial arts. That's cool. That's your thing and you can have a whole opinion of your own on it! :p

[lkfmdc]

What works is only found through competition? well, i guess, but fighting has been around for a lot longer. We all know that a punch in the face will probably hurt without ever having to feel that. lol



Sad, back to the old Jamieson

My original post




And by "competition" I am casting an open net to include anything real, including fights/challenges/self defense situations

Yes, you work punches because you know they work. You know they work because we can documents MILLIONS of times they have worked

Is there a single place we can document something like "suk sau" for example being used in anything other than a compliant demo?




Anyway, competition isn't the only measure of truth in Kung Fu.
Kung Fu is beyond and over that. Competitive fighting is one aspect of Kung Fu. It's a good aspect, especially for younger guys getting direct experience.

After time, that desire goes away



Again, you should neither ignore or mis phrase what I actually said! YOU don't have to compete, AT ALL.

But if you want to train in something that works, HOW YOU KNOW IT WORKS IS BASED UPON IT HAVING ACTUALLY WORKED IN THE PAST





I'm guessing cause it is counter to your whole bread and butter line of thinking about martial arts. That's cool. That's your thing and you can have a whole opinion of your own on it! :p

Again, avoiding completely what I was saying and offering a "throw away line" about how it's my "bread and butter line of thinking"

Really :rolleyes:

so, AGAIN, you don't have to compete, but if you want to claim what you do is effective, the only thing you can EVER offer is documentation that it works, and that documentation comes from people actually doing it ALIVE

[taai gihk yahn]

1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owFfXYcBVYQ
nice; what is interesting now, is that becuase now u hav a good baseline skill level for the foundational hi percentage stuff, u can actually c low percentage techs start to "work" in this format; at the same time, if u look at how the skilled TKD guys throw those "sitch kicks", they do it with a more efficient biomechanical structure (e.g. - keeping their balance when they land)


2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CC7TKALpWyc
that CLF chick is hawt in a funky hairy arm pit sorta way, and I would like to bed her :eek::eek::eek:

[lkfmdc]

that CLF chick is hawt in a funky hairy arm pit sorta way, and I would like to bed her :eek::eek::eek:

I always knew there was something deeply, DEEPLY wrong with you :eek:

[David Jamieson]

Sad, back to the old Jamieson

My original post



Yes, you work punches because you know they work. You know they work because we can documents MILLIONS of times they have worked

Is there a single place we can document something like "suk sau" for example being used in anything other than a compliant demo?



Again, you should neither ignore or mis phrase what I actually said! YOU don't have to compete, AT ALL.

But if you want to train in something that works, HOW YOU KNOW IT WORKS IS BASED UPON IT HAVING ACTUALLY WORKED IN THE PAST




Again, avoiding completely what I was saying and offering a "throw away line" about how it's my "bread and butter line of thinking"

Really :rolleyes:

so, AGAIN, you don't have to compete, but if you want to claim what you do is effective, the only thing you can EVER offer is documentation that it works, and that documentation comes from people actually doing it ALIVE


Dave, you are reiterating what I said. You said "cast a wide net" I said
"competition? I guess."

Man, focus on the peas and carrots dude. :p
the meat and potatoes of this argument were gone long ago....

[taai gihk yahn]

I always knew there was something deeply, DEEPLY wrong with you :eek:

of course, it would explain our continued association over the years though... ;)

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

Neither!

the first one is just fighting, the second one is a train wreck of convoluted ideas regarding what kung fu is...

But THIS (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rr88_FHhSa4), well that's the kind of kung fu I'd like to have because it would appear that it can still eb done when quite old and long in the tooth.

I'm 47 and could give a sh1t about competition. I'm more interested in continued health, firmness and quality of life. If I gotta fight, well, I think I'd be just as well off with old man kung fu as with anything else. :)

If you are simply asking which is a more worthwhile pursuit, then I would pan the tru2form just because it is a ridiculous expression of teh art form. It is completely ass backwards and not representative in any way of something valid as far as I'm concerned. A young person would get more out of the 1st pursuit. The second clip is a huge waste fo time for a martial artist, unless of course that person is happy with that sort of nonsense.

I mean, there's ballet for fat chicks too, but no one goes to watch it.

You posted a very interesting clip. That old master is a structural nightmare, with the worst mechanics I think I have seen in a long time. Yet, some how, buy some freak of nature, he has the agility and fluidity of a 16 year old female cheer leader. It's making my brain short circuit.

[sanjuro_ronin]

I don't even know WTF that second clip is and I don't want to.
There was certainly more "hard work" in the first clip.
It takes lots of skill to land a low percentage move on a trained fighter.
And some luck yes, but still good skill and THAT is GOOD Kung Fu !

[bawang]

tru 2 form is not actualy tru 2 form

it all lies

LEIS

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

I don't even know WTF that second clip is and I don't want to.
There was certainly more "hard work" in the first clip.
It takes lots of skill to land a low percentage move on a trained fighter.
And some luck yes, but still good skill and THAT is GOOD Kung Fu !

It's all in the set up!





















**RD runs away and hides before someone calls him on the fact that he can't to that***

[Dragonzbane76]

And some luck yes, but still good skill and THAT is GOOD Kung Fu !

not arguing with you about it but I believe the guy was a capoeira player. Maybe i just stated the obvious? :p

Anyone ever see that vid of anderson silva doing capoeira in a cage fight? I remember watching it some time ago.