Cultivating Chi

[Yoshiyahu]

How do you cultivate chi?

Some have said Practicing Wing Chun SLT cultivates chi if done very slowly..

other lineages have chi gung or breath work...aka energy work?


Also how does the chi you cultivate develop your Jing?

[Hendrik]

How do you cultivate chi?

Some have said Practicing Wing Chun SLT cultivates chi if done very slowly..

other lineages have chi gung or breath work...aka energy work?


Also how does the chi you cultivate develop your Jing?



take a look at my playing with 5 layers clip.

everything you ask here is in it.

[Yoshiyahu]

take a look at my playing with 5 layers clip.

everything you ask here is in it.

thanks i will check it out!

[mjw]

slt, chi hung and a few tai chi exercises for me

[Robinhood]

Yang Jwing Ming has a lot of books out on Chi, I suggest starting there, or Mantak Chia books.

[Hendrik]

So, what is qi? How to cultivate qi? What is it do for Jin or force vector?

[Yoshiyahu]

So, what is qi? How to cultivate qi? What is it do for Jin or force vector?

Qi or Chi is your lifeforce your born with. It is your breathe you take each day...you accumulate chi from breathing, from exerting effort and sweating, from eating and drinking. When you jogg or fight you accumulate chi because your body requires more oxygen it takes in more to nourish the body meaning you accumulate more breathe or life energy. Your Meridian Channels have microcosmic water ways that warm when your body temperture rises...Like water they evaporate and become a mist. Mist is air or breathe thus causing more Chi.


Jin, Shen and Yi is the vehicle for which your Chi travels...Your Shen dictates if the chi is good or bad...if your shen is negative your chi will be corrupted...if your shen is happy your chi will be good. The Yi is your intention you can not move chi with out it. Just as you can not move your hand with out your Yi. So it is with chi. When you direct your Yi to move your chi it goes. When you want to use chi to hit someone it must be accompanied with Jing. With out Jing it is simply Yin and Soft power by it self has no power...Hard power by itself is too stiff and can not release. Your Chi is the relaxation with in the hard...Hard and Soft combined is powerful. An when it release the intended result is realize.

Jing Chi and Shen are the three treasures


As for Force Vectors...according to my understanding...Force is the Jing or power you expel out to your opponent...Vectors are the direction to that force...You can draw them in with a jut sau, you sink or draw them down with jum sau, you can force them away with butterfly palms, you can strike them on their left and right gate with shifting horse and punch or lop sau while shifting your central line causing their center turn. These are merely one example...my opinion of how i use it...But there are more an various different ways one may achieve them with punches or kicks or chin na...its up to you....But i think of it forwards, backwards, to the side, up and down! When you sink you breath in, When you uproot you breath out, when you pull in while stepping back you breath in. When you push out while moving forward you breath out. Side Steps also can be used to flank your opponent an capture the other two vectors...Standing Still if you will marks the place of origin or the vertex if you will...So standing still in my opinion marks the seventh vector!

[Hendrik]

Thanks and appreciate for sharing!

[YouKnowWho]

How do you cultivate chi?

When you train XingYi for

- cultivate Chi, you don't use force when you punch. This way you can breath slowly. When you pull your punch back, you need to use your force and inhale deeply. It's light out and heavy in. Also light exhale and deep inhale, and long exhale and short inhale.

- combat, you need to exhale and you don't have luxury to inhale. The moment that you inhale, the moment that you may expose your weekness to your opponent.

[stonecrusher69]

How do you cultivate chi?

Some have said Practicing Wing Chun SLT cultivates chi if done very slowly..

other lineages have chi gung or breath work...aka energy work?


Also how does the chi you cultivate develop your Jing?

Drink Red Bull " it gives you wings" That sound like chi to me..

[Yoshiyahu]

Drink Red Bull " it gives you wings" That sound like chi to me..

So it is...You gain or increase your chi by what you drink and eat!!!


When you train XingYi for

- cultivate Chi, you don't use force when you punch. This way you can breath slowly. When you pull your punch back, you need to use your force and inhale deeply. It's light out and heavy in. Also light exhale and deep inhale, and long exhale and short inhale.

- combat, you need to exhale and you don't have luxury to inhale. The moment that you inhale, the moment that you may expose your weekness to your opponent.

Very interesting and like the analogy....So this practice how do you feel it moves your chi...in what way...Also the pulling back force hard...do you see this as training your jerking power or jing more?

[YouKnowWho]

Very interesting and like the analogy....So this practice how do you feel it moves your chi...in what way...Also the pulling back force hard...do you see this as training your jerking power or jing more?

Chi to me is breathing. The cultivating Chi is only to make your body strong. It's indirect to combat but not direct. The XingYi system does't have Chi Gong. The solo form training is the Chi Gong. You build your body from outside in.

[Yoshiyahu]

Chi to me is breathing. The cultivating Chi is only to make your body strong. It's indirect to combat but not direct. The XingYi system does't have Chi Gong. The solo form training is the Chi Gong. You build your body from outside in.

Very Interesting??


So elaborate on building from the outside in?

Also is there a disadvantage to someone who does both...Build from the outside and in and inside out?

[YouKnowWho]

Very Interesting??

So elaborate on building from the outside in?

Also is there a disadvantage to someone who does both...Build from the outside and in and inside out?

I don't believe you can build from inside out.

If your external body is not coordinated, your internal has nothing to coordinate with. If your hands can't coordinate with your feet, you can't coordinate your Chi with your hands but not with your feet.

It will take some time for a new student to be able to coordinate his hands with his feet. If you divide 1 move into many sub-moves.

1. Coordinate back foot with front hand.
2. Coordinate front foot with back hand.
3. Coordinate front foot with front front.

It may take you 3 month to achieve this. You then pay attention on your knee and elbow coordination. This may take another 3 months. You finally pay attention on hip and shoulder coordination. After at least 9 months, you can then pay attention on your "inside".

尚云祥解释，练拳练到一定程度，骨骼筋肉都已爽利坚实，此时功夫要向身内走，就是要沁进五脏六 腑。但这一步 很难，就要用发声来接引一下，声音由内向外，劲力由外向内，里应外合一下，功夫方能成就。

XingYi master Shang Yunxiang said, "When you have reached to certain level, your muscle and born are all strong, your Kung Fu should move from outside in and enter your internal organ. This step is very hard, you will need to use your sound to help it. The sound come from inside out, the power come from outside in. When both meet, your Kung Fu development is then completed".

[Yoshiyahu]

Thanks for sharing very interesting indeed!



I don't believe you can build from inside out.

If your external body is not coordinated, your internal has nothing to coordinate with. If your hands can't coordinate with your feet, you can't coordinate your Chi with your hands but not with your feet.

It will take some time for a new student to be able to coordinate his hands with his feet. If you divide 1 move into many sub-moves.

1. Coordinate back foot with front hand.
2. Coordinate front foot with back hand.
3. Coordinate front foot with front front.

It may take you 3 month to achieve this. You then pay attention on your knee and elbow coordination. This may take another 3 months. You finally pay attention on hip and shoulder coordination. After at least 9 months, you can then pay attention on your "inside".

尚云祥解释，练拳练到一定程度，骨骼筋肉都已爽利坚实，此时功夫要向身内走，就是要沁进五脏六 腑。但这一步 很难，就要用发声来接引一下，声音由内向外，劲力由外向内，里应外合一下，功夫方能成就。

XingYi master Shang Yunxiang said, "When you have reached to certain level, your muscle and born are all strong, your Kung Fu should move from outside in and enter your internal organ. This step is very hard, you will need to use your sound to help it. The sound come from inside out, the power come from outside in. When both meet, your Kung Fu development is then completed".

[Lee Chiang Po]

You can only develop Chi by living well, eating well, drinking well, exercising daily, not smoking, and getting plenty of sleep. A strong healthy body makes for strong Chi. I think what you are wanting to know is how to develop your ability to use it in the application of your Wing Chun. You can make use of it in just about anything you do.
For fighting applications, you need to develop your abdominals because they are the power generators, the triceps because they are the thrust engine, the lats and your wrists in order to take the full force of your own chi.

[wingchunner]

Yes, healthy eating habits and living habits will improve your chi. I don't think there is much in Wing Chun that will cultivate chi. For me, after a good workout with Wing Chun, I don't feel energized. I feel drained. Staying down in the stance, working on proper position and structure is quite draining. However, I believe the training does help me conserve chi later on. I study other internal martial arts. Quite often after training in those I have cultivated chi. I am much more energized. I "awaken the dragon". The only time in Wing Chun that might happen is when I am sparring and working with people on chi sao and I let it come out; possibly working with the dummy a bit. But, even then I would not say that I am cultivating chi. Rather, I try to conserve it as it it begins to bubble up. I do focus my chi during training, it heightens my awareness of my position and the energy I am using. But, again, I would not say I am cultivating it... I am opening channels for it to flow much more cleanly.

If you can gain something from the above paragraph, then... great. If not,... sorry.

This I know, in order for me to cultivate chi, my mind needs to be relaxed and focused. Not that it isn't in Wing Chun, but it is focused on utilizing chi. Oft times the rotations of the tantien help facilitate in the cultivation of chi. For me, I limit waist rotations in Wing Chun.

Marty

[Hendrik]

You guys want honest words?

[Phil Redmond]

How do you cultivate chi?

Some have said Practicing Wing Chun SLT cultivates chi if done very slowly..

other lineages have chi gung or breath work...aka energy work?


Also how does the chi you cultivate develop your Jing?
Which Chi/Qi? There are 8 types of Chi in TCM.

[Phil Redmond]

The 8 types of Chi. http://www.wingchunkwoon.com/accu.asp

btw, there is a mistake in the Horary clock that needs to be corrected. I'm having another website done and it will be corrected..
scroll down to see the 8 chi

[imperialtaichi]

Everyone talks about Qi. Everyday it becomes more complicated and elaborate.

Ask yourself an honest question: is the way you "cultivate Qi" making you a better fighter? When it comes to the crunch, how well are you going fight against a physically stronger person? How is your "Qi training" going to help? Are you living in fantasy or reality?

I am not knocking Qi training. I have seen some really amazing sh!t that is hard to explain purely on Newtonian physiology alone. I just want to remind people not to lose there heads caught up in fantasy and focus on practicality and reality.

Don't just talk about how to kick a ball. Don't just learn about how to kick a ball by reading and theorizing. Learn to kick a ball by kicking a ball.

Cheers,
John

[Yoshiyahu]

I agree...so what methods do you use to learn to kick the ball by actually kicking the ball?



Everyone talks about Qi. Everyday it becomes more complicated and elaborate.

Ask yourself an honest question: is the way you "cultivate Qi" making you a better fighter? When it comes to the crunch, how well are you going fight against a physically stronger person? How is your "Qi training" going to help? Are you living in fantasy or reality?

I am not knocking Qi training. I have seen some really amazing sh!t that is hard to explain purely on Newtonian physiology alone. I just want to remind people not to lose there heads caught up in fantasy and focus on practicality and reality.

Don't just talk about how to kick a ball. Don't just learn about how to kick a ball by reading and theorizing. Learn to kick a ball by kicking a ball.

Cheers,
John

[Yoshiyahu]

The 8 types of Chi. http://www.wingchunkwoon.com/accu.asp

btw, there is a mistake in the Horary clock that needs to be corrected. I'm having another website done and it will be corrected..
scroll down to see the 8 chi

I dont think i have heard of eight different types of CHI?

Are u referring to meridians channels?

I know there is Chi your born with...and chi you acquire from eating, drinking, exercising and other things?

Please share the eight different types of chi....I believed under the acquired chi we have alot more than eight...possibly a different chi for every organ in the body, chi from the air, from trees, from water, from fire, from the earth, from contact with others, from the heavens itself. But then again this is all acquired chi so were really back to just two...an acquired and congential chi is really not different at all...in my opinion...




You guys want honest words?

[imperialtaichi]

I agree...so what methods do you use to learn to kick the ball by actually kicking the ball?

Keep it simple. Keep it natural.

Understand that true Yi does not come from intellectualising the concept. Learn to switch the brain off and turn on your heart/instinct on. Then you will lead your Qi. All these Yin Yang question becomes self answering because you will also understand the Yin and Yang nature of Qi.

We will use a simple punch as a training example: learn to punch with less force, more Yi and more power penetration.

In the beginning try the punch in a controlled enviroment; punch your training partner, let him feel and describe to you the effect of your punch. Experiment with your Yi until you get the desired result. Of course, you will also have to let the opponent punch you too, so you can help him develop. A good punch is one that seems only like a tap, but the receiver should feel like being hit by an iron ball (or as one of the guys I tapped yesterday at a Kung Fu gathering describes, "feels like being hit by a log").

Once you get decent result, of course test in out with someone you don't normally train with during sparring.

And of course, in a real fight, don't be obscessed with techniques, focus on destroying the guy and let your habits win your fight.

-----

You must continue to test your progress on partners and opponents; you don't want to waste years of training (like many internal people do) chasing things that does not work.

Another example: I didn't learn to take hits by imagining or reading; I learn to take hits by getting hit.

[Yoshiyahu]

Yes we do natural breath too. But also we practice a short breath that comes out through the nose...Upon impact you release. This is practiced during training, chi sau, sparring, form practice, sup yee san sik and other training methods. The more you practice it the more it becomes second nature. I utilize both natural breath and the wing chun breath. When fatigued breath natural. When energized use the breath. This one thing Sifu said. But it just dependant on you...your not gonna be striking and using that breath 100% of the time. Same way as your not going to be stepping or using your waist to with a punch 100% of the time. But I agree the majority of the time you breath natural...



I was taught to breathe naturally...
Push - breath out, pull breath - in, etc... This is new idea to me...
Is this natural process or do you developed it consciously? Is it from ving tsun or tai chi...?


Jox, :)

Hmmm very good I like your details and explanation...very good indeed


Keep it simple. Keep it natural.

Understand that true Yi does not come from intellectualising the concept. Learn to switch the brain off and turn on your heart/instinct on. Then you will lead your Qi. All these Yin Yang question becomes self answering because you will also understand the Yin and Yang nature of Qi.

We will use a simple punch as a training example: learn to punch with less force, more Yi and more power penetration.

In the beginning try the punch in a controlled enviroment; punch your training partner, let him feel and describe to you the effect of your punch. Experiment with your Yi until you get the desired result. Of course, you will also have to let the opponent punch you too, so you can help him develop. A good punch is one that seems only like a tap, but the receiver should feel like being hit by an iron ball (or as one of the guys I tapped yesterday at a Kung Fu gathering describes, "feels like being hit by a log").

Once you get decent result, of course test in out with someone you don't normally train with during sparring.

And of course, in a real fight, don't be obscessed with techniques, focus on destroying the guy and let your habits win your fight.

-----

You must continue to test your progress on partners and opponents; you don't want to waste years of training (like many internal people do) chasing things that does not work.

Another example: I didn't learn to take hits by imagining or reading; I learn to take hits by getting hit.

[Phil Redmond]

I dont think i have heard of eight different types of CHI?

Are u referring to meridians channels?

I know there is Chi your born with...and chi you acquire from eating, drinking, exercising and other things?

Please share the eight different types of chi....I believed under the acquired chi we have alot more than eight...possibly a different chi for every organ in the body, chi from the air, from trees, from water, from fire, from the earth, from contact with others, from the heavens itself. But then again this is all acquired chi so were really back to just two...an acquired and congential chi is really not different at all...in my opinion...
I learned about the 8 types of Chi when I studied acupuncture in NYC. I sent a link to my website which shows the 8 types of Chi that acupuncturists learn about. There are plenty of books where explaining. Here's one of the books we used: http://www.amazon.com/Acupuncture-John-Bensky-translated-OConnor/dp/B000KNH1ZE

[Phil Redmond]

Do you mean 8 pa kua forces?


Jox, :)

Look near the bottom of this page on my website:
http://www.wingchunkwoon.com/accu.asp

[Phil Redmond]

http://sacredpeaks.net/meYuanChi.htm
Huang Di Nei Jing Su Wen The Yellow Emperors Classic
http://www.amazon.com/Huang-Nei-Jing-Wen-Knowledge/dp/0520233220

[k gledhill]

Chi-masters (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tjtvyw31wVs&feature=youtu.be) [ aka beano boys ]...happy new year !

[Yoshiyahu]

okay will look it over in more depth later...thanks in advance




http://sacredpeaks.net/meYuanChi.htm
Huang Di Nei Jing Su Wen The Yellow Emperors Classic
http://www.amazon.com/Huang-Nei-Jing-Wen-Knowledge/dp/0520233220

[Lee Chiang Po]

I don't believe in 8 types of Qi. Or Chi. Whatever. I think that is just ancient Chinese Mystique. I believe that there is only one kind of Chi, which is the simple energy of the body that gives you life. There are probably at least 8 meridians, or pathways where the chi flows naturally, and these meridians can be blocked by injury or by intentional interference through accupuncture and other manipulations. I can give very good examples of this.
The problem with trying to use Chinese to explain these things is that it is way to general with somewhat broad meanings at times. Especially if Chinese is not your first language.

[Hendrik]

IMHO.

Reading this thread, I doubt any true development in the field of chi cultivation can be done. The reason is there isn't a Clear and full Comprehensive view on this chi cultivation engineering. It is more a philosophical interpretation here .

[Phil Redmond]

I don't believe in 8 types of Qi. Or Chi. Whatever. I think that is just ancient Chinese Mystique. I believe that there is only one kind of Chi, which is the simple energy of the body that gives you life. There are probably at least 8 meridians, or pathways where the chi flows naturally, and these meridians can be blocked by injury or by intentional interference through accupuncture and other manipulations. I can give very good examples of this.
The problem with trying to use Chinese to explain these things is that it is way to general with somewhat broad meanings at times. Especially if Chinese is not your first language.
So then you don't believe in Acupuncture and Traditional Chinese Medicine and that's fine.

[Phil Redmond]

IMHO.

Reading this thread, I doubt any true development in the field of chi cultivation can be done. The reason is there isn't a Clear and full Comprehensive view on this chi cultivation engineering. It is more a philosophical interpretation here .
Well Kirlian photography shows that something like chi exists.

[Hendrik]

Well Kirlian photography shows that something like chi exists.

IMHO,

The Chinese has a clear and precise process of cultivate chi. Everything is well define. It is no different then a physical development. One doesn't need kirlian or even biofeedback instrument. Kirlian or biofeedback instrument are mostly tools to pursue the western world. They really doesn't do much, not to mention they are always misunderstood and become mystefy.

Those who really has the qi cultivation is very clear for it. And also knows it is not everything such as qi ball blast projection. But it is certainly another layer of human reality which they can access for their use.

[k gledhill]

More Chi-Masters (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3psYEPYaBo&feature=related) :D

[Yoshiyahu]

IMHO.

Reading this thread, I doubt any true development in the field of chi cultivation can be done. The reason is there isn't a Clear and full Comprehensive view on this chi cultivation engineering. It is more a philosophical interpretation here .



So what must it be besides a philospical intrepreatiton in your opinion?

[Yoshiyahu]

More Chi-Masters (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3psYEPYaBo&feature=related) :D

i like that video..actually thats not chi he is doing...

it is dengfaifu...


i now posses the power to do that very thing lets touch hands:eek::eek:

[k gledhill]

This guy has students like the previous clip....'Ripley' where are you ? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FofBEedm80o&feature=related) :D

[jesper]

More Chi-Masters (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3psYEPYaBo&feature=related) :D

he isnt the only true master
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OT6BKj7sgJc&feature=related

[k gledhill]

Thanks for sharing very interesting indeed!


he isnt the only true master
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OT6BKj7sgJc&feature=related

Hmmmm.......; )

[Jansingsang]

Hmmmm.......; )

No one is a as bad as my man So put that in your pipe and smoke it :D

http://youtu.be/gEDaCIDvj6I

[k gledhill]

No one is a as bad as my man So put that in your pipe and smoke it :D

http://youtu.be/gEDaCIDvj6I

:D that is 'crazy' in action , you win...this battle, I shall return :D

[Jansingsang]

:D that is 'crazy' in action , you win...this battle, I shall return :D

That's a Punch Kick, chop. Arse Wooping . If i ever saw one:eek:

[Yoshiyahu]

this thread is offically derailed...


lol

let me join in on the fun!!!

Strong Ch
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdHB37UKpyQ&feature=related

immortal Jing
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkdRFUkgZ9c&feature=related

True Chi Master
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikWpPgUZ0o8&feature=related

[Lee Chiang Po]

So then you don't believe in Acupuncture and Traditional Chinese Medicine and that's fine.


Oh no, I never said that. I have used accupuncturists and Traditional Chinese medicine. I know it works. However, I do not believe that there are 8 different and distinct kinds of Chi. I think it is all one chi, and it takes several different paths. Also, like the last post about heaven and earth and such, it all makes very little sinse. It is much better and easier to explain if you use a more precise form of language. Chinese may be well understood by those that speak it fluently, but it is too general in nature to refer to heaven and earth and all that other silly stuff. Too much room for interpretation. We do not take our energy from the universe, or even the earth.

[anerlich]

We do not take our energy from the universe

Actually we do, unless you can conclusively prove the universe is not closed.

[Lee Chiang Po]

Actually we do, unless you can conclusively prove the universe is not closed.


Not trying to be rude here, but that statement makes no sense to me. The Universe is a vast, cold, and dark place, and we can not physically draw energy from it. Our energy is created by our own bodies from food and oxygen that we take in. Stop eating and breathing and see how long the universe keeps you alive. That is reality.

[Yoshiyahu]

correct me if i am wrong...But isnt your body, my body, the air we breath, the food and water we intake, the sun and the light it radiates to us all apart of the unvierse?

We need sunlight to grow, Water to survive food to replenish our minerals and elements. Arent these things the universe?




Not trying to be rude here, but that statement makes no sense to me. The Universe is a vast, cold, and dark place, and we can not physically draw energy from it. Our energy is created by our own bodies from food and oxygen that we take in. Stop eating and breathing and see how long the universe keeps you alive. That is reality.