Wing Chun in a Phone Booth

[Yoshiyahu]

Got this from another thread...its too funny to me...Made me laugh!

But realistically with absence of a phone booth. Wing chun would have a grave advatage over MT, MMA and a boxer in an enclose space like a public bathroom stall. or a narrow alley way between apartment buidings where hooks or round house kicks would be restricted.

If you were in an enclose area where you couldnt throw wide open power punches and kicks with out injuring yourself, WC would be ideal. With its linear attacks you move right up the center line with your body behind the attack!!!


QUESTION: Since in real life we may not always be fighting with in inclose space like a bathroom stall how do we make open wide space that inclose space for our opponent when fighting!!! How do we use our wing chun concepts to give him few options and force him to fight short range with us?

[sanjuro_ronin]

If you would have actually paid attention you would have understood the analogy.
And it has very little to do with range.

[TenTigers]

In a nutshell..most Southern short-hand systems (as well as Hung-Ga) seek to attack the attack-immediately close with the attacker as he attempts to launch his strike,(intercept his intention) shutting him down, maintaining constant forward pressure while striking-until you are done.

[TenTigers]

so.. not only do I fight in a phonebooth, but I attack you while you are attempting to leave the booth, push you in, and smother you.
Then I kick over the phone booth.

[sanjuro_ronin]

so.. not only do I fight in a phonebooth, but I attack you while you are attempting to leave the booth, push you in, and smother you.
Then I kick over the phone booth.

Don't forget chaining the phone booth to the back of a pick-up and driving away with it !

[sanjuro_ronin]

In a nutshell..most Southern short-hand systems (as well as Hung-Ga) seek to attack the attack-immediately close with the attacker as he attempts to launch his strike,(intercept his intention) shutting him down, maintaining constant forward pressure while striking-until you are done.

And do that in as much of a minimal "area" as possible.

[Yoshiyahu]

I am sorry if you feel i took your comment out of context...I just took what i glimpse over and it reminded of this movie i saw awhile ago...an i sat there an thought if ole boy practice Wing Chun he he wouldnt be getting dusted so bad in that small hall space. Ne way...go ahead and reassert your feelings of your opinions as you see fit?


If you would have actually paid attention you would have understood the analogy.
And it has very little to do with range.


In a nutshell..most Southern short-hand systems (as well as Hung-Ga) seek to attack the attack-immediately close with the attacker as he attempts to launch his strike,(intercept his intention) shutting him down, maintaining constant forward pressure while striking-until you are done.


In a phone booth hung ga, choy li fut and other styles would have limited mobility against wing chun...WC would have an advantage!


so.. not only do I fight in a phonebooth, but I attack you while you are attempting to leave the booth, push you in, and smother you.
Then I kick over the phone booth.




Wow thats cold blooded...I like it...you may just be ready to become apprentice of the dark side!

[sanjuro_ronin]

In a phone booth hung ga, choy li fut and other styles would have limited mobility against wing chun...WC would have an advantage!

Why on earth would you think that?

[WingChunABQ]

Don't forget chaining the phone booth to the back of a pick-up and driving away with it !

This technique, by the way, works best with a Porta-John. Just sayin'.

[TenTigers]

Why on earth would you think that?
I was gonna say that....

[JPinAZ]

How do we use our wing chun concepts to give him few options and force him to fight short range with us?

Do you have any answers of your own on this? This is a pretty broad question as it stands now. It's almost like asking "how do we fight with our WCK"?

[JPinAZ]

This technique, by the way, works best with a Porta-John. Just sayin'.

haha, that's a funky visual - dragging a guy around behind a pickup truck chained inside a porta-john!

[Yoshiyahu]

Do you have any answers of your own on this? This is a pretty broad question as it stands now. It's almost like asking "how do we fight with our WCK"?

I know nothing...educate me great grand master of all fightedom!

[YouKnowWho]

In a phone booth hung ga, choy li fut and other styles would have limited mobility against wing chun...WC would have an advantage!

If you train your "elbow" skill like in the following form clip, you will have better advantage than WC. Some of the northern TCMA systems do train "elbow" seriously. There was a fight in an office that 1 person had to handle 8 opponents (small space, multiple opponents). Through the whole fight, the elbow striking was only used. There were no punch, kick, lock, throw, ground game in that fight.

In a phone booth, you may have to punch 3 times to knock down one person. You may drop one person just by one single elbow. When you deal with multiple opponents in a small space, 3 punches to a person may be a "luxury".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c21vpG6jqcE

[Chadderz]

Your argument is pretty invalid because most WC schools STILL don't train realistically.

Unless it's an Alan OR student of course.

[WingChunABQ]

If you train your "elbow" skill like in the following form clip, you will have better advantage than WC. Some of the northern TCMA systems do train "elbow" seriously. There was a fight in an office that 1 person had to handle 8 opponents (small space, multiple opponents). Through the whole fight, the elbow striking was only used. There were no punch, kick, lock, throw, ground game in that fight.

In a phone booth, you may have to punch 3 times to knock down one person. You may drop one person just by one single elbow. When you deal with multiple opponents in a small space, 3 punches to a person may be a "luxury".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c21vpG6jqcE

There are plenty of elbows in the Biu Jee form.

[Yoshiyahu]

You do know some WC lineages has an elbow form right?


Ne way...even in small space you may not be in elbow range. If try to launch an elbow from the outside your going to get trapped or controlled. The best time to throw an elbow is when you are too close for your opponent to stop you from making contact.


Elbows should be thrown when your in the lions mouth!



If you train your "elbow" skill like in the following form clip, you will have better advantage than WC. Some of the northern TCMA systems do train "elbow" seriously. There was a fight in an office that 1 person had to handle 8 opponents (small space, multiple opponents). Through the whole fight, the elbow striking was only used. There were no punch, kick, lock, throw, ground game in that fight.

In a phone booth, you may have to punch 3 times to knock down one person. You may drop one person just by one single elbow. When you deal with multiple opponents in a small space, 3 punches to a person may be a "luxury".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c21vpG6jqcE

[Yoshiyahu]

Your argument is pretty invalid because most WC schools STILL don't train realistically.

Unless it's an Alan OR student of course.

Define realistically?

Do you Train with Alan Or?

[JPinAZ]

Define realistically?

Do you Train with Alan Or?

You define realistically, do you train with Stan? ;)

[Chadderz]

Define realistically?

Do you Train with Alan Or?

As close to practical combat as possible, eg, sparring and losing forms in favour of function.


And no, but I've seen him, and I like the way he thinks, and he spars regularly.

[Yoshiyahu]

You define realistically, do you train with Stan? ;)

I have trained with stan about five times...I plan to train a little more with doing chi sau and sparring. an working on his dummy and hitting his punching bag and wall bag...

[Yoshiyahu]

As close to practical combat as possible, eg, sparring and losing forms in favour of function.


And no, but I've seen him, and I like the way he thinks, and he spars regularly.

Who do you do wing chun with?




Define: losing forms in favour of function

[JPinAZ]

I have trained with stan about five times...I plan to train a little more with doing chi sau and sparring. an working on his dummy and hitting his punching bag and wall bag...

haha, I was joking/messing with you. From everything I've seen, nothing stan does is even remotely close to realistic anythying. That's why I asked you to describe what you think is 'training realistically', so people can get a baseline of your understanding of the term :)

[couch]

I love Wing Chun. It's what I like to do in my free time.

...but boxing, MT, etc have 'pockets of power' as well. While large looping punches are often seen in boxing - hooks, uppercuts, body shots, etc were developed when the range got closer and straight lines didn't work (opponent covers up, gloves are in the way of their face, etc).

So, yes: Wing Chun would excel in a phone booth, but if you're in there with a boxer, watch your ribcage.

CTK

[anerlich]

Your argument is pretty invalid because most WC schools STILL don't train realistically.

Oh yeah? How often do you train in phone booths and porta-loos?


Unless it's an Alan OR student of course.

Alan ORR. Yes, but he's not the only one. He is the only one with a good video series.

[WingChunABQ]

I love Wing Chun. It's what I like to do in my free time.

...but boxing, MT, etc have 'pockets of power' as well. While large looping punches are often seen in boxing - hooks, uppercuts, body shots, etc were developed when the range got closer and straight lines didn't work (opponent covers up, gloves are in the way of their face, etc).

So, yes: Wing Chun would excel in a phone booth, but if you're in there with a boxer, watch your ribcage.

CTK

Can't I just give the guy 50 cents and save my floating ribs? Sheesh!

In all seriousness I agree with you. I can't stand WC people who insist that the only effective and real power generation can come out of a Wing Chun structure, especially since there is a very easy way to prove that is not the case.

[WingChunABQ]

Oh yeah? How often do you train in phone booths and porta-loos?


http://www.flickr.com/photos/75696883@N05/6803733955/in/photostream

http://www.flickr.com/photos/75696883@N05/6803733955/in/photostream

[Wayfaring]

so.. not only do I fight in a phonebooth, but I attack you while you are attempting to leave the booth, push you in, and smother you.
Then I kick over the phone booth.

When I am in a phone booth, it is for the exclusive purpose of changing into my Superman outfit. ;)

[YouKnowWho]

There are plenty of elbows in the Biu Jee form.
Please show some pictures or clips in the Biu Jee form that has:

- downward elbow,
- upward elbow,
- straight elbow,
- horizontal elbow,
- backward elbow,
- both forward and backward elbows,
- both right and left elbows,
- ...

http://www.google.com/imgres?hl=en&sa=X&rlz=1C1CHMZ_enUS308US310&biw=1400&bih=923&tbm=isch&prmd=imvns&tbnid=qx6VuuM3Kh_2jM:&imgrefurl=http://fightingarts.com/reading/article.php%3Fid%3D552&docid=dhVrufnfaNKNoM&imgurl=http://fightingarts.com/content05/graphics/bokator_elbows-1.jpg&w=225&h=212&ei=fs4pT9f7FsXy2QXT_6T3Ag&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=647&sig=106679325854226616519&page=1&tbnh=145&tbnw=154&start=0&ndsp=32&ved=1t:429,r:10,s:0&tx=66&ty=72

http://www.google.com/imgres?hl=en&sa=X&rlz=1C1CHMZ_enUS308US310&biw=1400&bih=923&tbm=isch&prmd=imvnsb&tbnid=_62F_Vp3se-QyM:&imgrefurl=http://www.letsblocking.com/close-combat/elbow-strikes.html&docid=qQaleJoH8NRnrM&itg=1&imgurl=http://www.letsblocking.com/close-combat/images/4214_68_122.jpg&w=186&h=186&ei=qc8pT93QL-fe2AWcy8DOAg&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=389&vpy=457&dur=213&hovh=148&hovw=148&tx=92&ty=79&sig=106679325854226616519&page=1&tbnh=130&tbnw=129&start=0&ndsp=36&ved=1t:429,r:15,s:0

http://img857.imageshack.us/img857/6060/elbowe.jpg

[anerlich]

http://www.flickr.com/photos/75696883@N05/6803733955/in/photostream

http://www.flickr.com/photos/75696883@N05/6803733955/in/photostream

Now THAT's what I'm talkin' ABOUT!

[Vajramusti]

They are every where-slt, ck, bj, mok- with proper learning and practice they cover all directions.
They are difficult to control in chi sao- specially for beginners.

joy chaudhuri

[JPinAZ]

When I am in a phone booth, it is for the exclusive purpose of changing into my Superman outfit. ;)

My biggest problem is, there are no real phone booths left to fight in! I guess WC's use has finally passed us....

[anerlich]

Please show some pictures or clips in the Biu Jee form that has:

- downward elbow,
- upward elbow,
- straight elbow,
- horizontal elbow,
- backward elbow,
- both forward and backward elbows,
- both right and left elbows,

He said "there are plenty of elbows in Bil Jee", not "Bil Jee contains every type of elbow strike you can think of".

[anerlich]

My biggest problem is, there are no real phone booths left to fight in! I guess WC's use has finally passed us....

No phone booths, but portaloos are still on the ascendance ... a good martial artist must learn to adapt.

[GlennR]

No phone booths, but portaloos are still on the ascendance ... a good martial artist must learn to adapt.

Well there are also closets if you happen to be in one

[Yoshiyahu]

haha, I was joking/messing with you. From everything I've seen, nothing stan does is even remotely close to realistic anythying. That's why I asked you to describe what you think is 'training realistically', so people can get a baseline of your understanding of the term :)

thanks for the comical relife...ha ha lol


Can't I just give the guy 50 cents and save my floating ribs? Sheesh!

In all seriousness I agree with you. I can't stand WC people who insist that the only effective and real power generation can come out of a Wing Chun structure, especially since there is a very easy way to prove that is not the case.


What if his name is 50 cents and he wants to hit you with a Hook?


When I am in a phone booth, it is for the exclusive purpose of changing into my Superman outfit. ;)

Wow I prefer changing into my god costume in the portapotty!

[Yoshiyahu]

Why on earth would you think that?

In a phone booth..Hung Gar and choy li fut and other longer or round punching styles would have less advantage. Yes Hung Gar has some direct in middle attacks but the power generation is different. Wing Chun is more Linear than choy li fut or hung ga if you fight with it traditionally...

if you use choy li fut like a western boxing...you will be limited when it comes to round punches outside of the jab and right and left crosses. sure uppercuts be utilize but WC method is for going straight ie sun punch...where choy li fut uses more outside attacks that uses swinging motion to generate more power!!!

That swinging motion or swinging range would be greatly limited by an enclosed space!

[anerlich]

While one has to take the reality check and realise that fighting in a phone booth is a farcical situation ...

Choy Li Fut does not solely consist if big swinging attacks. There are close range movements as well.

Sky marshals etc. have to operate in "tubular environments". And there are plenty of places which are basically narrow corridors in buildings.

[Lee Chiang Po]

[QUOTE=YouKnowWho;1155421]Please show some pictures or clips in the Biu Jee form that has:

- downward elbow,
- upward elbow,
- straight elbow,
- horizontal elbow,
- backward elbow,
- both forward and backward elbows,
- both right and left elbows,

The elbow is only used in dire emergencies. Where you can not use the fist. The elbow is not as powerful as you might think, and the weapon is only about a foot long at best. It is like hitting someone with an 8 inch stick. It might hurt, but it will not hurt near enough to do you much good. You have to get to within a foot of the target, and your force is only a short swing of the upper arm with some of your weight behind it, maybe. Not much of your weight anyway. If you try to fight someone with your elbows you are going to get beaten badly. The only time an elbow is worth anything is when it is the only thing you can use at that time. Back when WC was being developed, Kung fu was about the only thing you would have to deal with. You have seen guys doing forms and such, and try to imagine doing that in a narrow run or doorway on a small junk or boat. You would not have enough room to fight. WC was developed on that boat and in that doorway or narrow run you can punch and kick with all your force and power. Standing in a real narrow space I can punch very hard, and I can kick very hard. Try getting through that small run by use of your elbows, and I will end up with your lunch money. Outside it's most useful situation(the phone booth) you have to improvise and overcome. You crowd the guy and render his best and most powerful weapons useless if you can.

[Dragonzbane76]

Elbow is useless? Where do u get this crap really? The elbow and the knee are probably two of the most powerful techniques u have in clinch/close range fighting. Sometimes i wonder if u have ever actually done any MA's. Yes its limited in range but thats not what its intent is for. You compare it to a short stick. I compare it like being hit with a hammer.

[WingChunABQ]

Please show some pictures or clips in the Biu Jee form that has:

- downward elbow,
- upward elbow,
- straight elbow,
- horizontal elbow,
- backward elbow,
- both forward and backward elbows,
- both right and left elbows,
- ...



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BhdmnxHdfRw

Here is a video of a Fong lineage practitioner doing the Biu Jee (It's in slow-mo as a reference).

As I was taught by my sifu (also Fong lineage): When you pull your arms back to "neutral position" (chambered by the chest) in each form, you're training elbow strikes with the posterior of the elbow.

As I practice the Biu Jee form, the first set of elbows are "piercing", i.e. they are done with a stabbing motion, training strikes with the tips of the elbows. The second set (with the stepping) are done as "hacking" , training strikes with the 'blades' of the elbows/ forearms. The third elbow set is training "crushing" elbows, using forceful downward pressure.

[sanjuro_ronin]

While one has to take the reality check and realise that fighting in a phone booth is a farcical situation ...

Choy Li Fut does not solely consist if big swinging attacks. There are close range movements as well.

Sky marshals etc. have to operate in "tubular environments". And there are plenty of places which are basically narrow corridors in buildings.

The phone booth is an analogy of a situation where one has limited ability to move and generate "typical" power.
One can just as easily say:
In a crowd, in a corner, back against the wall, in a bathroom stall ( crappy situation but there you have it), etc.
As for the notion that Hung Kuen and CLF don't have close range, well, it seems that Yoshi is confusing what he thinks he knows about those systems with what those systems actually do/train.

[couch]

The elbow is only used in dire emergencies. Where you can not use the fist. The elbow is not as powerful as you might think, and the weapon is only about a foot long at best. It is like hitting someone with an 8 inch stick. It might hurt, but it will not hurt near enough to do you much good. You have to get to within a foot of the target, and your force is only a short swing of the upper arm with some of your weight behind it, maybe. Not much of your weight anyway. If you try to fight someone with your elbows you are going to get beaten badly. The only time an elbow is worth anything is when it is the only thing you can use at that time. Back when WC was being developed, Kung fu was about the only thing you would have to deal with. You have seen guys doing forms and such, and try to imagine doing that in a narrow run or doorway on a small junk or boat. You would not have enough room to fight. WC was developed on that boat and in that doorway or narrow run you can punch and kick with all your force and power. Standing in a real narrow space I can punch very hard, and I can kick very hard. Try getting through that small run by use of your elbows, and I will end up with your lunch money. Outside it's most useful situation(the phone booth) you have to improvise and overcome. You crowd the guy and render his best and most powerful weapons useless if you can.

It's a really good thing you know what you're talking about. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OowSKtuW8YA

[TenTigers]

In a phone booth..Hung Gar and choy li fut and other longer or round punching styles would have less advantage. Yes Hung Gar has some direct in middle attacks but the power generation is different. Wing Chun is more Linear than choy li fut or hung ga if you fight with it traditionally...

if you use choy li fut like a western boxing...you will be limited when it comes to round punches outside of the jab and right and left crosses. sure uppercuts be utilize but WC method is for going straight ie sun punch...where choy li fut uses more outside attacks that uses swinging motion to generate more power!!!

That swinging motion or swinging range would be greatly limited by an enclosed space!
yeah..kinda thought your answer would be like that...
This is a very common misconception those outside the system have.

The reality is, Hung-Ga has pretty much the same techniques and power generation when using the short bridges. It is not a long bridge system that has some short hand techniques. On the contrary, it was originally a short bridge system that added longer bridging to it. Tan, bong, fook, pak, gan, kwun, yjkym, short shifting, inch power, elbows, sticking, trapping, lin sil die da, etc., have always been in the system. Look at the snake and crane techniques and one would think they are much more similar than different.
CLF's Crane and Snake, utilizes the same principles.
Power generation is similar in many cases as well-out of necessity.
Having trained in all three systems, I have more than a little knowledge on this.
(although I do admit I have spent much less time in CLF)

[JPinAZ]

Elbow is useless? Where do u get this crap really? The elbow and the knee are probably two of the most powerful techniques u have in clinch/close range fighting. Sometimes i wonder if u have ever actually done any MA's. Yes its limited in range but thats not what its intent is for. You compare it to a short stick. I compare it like being hit with a hammer.

One major point of Jackie's that I agree with is the time to use elbows from a WCK perspective - in emergencies. Bascially, it's when our range and/or facing gets compramised and it's the only weapon available to us. If it's range that was lost, yes we would be in a clinch timeframe.

But, my understanding of elbows as a tool in WCK, it isn't our primary weapon because to use them means I had to give up my own space (I let my opponent inside my 'box') and lost full range to use both hands equally. We don't look to strike with elbows from the get go, we use them to get back to our preffered range and to regain facing if needed. But they are fun to use and do hurt like he11 when used with proper body methods! :)

[LoneTiger108]

The reality is, Hung-Ga... it was originally a short bridge system that added longer bridging to it. Tan, bong, fook, pak, gan, kwun, yjkym, short shifting, inch power, elbows, sticking, trapping, lin sil die da, etc., have always been in the system. Look at the snake and crane techniques and one would think they are much more similar than different.

Quite an interesting claim about the seed of WCK being in HG, but as a practitioner yourself can you confirm that Hung Gar actually use the 'terms'? (Tan, bong, fook, pak, gan, kwun, yjkym etc)

I'd rather not comment about the 'phone booth' stuff, besides it's called a phone box in the UK!

[Wayfaring]

I'd rather not comment about the 'phone booth' stuff, besides it's called a phone box in the UK!

All you Brits and Aussies on this forum need some basic education here to understand proper terminology.

Please review:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDcdkbrAA3U

Thank you.

[anerlich]

in a bathroom stall ( crappy situation but there you have it)

Pun intended?

[TenTigers]

Quite an interesting claim about the seed of WCK being in HG, but as a practitioner yourself can you confirm that Hung Gar actually use the 'terms'? (Tan, bong, fook, pak, gan, kwun, yjkym etc)

I'd rather not comment about the 'phone booth' stuff, besides it's called a phone box in the UK!
we use different terms, usually more older descriptives, such as gang-sao, or mai yun jiew gang for tan, etc. But we also use terms such as bong, yjkym.

[GlennR]

All you Brits and Aussies on this forum need some basic education here to understand proper terminology.

Please review:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDcdkbrAA3U

Thank you.

Great, english lessons from a yank! ;)

[YouKnowWho]

The elbow is not as powerful as you might think,

Old Chinese saying said, "宁挨十拳不挨一肘 - I prefer to be hit 10 times by punches than to be hit once by elbow." There is a good reason that elbow is still not allowed in the San Shou and San Da ring even the knee is already allowed.

When your opponent is on the ground, an elbow strike on his "heart area" can finish that fight.

[Lee Chiang Po]

Elbow is useless? Where do u get this crap really? The elbow and the knee are probably two of the most powerful techniques u have in clinch/close range fighting. Sometimes i wonder if u have ever actually done any MA's. Yes its limited in range but thats not what its intent is for. You compare it to a short stick. I compare it like being hit with a hammer.


What you describe as close range techniques is what I refer to as dire emergency. In a clinch where you can not use a punch or kick, the knee or elbow can be useful. It is not powerful or practical enough to fight with otherwise. It is like taking a pocket knife to a sword fight. Really, it is not a decent weapon in a fight other than what I described. Whan I was young, I could role off an elbow and not even feel the blow. If you knee someone in the face it will certainly hurt, and it might even knock you out, but it is longer and has more muscle power behind it. The elbow is not nearly so. However, just coming in and trying to knee someone outside a clinch you are going to eat some fist.

[Lee Chiang Po]

Old Chinese saying said, "宁挨十拳不挨一肘 - I prefer to be hit 10 times by punches than to be hit once by elbow." There is a good reason that elbow is still not allowed in the San Shou and San Da ring even the knee is already allowed.

When your opponent is on the ground, an elbow strike on his "heart area" can finish that fight.

Well, I am an old Chinaman and I would never say that. Everyone seems to be trying to justify the elbow as a prime fighting weapon when it really isn't. Pick you a fight with someone and try fighting with your elbows, then tell me how effective it is.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Yeah, elbows have no power:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3s6rF0gId4E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sj8nmn3eT5I

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OowSKtuW8YA&feature=fvsr

[LoneTiger108]

we use different terms, usually more older descriptives, such as gang-sao, or mai yun jiew gang for tan, etc. But we also use terms such as bong, yjkym.

Thanks for answering dude. I find HGK one of the most fascinating systems and have heard about their 'lost' short bridge style. Personally, always been of the opinion that Wing Chun has a few things to say about that ;)

The thing many people seem to misunderstand is that Wing Chun itself is in fact a slang language that must have had older roots and HGK is one of the more 'written' styles imho preserving some of the oldest Martial language we have today.

In this sense, Wing Chun has always been 'modern'.

Much better convo than phone boxes and elbows lol!

[wingchunIan]

this thread is right up there for awards of most clueless quotes in a single thread. :D
Starting with analogy of the phonebox as a concept of fighting in a confined area being taken literally as a phone box and from then on,
Fighting three people in phone box - lol, how big is the phone box?
Elbows lack power - lol, step into a ring with an MT fighter and see if you change your mind.:rolleyes:
The idea of a boxer throwing hooks in a phone box - if you've done boxing you'd know that you need to move your body to throw a decent hook and aside from the mamoth, three person holding booth above you'd be banging your head / opposite shoulder on the wall of the booth and your elbow on the other one. The fact that he could simply throw uppercuts, jabs and crosses seems to have escaped attention.

Loving it, haven't laughed so much in ages....:p

[k gledhill]

If a guy took too long on the phone call and it was in a booth, I'd do this ! Get off the phone !

Now thats a Thai elbow !!!

for BJJ ground and pound in a booth !!

[sanjuro_ronin]

this thread is right up there for awards of most clueless quotes in a single thread. :D
Starting with analogy of the phonebox as a concept of fighting in a confined area being taken literally as a phone box and from then on,
Fighting three people in phone box - lol, how big is the phone box?
Elbows lack power - lol, step into a ring with an MT fighter and see if you change your mind.:rolleyes:
The idea of a boxer throwing hooks in a phone box - if you've done boxing you'd know that you need to move your body to throw a decent hook and aside from the mamoth, three person holding booth above you'd be banging your head / opposite shoulder on the wall of the booth and your elbow on the other one. The fact that he could simply throw uppercuts, jabs and crosses seems to have escaped attention.

Loving it, haven't laughed so much in ages....:p

This thread IS the WC forum, lol !

[k gledhill]

get off the PHONE !!! :D CLIP (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrtgJZ5pMtY)

[k gledhill]

Even the 'Greatest' had a phone booth moment....now theres a worthy Phone booth opponent :D
try telling him to hurry up...

[WingChunABQ]

Even the 'Greatest' had a phone booth moment....now theres a worthy Phone booth opponent :D
try telling him to hurry up...

This is glorious

[Yoshiyahu]

True that...In my belief from what I know from what little experience i have with Hung Gar it is a longer system. Choy li fut is too...

Atleast the system is long system compared to WC which is more compact...

All arts have long range and short range techniques...even Wing Chun...but WC foundation is short range. We utilize long range techniques to draw our opponent in to our core set. Once there we dominate. We dont set up to fight tit for tat in a long range duel. For lack of a better word.

Boxing is short range system, Muay Thai is a long range system...

Now certrain animal forms have short range techniques true...because they are hand styles. hand styles are shorter than wu shu styles. The wu shu or nothern shaolin style is certainly longer than choy li fut...ie long fist...

But what I mean is outside swining motion of CFT is a longer bridge technique than WC. If i wanted attack someone with a long range technique I would use the basics of hung gar. If i wanted to utilize the inside fighting skills i would use WC...


When i first started off off at age 16 I learn a form named northern drill and bashi. I may be spelling the second wrong...The forms are definitely longer in comparison to WC compact structure.

I learn some basic striking techniques such has long range upper cut I dont remember the name and high, medium low punches in the horse stance along with other training techniques like three star blocking before I went on to WC an made WC my primary art. I felt at 16 the phyiscal confrontation of high school would be better dealt with doing WC which i could masked as boxing or streetfighting better. Plus it was more direct and I could understand it usage right away.


The phone booth is an analogy of a situation where one has limited ability to move and generate "typical" power.
One can just as easily say:
In a crowd, in a corner, back against the wall, in a bathroom stall ( crappy situation but there you have it), etc.
As for the notion that Hung Kuen and CLF don't have close range, well, it seems that Yoshi is confusing what he thinks he knows about those systems with what those systems actually do/train.




What I mean is in reference to WC CLF and Hung Ga is long fighting style...The hard bridges are longer...similiar to Weng Chun....which is long bridge fighting system is it not?


One of the early disciples of WC was rumored to practice both Wing Chun (Short arm bridge) and Weng Chun (long arm bridge)

wing chun is attributed to the female attributes and weng chun is attributed to male attributes if you believe the legends that is...if not...its okay...

When you look at the forms an look at structure of the stances in conjunction with the swinging of the arms...thats where i get the opinion its a long range fighting system!



yeah..kinda thought your answer would be like that...
This is a very common misconception those outside the system have.

The reality is, Hung-Ga has pretty much the same techniques and power generation when using the short bridges. It is not a long bridge system that has some short hand techniques. On the contrary, it was originally a short bridge system that added longer bridging to it. Tan, bong, fook, pak, gan, kwun, yjkym, short shifting, inch power, elbows, sticking, trapping, lin sil die da, etc., have always been in the system. Look at the snake and crane techniques and one would think they are much more similar than different.
CLF's Crane and Snake, utilizes the same principles.
Power generation is similar in many cases as well-out of necessity.
Having trained in all three systems, I have more than a little knowledge on this.
(although I do admit I have spent much less time in CLF)

[sanjuro_ronin]

Yoshi,
Let me just expalin this about Hung kuen:
It starts "big" to build a "solid core" then it becomes "small" and when you add that "solid core" to those "small" moves then you have something that is formidable:
Long power over a short distance.

[k gledhill]

Think outside the PHONE BOX (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qMf_rbydvg)!!

[wingchunIan]

is this thread really still going:D

[Yoshiyahu]

is this thread really still going:D


Yoshi,
Let me just expalin this about Hung kuen:
It starts "big" to build a "solid core" then it becomes "small" and when you add that "solid core" to those "small" moves then you have something that is formidable:
Long power over a short distance.



what are some of the basics you add to make the hung kuen smaller?

Also is your lineage a small frame one in comparison to other lineages...

Because there is small frame and big frame gung fu styles too! such as tai chi...big and small frame!!!

[GlennR]

Boxing is short range system, Muay Thai is a long range system...



Mate, put the keyboard down, walk out onto the street, walk into a boxing gym, MT gym, Karate gym, tai chi kwoon........... whatever

And THEN start referring to styles you (currently) know nothing about

[JPinAZ]

Mate, put the keyboard down, walk out onto the street, walk into a boxing gym, MT gym, Karate gym, tai chi kwoon........... whatever

And THEN start referring to styles you (currently) know nothing about

that whole post was so clueless, I couldn't bring myself to clip quote or reply to it. I figured it was better off left alone - you're a braver man than me! :D

[GlennR]

that whole post was so clueless, I couldn't bring myself to clip quote or reply to it. I figured it was better off left alone - you're a braver man than me! :D

I (strangely) admire his enthusiasm for WC and the discussions in general... he would have to be the busiest poster, but he really needs to get some REAL exposure.

And i wish he would go easy on the !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!'s

[JPinAZ]

I (strangely) admire his enthusiasm for WC and the discussions in general... he would have to be the busiest poster, but he really needs to get some REAL exposure.

And i wish he would go easy on the !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!'s

yeah, I guess I can't blame him for wanting to learn more considering the exposure he has had... :eek:
I just don't see the point of him asking a million questions if he's not going to even read (or can't comprehend) the answers he's given.

[Yoshiyahu]

Mate, put the keyboard down, walk out onto the street, walk into a boxing gym, MT gym, Karate gym, tai chi kwoon........... whatever

And THEN start referring to styles you (currently) know nothing about

Just my opinion mate!

[GlennR]

Just my opinion mate!

Opinions are fine, just make it an educated opinion

[Yoshiyahu]

Opinions are fine, just make it an educated opinion

Well every one is on a different level...Maybe yours is higher than mines...maybe mines is higher than yours...what ever the case...one will not comprehend the higher persons opinion because the lower one is not their yet!

[wtxs]

Mate, put the keyboard down, walk out onto the street, walk into a boxing gym, MT gym, Karate gym, tai chi kwoon........... whatever

And THEN start referring to styles you (currently) know nothing about

Welcome to the exclusive Bang-Head-On-Brick Wall club my friend.:p:D

[Yoshiyahu]

ever man is right in his own eyes!

[wtxs]

ever man is right in his own eyes!

The saddest thing is ... not every man is willing to see and accept what is right.;)

[Yoshiyahu]

The saddest thing is ... not every man is willing to see and accept what is right.;)

http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/small/1005/dedication-wrong-leave-internet-demotivational-poster-1272856078.gif

[wtxs]

http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/small/1005/dedication-wrong-leave-internet-demotivational-poster-1272856078.gif

Is it dedication? Or is it blind devotion?

[Yoshiyahu]

Is it dedication? Or is it blind devotion?

probably a little of both!

[JPinAZ]

haha, yeah, and this guy thinks he's right too.... ;):D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVXH9f1WMbY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtkaS...1&feature=plcp
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVXH9...lcp&playnext=1

[Yoshiyahu]

If you like to debate that guy...

i suggest you send him a message on his on youtube page...

i cant speak for him...only my self mate!!!



haha, yeah, and this guy thinks he's right too.... ;):D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVXH9f1WMbY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtkaS...1&feature=plcp
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVXH9...lcp&playnext=1

[JPinAZ]

If you like to debate that guy...

i suggest you send him a message on his on youtube page...

i cant speak for him...only my self mate!!!

Really? You can't be this stupid - you did speak for him, and not too long ago either! Don't you remember issuing me a challenge to go meet you and him and spar him?:rolleyes: Was only a few weeks ago..

Oh, what's the use..

[Yoshiyahu]

Really? You can't be this stupid - you did speak for him, and not too long ago either! Don't you remember issuing me a challenge to go meet you and him and spar him?:rolleyes: Was only a few weeks ago..

Oh, what's the use..

The invitation to spar him still stands...I already told him a year ago any one who talks trash about I will let them know to meet him at forest park on sundays...he has an open challenge for all you knuckleheads who talk trash....

if you go to his youtube comments you will see his open challenge given...

so if you wanna meet up with him to spar...by all means have at it...i dont think you gonna like the outcome!

[JPinAZ]

Ok, so you can speak for him then - Make up your dam mind! Are you sure you're not on some type of drugs?

You must really be high if you think I would waste my money to fly half way across the country to spar with some clown like him! Stan is a joke, and you issuing these idiotic internet challenges in his name makes you one too. Yeah, I got his youtube challenge - thanks for the laugh!

If you or that clown stan want to prove something all you have to do is walk into any of the decent MMA gyms in the area, ask to spar and film it. Let's see how that works out for him - I've seen his horrible clips, I already know how it would go..
Hell, you had your chance to prove to all of us just how awesome you were, all you had to do was go meet with Terrance. But after you found out there was a measly $10 matt fee, you used that as an excuse to b!tch out.

You clowns want to prove something, now's your chance. Until you post your clips up of you sparring ANY decent people, I'm done with you and stan and your continued stupidity.

[Wayfaring]

so if you wanna meet up with him to spar...by all means have at it...i dont think you gonna like the outcome!

The outcome would be like the conclusion of the movie "Grumpy Old Men" ????

:D:D:D

[wtxs]

The outcome would be like the conclusion of the movie "Grumpy Old Men" ????

:D:D:D

Or end up like this as posted in this forum ...

http://www.elrellano.com/videos_online/3321/clases-de-defensa.html

[sanjuro_ronin]

Yoshi, I gotta ask you.
Do you think that what that guys is doing is remotely good?

[Yoshiyahu]

Okay dude well stop asking me about another man!!!

Your like riding his N.U.T.Z. Alls you do is talk about him...Do you want to be his boyfriend...you asked me about him like Im his Father...AS much as you reference his videos. it tells me you must be learning something from him. Because videos i dont like I dont sit through and watch from start to finish. How many of his videos have you actually watch by the way? Im glad your such a fan...giving him numerous hits on his channel...lol...i betcha your on his youtube page more than i am...lol From your constant idiotic post i can tell you got an issue with him maybe your scared of him...are your just hater!!!



Ok, so you can speak for him then - Make up your dam mind! Are you sure you're not on some type of drugs?

You must really be high if you think I would waste my money to fly half way across the country to spar with some clown like him! Stan is a joke, and you issuing these idiotic internet challenges in his name makes you one too. Yeah, I got his youtube challenge - thanks for the laugh!

If you or that clown stan want to prove something all you have to do is walk into any of the decent MMA gyms in the area, ask to spar and film it. Let's see how that works out for him - I've seen his horrible clips, I already know how it would go..
Hell, you had your chance to prove to all of us just how awesome you were, all you had to do was go meet with Terrance. But after you found out there was a measly $10 matt fee, you used that as an excuse to b!tch out.

You clowns want to prove something, now's your chance. Until you post your clips up of you sparring ANY decent people, I'm done with you and stan and your continued stupidity.


Yoshi, I gotta ask you.
Do you think that what that guys is doing is remotely good?

i like some of drills his does...Its different than the way I learn but its still pretty good. I like his outside intercepting techniques. It for beginners learning how to intercept a single punch. Its not based off chi sau at all...which most demos i see on the internet are all based of chi sau drills.

If you dont like his vids...it probably because the way you learn is foriegn to his...i can see his stuff as basic self defense tactics to drill from No Bridge.

[JPinAZ]

Okay dude well stop asking me about another man!!!

Your like riding his N.U.T.Z. Alls you do is talk about him...Do you want to be his boyfriend...you asked me about him like Im his Father...AS much as you reference his videos. it tells me you must be learning something from him. Because videos i dont like I dont sit through and watch from start to finish. How many of his videos have you actually watch by the way? Im glad your such a fan...giving him numerous hits on his channel...lol...i betcha your on his youtube page more than i am...lol From your constant idiotic post i can tell you got an issue with him maybe your scared of him...are your just hater!!!

Yes Stan is a dude...i like some of drills his does...Its different than the way I learn but its still pretty good. I like his outside intercepting techniques. It for beginners learning how to intercept a single punch. Its not based off chi sau at all...which most demos i see on the internet are all based of chi sau drills.

If you dont like his vids...it probably because the way you learn is foriegn to his...i can see his stuff as basic self defense tactics to drill from No Bridge.

Complete and utter garbage.

[Yoshiyahu]

Complete and utter garbage.

That is my sentiments exactly when you begin to speak!

[Chadderz]

haha, yeah, and this guy thinks he's right too.... ;):D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVXH9f1WMbY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtkaS...1&feature=plcp
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVXH9...lcp&playnext=1

Gotta be honest, that looks proper terrible. So far removed from proper combat it's a bit ridiculous to be honest.

[GeneChing]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bN-f9CWqlBI

Wing-Chun-in-a-Phone-Booth (https://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?62986-Wing-Chun-in-a-Phone-Booth)
Phone Booth Fighting (https://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?72569-Phone-Booth-Fighting)