Chiropractic Treatment length

[Merryprankster]

I injured my back (again) recently, and after 13 years (yup you read that right) of daily low grade back pain, I finally decided to see a chiropracter.

First thing, the adjustments are magic. I find that I still posess the strained muscle pain from my back injury, but the nagging radiating stuff is completely gone. I was trying to figure out why I felt so wierd the other day and I realized that for the first time in 13 years I was completely without nagging lower back pain.

I am concerned about treatment length. At 35 dollars an adjustment, this is expensive stuff. Years of wrestling and discus and shot have pushed my back and neck out of alignment. The primary concern is what appears to be a degenerating disc at L5 (lumbar 5).

The doc is telling me that treatment will be 3 times a week. At 12 times per month, that is $420. I am in the military, and they told me they do not cover chiropractic care.

He thinks he can have everything corrected in 6 to 8 months. Will I be undergoing adjustment 3 times a week for this long? That's insane! Or do they start off with a 3 times per week course, and then ease up as things improve?

Anybody got any experience with this? I have some goals that my lower back is a part of, so if I have to, I'll find the $420 per month to do this, but just thinking about it hurts my pocketbook :)

[omegapoint]

Ask any Physician about Chiroquackters, and they'll tell you how dangerous and how much BS it is! If you want "manipulations" got to a D.O. instead of an M.D. (yes there are 2 types of Physicians or Medicine Doctors). Doctors of Osteopathy are licensed Physicians and they know Manipulation techniques. That's where Chiros' stole their get rich quick idea from, but they just took the Manipulation part. Imagine 3 years of Grad school devoted to massage therapy and alternative "medicine"! What a scam, and medicare covers it! Frikkin' idiots. Manipulation of the spine especially in the neck can cause strokes and other complications. There's documented proof and in Med School we learn to be careful with spinal manipulation. Just a heads up from someone in the know. Money, money, money.....

[Merryprankster]

On the other hand there are several thousand of them doing rather well and I have a lot of sports buddies that swear by them.

I dunno. All I know is that it works. This makes me happy.

[SevenStar]

My chiropractor is great. I was going three times a week at 40 bucks a pop. It's expensive, but in my oppinion, it was worth it. My right side is twisted slightly further forward than my left side, so my spine is slightly crooked. It doesn't affect my training much, but on occasion the pain is murder. I was involved in an accident 2 years ago that aggravated the pain immensely. After a few months of treatment, the pain was gone. he reccomends that I continue to go until my spine has re-aligned properly. Being the rebel that I am, I don't go, but I do go when the pain resurfaces. Also, there are some types of insurance that will cover chiropractic. Where I work, I have two different options for coverage, one of which covers chiropractic.

-ShortySeven©
Step right up and get it -- whoever wants [defeat]

Come not between the dragon and his wrath...

[Merryprankster]

Seven,

Does he expect you to go 3 times a week until it's realigned, or less frequently once you're "close" to your goal?

[old jong]

Like in "normal" medecine there are some inherent risks to these treatments.A small percentage of patients suffer more than they gain in the hands of these practicians every years. A bad chiropractor could more easily cripple or kill you than many known fighters ;) Choose well!... :eek:
(Of course it is a very small percentage!) ;)...I heard! ;)

Les paroles s'envolent.
Les écrits restent!...

[SevenStar]

yeah, it's supposed to be three times a week to start and as improvement can be seen, it will lessen. Depending on the severity of course, this can take longer for some than others.

-ShortySeven©
Step right up and get it -- whoever wants [defeat]

Come not between the dragon and his wrath...

[SevenStar]

my chiropractor requires that all patients watch an orientation video that explains what chiropractic is all about before they are actually seen he also takes x rays and does various other tests in order to help determine the nature/severity of the problem before he performs any adjustments.

-ShortySeven©
Step right up and get it -- whoever wants [defeat]

Come not between the dragon and his wrath...

[Merryprankster]

Pretty much the same with mine. I'm still trying to decide if I like him. I like his partner very much. He seems to understand the "athlete mentality" more than the one I've been seeing. This guy doesn't seem to have really internalized that I'm going to go and do what I want/need to do to reach my athletic goals.

[SevenStar]

sounds like my chiropractor. he was a collegiate wrestler and also played football. At first I was hesitant to see him because of his name. I was thinking "what the hel1 kind of a chiroprator is named Rock?"

-ShortySeven©
Step right up and get it -- whoever wants [defeat]

Come not between the dragon and his wrath...

[Merryprankster]

Of course, I am mostly annoyed that I can't train. I was having one of those little epiphanies and really starting to improve my game. This all screwed that up good :)

Hopefully he can get me back on track... for less than $420 a month over 6 month...

[Watchman]

I see a chiropractor three times a week myself, but as he's a student I get all my visits comped.:D

Merryprankster,

Oftentimes a chiropractor will start you out at the three times a week schedule, then scale it back to two times a week after about three months. I hope you're able to get healed up and back on track soon. I know it must be frustrating.

Sevenstar,

Your chiro sounds exactly like mine, only he also used to work as a bouncer in various Vegas night clubs back in the day.

He does the whole orientation and x-ray thing too. As a point of fact, because of this he has actually caught some potentially life threatening injuries in a couple of his patients that "regular" doctors completely missed.

http://www.wckfc.com/masters/man/Sec2-1.GIF

One is weak because he makes preparations against others;
he has strength because he makes others prepare against him.
-- Sun-Tzu

[Merryprankster]

I'm not that concerned about it. Once the muscle strain goes away, I will resume training AND stay with the chiropractic treatment. If they can't fix it while I am training, then I will find somebody who is willing to work with me so I can. I'm 25 now, and in all honesty, my truly competitive years will end in a decade. Sure, there are 35 year-old stand outs, but I am just a slightly above average athlete, not a great one. I've got some natural talent, but not enough to truly compete when I get that old.

[SevenStar]

"As a point of fact, because of this he has actually caught some potentially life threatening injuries in a couple of his patients that "regular" doctors completely missed."
:eek: yikes.

-ShortySeven©
Step right up and get it -- whoever wants [defeat]

Come not between the dragon and his wrath...

[SevenStar]

Merryprankster,

that's what I was doing. I was in class on mon wed and fri, and saw my chiro on tues thurs and fri (i made time to do it on friday because they are closed on the weekends)

-ShortySeven©
Step right up and get it -- whoever wants [defeat]

Come not between the dragon and his wrath...

[Merryprankster]

Yeah, that's gonna be how it is for me too. Except that my schedule is wierd, so I'll be able to train more frequently, not less.

Well, I'm off to the gym... I can use the isolation machines (I learned how at www.isolationisforpussies.com (http://www.isolationisforpussies.com)) and the hand bike.

Just for the record folks if you ever want to do something evil to your upper body and also get a pretty good interval workout, try a tough hand bike.

I'm interested in hearing anybody else's experiences so please keep em coming!

[old jong]

Ok,A chiro spotted something regular doctors missed.This can happen but the opposite is true also! I knew somebody who went to her chiro for diffuse back pains for months.The chiro was preaching against "traditionnal" medecine and was very reassuring until she was hospitalised with generalised cancer!...She died shortly after.
This is why I say "Always consult a doctor beside your favorite shaman!"

Les paroles s'envolent.
Les écrits restent!...

[SevenStar]

what kind of gym is open this late? Or is it a fitness center in your aparment complex or something?

-ShortySeven©
Step right up and get it -- whoever wants [defeat]

Come not between the dragon and his wrath...

[old jong]

Hey guys!...You have the right to completely ignore me and what I have to say,you know!...Feel free not to respond if you like! ;)Don't worry about it. I leave you to your little private chit-chat. ;)

Les paroles s'envolent.
Les écrits restent!...

[Watchman]

I'm not ignoring ya OJ!

I agree with your call to caution. It all comes down to the idividual practitioner.

[Merryprankster]

Nah! I work nights this week and the place I work has a gym.

Sorry Old Jong :) I wasn't meaning to ignore you, it's just that your advice is already noted: Don't go to a chiro, go to a specialist MD.

I agree that you need to be careful. So far, so good. Nobody has dropped dead in his office... yet :)

I was able to do some smith machine squats. Better than nothing

[omegapoint]

Merryprankster: A D.O. can be a Family Practice doc like the ones at local Primary Care Clinics. They are real PHYSICIANS,like M.D.s, that can specialize in General Medicine or Surgery.

The difference between them and a Pseudo-Profession like Chiropractic is that they know HOW to read an X-Ray and what to look for. Just because you claim to be able to identify radiologic abnormalities doesn't mean you can. I mean how would the average Joe know any better? Most non-Orthopedic or Radiology Physicians have a tough time when it comes to identifying legitimate skeletal trauma on film, and they see innumerable X-Rays from day 1 of Clinicals!

Anyways, Seven Star, what exactly can you diagnose from a traditional X-Ray? What exactly are they looking for and why? How does it specifically relate to the spine in proven medical terms and principles? How is it possible for incorrect alignment of the spine to effect numerous body systems? What biochemical, physiologic and anatomic variables account for the claims Chiropractic makes? They couldn't tell you because most of them don't have a clue as to the workings of medical physiology, modern biochemistry, neuroanatomy, pharmacology, simple/factual diagnostic principles and technique, or countless other skills acquired with years and years of medical school, internship, residency, and fellowship. After college that can be up to 10-12 years! It takes that sort of time to be called a D.O. or M.D.. 3 years of grad school after 60 hrs. of college just ain't gonna cut it. Even for the hardest working academic elite becoming a proficient clinician and diagnostician takes a decade (after college).

So waste your money to have some fool release endorphins due to the micro-trauma (and sometimes macro) he's causing. The temporary palliative effect from this is enough to milk your insurance company of their money. In the end it is your money though. But you do pay for their rarely utilized services. Now you see the rub! The best in Snake Oil!

Stretching your entire body properly and having someone crack your back every once-in-a-while is probably more effective, safer in the long run, and a whole helluva' lot cheaper. Just my 2 Centavos....

[Merryprankster]

point taken. I personally don't believe that spinal adjustment will cure cancer, alleviate abdominal cramping, etc. That's just hokey. But my back and neck? Yeah, it seems to work.

However, on the other hand, an awful lot of people on this board believe in the mystical healing power of chi and dit da jow.

I guess my point is that some people swear by them, some people don't. That's just the way it is.

Hey cool! My neck no longer makes funny cracking sounds when I turn it, and I can actually look all the way over my right shoulder. Neat!

[SLC]

omegapoint, I don't know what axe you have to grind, but there are just as many worthless MD's as there are worthless chiropractors, and lots, I mean thousands more people are killed by MD's and "traditional" western medicine that chiropractors ever come close to. This has recently been publically accepted as an industry-wide problem for western medicine. To assume that MD means risk free is mortally foolish.

The other side of that coin is that there are good on each side too.

I have done both and have had good results from chiropractors for back problems... where MD's just gave me pills and said go to bed or just sharpened their knife.

Prankster, as far as the treatment goes, yes, it seems standard to begin with 3/week for a period of weeks. Then it tapers off as improvement occurs. It may require maintenance visits forever. But the alternative is what you should think about... which is probably some level of surgery if you have a severe problem.

As to your doctor, why go to the one you don't care for?

Can eat with either hand. (But becomes moody when not fed regularly.)

[SevenStar]

You took the words right outta my mouth SLC.

-ShortySeven©
Step right up and get it -- whoever wants [defeat]

Come not between the dragon and his wrath...

[Merryprankster]

Oh, they are partners. I'll be requesting the one I favor from now on. The one I don't have a rapport with is skilled, just kind of not the best schmoozer in the world... kind of more interested in your pathology than you. I don't feel quite as comfortable.

Oh yes, I definitely plan on continuing care. This stuff is magic.

[Shaolin Temple]

:confused:

I agree with SLC. I am medical doctor and even then, I will disagree with you and agree with SLC.

Recent studies in the British Medical Journal and Journal of Orthopaedic Medicine show that Chiropractic is as quoted "...the Only proven and effective therapy for the treatment of chronic whiplash" (so much for your so called research on cervical/neck manipulations causing strokes.
Referring to this pseudo research paper you have, it is indicated that so called Chiropractic manipulations were performed by MD and physios who when it stuffs up call it Chiropractic manipulation.

It is like an MD extracting a wisdom tooth and discover that they accidentally caused neuralgia and claim that Dental techniques are dangerous and unsafe.

Omegapoint, your claims are unfounded and show your biased ignorance and lack of research.

As a matter of fact, in 1999 the Blood Journal (the most reputable medical research journal world-wide) and of course the famous British Medical Journal of 1991,indicated that Chiropractic is 400 times safer than aspirin and the later journal quoted that Chiropractic treatment of spinal injuries were two times more effective than medical management of spinal injuries.

So omegapoint, are you some uninformed hermit who knows absolutely nothing about medical sciences are you a medical or DO student who has been brainwashed by your lecturers that your profession is the only proven modality? Do your research before you open your mouth or do what an ostrich does...stick your head in the sand.

:cool:

[Kram1]

Let me preface this by saying that what follows is only MY opinion, and experience. This is one of those areas that "Whatever works for you, works!

I too had scoliosis (curveture of the spine) and disk/muscle injury of the back and neck, due to an auto accident. Was in chiropractic for a year and a half. Started at 5x/week, and bty the end, wsa down to 1-2x/week. Did it help? Heck yes!
Initially, it was pretty much the only was I could make it through the workday ( I would go at lunch ). But. It was, for me, only a quick fix that allowed me to keep going. It didn't really aid in any healing. It was only after I started some fairly intensive Physical Therapy w/ a strong program of excercise, that I saw a marked improvment in long term function and lowered pain levels. It is important to note that this not something I could have started right away, but after the initial healing had happened I am pretty sure that the Chiro was only a pallative (ie, go in feeling crappy, exit feeling wonderful, get up the next morning, feeeling crappy again.)
Only the correct excersises were of long term benefit. And only when kept up with. If I stop the workouts for more than 2 months, the lower back, neck and knee pains return nearly full force. It is only the constant workouts that protect the damaged parts.

So, do the chiro, but find a good PT guy/girl to help strengthen the damaged areas. If you are in DC, the Russian guy I used is in Baltimore.

MArk

My 2 cents


Mar

And So It Goes...

[fa_jing]

As for the original question - I received Chiro treatment for nearly four months. It was good, In that it loosened my vertebrae and made them "adjustable." However, they usually try to get you to come in too often and for too long. This is bad because it erodes the disks and makes your vertebrae too loose. He would adjust me, I'd walk out the door, and my back would pop right back into the wrong position! Since I quit, my back is better, and I have retained enough looseness of the spine to adjust myself, using Yoga and other streching. For instance, torso twists with the pole a la Bruce Lee cracks my upper back. Lower back can be adjusted with lotus pose. Any kind of backbend, forward bend, twist, etc. The only thing I miss the Chiropractor for is neck adjustments, this is a little more difficult to do on your own. Shoulderstand works sometimes. So the original loosening was very beneficial, but once you hit a certain point of looseness it's time to put your body in your own hands. One more warning: I am about 6 foot 1 and 175 pounds. My chiropractor was about 5'6 but he was able to make the adjustments. One day he was on vacation, and his partner came to do the adjustments. She was about 5'1 and 120 pounds, maybe. Needless to say, she could not perform the adjustments, and messed up my neck for a week. Don't be fooled like I was! They knew she couldn't do it, and just wanted to get me in the office so they could make their dough. -FJ

[prana]

I had treatment done by a chriporactor, and tried to go back as advised. The pain was soon gone.

Also, a close relative of mine, who finds sleeping many a tear in the eye, visits the chiropractor very often :) She now sleeps soundly, in fact, snoring muchly :)

ShaoLin Temple, sound advice :) Take it easy !

http://dharmatours.com/hbmc/Prwhbl1.gif

[Shaolin Temple]

Hi Prana, haven't seen you around for a long time.

I wonder if omegapoint is or is another gokitus prime trying to set up a
troll like he did in all the other sites as mercilessfighter, fivestar
praying mantis and etc.

Hi, hope you don't mind me copying this Dharma spinning wheel, it looks
great...

http://dharmatours.com/hbmc/Prwhbl1.gif

:cool: :D

Which Shaolin is authentic. North or South.
As Sifu would say...there is no permanence and there should not be any discrimination.
The point is therefore, who cares.
The more Shaolin there are, the better. Be civilized and chivalrous in your behaviour. As martial artists, we are supposed to not forget that we learn this art to help others and ourselves in times of need...not be a thug!!!
Amitabha.

[prana]

no problemmo with the wheel. In this current state of the world, the great Lama's advices that we turn the wheel of Chenrezig and give as many prayers of the 6 syllable mantra, and so I thought, why not distribute it on the forum and let the wheel turn on all the screens of our friends.

I hope that it will generate much loving kindness to heal the current state of the world.

http://dharmatours.com/hbmc/Prwhbl1.gif

[WongFeHung]

you need to go to an ot or a tiet da yee-chinese bone-setter. My fiance' learned her art from her mom, who learned it from her dad, etc, and she puts people back and they stay put. None of this maintenance crapola. Look at it this way-the spine is held together by tendon and ligaments which are lacking in elasticity. How many times would it take to manipulate a spine over and over untill it cannot hold, and the body needs more and more frequent adjustments? Tiet-da medicine not only adjusts the bones, but manipulates the muscle, and through massage and herbal formulas, strengthen and rebuild tissue. To some western Drs, it might sound like quackery, but fek'em.

[fa_jing]

For CD Lee.

[Cyborg]

I don't know if anyone still reads this but I'll say it anyway.

My oldest sister was involved in a wreck, no big deal except that soon thereafter she started having stomach pain. No MD could diagnose it, she spent alot of money with them and got nothing. 6 months after the accident she hurt her back and went to the chiro, who says, "hmmm, been having stomach problems?" 3 treatments and no more stomach pain.

My conclusion? (As if anybody cares :)) The body is one organism! One thing gone wrong will affect another.

And yes, there are quacks out there on both sides of the fence. :(

"Box a fighter and fight a boxer". Bruce Lee

[joedoe]

I am always a bit dubious when the medical profession speaks out against an alternative therapy. While they may well have our safety at heart, it also smakcs of protecting their own turf too.

I do not think omegapoint is a troll, and he is just speaking his own mind. However I had heard a different history for chiropractics than the one that he outlined.

Don't forget - it wasn't that long ago that osteopaths were considered quacks as well.

cxxx[]:::::::::::>
You're fu(king up my chi

[GeneChing]

This has made quite a stir in the news.



MODEL KATIE MAY'S DEATH
Coroner Finds ...
CHIROPRACTOR DID IT (http://www.tmz.com/2016/10/19/model-katie-may-chiropractor-cause-of-death/)
10/19/2016 12:50 AM PDT BY TMZ STAFF
EXCLUSIVE
http://ll-media.tmz.com/2016/10/17/1017-katie-may-instagram-4.jpg

Playboy model Katie May died from a simple visit to a chiropractor for an adjustment, which ultimately left her with a fatal tear to an artery in her neck ... according to the L.A. County Coroner.
TMZ obtained a copy of Katie's death certificate, and it clears up a huge mystery surrounding her sudden death in February. The document says she died when a blunt force injury tore her left vertebral artery, and cut off blood flow to her brain.
It also says the injury was sustained during a "neck manipulation by chiropractor." Her death is listed as accidental.
As TMZ first reported, Katie -- known as the "Queen of Snapchat" -- had taken a nasty fall during a photo shoot. She thought she had a pinched nerve and went to an L.A. chiropractor on Friday. She suffered a stroke on Monday, and remained on life support until Thursday.
Katie's family is aware of the coroner's findings. They would not comment on whether they or her estate would pursue legal action.

I see a chiropractor regularly. But like with any healer, I find it's more about the specific practitioner than the practice itself.

[Sihing73]

I see a chiropractor regularly. But like with any healer, I find it's more about the specific practitioner than the practice itself.

Much the same can be said for any martial art "style".
Whether it is able to be used is often more related to the individual than to the specific "style".

Everything has both good and bad examples.
A lot of whether something appeals to one or not has a lot to do with what is being sought.
In some cases the simple belief that something will help makes it helpful. Placebo effect anyone???

[bawang]

To anyone suffering from chronic spinal pain
Seek reverse hyper machine now

[David Jamieson]

Much the same can be said for any martial art "style".
Whether it is able to be used is often more related to the individual than to the specific "style".

Everything has both good and bad examples.
A lot of whether something appeals to one or not has a lot to do with what is being sought.
In some cases the simple belief that something will help makes it helpful. Placebo effect anyone???

style is the vehicle, once you are using it, it loses meaning.
Everything you need, you already have and the catch 22 is that you won't know what you need until someone shows you. lol

[SteveLau]

Merryprankster,

I am not sure that the chiropractor wanted to heal you completely, but I am certain that he wanted to maximize money profit from you. My high school friend asked me when we were in our late twenties "do you have low back pain?" Sure, we both had. Just after a few years of started working full time, and over a decade of desk bound school study, one will almost for certain have such pain. Improper sports and daily living techniques like bent our back in picking up an object will also contribute to the injury. It is chronic pain disorder occurred over a long period - weeks. Also, acute injury like the one you mentioned can add more damage to it. And it does not take old age for it to show symptom. I am not a physician, but I think DIY method might work for your case. Please get a second opinion from another licensed chiropractor or sports medicine practitioner. See if their view matches with mine. What likely the second professional opinion you will get is that you do not need to spend a year of treatment by a physician.


Regards,

Steve Lau
Hong Kong

[boxerbilly]

To anyone suffering from chronic spinal pain
Seek reverse hyper machine now

How is your issues coming ? My chronic pain is wonderful joy, LOL. I guess that reflects at times too.