MMA fighter with Choy Lee Fut background

[hskwarrior]

John "the Muscle bot" Rivera.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6cnGSii0yg

[RWilson]

Kickboxing is what is on this video. Is that what clf is? Kickboxing?

[hskwarrior]

Kickboxing is what is on this video. Is that what clf is? Kickboxing?

i don't see any boxes being kicked...i'm confused :confused:

[RWilson]

i don't see any boxes being kicked...i'm confused :confused:

Atleast you agree with me. I have finally discovered what clf is. Tcma version of kickboxing.

[hskwarrior]

atleast you agree with me. I have finally discovered what clf is. Tcma version of kickboxing.

good for you. Jolly good n all that!

[Raipizo]

Cool video, he seems amateur though.

[hskwarrior]

he is. but he's been making a name for himself.

[hskwarrior]

his face book fan page
https://www.facebook.com/pages/John-The-Musclebot-Rivera/114970538584009

[Frost]

Not being funny but looking at his Bio id say he was a northern kung fu guy and that was his background
He lists 30 years in northern kung fu under master Chaan Tzu Sadaat,who he still considers his master, 2 years in CLF (2006-08) and then he joined ATT and started Thai Boxing, he also has rankings in TKD and Okinawan karate. Chinese stylist for sure, strong CLF background….narghhhh

[donjitsu2]

John "the Muscle bot" Rivera.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6cnGSii0yg

{insert lame/smug comment about that looking more like kickboxing than CLF here}


:p

[CLFNole]

Yes he mostly trained in some northern style but trained at our school and my kung fu brother's school for a bit. I believe one of his sponsors sells CLF shirts and used him in a promo hence the "clf background".

He is an MMA fighter now I believe and trains with American Top Team.

[Pork Chop]

Not being funny but looking at his Bio id say he was a northern kung fu guy and that was his background
He lists 30 years in northern kung fu under master Chaan Tzu Sadaat,who he still considers his master, 2 years in CLF (2006-08) and then he joined ATT and started Thai Boxing, he also has rankings in TKD and Okinawan karate. Chinese stylist for sure, strong CLF background….narghhhh

I'd actually tend to agree with this assessment.

My initial thought was: "well that's not muay thai"
-low, squat stance with active footwork
-leg kicks with no set up, the skip low kick is kind of tell-tale chinese
-doesn't turn over the hips on the round kick
-combos with a lead push kick at the end
-the "loose" guard

Next thought was: "maybe he's boxing? nah..."
-no extension on the jab
-no head movement in the first round

I didn't see much in there that made me think "CLF".
He did do some stuff common among sanshou folks - the bouncing is a lot like faking a shot, active footwork, sanshou people like the lead leg skip low kick, the "loose" guard, seemed to like to clinch up...
Sanshou tends to have a heavy northern influence & that combo with the push kick is pretty northern.

[ngokfei]

what you guys expect to bust out Sup Ji Kau Da LOL

A fighter being critqued by non-fighters:rolleyes:

[Pork Chop]

what you guys expect to bust out Sup Ji Kau Da LOL

A fighter being critqued by non-fighters:rolleyes:

I fight...
fought a muay thai smoker in april at saekson's gym and shooting for master's division golden gloves amateur boxing next year.
I'll probably take another official stab at muay thai and/or sanshou/sanda after that if things work out right.

and yeah, it wouldn't hurt if there was a gwa choy - sow choy combo... or if he sat on his jabs like a proper charp choy....
The fighters from Oz (Chan family as well as Lacy Buk Sing progeny) and the Chicago CLF folks still manage to have some CLF flavor to their stuff...

I pointed out his obvious Chinese flavor not to put him down, but more that I can see his influences, and I respect them. Just saying that he's missing that flair that I typically see from CLF cats. I imagine he'd do even better in san shou than muay thai.

Cool that the guy's training with ATT now.

[Frost]

what you guys expect to bust out Sup Ji Kau Da LOL

A fighter being critqued by non-fighters:rolleyes:

whats your fight record?

no one critiqued him we simply said its stretching it a bit to call him a CLF guy when he has 2 years in that art, 6 years at ATT and 30 years in long fist :rolleyes:

there are enough CLF guys fighting out there we dont need to steal someone from another style as our own....we are not wing chun lol

[Lucas]

we dont need to steal someone from another style as our own....we are not wing chun lol

hahahahhahaha

[ngokfei]

please post some footage of your fights Pork chop & frost so that other fighters can compare and critique.:)

Me, I'm not critiquing and my Ring fight experience is actually very little.:D

[Pork Chop]

please post some footage of your fights Pork chop & frost so that other fighters can compare and critique.:)

Me, I'm not critiquing and my Ring fight experience is actually very little.:D

I doubt the fighter in question would be upset by any of the comments made by myself or frost. He'd probably explain his strategy more in depth and maybe look at some things to do differently. I hardly think he needs a white knight to defend him.

I find it funny you get so bu+t hurt over some comments that were hardly critical, only an honest assessment. But then you're the same guy who brought up a medical condition of Derek Johnson in the middle of an argument with the guy on another forum. So I know very well your tactics and that your motivations for requesting footage are just to get us to shut up.

I don't owe you anything, but I'm going to post this clip anyway, because I don't like the insinuation that frost and I are just "keyboard warriors".
I'm not proud of it.
This is what happens when you find out an hour before a smoker that you're in a smoker: http://youtu.be/ou3KT0jEQW4
It's horrible, i can't even watch.
But i'll take any critique offered as constructive criticism to help me get better - coz that's what fighters do: put the ego aside and look for any opportunity to improve.

[Frost]

please post some footage of your fights Pork chop & frost so that other fighters can compare and critique.:)

Me, I'm not critiquing and my Ring fight experience is actually very little.:D

sure if you can post where i critiqued him, please quote or STFU

[TenTigers]

I believe Roy Nelson has a Kung-Fu background, as well as BJJ.
Anyone know what school he was from?

[ngokfei]

Pork Chop - respect for stepping up with the vid clip.

Frost - distraction excuse. Lets see the vid (good or bad) man. then I'll stfu:D:D


Pork Chop
- in regards to the ***** session thread I had with D. Johnson on the Naam Kyun forum (which has mysteriously disappeared!!) but I have it stored if you want to see it complete.My comment to DJ was something along the lines of "enjoy the rest of your life" - basically being sarcastic that he was focusing too much time and effort on knocking his training brothers book on Jow Ga. It was DJ that came out that he had had a medical problem and supposed I knew about it, which I didn't (why would I as I don’t run in his circles). I guess he forgot the base rule of interrogation and that is not to get excited as you might say or reveal something you don't want known. For me the issue is closed and I wish him the best in regards to health and family.
So as for Tactics - you give me too much credit:)

[wenshu]

I believe Roy Nelson has a Kung-Fu background, as well as BJJ.
Anyone know what school he was from?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8wTXrsTn64

[Frost]

Pork Chop - respect for stepping up with the vid clip.

Frost - distraction excuse. Lets see the vid (good or bad) man. then I'll stfu:D:D


Nope either man up and post where i said anything about the guy other than he wasnt CLF but northern shaolin and ATT, or STFU and p*ss off you little wanker :)

or let me put it another way, grow a set of balls because you are a whining little idiot with no ability to read or comprehend anything anyone writes

ill make it easy for you here is what i wrote

Not being funny but looking at his Bio id say he was a northern kung fu guy and that was his background
He lists 30 years in northern kung fu under master Chaan Tzu Sadaat,who he still considers his master, 2 years in CLF (2006-08) and then he joined ATT and started Thai Boxing, he also has rankings in TKD and Okinawan karate. Chinese stylist for sure, strong CLF background….narghhhh

please show me anywhere in the above i said anything about the guys ability or clip...come on man up .......

[IronFist]

Why does one need to have fighting experience themselves in order to tell if kickboxing or TCMA techniques are being used in a fight?

Do you also need to have performed on stage to be able to tell the difference between opera and pop music?

[IronFist]

Every one of these threads is the same.

Someone posts a vid.

Someone else says "that was kickboxing, not TCMA"

The first person replies "WHERE ARE THE VIDS OF YOU FIGHTING?" as if that would actually alter the reality of the techniques being used in the first vid. It's hilarious because 1) no one ever said the person wasn't a good fighter, they just said they weren't using TCMA techniques. 2) that person posting a vid of themselves fighting wouldn't change whether or not the first person was using kickboxing or TCMA techniques.

It's ridiculous.

It's like if someone posts a vid of them singing opera, and someone else says "that isn't opera! That's country!" Why would anyone reply "WHERE ARE THE VIDS OF YOU SINGING?" lol what would that prove? But it's only MA people who seem to think that way.

Silly MA people.

Anyway, the dude in the original vid looked like a decent fighter. I'm not challenging him or any of the other nonsense that MA people continuously misconstrue. It just didn't really look like CLF to me.

I would be interested to hear his thoughts on it. Does he represent himself as a CLF fighter, or is he an MMA guy who just happens to have a CLF background?

[hskwarrior]

I would be interested to hear his thoughts on it. Does he represent himself as a CLF fighter, or is he an MMA guy who just happens to have a CLF background?

personally, i don't care. as long as one person enters MMA with CLF in their background, more and more people will be entering that ring soon enough.

win or lose he has CLF people's support

[IronFist]

personally, i don't care. as long as one person enters MMA with CLF in their background, more and more people will be entering that ring soon enough.

win or lose he has CLF people's support

What if he's not using CLF techniques, though?

[hskwarrior]

What if he's not using CLF techniques, though?

first, when you put gloves on a CLF guy you eliminate most of the specialized techniques like the panther fist, snake hands, etc etc. Another example is the Tiger Claw. CLF has vicious tiger claw (if those students were taught it the right way). Regardless.... i loves me the fu jow. I forget who it was but i met some folk from the forum in Texas at Tai Chi legacy and showed them my fu jow. the looks of pain on their faces were priceless. :D

i can't speak for all CLF but Hung Sing Choy Lee Fut has the jabs, upper cuts, back fists, over head strikes (sow choy), elbows and knee's. what most people conjur up in their minds in regards to CLF are our big swinging style hay makers. put gloves on us it looks like an average overhead strike. but there is a difference with intention and striking surface between a boxers overhead strike and a sow choy in choy lee fut. While a boxers intention is to try and knock you out, its our intention to not only knock you out but to wipe your face off of the side of your head with a sow choy-hung sing style.

so, in most all cases because CLF is such a practical system, once you put gloves on our hands to disguise and limit us to closed fists its more than likely CLF will look like kick boxing. take the gloves off us you will see the style used the way it should be because there's no limitation that the gloves offer us. we can still defend the same with or without gloves and still look CLF

Sure, the big swing is an ear mark of CLF....but so is our chop choy. but as i mentioned, i can't do my chop choy as easily than with an gloved hand. however, HSCLF is a system that can adapt to any situation. when we put gloves on we would be focusing on only the techniques that work with gloves on. Gloveless, well, we do all the other stuff then.

anyways, i'm happy that CLF people are answering the call to combat and stepping up to show our own skills. i do see in the future more and more CLF people in sport fighting compeitions

CLF Chop Choys

One thing about CLF Chop Choy's while wearing gloves is that its alot easier to trap our hands between your arm and body. Fingerless or ungloved hands we will punch holes into your body without that fear of being trapped.

[Frost]

What if he's not using CLF techniques, though?

CLF includes hooks uppercuts, straights and overhands. its not so much the techniques as the footwork and intent that would be different lol

Its not whether its looked like CLF for me, its that his background isnt CLF its northern kung fu and he's cross trained a little in CLF and karate, give the guy his due and dont claim him for your own if he considers himself a northern stylist

[GlennR]

I doubt the fighter in question would be upset by any of the comments made by myself or frost. He'd probably explain his strategy more in depth and maybe look at some things to do differently. I hardly think he needs a white knight to defend him.

I find it funny you get so bu+t hurt over some comments that were hardly critical, only an honest assessment. But then you're the same guy who brought up a medical condition of Derek Johnson in the middle of an argument with the guy on another forum. So I know very well your tactics and that your motivations for requesting footage are just to get us to shut up.

I don't owe you anything, but I'm going to post this clip anyway, because I don't like the insinuation that frost and I are just "keyboard warriors".
I'm not proud of it.
This is what happens when you find out an hour before a smoker that you're in a smoker: http://youtu.be/ou3KT0jEQW4
It's horrible, i can't even watch.
But i'll take any critique offered as constructive criticism to help me get better - coz that's what fighters do: put the ego aside and look for any opportunity to improve.

Youre the shorter guy PC?

[Lucas]

Shaolin represent!!! :P

[Pork Chop]

Youre the shorter guy PC?

yeah
Rules we were using were weird - 1 min body boxing, 1 min kicks only, 1 min clinch only. that's why it was smoker sparring session and not an official amateur bout.
It came at the end of a 3 day long seminar with a ton of hall of fame muay thai guys at Saekson's gym; including Samart Payakaroon, Kaensak Sor Ploenjit, Matee "Dragon Leg", Kongnapa BMS, BM sasiprapa, Neungsiam, Sugar Cane Coke Chunhawat, and Nop- a trainer for Chaz Mulkey & Kevin Ross (2 of the top US muay thai fighters).
EDIT: Just saw a picture and Jongsanaan was there too.

[RWilson]

Hskwarrior, I know why you are upset. You are mad cause the clf fighter is not a clf fighter. Case solved. I left this place along for a week and it practically died.

[hskwarrior]

Hskwarrior, I know why you are upset. You are mad cause the clf fighter is not a clf fighter. Case solved. I left this place along for a week and it practically died.

are u just assuming i'm mad? i have real gung fu, you don't :D

[RWilson]

are u just assuming i'm mad? i have real gung fu, you don't :D

If by real kung foo you mean you did millions of forms, fought in te deadly streets, and are now a big fatty than yes you have the real Kung foo. You were too deadly for the ring but decided that onion rings were not too deadly for you. The only street fighting you did was when you used Ryu in Streetfighter 2 to beat the game.

You could beat Dave Ross's a$$ in a fight. I will give you that.

[hskwarrior]

If by real kung foo you mean you did millions of forms, fought in te deadly streets, and are now a big fatty than yes you have the real Kung foo. You were too deadly for the ring but decided that onion rings were not too deadly for you. The only street fighting you did was when you used Ryu in Streetfighter 2 to beat the game.

You could beat Dave Ross's a$$ in a fight. I will give you that.

no i liked Chun Li. she's sexy.

glad my lineage doesn't have hella forms then. :D

FYI, i was never too deadly for the ring. I have always been able to handle myself in any street situation.

[RWilson]

no i liked Chun Li. she's sexy.

glad my lineage doesn't have hella forms then. :D

FYI, i was never too deadly for the ring. I have always been able to handle myself in any street situation.

Frank, I really do not have any personal issues with you and I have come to like you and Lucas.

[hskwarrior]

Frank, I really do not have any personal issues with you and I have come to like you and Lucas.

thas awesome bro. i'm an alright kinda guy. appreciated.

i dont raeally have issues with you either. no need for that

[Lebaufist]

Frank.........R, It is usually the onus of the one delivering the critique to qualify their opinion with their credentials or ability. As a point of reference, and practice, I tend to like to know the source. Could you please provide some sample of what you can do?