Has anyone here learned total 100% from videos and books

[firedragon21]

Has anyone here learned total 100% or mostly 100% from videos and books?

[Vajramusti]

Has anyone here learned total 100% or mostly 100% from videos and books?
------------------------------------

Learned what?

[Paddington]

Come on Joy you know fully well what the OP is asking! But to wit, eh?

To answer the OP, no. Although I have about 25 Wing Chun titles in my library, nothing is a substitute for learning from someone with more experience than you, face-to-face and being able to 'touch arms'.

[firedragon21]

Come on Joy you know fully well what the OP is asking! But to wit, eh?

To answer the OP, no. Although I have about 25 Wing Chun titles in my library, nothing is a substitute for learning from someone with more experience than you, face-to-face and being able to 'touch arms'.
Thank you,that somes up what I was thinking.

[LFJ]

The problem with such learning is that Wing Chun is not like other martial arts where you only need to learn various techniques. WC is a concept-based skill which can only be developed through interaction with human energy through contact. Learn all about the forms and theory, without chi-sau it is all useless. But of course, without real sparring, chi-sau is only a game. Many people get hung up on that and get a false sense of ability to fight because they can "defeat" someone in a game of chi-sau.

[chaotic2k]

I have learnt all my kung fu from DVDs. I feel i have reached a very high level. I chi sau alone which allows me to be soft as air. Anyone who says you cant master wing chun vis DVD needs to spend hundreds of $$$ on instructional DVDs plus put in the hours. I view everyday and practice once a month. Soon im gonna open up my own club teachinh people. Im currently learning grappling from DVD so might start teaching MMA. Why face to face instruction?? Dealing with a teachers bad breath?? Get with the program peeps!!

[Vajramusti]

I have learnt all my kung fu from DVDs. I feel i have reached a very high level. I chi sau alone which allows me to be soft as air. Anyone who says you cant master wing chun vis DVD needs to spend hundreds of $$$ on instructional DVDs plus put in the hours. I view everyday and practice once a month. Soon im gonna open up my own club teachinh people. Im currently learning grappling from DVD so might start teaching MMA. Why face to face instruction?? Dealing with a teachers bad breath?? Get with the program peeps!!
------------------------------------

Trolling......

[Paddington]

------------------------------------

Trolling......

And self contradictory too! By his own argument he defeats the need for the martial arts school he proposes to set up!

[LFJ]

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_1pGsXlBcxrY/S_Bh-gBEIxI/AAAAAAAAEP0/muy5Hr0Ihg4/s1600/captain.obvious+to+the+rescue.jpg

[pazman]

The problem with such learning is that Wing Chun is not like other martial arts where you only need to learn various techniques. WC is a concept-based skill which can only be developed through interaction with human energy through contact.

Oh dear, what other martial arts have you studied that didn't require contact?

[Vajramusti]

Oh dear, what other martial arts have you studied that didn't require contact?
--------------------------------------------------

Front Cover
Paul Dong, Thomas Raffill
0 Reviews
Blue Snake Books, Jan 19, 2006 - Sports & Recreation - 192 pages
Ling Kong Jing, the "Empty Force," is the highest martial arts skill in China. This extraordinary technique harnesses the power of chi, the body's vital energy, enabling masters of the art to defend themselves against opponents without making physical contact. The book takes readers step by step from theory to the actual practice used to generate Empty Force, and shows how to use its remarkable power for healing as well as self-defense.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
One of the disciples said that he would cook my liver from far without contact.<g>

[wingchunIan]

Oh dear, what other martial arts have you studied that didn't require contact?

I strongly suspect it was a joke, posted very tongue in cheek

[Vajramusti]

I strongly suspect it was a joke, posted very tongue in cheek
---------------------
The answer- empty force- was also a joke

[LFJ]

Oh dear, what other martial arts have you studied that didn't require contact?

Sorry if I didn't make it obvious, but don't be retarded. The point is punching and kicking techniques can be learned on a bag and applied straight away. Most other MA's don't use or need chi-sau type interaction, but WC concepts must be developed into skill through chi-sau practice, otherwise they're largely useless.

[Ali. R]

Sorry if I didn't make it obvious, but don't be retarded. The point is punching and kicking techniques can be learned on a bag and applied straight away. Most other MA's don't use or need chi-sau type interaction, but WC concepts must be developed into skill through chi-sau practice, otherwise they're largely useless.

Which is true, but if someone can’t move their feet right, they won’t generate enough balance in which one needs to have to hit a moving target with power.

With good form and strategy one's strikes will most of the time land first, but without good balance/mobility; power, form and technique will never develop. And that's with wing chun as well.

[Ali. R]

What you’re about to see here is something I’ll do every other day of the week, about 200 three minute rounds. I like welterweights mostly because of the faster workouts.

NOTE: 'Fury' is on his 8th round right before the other rookies walked in, and he’s on his way out (sapped energy), but still kept form, balance and technique while moving his feet at the same time. But when I’d see them trying to stop before I said it’s over, and then I’ll push them a little harder.

The other kid did ok, but when it was time for him to move his feet, it went ugly and without power. I know this has been voted the worst pad work ever (http://youtu.be/y32rriFr9cw)here on this forum by you guys, so let’s just stay with my premise.

[pazman]

Sorry if I didn't make it obvious, but don't be retarded. The point is punching and kicking techniques can be learned on a bag and applied straight away. Most other MA's don't use or need chi-sau type interaction, but WC concepts must be developed into skill through chi-sau practice, otherwise they're largely useless.

Sorry, a bit of a joke on my part, but I think you should be careful of calling people "retarded."

You're original post seemed to indicate that other martial arts only have techniques while Wing Chun is unique in being based on "concepts".

[anerlich]

Most other MA's don't use or need chi-sau type interaction, but WC concepts must be developed into skill through chi-sau practice, otherwise they're largely useless.

That sounds like a weakness where Wing Chun is concerned.

[LFJ]

Sorry, a bit of a joke on my part, but I think you should be careful of calling people "retarded."

You're original post seemed to indicate that other martial arts only have techniques while Wing Chun is unique in being based on "concepts".

Didn't call anyone retarded, just don't be if you aren't. :)

Compared to many traditional martial arts, that is the case.


That sounds like a weakness where Wing Chun is concerned.

How do you mean?

[k gledhill]

That sounds like a weakness where Wing Chun is concerned.

VT is strong....weakness is in errors. Aka not understanding very BASIC fundamentals.

[anerlich]

How do you mean?

You said:

"Most other MA's don't use or need chi-sau type interaction, but WC concepts must be developed into skill through chi-sau practice, otherwise they're largely useless."

You basically said other MA's don't require chi sao practice, but WC is largely useless without it.

One possible conclusion would be that other MA's are better because they work without chi sao practice. One less requirement for success.

Unless you are implying that most other MA's are useless, which IMO would be ... dare I say it ... retarded.

All MA's require drilling, and practice against non-compliant partners/opponents. Chi sao is not magic and arguably not unique in purpose.


Compared to many traditional martial arts, that is the case.

What about non traditional arts? WC is hardly the only concept based art.

[LFJ]

You basically said other MA's don't require chi sao practice, but WC is largely useless without it.

One possible conclusion would be that other MA's are better because they work without chi sao practice. One less requirement for success.

There's a difference in strategy & tactics, hence training tools, final product, and "success". WC can't do without chi-sau because of its strategy & tactics which differ in other arts and consequently don't require chi-sau to do what they do. It is my experience and opinion that chi-sau skill will make you a better fighter than without, provided it's not a game of sticky hand chasing and is about hitting the person, because I am of the opinion that WC has superior strategy & tactics.. which require chi-sau practice. :)

[k gledhill]

You said:

"Most other MA's don't use or need chi-sau type interaction, but WC concepts must be developed into skill through chi-sau practice, otherwise they're largely useless."

You basically said other MA's don't require chi sao practice, but WC is largely useless without it.

One possible conclusion would be that other MA's are better because they work without chi sao practice. One less requirement for success.

Unless you are implying that most other MA's are useless, which IMO would be ... dare I say it ... retarded.

All MA's require drilling, and practice against non-compliant partners/opponents. Chi sao is not magic and arguably not unique in purpose.



What about non traditional arts? WC is hardly the only concept based art.

Its obvious you dont know what chi-sao is for, you're an assumptive egomaniac.

[anerlich]

Its obvious you dont know what chi-sao is for

Opinions vary. your entitlement is but one.


You're an assumptive egomaniac.

I'm cut to the quick. *yawn*

OK ... I'm am assumptive egomaniac. One you apparently still can't ignore, Kev.

[k gledhill]

Opinions vary, yours is of little consequence



An assumptive egomaniac you apparently still can't ignore, Kev.

That matters ? it doesnt change the fact you're uninformed and casting assumptions like your opinion has weight ??? it doesnt dude, regardless of the reply.

[anerlich]

it doesnt change the fact you're uninformed and casting assumptions like your opinion has weight ???

Look who's talking.

[anerlich]

There's a difference in strategy & tactics, hence training tools, final product, and "success". WC can't do without chi-sau because of its strategy & tactics which differ in other arts and consequently don't require chi-sau to do what they do. It is my experience and opinion that chi-sau skill will make you a better fighter than without, provided it's not a game of sticky hand chasing and is about hitting the person, because I am of the opinion that WC has superior strategy & tactics.. which require chi-sau practice. :)

OK, that makes sense.

[k gledhill]

Look who's talking.

:D so you met PB, WSL, exchanged ideas ?

[anerlich]

:D so you met PB, WSL, exchanged ideas ?

Hate to break it to you: neither of them have/had the exclusive.

[k gledhill]

Hate to break it to you: neither of them have/had the exclusive.

How do you have the ability to make such an informed opinion ?

[Graham H]

How do you have the ability to make such an informed opinion ?

He uses a keyboard and that's about it.

[GlennR]

He uses a keyboard and that's about it.

As opposed to you oh fearsome pbwslvt killing machine?

Bwahahahahaha.......

[Graham H]

Refer to my post on the other thread :rolleyes:

[anerlich]

Kevin seems to be having lots of problems getting the ignore list to work, as I seem to somehow continually slip through. My posts seem to upset him, and the level of vituperation in his replies indicate an increasing level of angst and desperation with this situation.

I've added him to my ignore list, and, surprisingly, it works perfectly!

Just to double check, I added "Gentleman" Graham H to the list as well.

I'm going to leave it this way for a little while. As you all can imagine, I'm still not quite over being subject to the heinous insult from Kevin of being called an "assumptive egomaniac". Where are the moderators when you need them? How can they stand back in the face of such torrid abuse?

I've got a significant backlog of Phillip Bayer competition chi sao vids from the forum to work my way through and don't want to be distracted from that fascinating endeavour by further banter with Kev and Graham.

[Vajramusti]

Has anyone here learned total 100% or mostly 100% from videos and books?-
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Since the thread is going as many do like a runaway train- I am commenting on your original question:


Ip Man (with Chan Wah Son and Leung Bik) Ho kam ming with Ip Man, Augustine Fong with Ho kam
Ming, Luis Ming Fai- all spent 7 to 8 years regularly learning regularly - not depending on books, videos or an occasional seminar or two. from their competent teachers..


But the common learning patterns these days appear to be quite different- perhaps accounting
for the disastrous state of much of wing chun.

IMO fwiw wing chun schools should shrink rather than expand until they get a handle on quality control.