Over active bladder?

[PHILBERT]

Ok, I noticed recently since I started taking creatine, EAS protein drinks, and phoso fuel (creatine and phoso fuel by twin labs), I been drinking more water in a day than I have in a weeks time in the past. But I also take a **** alot. Like ALOT. Like 12 times a day (seriously, I counted). Sometimes within an hour of my last. Is this to be expected while taking creatine and drinking water while working out? Or am I getting screwed and being put in deep water? I don't know who else here has had creatine and maybe ****ed alot, but it is somewhat annoying, waking up at 2 am to ****.

PHILBERT

[prana]

sounds normal.

[Repulsive Monkey]

As far as normal bodily functions are concerned this is defintely abnormal.

[Shaolin]

It could be simply just the way your intaking it. When taking a creatine supplement it needs to be taken with juice not water, generically speaking the juice acts as a transporter, the muscles aborb the creatine better this way. If taking the creatine with just water it can go right through your system which could be why you go #2 so much.

[ElPietro]

It's normal...when you are working out you are probably taking in more food...or your metabolic rate is greater which means your body is processing nutrients at a quicker rate. Creatine will still get into your cells with water but it's maximized when sugar is added. The best form of sugar for this purpose is dextrose which you can buy like 2lb bags for next to nothing at a grocery store. Grape juice is the best fruit juice to aid in transport...some sugars don't really help at all.

[PHILBERT]

Actually I just **** alot. I don't have any other problems with going to the bathroom each day. I just **** like 12 times a day.

PHILBERT

[PHILBERT]

Egad! I just now realized it stars out p*ss. I mean I potty alot. Pee, not take a cr*p! Hahahaha, just goes to show how whacked out the censors are sometimes!

PHILBERT

[prana]

yeah by products of organic digestion usually ends up in water and carbon dioxide, which explains the frequency, not to mention the extra water you are taking in.

Also, your body is probably trying to cleanse the extra lactic acid caused by the creatine. Might contribute to having the urgency ?

"...during adsorbtion, you are pronounced medically dead, but don't worry, you can breath through your skin, ears..."

[Repulsive Monkey]

going to the toilet 12 times a day is abnormal. If you are losing more body fluids than you are taking in (IF that is!!) then you could be imapiring your health, both your Kidneys and your lungs as in Chinese Medicine they govern and control water in the body. Drying out of the body can help develop Yin Deficiency disharmonies in organs.

[PHILBERT]

Repulsive Monkey, I am drinking a s|-|it load more water now a day than I have in a week. So I am not drying my body, I am just drinking more water. I know creatine makes you thirsty, so I drink about a gallon of water a day. My brother use to take creatine and he could drink a gallon in less than 5 minutes, room temperature. I guess because of all the extra water I drink, my body is releasing the water it doesn't need. Because after I drink about 2 cups of water, within 2 hours I am in the bathroom taking a wizz. So I am keeping myself hydrated.

PHILBERT

[Repulsive Monkey]

the best health advice to given here Philbert, is quite simply cut out the Creatine. Massive amounts of water on a daily basis is potentially bad for your long term health. It can create internal dampness which can slow the bodies functions down and produce lethargy, odema, slower relfex actions, general tiredness etc. Why do you put your body through this regime???

[IronFist]

Listen, when you first increase your fluid intake, your body will pee a lot of it out. After your body becomes used to it, it will stop. You will pee less frequently, but there will be a lot more pee per trip to the bathroom.

Your body holds water when there is a deficit of it. ie. If you stop drinking for a while, your body will hold on to what little water it has. I've come from a somewhate dehydrated state before and drank almost half a gallon and then not had to pee for 12 hours.

On the other hand, when there is a surplus of water coming into your body, your body won't hold on to it because it thinks "hey, more's on the way, so let's get rid of this." After a while, it gets accustomed to this new level of water (gallon+ per day) and stops thinking of it as a surplus, and therefore you will hold water more, gaining a few pounds, and at any one moment there will be more water in your body than before. But, like I said, when you go pee you will pee a lot because you're holding more water.

Iron

[ElPietro]

Repulsive Monkey can you please provide more detail on your thoughts of long term damage caused by drinking large quantities of water? I've never heard anything like that before and can't think of any way it could be true. Your body is 70% water and uses water to help flush out your internal systems.

I can see drowning as a short-term damaging effect of too much water ;), but please articulate what you have stated if possible. Thanks.

[prana]

Repulsive Monkey, just on that note. Taking creatine is also "bad" because it increases the "breathing" rate which in tantrayana is considered bad, because it shortens life and also decreases mindfulness. But that is of course, if you believe... :)

But honestly, I wouldnt take supplements either, but that is just my own opinion :)

El Pietro, if I understand correctly, "I think" Repulsive Monkey also believes drinking water is good for you, he is merely saying that drinking less than passing water is a bad sign of sickness. I think he is just saying to cut down on Creatine, not to cut down on water intake :) And of course, too much of anything is not good for you.


"...during adsorbtion, you are pronounced medically dead, but don't worry, you can breath through your skin, ears..."

[PHILBERT]

I take ONE pill, just ONE before my workout. Not two. And none after. The product said "Take 6 pills a day, 3 before and 3 after." I also read that you **** out the creatine your body doesn't use (I.E., 5 pills you litereally flush down the toilet). So I don't take alot of creatine. Honestly, I take, at most, and this is at most (as in I work out my "normal" training week) 6 creatine pills.

I also would take 12 phoso fuel pills. (I take 2 of those even though it reccommends 4). I don't take exactly what it reccomends, because I can't buy creatine every 10 days (6 times a day x 10=60 amount of pills per bottle.) But on average, now this is average, I take 4-5 creatine pills a week, and only 8-10 phoso fuel pills.

I put my body through this because I need to increase my muscle mass, and for some reason, my muscle mass does not increase normally. I have been working out for almost 6 years now. I have only increased the amount I can bench 50 pounds in 5 years. I would watch people around me who, at the age of 15, could bench more than I can now. I don't bench anymore, because I heard it was bad for your elbows (plus I just hated it, I almost dislocated my shoulder benching my normal amount.) So I focus on push ups and other means of enhancing chest muscles.

I weigh 170 lb. I just graduated high school at the weight of 150 lb. I had weighed 150 lb. since I was in the 9th grade. Yes, I had not increased my weight (well, the average was 150) in 4 years. My body just rejects food (even healthy) and won't let me put on weight. So I have to look into other means of enhancing my body weight and muscle mass.

My brother took creatine and all those other muscle enhancers, and as far as I can tell, he had no side effects. His arms are 3 times what they use to be. He could curl my body weight at the gym. He stopped taking creatine (because he followed the instructions they gave) and found it too expensive. Well, I don't want to take 6 a day and have to buy a new bottle each week because I flush 5 pills a day down the toilet. So I just take 1 a day before my work out then drink a protein drink after my work out.

PHILBERT

[IronFist]

PHILBERT I would say if you haven't grown in 5 years you're not eating enough :)

No I'm serious. Read through some of my posts here I explain the necessity to eat like a horse while trying to gain muscle. 1g protein per pound of bodyweight.

But what are your goals? Increased strength? Or increased muscle mass?

Iron

[PHILBERT]

I want to get stronger, while look stronger. I am not wanting some huge body, but just well toned, able to see my abs and all. And believe me, I eat like a horse. I use to eat like 4-5 times a day, pizza, ice cream, everything. I took in over 3000 calories a day. I just burned it off (I have an incredibly high metabolism. People envy me for it.) I hate it though, but hey, the junk food went straight through me, so I don't have to sit there and work 10 times harder to loose weight around my belly from eating junk food for so long. So I guess there is an advantage there.

PHILBERT

[IronFist]

3000 calories a day isn't that much. The "FDA recommended" is 2000 per day, or 2,500 if you're active or whatever. That doesn't include people trying to GAIN weight (most people are trying to lose weight... as evidenced by food marketing strategies). Try 4, 5, or 6000 a day, but slowly work up to it. Also if you're trying to bulk, pretty much forget about cardio.

But dude I know what you mean. I have a fast metabolism, too. I used to eat 5 or 6,000 a day and I still couldn't get above 173lbs at 8% bodyfat. My body won't add fat :) knock on wood :) So, I've pretty much given up the bodybuilding thing because my body isn't suited to handle it. And, there are some major reasons here:

1. When combined with my already fast metabolism, eating 5000+ calories a day made me hot as hell. I would literally sweat, non stop, regardless of the environment. Try wearing a t-shirt to class in the winter because your body is producing so much heat.

2. Eating more naturally makes your metabolism speed up, and with my already fast metabolism, it went crazy. If, for whatever reason, I had to miss a meal, at which time my body would be craving food, I would get immensely hungry, sometimes to the point of not being able to do anything because my body would be expecting food.

3. I can't afford to eat as much as I needed to. I quickly ran out of money buying a large pizza every night for my second dinner.

You'll notice that some people eat like ****e, but grow like crazy. They suck. For ectomorphs, it's hard to put on weight, but whatever we do get on is shredded because we have naturally low bodyfat. I guess it's a compromise.

Iron

[PHILBERT]

I got body fat alright. I can grab anywhere on my body just about (except certain points on my legs) and locate fat. But I got an advantage. I still live at home, so I can just make my mom buy me more food. hehe. College rules.

I do cardio to remove the fat off my belly and I've gained 20 pounds this previous summer. But I also take some weight gainers to get a little bit more. I gained 10 pounds in a week, mostly muscle.

PHILBERT

[Repulsive Monkey]

for mirroring my intent here. Prana is correcting for standing up for what I intended (and sometimes I don't it clear enough)thoughts on the matter. Water consumption is necessary of course, but too much will create in Chinese Medical terms what is known as internal damp. This will slow down the body and create all the symptoms of "Damp". My (slow) understanding now is that this is all about muscle development, am I right? Well why do you desire these obvious and asthetic development? How will it enhance your present state in life in real terms? I mean if it was a replacement therapy due to Muscular Atrophy I could understand, but if its for asthetics then it would seem natural that to do something unnatural to the body will obviously present unnatural side effects.
I know this sounds all rather pompous but its just an opinion of course, as easy forgotten as easily it is said.

[ElPietro]

In a few years when all the paranoia about creatine has been laid to rest you will see it used as a supplement for people in all walks of life. It is a naturally occuring amino acid in your body.

[IronFist]

PHILBERT,

I forgot to mention, that unless you're on drugs or a complete beginner, it's pretty much impossible to lose bodyfat and build muscle at the same time. You cannot do both. There are biological reasonings for this, but I don't have time right now so just take my word for it, ok?

As evidence, however, look at bodybuilders. In the off season, they get fat and bulk up. They don't look like bodybuilders then, they look like giant marshmellows. This is because only by this method of bulking up and adding fat can a maximum of muscle be added as well. Then when contest time comes, they diet off the fat and strive to maintain as much muscle as possible. Granted, they all lose a bit of muscle while dieting, but drugs and crazy diets help to keep atrophy to a minimum. If it was possible to add muscle and lose fat at the same time, bodybuilders wouldn't need to get all fat in the offseason, they would just look ripped all year round instead.

Iron

[Repulsive Monkey]

if this Creatine is a naturally occuring Amino Acid in the body, then do just that! Let it occur naturally and not in a self dosed supplementary fashion.

[ElPietro]

Repulsive Monkey please feel free to remain a repulsive stick-boy never have muscle ancient chinese medical text reading, low muscle mass having ignoramus for the rest of your life if you wish...but why waste this boards space by making anyone who reads your posts significantly more stupid?

Can you please think before you post. If it's naturally ocurring don't supplement...so I guess you never take vitamins or anything like that. I guess there's no reason for your chinese medical text on any forms of naturally ocurring herbs that provide vitamins your body already produces...we should all just eat as we are now and live to 100 years old. Does the fact that you are putting your body through more stress therefore it requires more nutrients mean anything at all to you? or have you overlooked a basic simple-to-understand point in life, not just bodybuilding. I guess a race car uses the same amount of fuel on the indy circuit as a honda civic on a side road. Maybe there's an area where you have some intelligent thoughs...so why don't you find the forum where that exists and post there instead of wasting our time here?

I haven't flamed anyone here before until you because what you say is just plain dumb. Sure everyone is entitled to an opinion...but some are just so dumb you should keep them to yourself.

[prana]

Repulsive Monkey and El Pietro,

I hope I don't inject a bad feeling in anyone of you by intervening.

I think one opinion comes from one who is an enthusiast in muscle development, western way of developing as such, which may include taking supplements. Such which follows the logic of western medicine and research into hyperthrophy, recruitment, creatine or whatever to maximise growth.

And another, a learnt follower of the eastern philosophy of energy control with knowledge behind the "marketing" of western medicines. One who believes in the "clean" sources of life energy, and preventing harm in the "meridian" body, and also the "natural" way of strengthening via/or control of Jing.

Kinda like 2 illuminating lamps on each side of a Sculpture. It highlights the otherwise shaded areas.
....

[Repulsive Monkey]

ElPietro,

This will probably be one of the last few returns I send you as are conversations are inceridbly imbalanaced (more so as you seem to lose your temper even more). Shall we just leave this conversation with my lifestyle doesn't need supplements to at all to support the 3-4 hours of daily training that I do. I have maintained my athletic musculature for many years with my regime and teachings from my teacher, and the effects I get from Acupuncture. I see that your regime and health beliefs are stringently different, and there appears to be a rigidity to even consider others ideas. I always state mt opnion becasue I have no wish to forcibly convert others like you seem to think that I try to.

If we are to agree on anything ElPietro then let us close this dialogue between us on the premise that we disagree with each other. I am in no way saying that either one of us is correct or otherwise, just that being able to be considerate to each others views would seem to have too many obstacles in its way.

Thanks for taking the time to read all my responses ElPietro and I have found enlightening to scan yours too. I have recived insights from you.

[Repulsive Monkey]

Thanks for your message it was welcomed, and highlighting.

Cheers brother.

[Jeff Brown]

Creatine ain't good for you. I wouldn't take it.

"Once I have harnessed the power of the Sun, I will be UNSTOPPABLE!" -- Mini-Me

[ElPietro]

Agreed. Repulsive Monkey my apologies for going off a bit and posting in anger. I would still be interested in some background information on some of your statements. But we can let things lie...

On the other hand it is still irritating that posts like these crop up:

"Creatine ain't good for you. I wouldn't take it."

Meng Shuo perhaps you could elaborate a bit on your in-depth analysis? I guess if creatine isn't good for you it wouldn't be stored in every muscle cell in your body...your body wouldn't produce it every single day as a necessary amino acid...and we'd all be suffering when we eat since it is contained in many food products...but then again...what do I know...like I said make a statement...back it up with at least a shred of information. Thanks.

[prana]

RM & EP

Peace :)

[Gluteus Maximus]

Creatine is natural (occurs mainly in red meat), but the amount often recommended to be taken to increase muscle mass (25-30 grams per day loading dose and 5-10 grams per day maintenance dose) is not a natural amount. We'd have to eat the equivalent of a whole cow or more each day to get that amount in our diet. Whether it's bad for us to take that amount or not, I don't know. I've heard rumours suggesting it's bad but haven't personally read the results of any studies on the adverse effects of high creatine doses.

Max

Yooby Yoody

[Shaolin36]

I have experienced this and so has alot of my friends. It is normal for some peoples bodies to react this way. The runs and alot of ****. Creatine takes water and pulls it into your muscle instead of it being on the surface of your muscle, this is why you experience a little growth while on it. This is also while you drink more water. As for the ****ing part, I think because your drinking more water your body gets to that hydrated stage and needs to aaleviate the overconsumption of water. I would not cut down on your water intake though.

I would also suggest that you cycle creatine, 1 month on, 1 month off- for two reasons.

So your not constantly putting your kidneys in overdrive and,

To help retain your size a little better. For some reason while on creatine you will be able to lift heavier weights and fromn that you will grow, if you stay on it constantly you will grow but when you come off you will shrink alot(this is if you are off it for a while) but if you cycle it you will help retain some weight during your off month and then groww in small steps so your body in a sense will own the weight you gain instead of thinking of it as temporary weight.

Hope that made sense,

Shaolin

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