POLL: is this match real?

[lkfmdc]

We've argued over the 1954 wu kung yi vs chan hak fu match. We've argued over that "wushu star" show and its fake matches... well, let's try this one!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQcrOm6ATzM

I have people on facebook who think it is 100% real match.

[GoldenBrain]

That was like watching a professional wrestling match, or maybe a train wreck, it's hard to tell.

[lkfmdc]

and yet there are people who SWEAR it is real :rolleyes:

[GoldenBrain]

and yet there are people who SWEAR it is real :rolleyes:

Scary isn't it? I'd say thanks for the entertaining video but truthfully I'd like to have that 4 minutes and 37 seconds of my life back. :D

[YouKnowWho]

It's a fake match. The reason is simple.

- In reality, it's not that easy to break a clinch apart.
- At 1.48, Huang used his right hand to push his opponent's chin. Anybody even without any MA training would try to use his left hand to push Huang's right chin pushing hand away.
- ...

[Jimbo]

It just looks like an exhibition to me, and not a very good one, either.

[Dragonzbane76]

Looks like a pro wrestling match today with out of shape old guys.

[Kymus]

Totally CGI :p

[tc101]

We've argued over the 1954 wu kung yi vs chan hak fu match. We've argued over that "wushu star" show and its fake matches... well, let's try this one!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQcrOm6ATzM

I have people on facebook who think it is 100% real match.

Not a real match by today's standards but I think a real match by their standards. I think there were unspoken conventions or gentlemen agreements in these sorts of matches and they were not fights as we think of them but more as demonstrations of skill with a semi resisting opponent so that each could show their supposed goods.

[lkfmdc]

An obvious question (and problem for those calling it "real"); this "champion wrestler" doesn't pummel, he doesn't go for over and under hooks, his head is in the wrong position, he attempts no snap downs, no headlocks, no duck unders, he makes no attempts at leg takedowns ... the whole thing should be rather obviously fake... but, again, a few swear by it

[sanjuro_ronin]

It was a real exhibition match for fun with a pre-determined end result.
:D

[tc101]

An obvious question (and problem for those calling it "real"); this "champion wrestler" doesn't pummel, he doesn't go for over and under hooks, his head is in the wrong position, he attempts no snap downs, no headlocks, no duck unders, he makes no attempts at leg takedowns ... the whole thing should be rather obviously fake... but, again, a few swear by it

Good or skilled is a different question. You are assuming that if it is real then you would see good wrestling but what if he is not good so called champion or not? Then you may not see pummeling, snap downs, good head position and so on all you see is really poor wrestling. In fact if it was worked I would expect to see a better display of skills since they are easier to pull off when the opponent cooperates.

[lkfmdc]

Good or skilled is a different question. You are assuming that if it is real then you would see good wrestling but what if he is not good so called champion or not? Then you may not see pummeling, snap downs, good head position and so on all you see is really poor wrestling. In fact if it was worked I would expect to see a better display of skills since they are easier to pull off when the opponent cooperates.

it doesn't have to be good, but it should be there!
It is TOTALLY ABSENT

It would be like advertisign someone as a "boxer" and them not even trying to punch!

So, do YOU think it is real?

[tc101]

it doesn't have to be good, but it should be there!
It is TOTALLY ABSENT

It would be like advertisign someone as a "boxer" and them not even trying to punch!

So, do YOU think it is real?

As I said I think it is real by their culture and time period but not by our standards and time period.

I agree with you that this is extremely poor wrestling but I think that was unfortunately the norm at that time. Thanks to mma we now have been exposed to good wrestling for fighting and we look with educated eyes. If you saw that same clip 30 years ago or when it was made most of the wrestling uneducated would not see the problems.

Even if a complete work would you not expect to see the basics of good wrestling? We did not see them because he did not have them.

[lkfmdc]

As I said I think it is real by their culture and time period but not by our standards and time period.



that is a "non answer"... it is either a real match or not




I agree with you that this is extremely poor wrestling but I think that was unfortunately the norm at that time.


That is around 1960! You don't think there was real wrestling in 1960!




Even if a complete work would you not expect to see the basics of good wrestling? We did not see them because he did not have them.

What I see was a "set up" to "sell" magical taiji chi power skills, so the so called "wrestler" falls down for no reason half the time

[tc101]

that is a "non answer"... it is either a real match or not


OK then by your standards no it isn't.




That is around 1960! You don't think there was real wrestling in 1960!


Sure but there was also a lot of really bad wrestling particularly from the TCMA bunch.



What I see was a "set up" to "sell" magical taiji chi power skills, so the so called "wrestler" falls down for no reason half the time

I also think what it was was a demo using semi resistance with a poor wrestler to show off the tai ji guy. Sort of like if you had one of your students who was a really bad boxer lightly spar with you to showcase your skills. Not really a work, not a 100% match, but a match to demonstrate something.

[Lucas]

two old fat guys playing patty cake? totally real.

[MasterKiller]

Silicon tits are real in the sense that I can touch them, but...

[MasterKiller]

This is what real fighting looks like...

http://d24w6bsrhbeh9d.cloudfront.net/photo/aYbNO3m_700ba.gif

[md1]

Yea it's real alright... REAL Fake, as a MoFo

[lkfmdc]

a facebook discussion on this produced this gem :rolleyes:

" Taijiquan, Xingyi, Bagua, Liu He Ba Fa, Wujiquan, and a number of others all use a different type of strength than normal strength... "

a different type of strength? at times like this I wish TaigihkYaan was still around

[bawang]

a facebook discussion on this produced this gem :rolleyes:

" Taijiquan, Xingyi, Bagua, Liu He Ba Fa, Wujiquan, and a number of others all use a different type of strength than normal strength... "

a different type of strength? at times like this I wish TaigihkYaan was still around

u need to get him to come back, restore HONER of kung fu

[Scott R. Brown]

What I saw was two men wrestling with reality, either that or a wrestling match in which wrestling was not allowed!

[Scott R. Brown]

a facebook discussion on this produced this gem :rolleyes:

" Taijiquan, Xingyi, Bagua, Liu He Ba Fa, Wujiquan, and a number of others all use a different type of strength than normal strength... "

a different type of strength? at times like this I wish TaigihkYaan was still around

It was a demonstration of, The Art of Fighting, Without Fighting!

[YouKnowWho]

a different type of strength?
Someone mentioned this in another forum. This is the 1st time that I heard "blood power".

"tendon power ... meridian Qi power ... muscle power ... bone power ... blood power..."

[Pork Chop]

Heard that thing was pretty bad back in like 94, but still wanted to see it.
Not a real fight for sure.
Was going to posit that maybe it was a "stiff" wrestling match, but upon seeing it, I would *never* go that far.
I might go so far to say that it's an awkward push hands session...

[Lucas]

i think that chick with the solid jaw in mk's post should fight the tranny dude from the mma thread

[Dragonzbane76]

different type of strength? at times like this I wish TaigihkYaan was still around


what ever happened to him?