This forms / style

[HmorenoM]

Hello people, well, i found this on YT and i'd like to know if someone here could tell me what style is, or if it's just a free-flow with some weapons :)

Thank you very much
Respect

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=myZSH9KrYnQ

[PalmStriker]

Exhibition WuShu . :)

[mickey]

Greetings,

I wouldn't call it wushu. He is pretty polished. His name: Fu Shun Nan.

At 1:27 in the following link he is doing what looks like Cha Chuan. It is very well done, without the wushu flair. Taken in South Africa:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgB_hDxselY

I guess he put those up himself. Try contacting him thru u tube.


mickey

[mickey]

Greetings,

More Info:

http://www.naturalstylekungfu.com/martinez.html



mickey

[YouKnowWho]

Exhibition WuShu . :)
When he left China and moved to Taiwan with his father back in 1948, The WuShu was not even born in China yet. His TCMA has zero influence from the modern WuShu.


Greetings,

I wouldn't call it wushu. He is pretty polished. His name: Fu Shun Nan.

At 1:27 in the following link he is doing what looks like Cha Chuan. It is very well done, without the wushu flair. Taken in South Africa:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgB_hDxselY

I guess he put those up himself. Try contacting him thru u tube.


mickey

傅松南: Fu Song Nan learned from his father 傅嘉賔：Fu Jia Bin when he was young. His father was a big strong guy and famous in Guan Dao.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.274408894369.145540.246585164369&type=3

In Taiwan he became the longfist GM Han Chin-Tang's disciple.

Here is a clip when he was much younger.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OaNj078V84o&feature=youtu.be

Last time when he was in my house that was almost 30 years ago. He wrote 3 books about he traveled with his father in Taiwan by performing TCMA on the street for living. He had performed in circus and traveled around the world. He taught in Beijing opera school in Taiwan for many years. He is the guy who can tell you many interested TCMA stories.

[mickey]

Greetings,

That was great info, YouKnowWho.

That would make Fu Shun Nan the go to guy to learn Shaolin Long Fist. His approach/flavor is much different from other practitioners that I have seen in the Han Ching Tan lineage. It is more spirited. I like it very much.

Do you Know what style his father practiced?


mickey

[David Jamieson]

looks like North Shaolin usage.

I think this is probably pek kwar dao.
Just a guess, but it has the hallmarks.

[Jimbo]

Whatever he learned from Han Ching-Tan would have been from the Cha Quan and/or Mei Hua Quan Long Fist styles.

It has no connection to the mainland China Standardized performance wushu.

[bawang]

Whatever he learned from Han Ching-Tan would have been from the Cha Quan and/or Mei Hua Quan Long Fist styles.

It has no connection to the mainland China Standardized performance wushu.

standard wushu comes from cha quan

[David Jamieson]

standard wushu comes from cha quan

And Hua. You are correct.

[Miqi]

Professional Chinese conetmporary wushu players are much better than those old traditional guys - at least at forms. Modern forms are infinitely superior, the athletes massively fitter, stronger, more flexible, more agile and more technically skilled. When I see old videos like this, I just see something that is waiting to evolve into proper wushu forms by becoming faster, stronger, more technically challenging and more well trained, thanks to the government investing massively in the development of this skill base. Yet, we have to listen all the time to the nonsense that the Chinese government killed wushu, and that the real wushu is infinitely inferior athletes. That makes me laugh all day.

[David Jamieson]

Professional Chinese conetmporary wushu players are much better than those old traditional guys - at least at forms. Modern forms are infinitely superior, the athletes massively fitter, stronger, more flexible, more agile and more technically skilled. When I see old videos like this, I just see something that is waiting to evolve into proper wushu forms by becoming faster, stronger, more technically challenging and more well trained, thanks to the government investing massively in the development of this skill base. Yet, we have to listen all the time to the nonsense that the Chinese government killed wushu, and that the real wushu is infinitely inferior athletes. That makes me laugh all day.

contemporary wushu does take athletic skill.
It doesn't offer any fight venues and there is certainly not much within the acrobatics that can be extrapolated out into drills and roadwork etc that one would find more useful for the task of actually fighting.

Contemporary wushu is gymnastics with martial flavour for the most part.
Old kung fu is ugly and boring because that's what fighting is. Well, ugly anyway. :)

[YouKnowWho]

Do you Know what style his father practiced?

I believe it was the northern Shaolin system (longfist, Lohan, ...).

His Da Dao clip.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBlLk-YoAkU

His open hand class.

http://www.wretch.cc/blog/a710067/13118026

The 3 books he wrote.

http://www.silkbook.com/search_result.asp?SearchOption=3&SearchText=%B3%C5%AAQ%ABn

http://news.gpwb.gov.tw/book.aspx?ydn=f2KgAkk4mpLkKacMaa%2B0zITBHLB99xnyw1 Uw6ryvrebuXqCzxBS78Uk1DTOoE3QTZIFgRMIGeI1sdg6GWWum h7qTN%2FUrojVvfL3seG3oXi4%3D

This was my longfist teacher (middle) and Fu's (left) picture (taken by 1954 in Taipei).

http://longfist.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/e69d8ee88081e5b8ab-001-e1335531329812.jpg

[mickey]

Greetings,

Thank you YouKnowWho.

I would take that guy over ANY wushu player produced in the last 35 years. It shouldn't be that way but it is that way. I have always recommended the wushu basic training curriculum. The weight lifting component was not introduced to the West; but, it was pretty obvious that the wushu guys did something beyond stretch, punch and kick. bawang has been ringing the bell about this for quite a while. He is right.

mickey

[bawang]

When he left China and moved to Taiwan with his father back in 1948, The WuShu was not even born in China yet. His TCMA has zero influence from the modern WuShu.



was his father the guy that had a falling out with jie wanshan?

[YouKnowWho]

Professional Chinese conetmporary wushu players are much better than those old traditional guys .
The modern Wushu does everything wrong.

If you look at the modern Wushu jumping front kick. You can see that the kicking leg (not the jumping leg) is straight (0.30, 1.01, 1.27, 1.30, ...). The knee is not bending. The final kick is done by locking the knee and swing the leg upward. The kicking path is a "curve".

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=wushu+front+kick&FORM=VIRE1#view=detail&mid=20CC6977250FF04800BC20CC6977250FF04800BC

If you look at this TCMA jump kick. The kicking starts from bending knee up as high as you can. the knee than extend and send the leg out. The final kicking path is a "straight line".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QK7-D-jwQCw&feature=youtu.be

Without "combat" in mind, the modern Wushu has changed many important guidelines which is bad for the future of the TCMA development.

[lkfmdc]

"wushu" is so normal people can be fooled and never learn any real fighting skill, that way they can never cause trouble for the central government

[YouKnowWho]

was his father the guy that had a falling out with jie wanshan?

You are right! His father's teacher was 吉萬三 jie wanshan.

http://longfist.wordpress.com/2011/12/31/%E5%82%85%E5%98%89%E8%B3%93%E8%80%81%E5%B8%AB/

His father got into a group fight in China and won the fight. His opponents started to throw rocks at him and sent him to hospital. When he was in hospital, he told his friends that his TCMA teacher did not teach him "how to dodge rocks throwing".

[YouKnowWho]

"wushu" is so normal people can be fooled and never learn any real fighting skill, that way they can never cause trouble for the central government

By

- removing the "toe push kick" from Wushu, the front kick can't stop any incoming opponent.
- using the light weight Dao and Jian, the Wushu weapon can't be used for killing.

[bawang]

You are right! His father's teacher was 吉萬三 jie wanshan.

http://longfist.wordpress.com/2011/12/31/%E5%82%85%E5%98%89%E8%B3%93%E8%80%81%E5%B8%AB/

His father got into a group fight in China and won the fight. The other groups started to throw rocks at him and sent him to hospital. When he was in hospital, he told his friends that his TCMA teacher did not teach him "how to dodge rocks throwing".

his father is the harbin traffic director who held a fundraiser for Japanese occupation force and got kicked out by jie wanshan?

[YouKnowWho]

his father is the harbin traffic director who held a fundraiser for Japanese occupation force and got kicked out by jie wanshan?

Don't think that was true.

[bawang]

Don't think that was true.

his son jie donglin said in a interview, but didn't reveal first name, only fu.

[Kellen Bassette]

By

- removing the "toe push kick" from Wushu, the front kick can't stop any incoming opponent.
- using the light weight Dao and Jian, the Wushu weapon can't be used for killing.

Modern Wushu changed bent leg kick to a dancer's leg swing, changed kicking with the ball of the foot to pointed toe, changed heel side kick to bladed foot, made the stances unrealistically low, swapped real swords for tinfoil, and traded the laborer's clothes for sparkly pajamas.

It took the teeth out of TCMA.

[Kellen Bassette]

Professional Chinese conetmporary wushu players are much better than those old traditional guys - at least at forms. Modern forms are infinitely superior, the athletes massively fitter, stronger, more flexible, more agile and more technically skilled. When I see old videos like this, I just see something that is waiting to evolve into proper wushu forms by becoming faster, stronger, more technically challenging and more well trained, thanks to the government investing massively in the development of this skill base. Yet, we have to listen all the time to the nonsense that the Chinese government killed wushu, and that the real wushu is infinitely inferior athletes. That makes me laugh all day.

I don't understand. If you want to dance, take dance. If you want to do gymnastics, do gymnastics, if you want to fight, fight. What does contemporary Wushu offer? :confused:

[mickey]

Greetings,

Kellen Bassette, their basic training is it, really. It does offer better training longevity.

I had the chance to watch a dvd that featured traditional and professional students of Sha style bagua. I had to open the windows because the traditionally trained students almost sucked all the air out of my apartment. The older, pro trained, athletes faired much better.

mickey

[YouKnowWho]

Here is another example of the TCMA training. In the beginner training stage, your teacher would ask you to hold your kicking leg out. He then put bricks on top of your instep. You have to hold your leg out with weight while standing one single leg for a certain period of time.


I don't believe modern Wushu still has this training.

[lkfmdc]

Here is another example of the TCMA training. In the beginner training stage, your teacher would ask you to hold your kicking leg out. He then put bricks on top of your instep. You have to hold your leg out with weight while standing one single leg for a certain period of time.


I don't believe modern Wushu still has this training.

we used to have a sand filled pad that tied to the shin/calf so you had weight when you did stretch and crescent kicking, this was a good and simple device

[Golden Arms]

We just used the lead or shot filled leg weights you can fasten around the ankle to do this type of training.

[Kellen Bassette]

Did you guys train this for practical kicks as well, or just stretch kicks? I worry about hyper extension, has that been a problem while training this way?

[bawang]

Did you guys train this for practical kicks as well, or just stretch kicks? I worry about hyper extension, has that been a problem while training this way?

its supposed to be used for running.

[YouKnowWho]

its supposed to be used for running.

It's not a good idea. I used to put ankle weight on my ankle for running. When I detected it started to hurt my knee joint, I stopped using it.

[Golden Arms]

Did you guys train this for practical kicks as well, or just stretch kicks? I worry about hyper extension, has that been a problem while training this way?

Footwork and holding positions. Doing explosive movement with weight on your feet can be a great recipe for screwing up your knees and hips.

[lkfmdc]

never snap the knee, but especially never snap the knee with weight on the leg

stretch kick and crescent kicks are "swings"

[-N-]

Did you guys train this for practical kicks as well, or just stretch kicks? I worry about hyper extension, has that been a problem while training this way?

When I was in high school and college, I wore 5lb ankle weights on each leg. Just walking around and going up and down stairs to classes made my kicks very fast. Don't wear them for kicking.

I took off the weights only for sparring and taking a shower. I even wore them to sleep.
One English teacher used to make fun of me and claimed I was wearing orange socks all the time.

Then I took TKD which ruined my kicks, haha.

[Kellen Bassette]

Then I took TKD which ruined my kicks, haha.

:cool: Lol..nice...

[-N-]

:cool: Lol..nice...

Seriously. My sihing came back from UCLA after a year and asked, "wtf happened to your kicks???"