Grappling art solo training

[YouKnowWho]

Chinese wrestling has both partner drills and solo drills. You usually learn the partner drills first before you learn the solo drills. This order is quite different from most of the TCMA striking art training. Some grappling art such as wrestling or Judo may not have solo drills. Why? What's your opinion on this?

partner drill: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFgVrUMzZZE

solo drill: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kzCn-SAKsM

[-N-]

Chinese wrestling has both partner drills and solo drills. You usually learn the partner drills first before you learn the solo drills. This order is quite different from most of the TCMA striking art training. Some grappling art such as wrestling or Judo may not have solo drills. Why? What's your opinion on this?

partner drill: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFgVrUMzZZE

solo drill: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kzCn-SAKsM

Might depend on the teacher.

My teacher introduced new applications as solo drills, then had us pair up after practicing for a few minutes.

[YouKnowWho]

It's so clear to see exactly what's going on in this partner drill clip.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFgVrUMzZZE

It's not that easy to see what's going on in this solo drill clip.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kzCn-SAKsM

Sometime I think the TCMA teaching method that teach solo form first and application later may confuse students big time.

If your teacher taught you the following solo drill without telling you the application, will you be able to figure out what you are doing?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxVjYiWnH6U&feature=youtu.be

[-N-]

It's so clear to see exactly what's going on in this partner drill clip.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFgVrUMzZZE

It's not that easy to see what's going on in this solo drill clip.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kzCn-SAKsM

Sometime I think the TCMA teaching method that teach solo form first and application later may confuse students big time.


If the partner usage isn't shown until much later, there's a good chance the student will practice solo with completely wrong focus on where/how to put focus, force, and energy.


If your teacher taught you the following solo drill without telling you the application, will you be able to figure out what you are doing?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxVjYiWnH6U&feature=youtu.be

Looks like direct his lead arm to the opposite side, overhook, spin to the outside, wrap his arm backward across your body/arm, pressure his elbow, and block his footwork to throw.

[-N-]

This order is quite different from most of the TCMA striking art training. Some grappling art such as wrestling or Judo may not have solo drills. Why? What's your opinion on this?

There's a lot of "arm chair" kung fu. There's a difference between learning "about" kung fu, and learning "to do" kung fu.

Sometimes people get mixed up about what they actually are doing.

Solo drills are learning about the movement, which is different than learning to do the movement on a person.

[-N-]

If the partner usage isn't shown until much later, there's a good chance the student will practice solo with completely wrong focus on where/how to put focus, force, and energy.



Looks like direct his lead arm to the opposite side, overhook, spin to the outside, wrap his arm backward across your body/arm, pressure his elbow, and block his footwork to throw.

Or does that go deeper and you wrap his neck to throw?

Or....

Or...

Hahaha.

[SavvySavage]

If a student can't do a horse stance/cat stance solo than he definitely can't hold a horse stance while doing hip throw, IMO. It wools benefit that student to do strength drills like stances and squats. I grew though partner drilling is important to start quickly.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Solo training is about developing the attributes.
You can develop speed, power, endurance and flexibility in solo training.
Partner training is where you develop your ability to USE those attributes in a fight.
As long as you don't confuse the two, solo training is fine for grappling.

[Fa Xing]

Solo training is about developing the attributes.
You can develop speed, power, endurance and flexibility in solo training.
Partner training is where you develop your ability to USE those attributes in a fight.
As long as you don't confuse the two, solo training is fine for grappling.

Yeah last thing we need are 1000 move forms that teach the ultimate skillz of grappling :rolleyes::D

[lkfmdc]

Last few weeks I've been interviewed by Sinovision (USA edition) for a new show they are doing on "kung fu in America" (why am I on it? who knows :p LOL)

I spent a good time of it showing them solo movements and then REAL applications... they were pretty amazed that these things actually had practical applications :D

[lkfmdc]

If a student can't do a horse stance/cat stance solo than he definitely can't hold a horse stance while doing hip throw,



yeah, that's why Judoka, Samboists and wrestlers do hours of horse stance......

:rolleyes:

[lkfmdc]

Solo training is about developing the attributes.
You can develop speed, power, endurance and flexibility in solo training.
Partner training is where you develop your ability to USE those attributes in a fight.
As long as you don't confuse the two, solo training is fine for grappling.

Sanjuro has won the internet



This forum requires that you wait 30 seconds between posts.



screw you, I type fast :p

[SavvySavage]

yeah, that's why Judoka, Samboists and wrestlers do hours of horse stance......

:rolleyes:

I didn't say thousands of hours. I was talking about for weak people that have never done martial arts.

[YouKnowWho]

Sometime I think the TCMA teaching method that teach solo form first and application later may confuse students big time.

If your teacher taught you the following solo drill without telling you the application, will you be able to figure out what you are doing?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kzCn-SAKsM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxVjYiWnH6U&feature=youtu.be
What do you think the above concern that I have?

Someone once asked me the application of the SC basic form #4.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nvvhf36jhOs&feature=youtu.be

Apparently his SC coach didn't teach him the application. Why anybody wanted to learn something that he didn't even know what he was doing?

If we look at the SC basic form #4 clip, it has the arms moves but doesn't have the leg move. It was designed to teach beginners.

I like the solo drills that are identical to the partner drills. I don't like the simplify version solo drills that was designed for beginners. Since the solo drills that are identically to the partner drills are complicate and hard to understand without learning the partner drill application first. It makes no sense to learn those solo drills before learning partner drill application IMO.

[David Jamieson]

I read this whole thread.
I wasn't sure if it was a masturbation joke that belonged in off topic.

solo grappling were the keywords...

anyway... :p

[YouKnowWho]

solo grappling were the keywords...

There is a special term for solo grappling. It's called "演空(Yan Kon) - perform in the thin air". It can only help you to "polish" your skill when training partner is not available.

When you are 80 years old. you family are no longer with you. You no longer teach. Your "solo grappling" may be the only thing that you can do besides sitting on the rocking chair all day long.

[YouKnowWho]

If we compare TCMA teaching method and BJJ teaching method. When a BJJ instructor teaches his student solo drills on the ground (such as move body like worm) without explaining application, could that make any sense?

Why in striking art that you punch into the thin air could make sense, but in grappling art that you roll with an invisible opponent on the ground doesn't make sense?

[lkfmdc]

there is time for solo practice,

there is time for slow taiji like movement

there is time for individual technique

but there MUST be alive movement

and how much time total you have dictates how much you should spend on the lesser things

[Kellen Bassette]

there is time for solo practice,

there is time for slow taiji like movement

there is time for individual technique

but there MUST be alive movement

and how much time total you have dictates how much you should spend on the lesser things

I hope you mentioned that on that TV show interview...that's what people need to understand....

[YouKnowWho]

Assume we all agree that we are talking about solo "drills" training and not solo "forms" training here. Let's also agree that the solo training we are talking about here is exactly the same as the partner training without partner.

What do you think the difference between the "striking art solo training" vs. "the throwing art solo training"? Why do many people think the striking art solo training is normal but the throw art solo training is not quite normal?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQLMXqd3HWE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxVjYiWnH6U&feature=youtu.be

[Kellen Bassette]

What do you think the difference between the "striking art solo training" vs. "the throwing art solo training"?


The difference is, people know they also need to train with a partner to be effective at grappling, while some folks don't really believe you need partner training to be a good striker.

[lkfmdc]

I hope you mentioned that on that TV show interview...that's what people need to understand....

they filmed me over a month, most people are getting one segment, I might get three :p ;)

but they could never get everything I said or showed in there... it would be a mini-series :cool:

[YouKnowWho]

The difference is, people know they also need to train with a partner to be effective at grappling, while some folks don't really believe you need partner training to be a good striker.

Agree! You may not be able to find even one Judo guy or wrestler on earth who believes that grappling skill can be trained solo. Why do some people believe that the striking art can be trained solo?

What's the reason do you think?

[lkfmdc]

Agree! You may not be able to find even one Judo guy or wrestler on earth who believes that grappling skill can be trained solo. Why do some people believe that the striking art can be trained solo?

What's the reason do you think?

people think if they have a heavy bag in their basement they are learning to strike.... people are stupid :eek:

[bawang]

they filmed me over a month, most people are getting one segment, I might get three :p ;)

but they could never get everything I said or showed in there... it would be a mini-series :cool:

wat tv show mang

[Kellen Bassette]

Agree! You may not be able to find even one Judo guy or wrestler on earth who believes that grappling skill can be trained solo. Why do some people believe that the striking art can be trained solo?

What's the reason do you think?

Fantasy baseball, role playing, nerds living on their mom's couch thinking they will survive a zombie apocalypse, COD, WWE, reality tv based on staged and completely unrealistic premises....what can I say? We are a society of delusional pretenders...I mean some people out their still have faith in the two party political establishment! :p

[bawang]

Fantasy baseball, role playing, nerds living on their mom's couch thinking they will survive a zombie apocalypse, COD, WWE, reality tv based on staged and completely unrealistic premises....what can I say? We are a society of delusional pretenders...I mean some people out their still have faith in the two party political establishment! :p

COD is for reals mang

[sanjuro_ronin]

people think if they have a heavy bag in their basement they are learning to strike.... people are stupid :eek:

Honestly, it is simply the fact that the see other guys that do it and they are very good.
What they seem to either ignore or forget is that THOSE guys ALWAYS have YEARS of real MA training AND fighting in their background.

[David Jamieson]

Think/study/do.

The heart conspires, the mind devises but if the hand doesn't act, it's all for naught.

[lkfmdc]

Honestly, it is simply the fact that the see other guys that do it and they are very good.
What they seem to either ignore or forget is that THOSE guys ALWAYS have YEARS of real MA training AND fighting in their background.

Nah, it's because they saw this and thought it was actually good

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWJx7KnTMEA

(watch the forum burst into flame now)

[Fa Xing]

Nah, it's because they saw this and thought it was actually good

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWJx7KnTMEA

(watch the forum burst into flame now)

This actually a type of JKD "blast." It has specific context, one of the people I've trained with had this to say about it (emphasis is mine):


....Once you get the proper distance you finish your opponent off with a straight blast that uses the weight of your body by throwing your shoulders into the punches as well as your entire body. This is what Bruce lee would call a non-crispy attack which can also use boxing hook punches as well as straight line punches. But this should only be used after your opponent is injured and would be unable to counter attack effectively. An example of this can be seen in a video taken in Bruce Lee’s backyard where his is punching the heavy bag with heavy hooks. He, of course would never have attacked someone with this method unless it was safe to do so. If you want to see this type of straight blast in action look at Jack Dempsey attacking Jess Willard in their title fight. I know Bruce Lee watched it.

Source: OBSERVING THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN STAGES IN THE EVOLUTION OF BRUCE LEE'S MARTIAL ART (http://www.jkdwednite.com/observingdif.htm)

[lkfmdc]

punching from your hips and dropping your hands after you hit the bag is NOT good bag work, no matter what you want to call it or think it is......

[Fa Xing]

punching from your hips and dropping your hands after you hit the bag is NOT good bag work, no matter what you want to call it or think it is......

I understand that but you miss the point that it is a specific drill. However, I get it from your perspective of being an instructor.

Personally I wouldn't do it like that either.

[lkfmdc]

I understand that but you miss the point that it is a specific drill.



what makes you think it is a "specific drill"? Isn't it just him hitting a bag in his backyard?

and even if it is a "specific drill", what is he drilling? slopping punching that opens you up to counter punches?

the very last thing you want to do is punch and then drop your hands...

[Fa Xing]

what makes you think it is a "specific drill"? Isn't it just him hitting a bag in his backyard?

and even if it is a "specific drill", what is he drilling? slopping punching that opens you up to counter punches?

the very last thing you want to do is punch and then drop your hands...

Clearly you failed to even read my original response. He is not just hitting the bag in his backyard. He is doing a straight blast.

Dave, I have a lot of respect for you but I think you make a great deal of assumptions and jump to conclusions before finding out what is the reason for it. It's a common trait amongst martial artists imo. Read what I quoted above, hell read the article I sourced above.

[lkfmdc]

Clearly you failed to even read my original response. He is not just hitting the bag in his backyard. He is doing a straight blast.



NO, if anyone is failing to respond appropriately it is you. What evidence do you have that the footage is anything other than Bruce Lee hitting a bag in his backyard?

The footage has no explanation by Bruce Lee saying "this is me doing straight blast". What you posted was an article written after the fact trying to explain / validate the clip.

Furthermore, while you can call it "straight blast" and try to explain how/why/when it should be used, most people will say exactly what I said

1. punches thrown from the waist

2. punches that drop after hitting the target, leaving the head open to counter attack

AGAIN, it is very simple, what is your evidence there is something more here than what the clip actually is

and this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdPp5LdHzSY

run across the room and throw one kick, head down, and TURNED AWAY FROM TARGET, then run away???

[Pete]

looks like he's not that serious in the vids :p perhaps he was demonstrating how not to throw a punch :)

[LaRoux]

punching from your hips and dropping your hands after you hit the bag is NOT good bag work, no matter what you want to call it or think it is......

People who live in glass houses should beware of casting stones.

[lkfmdc]

just for ****ing fun.......


People who live in glass houses should beware of casting stones.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KROPwE9NBag

my hands appear to be up in the entire clip

so now you can go suck it.... you aren't even a very good troll... :D

[LaRoux]

just for ****ing fun.......



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KROPwE9NBag

my hands appear to be up in the entire clip

so now you can go suck it.... you aren't even a very good troll... :D

Based on that clip and others out there, you really shouldn't be putting other people's ability down.

[lkfmdc]

LaRoux

Where's YOUR CLIPS

yeah, that's what we all thought

LOL...

[LaRoux]

LaRoux

Where's YOUR CLIPS

yeah, that's what we all thought

LOL...



I don't have clips. I'm not good. I'm simply a student of the fight game. But, unlike you, I don't claim to be good when I'm not.

I don't put clips of me pretending to show others how to fight, when there's zero evidence of me doing anything that resembles going full out.

Until you can put up clips of you going full out on a heavy bag, you really have no place putting down anyone else's heavy bag work.

[bawang]

Based on that clip and others out there, you really shouldn't be putting other people's ability down.

by the time he realized the kung fu illusion his youth was gone. but he still decided to change his life and do what is right.

this is why I respect david ross. he could have been any one of those other fat ass washed up knug fu instructors with 3 students in a yoga studio, accepting their fate. their sh1tty kung fu ends with them. ross spreads the fist seed and molds kung fu in his vision. where david ross failed to achieve in his own life his students will succeed.

[lkfmdc]

I don't have clips. I'm not good.



and yet you talk mad ****

but of course you do it from the safety of behind a screen, no identifying information....

but, like I said, you aren't even much of a troll

[lkfmdc]

Bawang

the guy is yet another kungfu retard.... can't even grasp the idea that when you put up a clip of you TEACHING it isn't full speed :rolleyes:

again begs the question, why does TCMA rot the brain so.....

[LaRoux]

and yet you talk mad ****

but of course you do it from the safety of behind a screen, no identifying information....

but, like I said, you aren't even much of a troll

I talk mad **** because I've got no hidden agenda. You, on the other hand...

[lkfmdc]

you're an idiot....

you can't even grasp the difference between an instructional clip and full speed :rolleyes:

you're a coward, you won't even identify yourself and what you do

you won't put up a clip

in a pretty rotten barrel, you have the distinction of being the absolute bottom feeder

[LaRoux]

Bawang

the guy is yet another kungfu retard.... can't even grasp the idea that when you put up a clip of you TEACHING it isn't full speed :rolleyes:

again begs the question, why does TCMA rot the brain so.....

That's the point exactly. You are putting someone else down who is going full speed and full force, when the only evidence of you ever going full speed and full force is getting knocked the **** out.

[lkfmdc]

I talk mad ****



when even you admit it, CASE CLOSED

unless you want to say it to my face, which seeding as you are too scared to even put up identifying info on a WEB FORUM we all know would never happen

the funny thing is, I have never said I am a great fighter, but I'd still kick your ass and not even break a sweat.....

[LaRoux]

the funny thing is, I have never said I am a great fighter, but I'd still kick your ass and not even break a sweat.....

Really? Would you like to try?

[lkfmdc]

Really? Would you like to try?

are you in New York?

now watch him scramble :rolleyes:

we can FILM IT....

you're a coward, you won't even identify yourself

in a pretty rotten barrel, you have the distinction of being the absolute bottom feeder

[lkfmdc]

for the folks watching all this, we all know it would never happen

if he was in NYC, he could have come down any day of the week

YES, we are open 7 days a week :D

[LaRoux]

are you in New York?

now watch him scramble :rolleyes:

we can FILM IT....

you're a coward, you won't even identify yourself

in a pretty rotten barrel, you have the distinction of being the absolute bottom feeder

Not now, but I will be. I'll identify myself when I step in.

In the meantime, you might want to think about not putting down others for what you've never been able to do yourself.

[lkfmdc]

Not now,



LOL

told you all

"not now"

classic

and not in a good way like "classic coke" :D

[LaRoux]

LOL

told you all

"not now"

classic

and not in a good way like "classic coke" :D

Don't worry little man...

In the meantime, take my advice. Keep the pie hole shut.

[lkfmdc]

I should keep this handy for all ocassions like this

[lkfmdc]

Don't worry little man...



LOL

you can't be at all serious...

you just talked **** and then tucked tail and ran like a biotch :rolleyes:

do you really think you are looking good here? :D

[LaRoux]

Good. Now remember. You're being watched so behave yourself.

[lkfmdc]

artist's redering of "ladouche"

[LaRoux]

do you really think you are looking good here? :D

Careful little man. I'm not the one who is concerned about looking good.

Better watch yourself.

[lkfmdc]

Good. Now remember. You're being watched



Ladies and gentlemen, he actually thinks this is making him look tough :rolleyes:

yes, you're watching me from behind a computer screen, probably in your mother's basement.....

[lkfmdc]

I'm not the one who is concerned about looking good.



well, clearly so :rolleyes:

yes, this has been fun..... :cool:

[lkfmdc]

PS: I win the internet




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWJx7KnTMEA

(watch the forum burst into flame now)

spot on with that one wasn't I :D

[LaRoux]

Ladies and gentlemen, he actually thinks this is making him look tough :rolleyes:

yes, you're watching me from behind a computer screen, probably in your mother's basement.....

Ladies and gentlemen. Do you want to see the reality behind the wizard of oz?

[LaRoux]

He asks women this before he pulls down his pants, so far, he hasn't had much luck

You really should let this die.

[lkfmdc]

He asks women this before he pulls down his pants

[lkfmdc]

I should also mention that the above picture is appropriate to a thread called "solo training" :D

[LaRoux]

LOL

you can't be at all serious...

you just talked **** and then tucked tail and ran like a biotch :rolleyes:



Just for the record, before I make the trip. Are you saying here on this public forum that if I walked into your gym, you would be willing and able to do a full-contact, NHB style fight right then and there?

[lkfmdc]

he continues :rolleyes:

[LaRoux]

he continues :rolleyes:

That's kind of what I figured. The real tuck-tailer shows his true colors.

[lkfmdc]

Do whatever it is you feel you need to do.... whatever it is that gets you through your day and makes you sleep at night

But I'll suggest to ANYONE that if you live you life based upon what you THINK you know, based upon hearsay and 4th hand accounts, one day you may wake up and find you are no longer in Kansas

[sanjuro_ronin]

Why grapple solo when you can:
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-YxwDegnOsL8/UiPKKgZvTXI/AAAAAAAAA6k/gMjGeg3tJpc/s1600/7.jpg

[sanjuro_ronin]

I am out of here.
http://i1229.photobucket.com/albums/ee469/hitmanash1/sexy.gif

[YouKnowWho]

Why grapple solo when you can:
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-YxwDegnOsL8/UiPKKgZvTXI/AAAAAAAAA6k/gMjGeg3tJpc/s1600/7.jpg
My wife has injury spine and can't be my training partner. Since I don't have school in California, I still haven't be able to find any training partner here yet. Instead of for someone to pay me for my private lesson, I may have to pay someone for his time so he would allow me to use his body for my own training. In real life, a real training partner is not that easy to find.

Without a real partner, the angle will have no reference. This is why you have to draw a straight line on the ground. Mark your opponent's feet position so you can move in through the right angle. The body leaning is also important in throwing. Since we don't lean our body in our daily life, to "get used to a certain body leaning" will be helpful. You can train lost balance, regain balance, lose balance, regain balance, ... It can be quite useful.

In the following clip, you can even use a belt as "reference" for your opponent's leg. The nice thing about this is you can train on your belt 24/7.

http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMzUxOTYwMDY4.html

[Fa Xing]

NO, if anyone is failing to respond appropriately it is you. What evidence do you have that the footage is anything other than Bruce Lee hitting a bag in his backyard?

The footage has no explanation by Bruce Lee saying "this is me doing straight blast". What you posted was an article written after the fact trying to explain / validate the clip.

Furthermore, while you can call it "straight blast" and try to explain how/why/when it should be used, most people will say exactly what I said

1. punches thrown from the waist

2. punches that drop after hitting the target, leaving the head open to counter attack

AGAIN, it is very simple, what is your evidence there is something more here than what the clip actually is

and this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdPp5LdHzSY

run across the room and throw one kick, head down, and TURNED AWAY FROM TARGET, then run away???

Well, you win, I honestly see no reason in continuing this discussion because we keep going in circles.

Just so you know though, that article was written from the experiences of those who were there. :p:D:rolleyes::eek::cool:

I found some funny pics to describe our maturity level:

http://media.veryfunnypics.eu/2013/07/funny-picture-arguing-over-the-internet.jpg

http://www.mybroadband.co.za/photos/data/500/20110412-190616_20110324121351_someone_is_wrong.jpg

http://static.someecards.com/someecards/usercards/1307833473093_1187423.png

[YouKnowWho]

Old Chinese saying said, "If we move back one step, we will see the ocean is so wide and sky is so high". If we don't care about to have the last word, the argument can be terminated at any moment.

[Fa Xing]

Old Chinese saying said, "If we move back one step, we will see the ocean is so wide and sky is so high". If we don't care about to have the last word, the argument can be terminated at any moment.

I like that. It's too bad you don't live near LA, I would love to train with you.

[lkfmdc]

I like that. It's too bad you don't live near LA, I would love to train with you.

ah, something to agree upon, John is a great person and great martial artist

[Pete]

by the time he realized the kung fu illusion his youth was gone.

what is the kung fu illusion?

[Miqi]

NO, if anyone is failing to respond appropriately it is you. What evidence do you have that the footage is anything other than Bruce Lee hitting a bag in his backyard?

The footage has no explanation by Bruce Lee saying "this is me doing straight blast". What you posted was an article written after the fact trying to explain / validate the clip.

Furthermore, while you can call it "straight blast" and try to explain how/why/when it should be used, most people will say exactly what I said

1. punches thrown from the waist

2. punches that drop after hitting the target, leaving the head open to counter attack

AGAIN, it is very simple, what is your evidence there is something more here than what the clip actually is

and this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdPp5LdHzSY

run across the room and throw one kick, head down, and TURNED AWAY FROM TARGET, then run away???

It is difficult to argue with this. But I hear that there is someone who can:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ni-3zx8TvAk

I think Bruce may have been copying the great man.

[Frost]

It is difficult to argue with this. But I hear that there is someone who can:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ni-3zx8TvAk

I think Bruce may have been copying the great man.

seriously that's your arguement now, its no longer a straight blast but he is copying arguably the second greatest boxer the world has ever seen so that makes what he is doing ok???
Well I suppose if Bruce had Alis natural speed power and talent not to mention a decade of near daily sparring and training under sime wirld class coaches he might have been able to pull that off as well, otherwise its just a clip of bad bag work missing several key basic skills that us mere mortals have to ingrain in ourselves unless we want to get knocked out in sparring.....

[Miqi]

seriously that's your arguement now, its no longer a straight blast but he is copying arguably the second greatest boxer the world has ever seen so that makes what he is doing ok???
Well I suppose if Bruce had Alis natural speed power and talent not to mention a decade of near daily sparring and training under sime wirld class coaches he might have been able to pull that off as well, otherwise its just a clip of bad bag work missing several key basic skills that us mere mortals have to ingrain in ourselves unless we want to get knocked out in sparring.....

Peace. I haven't made any argument about the straight blast or Bruce Lee's level. I'm just pointing out that Bruce Lee may have consciously attempted to copy Muhammad Ali's style. To what degree he succeeded in doing that is another matter altogether.

[lkfmdc]

Both Bruce Lee and Ali both are figures with millions of fans who love them. Personally, I would argue that in Ali we have a greater figure, ie a man who stood up to the US government and literally sacrificed his life for a greater cause, ie PEACE... but I digress

People with such fame and fans, no one wants to discuss them objectively. Bruce Lee may have encouraged people to take up martial arts, he may have made martial arts "mainstream" etc but that doesn't change other facts like many of his "original ideas" were in fact the ideas of others and if you sit back and look at footage of him objectively he made many mistakes (or, alternately, since he was developing a screen martial art in many case he may not have cared about the "holes", remember that the same footage of him hitting the bag ends with him playing with camera angles for movie work)

It should also be noted that from a textbook boxing perspective Ali did certain things wrong. Very few people were able to capitalize on these things because Ali was tricky, super coordinated and fast, but Frazier certainly did, breakig Ali's jaw when he moved his head incorrectly