OC spray

[Ryu]

Because I'm gearing my MA towards functional self-defense, I am not only training ground and pound, grappling, and JKD boxing, but I'm also spending time with tactical pistol training, and have recently started getting familiar with OC sprays, etc.

Since I'm not an idiot or an egoist, and I gladly understand and tell people that there are better fighters than me (better grapplers, better boxers, etc. Just because you gain rank in BJJ doesn't mean you won't get into a fight with someone who also knows it, or who has done it harder and longer than you), I think other types of "self preservation" strategies are fair advantages. OC spray (pepper spray) and even tazers are non-lethal weapons I think can be employed by martial artists in crisis. I do not think you have to "duke it out" with someone bigger, stronger, and meaner than you just to prove "you trained martial arts and should be able to win"... I think spraying an attacker in the eyes, and escaping (or knocking him down when he is stunned and flailing) is just as "martial" as anything else.
This is the way the police defend themselves, why shouldn't I?

Have any of you had experience with OC spray, and or tazers, and what do you think of them if used properly?

Let me know your opinions.

Take care,
Ryu

http://home.vobis.net/user/roy/anime/images/streetfighter15.jpg


"One who takes pride in shallow knowledge or understanding is like a monkey who delights in adorning itself with garbage."

[IronFist]

I dunno, but usually I hear that if girls carry mace spray it will probably end up being used against them as opposed to them using it against their attacker.

Iron

[SanHeChuan]

Spray him in the face then beat his ass and when you tell everyone about it just leave out the first part. :D

If you’re a martial artist I doubt that they could take it away and use it on you as if you're some week little untrained girl. :p

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"Civilize the mind but make savage the body"

Hou fa xian zhi
-start later, but reach first.

[Ryu]

Very good point SanHe,

I'm fairly confident an attacker would have a bit more trouble with me than an untrained girl. :D
Think police officers, not scared high school girls.

Ryu

http://home.vobis.net/user/roy/anime/images/streetfighter15.jpg


"One who takes pride in shallow knowledge or understanding is like a monkey who delights in adorning itself with garbage."

[Chris McKinley]

Hell, I'm all for it. Cheat every way you can and every chance you get. I have 27 years of martial arts experience and the first thing I'd do is present whatever weapon I happened to be carrying at the time. It ain't about being Bruce Lee; it's about survival. The empty hand stuff's just for when I'm in the shower and don't have a blade on me.

[SanHeChuan]

If you were at home taking a shower and then all of a sudden somebody’s kicking your ass, you probably focked literally.

But there are plenty of weapons in the shower, curtain rods, soap on a rope, etc... :p

If somebody beat my as in my own shower, I would have to laugh about it at some point. Very disturbing. :(

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"Civilize the mind but make savage the body"

Hou fa xian zhi
-start later, but reach first.

[wufupaul]

I don't think that stun guns and pepper spray work very well, from my experiences. When I was studying jkd, my instructor used to carry a 250,000 volt stungun in his briefcase. One day, just for giggles, I asked him if he would zap me with it. So he tried it out on different parts of my body, and all it did was make me laugh, even when he left it on for several seconds. At any time, I could have just smacked it away. I have a 150,000 volt one, and me and my friends used to chase each other around zapping each other with it, it never froze anyone up, like they're supposed to. Nowadays, I see stunguns that have volt charges that are alot higher, maybe they are more effective now, I don't know. Stunguns are effective if you can control the person(grappling, chin-na, etc.) and then apply it. But if you can get the person down into a position where you can control them, why would you need the stun gun? Tasers seem to be a better option than stun guns. They don't always go through the clothing, but if they do, then they seem to work pretty well. Pepper spray has mixed results; I've seen it work very well on some people, and not so well on others. I've been sprayed with it several times(not by a victim, hehe, by friends when I wanted to see what it would do, and once by skinheads) and it does hurt, but it didn't completely stop me. I could still tell where people where and flail punches and kicks. One time I sprayed it in the wind, and it some of it came back and got me in the eye, so you also have to pay attention to where the wind is. Honestly, I would choose a knife before I would choose a stun gun, taser, or spray.

"I want to share something with you -- the three sentences that will get you through life. Number one, "Cover for me." Number two, "Oh, good idea, boss!" Number three, "It was like that when I got here." -Homer Simpson, THE SIMPSONS

[Sharky]

i wanted to get some mase but my sources always fell thru. i'd use it, then kick his ass, then steal his wallet.

=================================
Sharky, I should expect this level of immaturity from you after seeing your post titled "Hm." regarding the woman that lives next door to you. I think everyone who unfortuneatly read that post is a bit more ignorant now for doing so. - Spectre

All i wanted was some RICE CAKES! Now? WE MUST BATTLE.

[Xebsball]

Peper spray, very good.
I'd carry a sword but then both the thieves AND the cops would hate me, thats a big problem.

If someone attacks me i dont care, ill stick a piece of wood in their ass to win the fight, so the spray is kinda of a "nice" option.

I say, carry the **** spray. If someone attacks you use it in their eyes, open their mouth and use some more down his throat. Put him in doggy position and stick the empty spray thing up his "place where the light never shines".

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"I AM EFFECTIVNESS"

[SanHeChuan]

Sharky have you been playing to many video games? I've been playing Dungeons and Dragons video games so long that taking anything of value from a fallen foe is second nature. I kicked somebody ass in sparing class the other day then took his car keys.
;)

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"Civilize the mind but make savage the body"

Hou fa xian zhi
-start later, but reach first.

[Sharky]

:rolleyes:

=================================
Sharky, I should expect this level of immaturity from you after seeing your post titled "Hm." regarding the woman that lives next door to you. I think everyone who unfortuneatly read that post is a bit more ignorant now for doing so. - Spectre

All i wanted was some RICE CAKES! Now? WE MUST BATTLE.

[SevenStar]

I say go for it, but I'm with Wufupaul on the stun gun thing. I've seen them used on people with no effect. I got into a fight with the wind, and it was kicking my butt, so I pepper sprayed it... it blocked and sent the pepper spray back into my face. I was like :eek:, as it's not comfy. I was still able to see through watery eyes, and I was coughing. I wasn't sparring anyone at the time, so I dunno what effect it would've had on my fighting, but I was not incapacitated.

Something you may want to look into is foam. I got some of this for my significant other. When it hits something, it will foam up. The idea behind it is if you hit someone, it will foam over them, getting more in their eyes, nose and face than spray will.

I'd take spray/foam over a stun gun and a blade over foam.

"Just because I joke around sometimes doesn't mean I'm serious about kung-fu.
" - nightair

[Fish of Fury]

"I kicked somebody ass in sparing class the other day then took his car keys."

LOL SHC

use the spray Ryu.
as you have said numerous times, "tough guy" stuff is BS.
i've chosen not to carry a knife cos i don't wanna use it, but spray is an excellent idea. as some have mentioned though, it's not always effective...actually i think if they inhale it it's often more effective (it's hard to fight when you can't breath)

__________________________________________________ _________________________ "I'm just trying to lull you into a genuine sense of security!"

[wufupaul]

Seven, have you tried the foam out on yourself or someone to see how it works? Let me know if you ever spray it on yourself or anyone. It looks interesting, I've seen one type that acts as a foam, and another that actually hardens up and makes some kind of shell. Hhhmmm..maybe I'll buy some, try it out, and take pics to put up here! I used to carry mace on me, just because I'd rather use it than have to beat someone down, but I stopped carrying after it busted in my pocket...that wasn't fun, I didn't realize it until I felt my leg burning, haha.

"I want to share something with you -- the three sentences that will get you through life. Number one, "Cover for me." Number two, "Oh, good idea, boss!" Number three, "It was like that when I got here." -Homer Simpson, THE SIMPSONS

[Black Jack]

It's all about having another option to neutralize an unavoidable threat.

From a tactical fundamental standpoint I like my ASP OC Defender-a nasty impact weapon & OC unit all roled into one big suprise-a good combination of spray and fail.

The FOX products are the hottest though with 5.3 million SHU (scoville heat units).

Either way you should always have a backup plan and be ready to continue to defend yourself as a OC spray does not always effect the same people the same way.

IMHO a important thing to look at in a OC weapon is the type of spray pattern that it uses and then to consider which one will work best in the enviroment you will need it for.

Regards

[wu_de36]

the reason they say that girls will have it used against them is because so many of them clip it to their keys or bury it in their purse. Chances are they've never used it, don't know what the reactions will be, aren't ready for the blow-back. Worse, a lot of people are under the false impression that pepper spraying someone in the face will cause them to instantly fall to the ground clawing their eyes out and yelling to God to end their painful existence.

OC (which is different than mace/tear gas) is a good tool, but it prolly won't be the fight stopper. I've watched plenty of normal folks take OC to the face (fox labs) and are able to usually either swat the hand holding the spray, or work their way in past the spray and fight long enough to put a hurt on you.

Cops in academy often get sprayed in the face and then have to draw their gun and fire at a target 10 feet away.

EDP folk will not even feel it.

Most people will be able to fight for a good 15 seconds, and it will be mean, adrenalized fighting. They will be ****ed off good.

You need to spray, and take advantage of the natural reaction (brief stop, hands coming up to the face) and incapacitate them fast. low kicks, knee to the groin, elbows forearms to the face. Then either run, or make a pig pile on the guy.

If they start running, they're going to deeply inhale that crap and it won't be fun for them.

[Badger]

web page (http://www.tbotech.com/bearspray.htm)


Badger

There's a little poop in all of us.

[wu_de36]

bears love spicy food. :)

OC% is not a good measure of OC strength surprisingly enough.

SHU (Scoville Heat Units) is the real measurement you wanna look at.

[JasBourne]

The effectiveness of an electrical charge is more dependent on amperage than it is on voltage. You can kill someone with the juice in a 9V battery, if you do it right.

I carry my tazer when I walk my dogs, to keep my neighbors' dogs at bay (not all my neighbors believe in leash and fence laws - controlling your dogs doesn't seem to be a big priority in the South). Works fine on big nasty dogs, surprises the crap outta them. I reckon if somebody stuck a tazer up my nose and crackled it a bit, it would get my attention too ;)

[Ryu]

!!!!!!!! It's JAS!!!! :eek:


:D


We were all looking for you.

Ryu

http://home.vobis.net/user/roy/anime/images/streetfighter15.jpg


"One who takes pride in shallow knowledge or understanding is like a monkey who delights in adorning itself with garbage."