Try to understand how people in other styles may do

[YouKnowWho]

In some WC thread, some people complain that the white crane discussion may pollute the pure WC discussion. I don't understand why some people always like to keep their MA discussion "pure within their own style". Most of the time, the guy you have to fight in the street will not be a guy from your same system. You will need to know how people in other styles may think and train in order to be able to deal with them effectively.

I'll be more interest to know how a MT guy uses his double neck tie than a wrestler does. The reason is simple. I know how a wrestler will do, but I don't know how a MT guy will do. To be able to deal with a MT guy's knee during clinch is extreme interest to me.

Your thought?

[Firehawk4]

What about a street fighter arent they unpredictable in the way they fight, there all different i think .

[David Jamieson]

WC discussions are always crazy. lol.
I mean, hey, there are probably some who think they can tan sau a nuke into submission to their mighty goat catching stance ability. lol
It's all good.

[Jimbo]

Developing a deep understanding of whatever art or arts you are specializing in is a good thing. However, a person can also over-analyze a thing, to the point where the 'tool(s)' being analyzed take on a greater importance than the purpose(s) behind it/them.

It's essential to go outside of your system and comfort level to progress. Experiencing different skills is needed, but equally important is experience facing different people...sizes, skills within styles, different aggression levels, clean/sloppy technique, etc. Sometimes an unorthodox person who is wild and sloppy can throw people off.

But styles don't fight, people do. Even within western boxing, there are countless 'styles' among individuals, even though they all draw from the same few movements. Yet in terms of striking, boxing is first-class. There can be analysis of details, strong and weak points, etc., but there isn't an OVER-analysis of little details to the point of obsession.

[YouKnowWho]

Sun Zi said, "If you know yourself and you also know your opponent, you will win. If you only know yourself but you don't know your opponent, you will lose."

[Faux Newbie]

I totally agree with this. Sometimes, seeing how two styles do the same move slightly differently for different reasons leaves me knowing more about that move and the way I may do it in my style.

Also, knowing how to use my style against other styles is fun work.

[David Jamieson]

Sun Zi said, "If you know yourself and you also know your opponent, you will win. If you only know yourself but you don't know your opponent, you will lose."

well...not exactly.

This is the translated quote from Art of War regarding knowing thyself

“If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle.”

I apologize for my pedantry...

Well...not really. :D

[jimbob]

I'm at a point where I feel like disregarding 'style' altogether. It gets in the way of good exchange more often than not.

What is 'style'? Every good system should have punches, kicks, locks and throws. Maybe some emphasise some things over others, but at the end of the day, the toolbox is pretty much the same.

Is it the traditions? If so, what does that have to do with the way I fight? If I blindfold you and hit you, could you tell me I'm a Choy Lay Fut guy? Does it matter as long as you stay hit?

Is style the training method? I think modern sports science is leaving a lot of traditional methods behind. Kind of makes "style" redundant, or leaves some practitioners holding on to outdated methods for the sake of history.

Is style 'principle' more than technique? See point one. If my goal is to damage someone, does it really matter how I throw my side kick?

Is it 'tactical'? Why I choose a certain technique in some situations instead of another? If so, does this really need to be so great a distinction that we see what we do as separate? I kick to the leg when my tkd friend kicks to the head. I elbow someone when the BJJ takes him down and breaks his arm. If we're both good, we should both achieve the result we're looking for.

When I was young, the Hong Seng kwoon in Singapore had a long lasting war of words with the Bak Hok people. I asked my Sihing if our style was better. "Of course" he told me.

I asked my Sifu if our style was better (when my Sihing was gone). He slapped me and told me not to be stupid. He said talking about "style" is like reading a book and then saying "this book is better than that book". He told me, I could spend my time reading about how to build a house, or I could just pick up a hammer and start to build things.

i was 9 and didn't really understand him. I'm 44 now and have a much better idea of why he slapped me.

[SPJ]

Your thought?

Variation is the spice of a life.

Even within the same style or core techniques,

we have to vary them.

We add randomness so that we are not predictable to our opponents.

:)

[SPJ]

Ba Gua Zhang has some core techniques.

However, many and many styles are added or incorporated.

Liang style Ba Gua has 64 random hands.

There are pi gua, tong bei, shuai jiao in them.

Core techniques may be the same.

Derivatives or add-on are not.

:cool:

[Happy panda]

Ba Gua Zhang has some core techniques.

However, many and many styles are added or incorporated.

Liang style Ba Gua has 64 random hands.

There are pi gua, tong bei, shuai jiao in them.

Core techniques may be the same.

Derivatives or add-on are not.

:cool:


Ba gua may have "Shuai" in it but practitioners do not practice it enough to get it to a level resembling real skill. Otherwise there would be droves of BG grapplers competing in judo and Shuai jiao.

[Faux Newbie]

Ba Gua Zhang has some core techniques.

However, many and many styles are added or incorporated.

Liang style Ba Gua has 64 random hands.

There are pi gua, tong bei, shuai jiao in them.

Core techniques may be the same.

Derivatives or add-on are not.

:cool:

I think most styles are the same. Muay Thai with the incorporation of boxing (and likely influences from different branches of Thai martial arts over the years),
MMA perpetually has something infused in to it from outside sources. I'd imagine back when boxing was pretty much mma as far as what was allowed, influences back and forth were common, especially considering England's position as a point of contact for many cultures back then.