Double Spears Strategy

[YouKnowWho]

When your opponent is static, you can attack with "double wrists control". If your opponent attacks first, you can modify your "double wrists control" into "double spears", function your arms as 2 spears that rotate either clockwise or counter-clockwise, and deflect the incoming straight punch such as jab or cross. Your arms then act like an octopus arms that wrap around your opponent's punching arm. In the following clip, your "double spears" will turn into "neck wiping" and "under hook". By adding "leg spring", you can take your opponent down.

This "double spears strategy" will be part of my "Grappling vs. Striking" book. All comments are welcomed and appreciated.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtIXgZu9OcQ

[-N-]

What happens when someone tries to use double spears against double wrist control?

[YouKnowWho]

What happens when someone tries to use double spears against double wrist control?

Since both persons will rotate their arms in the same direction (left arm clockwise, right arm counter-clockwise), it can end with an "infinite loop". It's like to use the "leg lift" to counter "leg lift".

1. You use your right leg to lift my left leg,
2. I escape my left leg, land my left leg on the ground, and use my right leg to lift your left leg (the rooting leg) while your right leg is still off the ground,
3. You escape your left leg, land your left leg on the ground, and use your right leg to lift my left leg (the rooting leg) while my right leg is still off the ground,
2. ...
3. ...
2. ...
3. ...
...

In grappling, this situation can happen quite often. It depends on the individual's skill level whether by using technique X to counter technique X can be successful or not.

[-N-]

Since both persons will rotate their arms in the same direction (left arm clockwise, right arm counter-clockwise), it can end with an "infinite loop".

[...]

It depends on the individual's skill level whether by using technique X to counter technique X can be successful or not.

Part of the skill includes knowing when and how to switch instead of chasing after a technique.

If Mantis throws an initial strike, it can land, it can miss, the other person can grab wrist control, or the other person can use one of his double spears.

Mantis will expect the other person to respond, and in either case, Mantis might leak out and continue in to attack(probably while using the other hand for wrist control or "spear")

[YouKnowWho]

knowing when and how to switch instead of chasing after a technique. ... Mantis will expect the other person to respond, ...
To be able to change with your opponent is very important. That's why the moment that your opponent's arms rotates with you, the moment that you reverse your arm rotation and meet him half way. I love to use my downward "parry" to set up my upward "wrapping".

In the following clip, you can see that your opponent resists against your shoulder lock, you borrow his resistance, reverse your technique, and take him down backward. If you have good timing to borrow your opponent's force, your 2nd reverse throw can be almost "effortless".


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_TniUqLRJY

[Faux Newbie]

YKW, is there a good source you are familiar with on reversals for throws in shuai jiao? Not to derail the thread, just your last video touched on that subject.

[YouKnowWho]

YKW, is there a good source you are familiar with on reversals for throws in shuai jiao? Not to derail the thread, just your last video touched on that subject.

What do you mean "good source"? Are you asking about books or DVDs? As far as I know the "combo" is treated as high level material that you normally don't see in most beginner level books.

For every throw, there are many reverse throws. It depends on your hands and feet position when you apply your 1st throw, you then use the reverse throw that doesn't require you to change too much of your hands and feet position.

You only use "reverse throws" when your opponent "resists against" you. If your opponent "yield into" you, you will use "follow up throws" instead.

[Faux Newbie]

What do you mean "good source"? Are you asking about books or DVDs? As far as I know the "combo" is treated as high level material that you normally don't see in most beginner level books.

For every throw, there are many reverse throws. It depends on your hands and feet position when you apply your 1st throw, you then use the reverse throw that doesn't require you to change too much of your hands and feet position.

You only use "reverse throws" when your opponent "resists against" you. If your opponent "yield into" you, you will use "follow up throws" instead.

I was just meaning book or dvd, including (probably especially) Chinese language ones. I'm familiar with some judo counters, but hadn't seen uch on shuai jiao ones.

[-N-]

To be able to change with your opponent is very important. That's why the moment that your opponent's arms rotates with you, the moment that you reverse your arm rotation and meet him half way. I love to use my downward "parry" to set up my upward "wrapping".

That's how techniques become style or system.

[YouKnowWho]

That's how techniques become style or system.

I do think Chinese wrestling takes a different approach from the western wrestling or Judo (for example, the leg bridge and the arms bridge concept). When people asked me, "Why reinventing the wheel?" My answer is, "It's a different wheel". So far, I have not seen any western wrestlers or Judo guys ever use this entering strategy yet.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mEVfdsRQpM

[-N-]

So far, I have not seen any western wrestlers or Judo guys ever use this entering strategy yet.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mEVfdsRQpM

What do you think is the reason for the difference?

[YouKnowWho]

What do you think is the reason for the difference?

The Chinese wrestling was part of the TCMA, it was separated away and became "sport" in the ancient time. But SC guys are always cross trained the striking art. My teacher's teacher's teacher 平敬一(Ping Jing Yi) had cross trained the striking art as well. May be the western wrestling doesn't include the striking art training. that's why the wrestler's posture just doesn't consider the possibility of striking.

8429

Also most of the Judo guys don't train the no-gi. Since no-gi is part of the SC training, it's much easier to integrate SC into MMA than to integrate wrestling or Judo into MMA. Unfortunately, there are just not enough SC instructors on this planet to do that job.