View Full Version : A civilized way to prevent a fight
YouKnowWho
06-19-2014, 10:15 PM
In the following clip, if you can control your opponent and if he can't break your grips, he may not want to fight you any more. That will be a very civilized way to prevent a fight before anybody get hurt.
In case your opponent still want to fight you, since you have used one arm to control both of his arms, you will have one free arm to punch at his face. So you have not rule out the possibility to continue your fight if your opponent wants to.
Your thought?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjG4p-erzuo
Looks like you are starting the fight here when you initiate with your right hand.
If he wanted to fight, he would already initiate, or at least throw his left punch while you are transferring control from your right hand to your left hand.
If you do the right hand, transfer left, and right grab all together as in ou lou tsai timing, then it might work.
But go in with your footwork, because right now you control on top only, and not the bottom.
Control the bottom and completely lock him up.
If you do as in ou lou tsai, don't pull so much with the right, then it will be faster, and you can go in faster with footwork too.
YouKnowWho
06-19-2014, 10:52 PM
The situation can be like this. My opponent throws a jab and cross at my face, I move away. I then jump back in and start this strategy. This way, my opponent still starts the fight first.
You are right. By using the leading leg to jam the leading leg is not shown in that clip.
If I don't pull his right arm to make his body to spin to his left, his left hand may still be able to hit on my face. A bit "shaking" can make myself safer. I agree that the ou lou tsai will be faster. But if I can't get his left arm, the whole thing will fail. In order to get his left arm, I have to take some risk, give he some time for his left hand to move toward his right wrist (or my face). In other words, if I move fast, I may not be able to get his left arm. If I move too slow, his left hand may punch on my face. Fortunately, I can use my left hand pulling and also I can move my head to my left. My risk is not that much.
The situation can be like this. My opponent throws a jab and cross at my face, I move away. I then jump back in and start this strategy. This way, my opponent still starts the fight first.
Ok, I see.
If I don't pull his right arm to make his body to spin to his left, his left hand may still be able to hit on my face.
I have a Praying Mantis bias.
If his left tries to hit you, he is making your job easier by giving you his hand.
If your right hand didn't pull back previously, it is already in guard and can control the punch sooner.
A bit "shaking" can make myself safer.
Destabilizing the other guy can be useful.
But to use your terminology, Praying Mantis will love to borrow the force and fly in to hit.
He will consider you are helping him to punch you. And your right hand will have more work to do to relax and get back in range.
But if I can't get his left arm, the whole thing will fail. In order to get his left arm, I have to take some risk, give he some time for his left hand to move toward his right wrist (or my face).
In this way the emphasis is on (chasing) the technique - to get the left arm.
Another way is to focus on the strategy of getting your right arm in a good controlling position.
You like head lock, so if his left hand doesn't move to his right, you just go in through the opening and control his head. This is variation on Praying Mantis huen chui.
In other words, if I move fast, I may not be able to get his left arm. If I move too slow, his left hand may punch on my face. Fortunately, I can use my left hand pulling and also I can move my head to my left. My risk is not that much.
Ou lou tsai is good when you pass to the left. That way you move fast, avoid his borrow attack, control his head, and you are set up to continue with slant cut if he doesn't give up.
David Jamieson
06-20-2014, 08:41 AM
The civilized way to prevent a fight is to be civilized and not fight. :p
The civilized way to prevent a fight is to be civilized and not fight. :p
I won't argue with that :)
Rover
06-22-2014, 12:38 PM
Starting a fight possibility percentage of using that technique is higher than starting a fight possibility percentage of the enemy guy.
if you are so sure that he will start a fight,then you better hit.
YouKnowWho
06-22-2014, 12:42 PM
if you are so sure that he will start a fight,then you better hit.
The problem is if you hit your opponent, the fight is already started. There is no return. If you can tangle your opponent's arms and then give him a hug, since nobody is hurting, by definition, the fight hasn't started yet.
RenDaHai
06-22-2014, 01:00 PM
As soon as there is any contact the pressure in the room goes up ten times, everybody feels it, it *****les your skin. Thats a dangerous chain reaction to get started.
You have them trapped.... then what?
YouKnowWho
06-22-2014, 01:09 PM
You have them trapped.... then what?
I'll ask him, "Can we stop right now? I really don't want any trouble."
RenDaHai
06-22-2014, 01:34 PM
I'll ask him, "Can we stop right now? I really don't want any trouble."
And if it were me, that might work.
Good people care about virtue, bad people care about power, stupid people care about money, but base people, animals, they care about face.
To the thug inside me, you trapping my arms and then saying you don't want any trouble, thats gonna make me lose a lot of face.
Jimbo
06-22-2014, 02:57 PM
The problem is if you hit your opponent, the fight is already started. There is no return. If you can tangle your opponent's arms and then give him a hug, since nobody is hurting, by definition, the fight hasn't started yet.
IMO, in some situations this would be a very good strategy from a legal standpoint, especially if there are objective witnesses present. You are already showing that your intent is not to be the aggressor, and are taking steps to deescalate the situation.
OTOH, I see some issues:
1. This presupposes that the attacker is actually squaring off with you. This scenario is most likely with someone you already know who's drunk and/or becoming belligerent with you...a friend, a relative, but sometimes a stranger, too. It's a person who may want to fight you, but not as seriously as a targeted street attack. Or he may be woofing and not really want to fight you at all.
2. If it's a person who really wants to get you, they might temporarily stop until you let them go. And if they're criminals or otherwise sociopathic, they may pull a weapon next. But then again, most such criminal-types would not have squared off with you in the first place, unless maybe to distract you/set you up for their partner.
Faux Newbie
06-23-2014, 06:34 AM
Good people care about virtue, bad people care about power, stupid people care about money, but base people, animals, they care about face.
Totally off the topic, but I really like the above statement.
David Jamieson
06-23-2014, 08:18 AM
Totally off the topic, but I really like the above statement.
Yes it's quite interesting. And on the strength of personal anecdotes alone, I'd say it's mostly true. :)
Rover
06-24-2014, 01:33 PM
We believe using that would be better if he is the one attacking to you ; to stop a fight that has already been started split sec ago.
YouKnowWho
06-24-2014, 01:38 PM
We believe using that would be better if he is the one attacking to you ; to stop a fight that has already been started split sec ago.
It can be like this:
Your opponent throws jab and cross at you, you step away, you then jump back in and do this.
Your opponent still attacks you first.
In the following clip, if you can control your opponent and if he can't break your grips, he may not want to fight you any more. That will be a very civilized way to prevent a fight before anybody get hurt.
In case your opponent still want to fight you, since you have used one arm to control both of his arms, you will have one free arm to punch at his face. So you have not rule out the possibility to continue your fight if your opponent wants to.
Your thought?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjG4p-erzuo
Yes.
1 If you may kou (mantis) or dai la (ba gua) his lead arm downward at his wrist, (since his lead elbow is straight), you may ignore his lead elbow and go at his rear hand wrist or forearm.
In this scenario, it would be your one hand gou lou cai his lead hand, and your other hand also gou lou cai his rear hand. (mantis) Your lead leg also positions behind his lead leg. You swipe sao his lead leg and off he falls. This is a signature mantis move. Depending on position, you may ignore his rear guard hand, and hook his neck or chest with your other hand.
2 however, we have to deal with his lead elbow first, that is old maxim of many styles.
3 pass 3 guards, wrist, elbow and shoulder.
4 These are common problems being dealt with.
If you do not want to fight, it is better keep at a distance.
Move back half a step or to the side one step.
People would know you are disengaging.
:cool:
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