rooting make you heavy on your feet?

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

i used to be really light on my feet before i started kung fu, but i seem to have lost at least half of that attribute since.

i used to be able to do things like jump up as high as i could and land without making a sound, fly up and down steps quietly, scramble up things like a monkey, prance accross streams like a little ballerina princess. . .

but now i feel awkward trying to do things like that. my shcools main focus is an internal style so there is great emphisis on rooting and sinking which seems to have caused this. i guess i'm lighter on my feet than allot of people but i still feel at least twice as heavy even when i'm trying not to be.

i have gained some mass from lifting during this period but have only gained a max of 4 or 5 pounds. i don't figure that's enough to throw me off that bad plus my body should have had time to adjust by now and compensated.

i definately think it's worth the tradeoff but was wondering if anyone else noticed this.

where's my beer?

[Sharky]

i have noticed this lots from wing chun. i had a hard time bouncing around like boxers do. it just didn't feel right. i'm still trying to come to terms with it. but i think my wing chun footwork is great and can mingle with the boxers. they aren't totally dissimilar.

i'm rambling. k.

=================================
What we really need is chicks with a whole new kinda orifice - Fish

Sharky, I should expect this level of immaturity from you after seeing your post titled "Hm." regarding the woman that lives next door to you. I think everyone who unfortuneatly read that post is a bit more ignorant now for doing so. - Spectre

All i wanted was some RICE CAKES! Now? WE MUST BATTLE.

[nobody]

it could be just that you are getting older. how long have you been doing this style, and how long ago, was it that you could do all the things mentioned without feeling awkward.

[Water Dragon]

GDA, this is correct. The question is, are you thinking you should fight like a boxer?

Pay attention to your hand matching exercises (push hand equivalent) That's the secret to setting up your attack. Even though you are very passive in the exercise, you need to use it aggresively in sparring. Don't wait for him to bridge. Jump out and force the bridge yourself.

The push hands of the internal arts is the equivalent of the jab in boxing. Figure out how and why the jab is used and you'll figure out how Tui Shou (bridging) is used.

[Xebsball]

My style is northern, so it is more focused on light footwork. But the thing is that naturally my footwork is heavy, training didnt make it lighter or faster, but made it more fluid...

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You brake my elbow i put your face in s.hit! HA HA HA, how about that, HA HA!
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[Starchaser107]

This isnt really about rooting , but , Ive got flat feet , and I train mostly nothern kungfu, but I noticed when I was training sanshou some of the exercizes after a while left my feet hurting,
anybody else here have flat feet and experience this problem ? also sometimes after an intense workout I experience the same thing.
How severely does this affect anything, if at all? If I somehow encounter a Xingyi, or bagua school would this affect my rooting?

"everything is everything"

[Shaolin36]

GDA,
I have noticed the same thing about myself. I think that now that we arte more rooted being light doesnt come without effort. I notice that I have to think about it more now to achieve it, rather than before it came more effortlessly. I am extremely more agile now so when I do go light on the feet its much more efficient.

Shaolin36

[Cody]

Eventhough I've never been much of a leaper, in my experience I know what you're talking about.
nobody's point about age might be a possibility, especially if there are old injuries, but you're speaking directly to before and after beginning KF training.

In terms of advanced teachers I have had contact with, age doesn't seem to have mattered a bit, nor training in rooting.

A couple of things can be going on with people. One has to do with placement of the mind, so that the concentration is so on rooting (translated into sinking of physical weight), that it begins and continues even when it shouldn't. Also the sinking and rooting idea can go wild such that one excessively sinks bones and mass in a strictly "physical" sense. This can make you feel grounded and is limiting, as you have found. Sinking energy does not do this, while allowing for appropriate sinking of mass. There is more to this than I can understand. k? But, from what you describe, there is something in your mental construct of rooting and sinking that needs to change, and you can do it.

Cody

[Mojo]

GDA
Don't worry, you'll always be our little ballerina princess.

:D

..............................
The Dude: Fortunately, I'm adhering to a pretty strict, uh, drug, uh, regimen to keep my mind, you know, uh, limber.

[Shaolin36]

I also read an article once that talked about rooting and said- If you wanted to root your self the best way would be to fill your body up with lead and let it settle down to your bodies feet and legs. Well, being that your body is 98% water this is figuratively possible. The best way to "settle" you water in your body-meaning putting it all on your lower parts(i.e. feet and legs) is to completely relax your body-this is how rooting takes place. When you relax you water settles. With this being said using the reverse to this-tensing your body while trying to do your light footwork may do the trick.

I dont know. Sorry for the scattered thoughts, it was a blurry weekend!!!!

Shaolin36

[KC Elbows]

At our school, we periodically do a couple drills to deal with this very thing. The basic theory behind the drills is that, in a real situation, you might not be rooted at the outset, and so you must be able to go from light footwork to rooted footwork.

What we do is basically shuffle for an indeterminate amount of time while another student plays the opponent, throwing out boxing style attacks. At any point where you see an opening, you must immediately root and attack. At first, your footwork will be very sluggish, but after practice, you gain skill in quickly rooting.

Frankly, its a good thing I've practiced this. My teacher recently decided to find lots of people for me fight. He gave a couple lessons to some SWAT dudes last week, and they've invited my teacher and I to practice at their facility, all kinds of gear and pads and masks and crap. I'm supposed to practice fighting for a full Saturday weekend after next. One of these guys outweighs me by 90 lbs, and I'm 220, so we're talking a real giant. I suspect that this is going to be a real learning experience, and though I'm more than a bit nervous, its very cool that my teacher wants me to be a good fighter as much as I want to be one.

I just hope they don't mace me first. ;)

[joedoe]

I am usually so stuffed after rooting I just fall asleep. Really ****es my GF off though :D

cxxx[]:::::::::::>
You're fu(king up my chi

[HopGar]

I know exactly what you mean, I have flat feet. Well Hop Gar has lots of stepping, more than other styles, well the one's I have done anyway, so my feet do hurt more. Maybe try to not sink your stances as much.....I dunno, I personally dont feel much pain, just have skin peelin....

Zvika

"He's not dead, 'es resting! Well if 'e's resting, I'll wake him up! 'Ello Mr. Polly Parrot...." -Monty Python, Dead Parrot Sketch

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

starchaser . . . my feet do that sometimes too. my sifu told me to get shoes with support in them and that actually made it worse . .. felt like someone was stabbing me in the arches of my feet by the end of class.

that's pretty cool kc elbows . . im gonna have to try that with my friends.

although my little girl makes me feel old sometimes, i'm physically only 21. though i was wondering if it could be related to age anyway . . . not so much to age but to lifestyle. when i was younger me and my friends used to run around doing crazy sh!t all the time. mostly we'd go breaking sh!t . . . but we'd also go climb on bridges, explore caves or abandoned buildings, break sh!t, egg houses, plaster church doors with poop, climb other stuff, run around in the woods, break stuff ... basically we were active little pri cks. i'm aging ****her and ****her from the lifestlye that likely kept me agile. i did most of this when i was a minor but i still tried to go out and have fun whenever i could all up until my kid was born. now i got to be more responsible and stuff. maybe i just need to go climb and do stuff more . . . but i just got to be careful not to kill myself cause i didn't give two sh!ts before. i need to break stuff more too. breaking **** isn't really realted to the agility but it's my favorate thing to do. infact, for the past two years my girlfriend got me and my friends a car to demolish for my birthday. her dad is real good friends with the dude who owns the garage and he just gave it to us to break. i'll see if i can't get the pics from my friends digi cam . . . we spent 3 - 4 hours each time making sure it was unrecognizable.

or maybe it's just the stupid kung fu.

where's my beer?

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

thanks mojo

where's my beer?

[Gigante]

I used to take pride in my ability to jump from something high up and land silently on my feet... nowadays I don't do it anymore for fear of hurting my knees... 8-/
And also I'm not very silent anymore...
I can not even run silently... I'm just too heavy... 8-(

[Nexus]

When rooting, we are also trying to accomplish taking the energy that the body is receiving as force and grounding it through the feet into the earth. This is why force instance in the horse stance, I can have 3 or 4 people pushing on me from my right side but I can maintain my posture because my body is aligned and the energy is sinking into the earth, so while they push the body remains in posture, even if my feet slide.

In qi gong, doing the wuji posture, we often try to sink all of the bodies energy into the earth through the feet. When we do this we feel very light in the upper half of the body, and it develops grounding(rooting).

Have you done any push hands yet?

- Nexus

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

yeah but i suck at it

where's my beer?

[KC Elbows]

He said push hands, not suck...

Oh, never mind.

[gazza99]

Push hands are great for learning to root, as well as pushing feet. (do push hands and lift one leg and push feet at the same time) Also "the post" training methods are good for this as well.
Bagua circle walking is also very good for learning to move easily and maintain root.
If im moving into an attacker I like to maintain a little lighter floating root until contact (so I can move a bit faster)and then I sink in more to put more power into it. This is just my preferance correct or not it works well for me. As soon as I make contact with the person I use my root and conect my center to theirs and put them off balence. This is very effective especially if you are throwing multiple strikes at the same time.
Gary

"Of course thats just my opinion, I could be wrong"-Dennis Miller
www.pressurepointfighting.com (http://www.pressurepointfighting.com)

[Nexus]

Gary, how goes your qi gong? You said you were going to start doing standing post more often these days, any movement in that direction?

[gazza99]

Nexus:
Accually yes Ive been doing much more qi-gong lately, I have also been doing my forms more, I noticed a big difference in my training after a week or so of increasing the above!!
I may not be posting for awhile after today, but perhaps once a month or so Ill have computer access? Im packing in the interim of posting...location of my "vacation" is classified....but take care everyone ....
regards,
Gary

"Of course thats just my opinion, I could be wrong"-Dennis Miller
www.pressurepointfighting.com (http://www.pressurepointfighting.com)