Lop Sau drills

[Bessho]

under the Touch reflexes: Chi Sau section check out the two movies, (1) Lop (grabbing hand) Sao & (2)Lop Sau with Footwork on this site. (http://www.wingchunkwoon.com/movies.asp)

why is it called "grabbing hand" when nobody is grabbing? is this a mistake or is there no grabbing hand in wing chun?

thanks,
ken

[fa_jing]

First video: They are grabbing then releasing, you just can't see it very well in the movie. Because it's a drill, they are probably not doing a full grab. A real lop sao is intended to jerk so hard that the shoulder is dislocated, the opponent loses their balance, and their head goes right into your punch.
Second video: Stepping back with bong sao is just a defensive maneuver against a strong punch. Although, if they get a good grip on your hand it will be difficult to move your feet. That's why the hand that is grabbed needs to roll into bon sao fast, to dissipate the force of the grab.
-FJ

[Bessho]

hi fa_jing,

Originally posted by fa_jing
First video: ... A real lop sao is intended to jerk so hard that the shoulder is dislocated, the opponent loses their balance, and their head goes right into your punch.

besides jurking to dislocate shoulder, disrupt balance and target the head - what do you think lop sau and punch portion of the drill is for? looking at the first movie again, both practitioners are using two hands to defend against one punch. is the bong not enough to deal with one hand? is this a modification? why do it that way? :confused:

tnx...ken

[rubthebuddha]

no idea why, but putting two hands one has always gotten me hit. personally, i'd either bong/wu or bong/punch. much simpler, and it keeps my head on straight.

[fa_jing]

I haven't thought a whole lot about it, since this is one of the first drills I learned, back when nothing made sense to me and I had to take everything for granted. Re-examining this drill, here are my opinions:

At a basic level, this drill trains the bon sao, trains the lop sau, trains the punch, and trains the footwork. As I stated before, the defender rolls the lop'd arm into bon sao as fast as possible, in order to dissipate the force of the lop. So if you vary your rhythm, you must be very sensitive to the force and react quickly. In my mind, this is the focus and #1 purpose of the drill. Yes, the bon sao alone is enough to dissipate the punch. If you truly needed a two-handed block, you would probably do a tan + bon double block. Keeping the other hand in the wu sao instead of tan sao is more aggressive, because there is less rotation of the wrist to do a lop sau. The normal wu sao position is not that far out, but for this drill the hand is placed close (not touching) to the bon sao in order to grab (lop) quicker. It should be pointed out that it is very difficult to lop a punch out of thin air, that's why you control the punch with your bon sao first. And acheiving a good lop on your opponent could help you end a fight.
More sensitivity is gained if you train the stance change. In this variation, when you are lop'd you have the option of lopping the lop by sharply interrupting the motion of your partner's lop. At the same time, you both turn your stances so that the other arm is out, and continue the drill. The goal is not to reverse every time, just every so often. This trains your sensitivity and preparedness.
For the record, in a real or realistic situation there is more than just 1 option from the bon sao + wu sao postion. Likewise, there are more ways to defend against a lop other than bon sao, Hsuen Sao or Circling Wrist comes to mind. Repeating the same thing every time is just training. This is a pretty easy drill to perform, I think it is mostly for beginners, but I still like it.
-FJ