Tell me about Wah Lum Tang Lang (not a troll, but might **** people off)

[Stacey]

What is it about? I'm talked to practitioners of it. It seems like wushu. 10,000 forms and weapon sets. They also say that "ALL" praying mantis was originally called Wah Lum. Is there any truth to thist? Has anyone ever faught Master Pan Choi? He is amazingly poised. I heard that he jumped out a window when people challenged him and they had to follow him, but none would.

Seeing articles on Sifu Mimi Chan got me interested. Is his style legit? Did he make it up? On other mantis sites, they mention diferent types of mantis, but not his, is it some kind of southern mantis?

[Richie]

I dont know if he is real or fake, but I understand what you are talking about when you say it kinda looks like wushu. I saw some Wah Lum guys doing butterfly twists in Traditional. I didn't know BT were traditional:rolleyes:

[Leonidas]

10,000 forms and weapons sets. Are you sure, i dont even think thats possible. The most techniques i've seen from a style is Hwa Rang Do and i could be wrong. I do know thats its a good style and can be used in a fight. It was also made to defeat other shaolin styles too. Thats how the origin the legend goes, but you can't really trust all of them. I think the original style was called Qi Xing(Seven star). Someone correct me on this

[NorthernMantis]

No problem dude.No offense taken.

We never use our real forms during competitions, the butterflies are part of our traditional repetoir.

The reason why there is so many weapons is because si gung is very knowleadgable on Chinese weapons.We do not have 10,00 forms :D That's abit much.There are plenty however.

[logic]

Wah Lum is northern praying mantis.
Pui Chan is a very good sifu and well known,He does train with sifu mimi.

He was on The Discovery Channel showing his technique the progrom was the secret of the warriors power.

find out more at
www.wahlum.com

[NorthernMantis]

<<They also say that "ALL" praying mantis was originally called Wah Lum. Is there any truth to thist?>>

We never said that.Wah Lum (Hua Lin in Mandarin) is a combination of Jut Sow Tong Long (wrestling hands praying mantis) and the Tam Tui family style of the late Lee Kwan Shan.Our history is basicaly the same as most others.However the founder of Jut Sow amd the the first 3 genration succesors are unknown.It called that way because it was founded in a place called Wah Lum which means dense forest.

<<Has anyone ever faught Master Pan Choi? >>

I heard of sigung being challenged but they were comical sturies oo how they were made to go through unsual tests to fight.

<<Is his style legit? Did he make it up? On other mantis sites, they mention diferent types of mantis, but not his, is it some kind of southern mantis?>>

Nope it's legit allright.Just ask the Taiji Mantis guys Master Lee Kwan Shan (the founder) hung out with Chiu Chuk Kai (the late Grandmaster of Taiji Mantis).It's northern like our other brothers.

[Tainan Mantis]

Like other styles of PM, Wah Lum consists of Wang Lang's original 3 forms; beng bu, lan jie and 8 elbows.
Lee Kwan Shan taught 12 empty hand forms, his WLPM has a strong influence of tan tui.

Chan Poi left Lee when he was 8 and continued his training in HK with Chan Wan Ching who himself left master Lee before finishing the WLPM system.

Chan Wan Ching went to HK and studied WLPM under the head of the HK branch Leung Sifu. He also became a master of several other styles and so had a lot of info to pass on to his student Chan Poi.

There are several of Chan Poi's kung fu cousins who continue to teach WLPM but remain low key and unaffiliated with Chan Poi's school's.

On a related note, master Zhang De Kuei of Secret Door PM also had only 12 forms, but his students, like Chan Poi, now have a very large curriculum of forms for the students to learn.

[EARTH DRAGON]

I was going to explian about wa lum but after tainan mantis spoke what more could be added other than I myself have had the opportunity to meet master chan pui on 2 differnt occasions and all I can say is that he is an incredicredable martial artist and a good man. I believe their is a plack at the shaolin temple that bears his name, he is 33rd generation from the temple. and I dare to you challenge his leg strength. he holds single leg knee bends for quite some time perfectly still.

[Fen]

I have a student that studied with Chan Poi in the 80's. His forms do not look anything like contemp Wushu to me. They look like Northern Mantis forms. And, he is a remarkable martial artist. His fave quote......."Kung Fu LOUSY!!!" (back then anyway). That's what my student says he said and that would make them study harder. They all wanted to make sure that he was happy with their Kung Fu. Must be a pretty great guy if he has that many people wanting to please him.....I feel fortunate to have one of his students as my student!!!

[NorthernMantis]

Actually Tainan I to my knowledge I'm not sure if we have Beng Bu or not but then again there are alot of forms that I don't know about yet.About 8 elbows...we have a from called 18 elbow.Could there be any similarity?

Iknow there are other Wah Lum schools in out there that are not of sigun's lineage but I don't know much about them.

[Tainan Mantis]

Northern Mantis,
Big mantis is another name for beng bu.
Little mantis is another name for iron door bolt.
Chan Wan Ching called little mantis a unique form of the wah lum system.

I'm sorry to say that 8 elbows is not related to 18 elbows. In WLPM people can learn 18 elbows in less than 2 years, sometimes. But 8 elbows is sometimes reserved as the very last form of a PM school.

[NorthernMantis]

I stand corrected.I know little mantis

[mantis108]

I believe that are 3 major lineages that are spinned off from the founder of the Praying Mantis style.

Mui Fah (considered both Hard and Soft)
Seven Stars (considered Hard Style)
Six Harmonies (considered Soft Style)

As far as my own research goes, Mui Fah line developed form the early stages of PM by the people who were more like friends and colleagues of Wong Long. This line also has many spin off styles Mui Fah, Taiji Mei Fah, Taiji, Wah Lum, 8 Steps, 8 Extremes, etc.. to name a few. May be this was when PM was still seeking an identity. BTW, Mui Fah might also have to do with the fact that Wong Long was dedicated to overthrow the Ching (foreign oppression). So Mui Fah was sort of a friendly reminder of the course or the common goal of practicing the style (just my speculation).

Seven Stars line, however, was developed at Wong Long's retirement age. So it has more forms and a more solid structure in teaching the PM style. So may be that's why it is a "hard style" (pun intended) ;) . Therefore less spin off (almost non) style from this line. Only today, we see something like conceptual vs traditional technical type of arguement within the style. i.e The debate on who gets the essence of the style? BTW, there is material to suggest the Taoist preist connection (some type of support to this theory of origin). Taoist preists were literate people. Perhaps that's why there are much more old manuscripts found in this styles than the others.

Six Harmonies line, I have no material to work with except that it is considered a soft style and is sometime referred as Ma Hau (horse monkey - a spiece of large monkey) Tong Long for its higher stance than the rest of the PM. Also this style seems to protect the centerline, which is a trait of internal styles, more so than the other PMs.

I tend to think that it would be helpful to compare the older versions of Kuen Po of each PM style. Quite a few of them are similar in writing styles and a few names of the moves are actually same regardless of the style. i.e the waist chop.

Just a few thoughts

Mantis108

[Tainan Mantis]

I'm sorry, I made a mistake.
Master Chan went to HK in 1948 when he was 12 years old.

Six Harmony PM.
I have some material on this style and there is no indication that it is an old PM style.
The forms are not in common with other PM styles. And forms like beng bu and dzai yao that they do teach were later adopted from other PM schools.
The forms appear to have PM techniques but the arrangement is not like other styles of PM.

Furthermore, the definition of the term six harmony as given in the ming dynasty by chi ji guang is not related to a later interpretation used by stylists of Six harmony PM.