Can light fighters even stand a chance against heavier?

[MantisKungFu]

I am only 5'4" and under 120lbs. I am thinking about training in Praying Mantis in about a week. My question is, in real life, would I be able to actually defend myself using my techniques? Or since I am so light, is it almost impossible for me to inflict pain/damage/whatever you want to call it? I just can't see myself being able to punch a 180+ lbs person and actually harm them.

I've come to realize I can't weight much, so I'm trying to build quickness. To do so, I've been doing lots of cardio over the past week, eating healthy, and drinking plenty of water. I seem to be more tone and possibly slimmer. Is this the wrong path to take? Should I try eating lots of protein and such?

Anyone who can answer either question 1. How can a lightweight hurt a heavyweight 2. Should I put on weight, if so by how? Would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for your time,

Brett

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"It is better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt"

[JWTAYLOR]

I watched a 5' 120lb 45 year old woman break the nose of a man that had just punched her. (He broke her nose too.) She kept punching, and had to be pulled off of him. I'd say, from that experience alone, that a lighter person can defend him/herself.

JWT

If you pr!ck us, do we not bleed? If you poison us, do we not die? And if you wrong us, shall we not revenge? If we are like you in the rest, we will resemble you in that the villany you teach me, I will execute, and it shall go hard but I will better the instruction. MOV

[apoweyn]

that's the thing. if you weigh 130lbs., you aren't applying 130lbs. to a target that's 200lbs. you're applying force to select and hopefully delicate targets on that person.

that said, a big muscular guy who's got skills too is a nightmare.


stuart b.

[Repulsive Monkey]

If you have a good root then no-one (except some one who has a deeper root then you!!) can knock you over. In that respect weight has nothing to do with it at all.

[Clyde the Glide]

Royce Gracie proved it time and again in his UFC matches. The early UFC's were open weight fights, and ver often you would see superior technique take out a stronger, larger opponent. I am sure that those here familiar with history concerning the various styles of kung-fu have similar examples from within their own art. However, where skill is relatively equal, other attributes such as strength, speed, agility, etc... come into play. Also, I would think that in extremes, size would be the deciding factor, ie a highly skilled fly-weight fighting an untrained 6'6" 375 lbs bruiser. In such extremes, skill may not be all that is needed for the win.

Clydeus Maximus: Mutt-fu Grand Master and Dominator of Cocky Teenagers in my youth group.

[Merryprankster]

Somebody define "root," are we discussing a static something or a dynamic something?

[JWTAYLOR]

Or, anyone with enough leverage anyone can knock/take anyone else down. Whatever way you want to look at it.

JWT

If you pr!ck us, do we not bleed? If you poison us, do we not die? And if you wrong us, shall we not revenge? If we are like you in the rest, we will resemble you in that the villany you teach me, I will execute, and it shall go hard but I will better the instruction. MOV

[Xebsball]

My sifu is smaller than me, but i bet he can kick my ass.

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"I AM EFFECTIVNESS"

[ewallace]

A smaller fighter will need to be the smarter fighter as well. Mantis would be a good system for you since it is very quick. If you were to come upon a larger opponent, your speed and angles of attack will be two of your greatest assets.

Victory goes to he who makes the next-to-last mistake.

[Kaitain(UK)]

that's pretty poor advice - your root is no good at all if someone smashes you in the face

also - a light person trying to root a heavy persons energy has a very tough time (in comparison to a heavy person rooting a lighter person_

my advice - use the toolbox you have - light, quick and agile - get them off balance, frustrate them and attack the joints (especially knees) - once they start getting flat-footed you can go for the body and head shots as they won't be absorbing them too well

remember - whatever you weigh, you can learn to put all of it into your hits and that will be enough to stop most people

Well trained skills will serve you well against most big guys - but if you get someone a lot bigger than you who also has skills then you're at a disadvantage - fight as dirty as you can

"If ignorance is bliss, why aren't more people happy?"

[Merryprankster]

WHAT THE @#!$##@! IS ROOTING!!!! :eek:

[MonkeySlap Too]

One of the most heinous fighters I ever knew was a fly weight.

The smaller guy really needs to be superior, especially if he is fighting bigger, skilled opponents.

Anyone who says size and strength does not matter, has never fought anyone bigger and stronger. Size and strength are great compensators - you can blow through mistakes in a fight. But, as cited above about Royce Gracie, superior technique, attitude and attributes can be used to defeat a bigger, stronger opponent.

"Poor is the pupil who
does not surpass his
master" - Leonardo Da
Vinci

[Jaguar Wong]

Merryprankster, it's exactly like when a Judoka drops his base to prevent a throw. I've noticed that wrestlers and Judoka will come into our school with a much better "root" than most of the guys that have been practicing the same amount of time. I guess they just worked harder to acheive the same results.

A smaller fighter would also have to be smart and choose when to be aggresive. You can't play defense as a smaller guy. You have to watch for, or set up an opening, and attack hard and fast. I would say that Praying Mantis is a good system for this. Either that, or Wing Chun (Wing Chung if you're talking to Ralek :)). Your strikes won't have as much power as the larger guy, so you have to unload on them and keep them on their heels to prevent them from counter striking with any power. If at all possible, take them down. It's your choice after that to follow (if you're a very sharp/technical grappler), or stay up and start pimp kicking (stomps) the guy.

Jaguar Wong

"If you learn to balance a tack hammer on your head
then you learn to head up a balanced attack!"
- The Sphinx

[Kaitain(UK)]

rooting - can be a bunch of different things

Essentially it's your link to the ground beneath you - a few things you can do with good rooting:

- an opponents force can be 'rooted' straight to the ground with a bit of practice
- the force of strikes can be greatly improved with a firm connection to the ground
- the above two can be combined i.e. you take your opponents incoming force, root it to the floor and use the rebound to magnify your own counter

"If ignorance is bliss, why aren't more people happy?"

[Merryprankster]

Ok... that makes sense. Thanks.

Jaguar, we don't necessarily work any harder at it, it's just that our whole sport is oriented about going to the ground under YOUR terms, not their's, so either you get good at it or you lose a lot.

I needed to know because I needed to point something out to Repulsive Monkey:

Having a good root as a little guy is useful, but if I remove you from the ground, no root. And a small person, on the neighborhood of 120 lbs, is one that I can lift, bodily, even without proper positioning, thanks to sheer size differential. I can stand in front of somebody that is 120 lbs with my arms STRAIGHT out, grab under their arms pits with my hands, and lift them to their tippy-toes, even if they have a decent base. God help them if I get an underhook.

Example: I shoot a single, and the 120 lb guy does everything correctly w/regards to hips and what not. Problem is, I'm too big, and it's like trying to crush a brick. Instead of forcing my body down, he's lifting his UP.

On the other hand, we have a 120 lb gymnast in our class who is unthrowable :) Not much of a root, but he doesn't need it.

[Robinf]

I'm personally 5'4" and 120 lbs training in Northern Praying mantis. In this style (as in all kung fu), you learn how to use the opponents movement against him/her. So, in those situations it'll be your weight plus the person's own weight against him/her. You also get conditioning--in drills and sparring.

While I admit that if I get sucker punched by someone larger than I, I'm going down for the count, if I can avoid it I'll be able to use it against him.

Robin

Surrender yourself to nature and be all that you are.

[Sharky]

hUHHuhuhUhUhhh... you said "rooting" UhUhuHUUhuUuhuUhUuhuh

All i wanted was some RICE CAKES! Now? WE MUST BATTLE.

[LEGEND]

Mantis...I'm only 140lbs and 5ft 7inches...the questions u're asking were questioned I ask myself years ago. From my experience it depends on 2 things...no. 1 do u have KO power...not just 1 punch KO...combo KO...the only way to find this out is to get in the ring and box and u're partner or trainer will judge for you. I have been KNOCK DOWN by a stocky white guy that weight only 120lb...he has a MEAN right hook! So it's possible.


No. 2...wrestling can help neutralize and takedown any bigger person!!! Especially if that person doesn't know how to defend takedowns!!! Most peeps look at wrestling as POWER vs. POWER. Not true...wrestling is ALL TECHNIQUE and LEVERAGE!!! The double leg takedown when broken down to DEMO. is an incredible tool for us LITTLE guys. It's hard for me to sit here and tell u...find a wrestling coach...ask him to show u step by step the DOUBLE LEG...and u'll understand how u can takedown a big guy! U have to feeeeeeeeelllllllll it! From there u're in the GROUND GAME and guys like KNIFEFIGHTER, JWT, Merryprankster can help u further.

A

[Ralek]

Royce Gracie opened a can of shizkit on all the kung fu guys who have challenged him at his academy. I have the challenge matches on video tape. The kung fu guys all outwieghed him but Royce still opened a can of shizkit and smashed this one guys head in with elbows. Royce is the shizkit.

Brazilian jiujitsu is superior.

[Aramus]

I've seen a little white guy not more than a buck 30 get blasted in the face and then proceed to unload hellicious blows on a much bigger guy 6' 200lbs (or so, steriod freak wanna be).

I had to fight a bigger guy 6'4"+(it was at night, he looked huge to me). He announced he was going to kill me and took a swing, I deflected and took out his knee. The fight was over that quick. I walked away (nervous and faster than normal) but I walked away.

If martial arts can't teach you to take down the bigger guy, why study? Of course if the big guy studies as hard as you...doh!

[HuangKaiVun]

The BETTER fighter wins, regardless of size or speed differential.

[MantisKungFu]

Everyone's opinions have been great. Keep them coming. Another thing though, should I try to put on 10 lbs? Will 10 lbs make a significant impact on my strength? Will it slow down my speed though? Thanks again,

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"It is better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt"

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

i'm little (5'4''/140) and big guys don't worry me at all.

i figure i have about the same chance of running into a big guy who can actually fight as i do running into a small guy who can tear it up.

allot of big guys can't hit woth a crap. same with allot of little guys. big or small, if they can't hurt me good pretty quick i will break them. i'm not a badass by any means, but i aint a b!tch either. if you can't hurt me in the time it takes for me to hurt you, your gonna fall down, and it's gonna hurt.

plus most big guys couldn't catch me anyway.

where's my beer?

[Silumkid]

Just as an example...

I have some black and white film footage of an old boxing match in which a 160 pounder fought a 220 pounder. I'd have to refer to my noted when I get home if you want names and dates, but anyhow, the 165er knocked the bigger fighter down for an 8 count. If I remember right, it was a straight right hand. In the street, that would have been plenty of time for one to make an escape or follow up....unfortunately, this was a boxing match. The big guy then hit the little guy so hard they say that 2 of his teeth were imbedded in the bigger fighter's glove.

We are trained in wushu; we must protect the Temple!

[LEGEND]

Well in streetifighting it doesn't matter...many bigger individuals will attempt to out strike you...and it ends up like a HOCKEY FIGHT...not even that technical! Many of the bigger punches will be a looping or baseball type punch= 1 power punch over and over again! Just simply striking your opponent with combinations should cause him to turn away! So u should not be concern with that at all.

The concern is if a bigger guy grabs u and tries to scoop u...u need to learn to defend that...any CMA style can teach u to hit the hell out of someone. But if he grabs you...u're now into the grappling realm and u better no how to counter that!

Adding an additional 10lbs or 20lbs would be wise!!! Begin lifting heavy 6 to 8 reps...failing near the 6 reps...COMPOUND exercises( squats deadlifts bench press rows military press etc... ). 3x a week! U should be swollen walking out the GYM. U will be stronger and bigger...EAT a lot of protein!

A

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

i agree with legend but i still think my chances of meeting a big grappler and little grappler are about the same. if anything, id probably be more likely to meet a small grappeler on the street.

of course the big guy would have an easier time hurting me, but as long as i don't die it's just something to chalk up to experience.

where's my beer?

[Wongsifu]

from my point of view it is possible easily to overcome larger opponents but its not too easy as they have a ****load of an advantage.

My sifu is 120 pounds which is light but he can kick like a mule, not only does he has a LOT of power but his technique and body positioning makes up for it, by far.

I am about 160 + pounds and i have a friend who is 250 pounds, which is a huge difference , he is tottally untrained but has a lot of muscle its not fat, and trust me it is harder to try and block punches from someone like that than it is for someone your own weight , they have so much raw power in them. but the bottom line is , if you do martial arts you can overcome it easily , btw packing on another 30 pounds of muscle will make a ****load of difference if you are serious about training. And you can accomplish it quite easily alongside your training , by the time it gets you to be proficient at ma you will have reached a good targt if you weight train.

what do bin laden and general custer have in common????
They're both wondering where the fu(k all of those tomahawks are coming from. - donated by mojo

[straight blast]

Definately put the muscle on, just don't lose sight of the fact that power comes from body mechanincs plus muscle., not just purely muscle. And in regard to fighting bigger people it doesn't matter how strong you are if you get a good smash in the nose, point of the jaw, throat, solar plexus or groin then you're in the s**t. Gee, doesn't that sound a little like the Wing Chun centerline?? :)
Always go for the throat. It scares the s**t out of people. :D

"Pain is merely weakness leaving the body"