Rare Choy Lee Fut book

[The Great Sage of HU]

The World's First Authoritive Presentation of Choy Lee Fut Kung Fu in Publication.

http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1402512192

[nospam]

Interesting.

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:cool:

[extrajoseph]

For those who are too young to know, it was published by Lee Koon-Hung. It is only the first issue, there was a whole series of them. Worth getting it if you have the money. There is some English translations in the magazine.

What a bummer, I threw all mine away years ago! Anyone got the whole set, please let me know. Together with Commemorative Anniversary Journals of various associations they make great research material, you can literally see how history is being manipulated and abused through time.

May be Lee Koon-Hung's estate would like to have them re-issued in one book, I am sure there will be plenty of interest.

JosephX

[Sow Choy]

Just for the record:

The book was not published by Lee Koon Hung, he only demonstrates some techniques. But it is a very interesting book, with various Choy Lay Fut styles.

As for the history, it's always nice to read. This versions history was written by Chan Yiu Chi, pretty detailed, just a little far fetched at times in my opinion.

[extrajoseph]

Sow Choy,

Thank you for the correction, I was told by my friend Edmond lee who does Wing Tsun in those days, that Lee Koon-Hung had a share in Kuen Way Kung Fu Magazine Publication. Obvious the information was incorrect. I believed him at the time because the publisher put out magazines on Wing Tsun, Choy Lee Fut and Five-Pattern Hung Kuen all at the same time.

The copy I had showed two articles on the history of CLF, one was by Wing Yeung (The Birthplace and Pioneeers of Choy Lee Fut), who got his information from the Association in Memory of Chan Heung and the other was called "The Story of Chan Heung's Founding of Choy Lee Fut" as recorded by Sifu Chan Yiu-Wun.

Chan Yiu-Wun was a student of Chan Yik-Yiu and Chan Yiu-Chi, so I presume, for the record, the article you mentioned was NOT written by Chan Yiu-CHI but by Chan Yiu-WUN, his student. As far as I know, Chan Yiu-Chi (the grandson of Chan Heung) had never published anything, he only wrote for his disciples and family members.

From the magazine, we can see everyone worked together and share their knwledge in those days. We have Leo Chu, a Buk Sing practitioner writing about the seeds of CLF and demonstrated by Chan Yiu-Wun, a Hung Sing practitioner from the Chen Family lineage. Lee Koon-Hung, Ho Ngau, Chan Siu-Fong (Chan Hon-Hung's daughter), Chui Kwong-Yeun, Li Yiu-Ling, Wu Wan-Chek, Chan Hee, Tong Shek, Doo Hon-Cheung, Lou Kee and Leung Biu (showed on the cover) and host of other CLF masters from different branch all contributed to the magazine and no one questioned Chan Heung as being the sole founder of CLF.

Nowadays, everyone works alone, we have different founders and we all think our techniques are more authentic and more advanced, whatever that mean. How sad and some people think this is progress!

Sow Choy, I am curious, from a historical point of interest, which part of Chan Yiu-Wun's story seem far fetched to you?

JosephX

[Sow Choy]

Hello extrajoseph,

Nice name, my name is Joesph also. First let me say I really enjoy your posts, thay are very informative and you seem very knowledgble. I actually was asked to write an article about the history of our style for a magazine, and only then did I realize the mass confusion of our history.

I found the history in the book to be very good and descriptive, naming the names of the villagers and all the specifics. The only thing I found un realistic was the way it was told, similar to a bad kung fu movie, the main thing was the feats of strength demonstrated by the masters in the story that seemed far fetch. Also there was not much mention of Jeung Yim. But that would have been a very larger book.

I am not a historian, but I do respect our history. In my article I used alot of info from that text as well as others. And I tried my best to represent the stories of Chan Heung, Jeung Yim as well as Tam Sam. I respect the different lineages, and their histories. I too feel that we are too distant from each other.

When it comes to Jeung Yim, I have a feeling he was unable to read or write thus no records of his training that I am aware of. This has caused some confusion, as well as bad translations into English. For example, Grandmaster Lee Koon Hung's books all contain some major errors, either movements, text and the history was incorrect also.

That's why I enjoy the history, but more so the philosophy. Getting excited over history is kinda like be a football nut. You never will give up you team, lol.

Anyways, I look forward to more of your posts, Happy New Year!

Joe Keit

[extrajoseph]

Dear Joe,

Thank you for your reply. I find the feats of strength a little bit strange as well, but I try to keep an open mind. People in those days do train very hard and all day long and everyday, so they are much more focused and may be able to do the things we think that are impossible. I try to think of them like modern athletes except in reverse. If your life depends on your skill and your training, I am sure you can do some amazing things as well.

As for Jeung Yim, I know from my experience, there are a lot of reference of him in the Chen family archive. Also there is a large body of theory and philosophy in the writings passed down by Chan Heung and his offsprings, but no one bothers to ask.

As you have read in the other posts, the Jeung Yim Hung Sing people have international meetings but never bother to invite members of the Chen family. If people are genuinely interested in CLF history and philosophy, why side line the Chen family? Why not visit the King Mui Village and speak to the elders there? CLF has a history of only 160 years, it is not very long and it is not difficult to find out what people 4 or 5 generations ago think, writing or no writing, educated or not.

For example, if someone said Jeung Yim or Chan Heung is born in a certain year and in a certain village, you can go there and find out if it is true because there would some body there remembered his family. If someone said he died in certain year and was buried in certain spot, you can go there and see if you can find the grave. We could not do this during the Cultural revolution but China is now open up, so there is no excuse for us to guess and fight each other with rheterics instead of proofs.

I hope I don't sound too acidic. Unlike some others, I really think history and philosophy do matter if a martial art system is to survive, hence the tone of my writing.

JosephX

[Sow Choy]

Hello Joseph,

I agree with you, going to King Mui is something I hope to do one day. I am actually going to be in Fut Shan this March, but I don't believe we will have time for King Mui, also we don't know anyone there.

I still find the feats of strength hard to believe, not so much that they couldn't do terrific things, just the way the author presented it, seems he is very proud and maybe tends to exagerate a little, never the less, great book and great info on our founding father, the great Chan Heung.

I am very proud to be a part of Choy Lay Fut, and I have nothing but great respect for Chan Heung and family. I have yet to meet anyone from the Chan family, but I would be very happy to make new friends and help keep our CLF families uniting, to me this is the most important thing.

I do agree with you on the history, that is why I enjoy reading your posts as well as others from the different branches, I just wish our pride would not let us get the best of us.

I believe that every master is a contributor to the evolution to CLF. While it is very important to respect Chan Heung our founder, is also important as real CLF brothers not to discredit anyone also. I know we all have made that mistake at least once.
Both of my sifu's taught me that Jeung Yim was a founding father and helped Chan Heung further our style, but always respected Chan Heung as his sifu and always called him that. Even though not everyone agrees on this story, and wheter it is true or not will always be speculation. I do believe he added to our branches syle.

Just like the bible, people will always argue over that until the end of time too. I do not believe we should ever give up researching and learning our history, I just believe we can improve on presenting a better way.

I know that in the past students have shared past knowledge with their sifus. Mine is the same way, he is always a student, and likes to see how all the martial arts train. I have showed him variuos techniques I learned before, and even the esscence of our style is a hybrid. But I could care less which story is true.

I have seem some Chan family video clips and thought the performers were pretty good. The expression was similar to our school, some differences in movements: extension, kicks, weapon technique etc... But same main techniques.

I see our CLF from Lee Koon Hung is very different than others. And so on with other schools I am sure. I just hope to live up to the generations before me, and I look forward to spending the rest of my life training CLF.

I currently teach CLF full time under Master Li Siu Hung at 2 locations in Florida. CLF has changed my life for the better, and I just hope that I can help others feel the same as I.

I respect your views on our history, even if we were taught different. I enjoy learning our history even if if it were different then what I was taught. Just like a detective, you must see all the clues and form your own hypothesis.

Take Care my friend, look forward to more posts.

Happy New Year! Sun Neen Fai Lok!

Joe Keit