Difference between Nei gong and Qi Gong

[Water Dragon]

What's the difference? I basically classify all my internal work as Nei Gong. Example: Iron Body, which uses the breath, is an example of Nei Gong. What is Qi Gong?

[Daniel Madar]

Qi gong is a form of nei gong. Nei Gong encompasses a wider range of activities, such as meditation, stance training, internal arts in general, and as you said, includes all things considered internal.

[Water Dragon]

Hey Daniel,
If that's the case, does the Qi Gong need the Nei Gong as a base? I guess I'm asking if it's a different training I haven't encountered yet.

Or is it just a different way of talking about the same thing? i.e. are the terms Nei Gong and Qi Gong interchangeable? Back to the Iron Body. It's dependant on me using my breath in certain ways. Is this a Qi Gong even though I'm physically doing things (not hitting myself) as well?

[EARTH DRAGON]

Actually translated neigong means "internal kung fu"
and qigong chi kung means "the study of chi"

So as you can see they are not the same at all.

[GreyMystik]

as i understand it, nei gung would be 'internal gung' which could be taken to mean 'knowledge and skill of the internal gained through hard work' or something along those lines, whereas 'chi gung' would be 'knowledge and skill of chi (breath, energy, there is no direct translation but i think you get the idea) gained through hard work'
in other words, one pertains to more chi-functions whereas the other applies to internal work in general. as i understand it, chi gung would be a sort of branch under nei gung.

[Daniel Madar]

Hmm. I consulted a friend who translates chinese to english for a living, and grew up in china, and an expert in Bagua Taiji.

His statement can be paraphrased thus:

Nei gong is a classification based on the use of chi. Chi gong is a classification based on the method of manipulationg chi. Qi gong can thus be viewed as a subclass of neigong. You do not need to learn neigong to do qigong. Qigong is by definition a form of neigong.

[Repulsive Monkey]

QiGong does not translate to the study of Qi at all!!!!It translates more closely to Energy Work. Qi =energy and Gong=work.

[GLW]

Qi Gong = Qi Work or Qi Exercise - Qi being what it is.
Nei Gong = Inner Work or Inner Exercise....

semantics....

[patriot]

Neigong has a martial connotation. It is applied QiGong. Many Qigong practitioners practise purely for health and cannot apply their Qi for self-defense.

[EARTH DRAGON]

Not to argue and with all due respect but I do speak mandarin and know what qigong means and was just explaining the differences however wanting to get technical

qi= energy (loose transaltion)

kung =skill actual translation

but all in all we all basically said the same thing for characters are extremly hard to actiually translate to english letters and paraphrases... take care your freind E.D

[blacktaoist]

Earth Dragon,Repulsive Monkey was Right in what he said in his post.


Earth Dragon(qi= energy (loose transaltion)

QI Also called Chi, means the energy that circulates within the body. But you are right when you write that Qi means Energy.


E-D(kung =skill actual translation

Kung means work in Chinese. So Chi Kung , also Called Nei Kung (internal Kung Fu) means the development of the energy that circulates within the body.



E-D(I do speak mandarin and know what qigong means and was just explaining the differences however wanting to get technical

I speak little mandarin, but my sifu teach me mandarin so I have a good understanding of Chinese Chi kung and Chinese terms. Also your Translation of the word Kung is Wrong.

The Actual Translation for the Chinese term Kung also called Gong, is energy or hard work. The Chinese term Kung Fu, Most Chinese masters that I train under use the other word Gong Fu means Literally energy-time. Anything which takes time and energy to learn or to accomplish is called Gong Fu (Kung Fu)


The Chinese term for skill is "QIAO: skillfull or ingenious. Other Term is QIAO JIN: Martial power applied skillfully or ingeniously. When I was in Beijing many Chinese masters use these two terms.
Peace



;)

[EARTH DRAGON]

I think we are splitting hairs here, as you know we cannot actually use english termenology to translate meanings and or characters into english letters as wade giles and pinyin have a pretty good general grasp at translating, there are still many things that simply cannot be translated or even properly spelled for that matter...i.e tell me whats right and whats wrong in this list acording to translation and spelling

qi, chi, ki
kung, gong , gung
pa kwa, ba gua, ba kwa,
bejing, peking,
tai chi, taji
chuan , Quan,
retreating monkey, repulsive monkey, returning monkey
wave hands like clouds, cloud hands, hands from clouds

So you see it is very hard to translate sound even the same meaning from mandarin to cantonese sounds different and translated different and spelled different.. especially into english

So my point is maybe ones learning of what certain meanings or characters is different but you cannot say that my interpertation is right and your is wrong for it is all interpretation....for there is no real interpration for what chi even is yet you tell me I am correct and that it means engergy that circulates through the body?????? maybe thats your interpreation of what chi is but that does not mean that you are right, becuse many people would say that qi is everywhere not just in your body....

So how can you say that anyones is wrong.........and however you spell kung fu it means what???
skill
work,
practice
time spent
knolwedge though practice
Sorry repulsiveMonkey and black doaist... while I didnt mean to go off like this but I find it amusing that people say that I dont know what I am talking about becuse I didnt identify it that way they understand it....

[les paul]

Now days both terms can mean the same thing.

Both terms could contain both Wei and Nei Gong, plus
different kinds pre and post Breathing, also various different post exercise.

Spanky

[Water Dragon]

Patriot's responce makes the most sense to me. Would the rest of you agree that his is correct?

[blacktaoist]

ED-So how can you say that anyones is wrong.........and however you spell kung fu it means what???
skill
work,
practice
time spent

BT- I can say that you are wrong because you are Wrong." Your Translation of The Chinese Term Kung was Wrong thats just the bottom line. As I said in my first statement the word Kung Have nothing to do with skill, and any Traditional Chinese sifu will tell you Kung means work in Chinese this word have nothing to do with skill. No matter how the word Kung Fu is spell in Chinese or English. Kung Fu means Time and enery to learn to accomplish QiAO -SKill



ED-for there is no real interpration for what chi even is yet you tell me I am correct and that it means engergy that circulates through the body?????? .


BT-I said your Interpration for Chi Is Correct, because it was a Fundamental statement by you that was correct. Chi is energy. A very General statement that everybodys knows. I hope?


ED-becuse many people would say that qi is everywhere not just in your body....

BT-My statement was just a General true answer to the Question about Nei Kung. I know that Chi(Qi) is a energy pervading the universe, including the energy circulating in the human body. Some people Call Chi that Circulating in the human body Bio-Electricity.



ED-So you see it is very hard to translate sound even the same meaning from mandarin to cantonese sounds different and translated different and spelled different.. especially into english

No matter if Kung Fu is Translate In Mandarin or Cantonese the Word Kung fu will sound Different, but the General meaning of the word would be the same.(Kung Fu- Time and energy.)



ED-So how can you say that anyones is wrong.........and however you spell kung fu it means what???

BT-Every Chinese Teacher I ever Train under, School me in they Culture Traditions getting me knowledge to enhance my personal growth. So I know what I'm talking about, Also I hangout with many Chinese Martial Artists. I'm always asking them Questions About Chinese Boxing and Taoism Theory. They also help me with my Mandarin and understanding of Chinese Terms. I say you are wrong because you are wrong in your first statement conforming to the Chinese term-Kung Fu. We are talking Chinese Term right?

Most Cantonese Chinese that I Know most of the time say the word GongFu (Kungfu) energy or hard work. Most MandarinChinese that I know say Kung fu (Gongfu) meaning the same as above. So the word may sound different, the maining of the word is about the same Because its a Chinese term.

Like I said In my first Reply to you, the Chinese term for skill is "QIAO: skillfull or ingenious. Other Term is QIAO JIN: Martial power applied skillfully or ingeniously. The word Kung or Kung fu is not the Chinese word for skill.

Do your research , I know I did mines.

:cool: Peace

[EARTH DRAGON]

I do not wish to agrgue about something so silly, for we both know what the difference is between qigong and neigong as I know we are both experienced in CMA and both have been trained by chinese masters, and I think that the point is that we know the difference not how we sliced it sorta speak, so while your explianation was fine I and I do enjoy your posts and wise words would just like point out something funny, again not to argue but just bring it to light... you said to see my point of view ..... you said

BT- I can say that you are wrong because you are Wrong." Your Translation of The Chinese Term Kung was Wrong thats just the bottom line. As I said in my first statement the word Kung Have nothing to do with skill, and any Traditional Chinese sifu will tell you Kung means work in Chinese this word have nothing to do with skill. No matter how the word Kung Fu is spell in Chinese or English. Kung Fu means Time and enery to learn to accomplish QiAO -SKill

so in that paragraph you definatly said "and any Traditional Chinese sifu will tell you Kung means work in Chinese "

yet here is what you said right after that.......

No matter if Kung Fu is Translate In Mandarin or Cantonese the Word Kung fu will sound Different, but the General meaning of the word kung would be the same.(Kung Fu- Time and energy.)

so which is it? do you see my point now?

first you said kung means work
then you said kung means (time and energy)

So therefore someone could say that your wrong in your definition, but yet you wouldnt want someone to say your wrong and you dont know what what kung fu means...... becuse you said kung means techniqally two different things..... that was my whole point. I hope you see the humor in this again I mean no disrespect and I admire you as a martial artist but if you say tomato and I say tomoato it still is a round red fruit right? or is a vegtable?????????????????????

[mantis108]

I will go with patriot's defination. Plus that traditionally Nei Gong is also an esoteric term for Taoist (Buddhist to a certain degree) practices. it is more "spiritual" than Qigong. If the Gong involves a highly spiritual component, it would be considered Neigong not just a Qigong.

Mantis108

[blacktaoist]

BT-so in that paragraph you definatly said "and any Traditional Chinese sifu will tell you Kung means work in Chinese "

I make a mistake in that statement using the word work. I'm only human.

But anyway you are right, I don't want to agrgue about who is right about Chinese Terms. I would like to talk about practical knowledge of Chinese Martial Arts and how to establish a real foundation for high level skills.

But most people on Kung fu on line don't know any real Knowledge. Most of them post Bull$hit Martial Art Theory, how sad."

Anyway Earth Dragon I have no beef with you or anybody on this web page You have a right to your opinion.

Peace Practice and live long.:cool:

[EARTH DRAGON]

Yes I hear you, whats even more funny is responding to the young kids who started training last year and post on the main forum where the big question is who would win in a fight bruce lee or jet li. But everybody has to start sometime. I enjoy these boards for exchanging knowledge, answering questions and helping out other people by sharing what I have been lucky enough to learn in my life. I decided to start teaching 4 years ago but have been training for 21 so compared to my shrfu's I am starting to learn a little. But if I can help other people become better or more informed than I that makes me feel good, but sometimes I am a little stuborn in my opinons, and I aplogize for that ..take my freind E.D