Please read this is a good one!!!

[EARTH DRAGON]

I am still cracking up as I write this post. I just got back from the main board and although I dont like the threads ever on that board as I am reading this caught my eye, the thread was called
"FAST Tai Chi-- For Self Defence (a new concept)" and I just had to cut and past it for you guys to have a good laugh here it goes....

My friends and I have been tryng this for 5 months now.

and to me it seems a lot like Kung Fu but different in a way.
And a lot more technical

The more I practice, The more I can move around my opponent without them even touching me.

I do mix this new technique with other Martial Arts.
Like Kung Fu itself.

But the calm easy flowing spirit helps alot.

Like if someone attacks you and turning it into a Re-Action
of easy breathing self defence.

DON'T get me wrong,I have years of Karate and Boxing.
But I really believe this Fast Form of Tai Chi could be very leathal (If executed right)


We didn't run this idea by my Sifu yet.

But we practice it because She suggested it.

But she doesn't know our progress.

Next these guys will be posting that they have a new invention that all you have to do is pick up a handle shaped device, punch a few buttons and you can talk to your freind without even being at the same house.................

[Waidan]

We've all got to start somewhere, man. Hopefully the kid's got a good Sifu that'll steer him correctly.

[Ray Pina]

My first taste of "taiji" came at a Grateful Dead show. I was moved by the music and though, this must be what they mean in Taiji.

Sort of right, sort of wrong, but that was my intro.

I saw that post too and even responded. Yea, I'm still foolish enough to get dragged into that board at times, but I'm finding the quality here to be much higher -- not surprising.

[Water Dragon]

Originally posted by EARTH DRAGON
I am still cracking up as I write this post. I just got back from the main board and although I dont like the threads ever on that board as I am reading this caught my eye, the thread was called
"FAST Tai Chi-- For Self Defence (a new concept)" and I just had to cut and past it for you guys to have a good laugh here it goes....


Real good attitude there SIFU
Remind me to send my children to go study with you.

[RAF]

Thats why my teacher, when students first came to him asking for taiji, sent them out to do only 4 single moving exercises: part the wild horse's mane, brush knee and strike, heel kicks, and 45 degree kicks. All done slowly and up and down a field about 50 yards. The 45 degree kicks actually had you go down, sit in a twist stance and then rise kicking slowly. This usually cured them of their "sugar plum fairy dance in my head" feel for taiji. Proved that taiji was not that easy. This went on for the entire summer. Needless to say there were few taiji students and maybe thats the way my teacher wanted it, I don't know.

Most students quickly said, "Naw, I don't want to do this and then got thrown into basic praying mantis kicking, punching and two man moving exercises. (mainly 8 step praying mantis) along with 18 lohan exercises.

Then they got some jiben gong dao training. After that they were much more open to training in taiji.

Don't you think learning fast taiji early is putting the cart before the horse?

[EARTH DRAGON]

Dear brother, I was reffering to the comment (new concept) Thats what I found amusing, it was worded that the idea that if you do Tai Chi Chuan fast you can use it for self defense was invented by these two guys.
I was not laughing at the lack of knowledge or their beginner staus. So Please reform from placing judgment on others simply by your interpetation or their words. I think you have read most of my posts and realize that I am much deeper than that. At least I hope so.

[Water Dragon]

OK, so maybe you weren't laughing at their lack of understanding/beginner status. How do you think the kids gonna feel if he come over on this board and reads the thread you started?

[prana]

Earth Dragon

I am often inpsired by your posts. I think the little clarification you made is a good step. It is good to know you are not knocking their enthusiasm :)

[EARTH DRAGON]

Water dragon, they would probably realized that what they said amused me. everyone hears funny things and stories from time to time but sometimes I hear things that make me laugh. I didnt know their was any thing wrong with that. Have you not read somethings on this board that you found were amusing?

Constructive critisism is O.K, actually helpful and sometimes humbling but saying that I have a bad attitude for a shifu and you wouldnt bring your children to me seems a bit harsh wont you agree. I did'nt think that I dissapointed you that much..

Prana, thank you.

[red_fists]

Earth Dragon.

What shocked me was when I read the Profile of "logic" I discovered that he has 2 yrs less in MA than me, but a bit more time in TCC.

Unless his Profile is not accurate, he also seems to be around my age.

[Water Dragon]

Maybe I'm wrong, I don't know. But I always hold a teacher to a higher standard. That's one of the reasons I don't plan on doing it, too much responsibility.

Truthfully, I'm not even 100 % comfortable with the Siheng title I have now. I'm not even living up to those responsibilities like I should.

If you never claimed the title Sifu around here, I'd probably be laughing with you. As it stands, you have chosen to refer to yourself as such. In my mind, it means you need to accept everything that goes with it.

Even if this is just cyberspace, and even if none of your students post here.

But like I said, that's just my opinion. And I'm pretty much nobody.

[EARTH DRAGON]

Water , ""You are a somebody""and you are intitled to your opinon. However becuse I am a sifu does that not give me the right to have a sense of humor? I also find humor in thread's (titled who who win in a fight jet li or bruce lee) Does that make me a bad sifu?
I think you have read into my post way to much and for some reason thought that I was being derogatory towards them. I just simply pointed out the fact that someone on this board though they invented Tai Chi fighting application. And found that funny, actually quite funny and it gave me a good laugh but should
I feel quity for that ?

Please dont judge someone simply by 1 of the 900 posts that I have made for I thought you had a perspective towards me....

PS I have many students that post here, some of wich have been with me for 7 years and some that have BB in other japanese styles that are looking for internal and softer skills, so I must be doing something right.

[jon]

Sifu is still a person.
I gotta say i kinda agree with both WaterDragon and EarthDragon on this one, notice how similar your names are guys?
I agree that a sifu posting as such in public will be held to a higher standard but that should not come at the expense on him or her enjoying themselfs whilst on the forum.
I think ED's post here was really just poking fun and was not intended to be insulting. I rather like a good sence of humour in a teacher and i find it refreshing to see that they dont take everything to seriously.
My old Tai Chi weapons sifu used to frequently start dancing around in the middle of a serious Tai Chi ruitine whilst trying to poke me with a stick. She would also sometimes go from Tai Chi to some kind of pretend monkey she had made up.
It made me cry with laughter seeing a 60 yo women trying to beat me up with a plastic sword whilst pretending to be a monkey and i loved her to bits for it.
I think a sifu should be a bit 'above' and beyond in terms of status but its really nice when every now again they come down and poke a little fun at what got them there in the first place.

[Nexus]

ED is entitled to be himself, and act the way he chooses. It's not right or wrong to poke fun at somebody or something, it just is what it is.

Right or wrong are "judgements" made after the fact, and as the Tao Te Ching says it,


In comparison, the sage,
in harmony with the Tao,
needs no comparisons,
and when he makes them, knows
that comparisons are judgements,
and just as relative to he who makes them,
and to the situation,
as they are to that on which
the judgement has been made.


Take care all of you.

- Nexus

[shaolinboxer]

Nexus, that, IMO is a poor use of an very wise statement to justify being a jerk.

[EARTH DRAGON]

Thank you jon and nexsus I thought I was all alone in my outlook towards what and whom I supposed to be. I have many times laughed at certain things that have been said on these boards, But according to water dragon this somehow takes away from my competence and skill as a teacher. I dont quite understand why this thread has taken this direction. I simply posted something that I found funny. But I guess that becuse I am a teacher of martial arts I am not allowed to laugh at things that are funny like a student can. What has this world come too.

Shaolin boxer , I hope you are not implying that I am a jerk and you are just making a general statement.....

[shaolinboxer]

I am not making a general statement, but I am not saying you ARE a jerk, merely that laughing in the face (actually behind the back) of an eager student's ignorance is acting LIKE a jerk.

"But I guess that becuse I am a teacher of martial arts I am not allowed to laugh at things that are funny like a student can."

Yes, that is right. You are not afforded certain liberties because as an instructor you are expected to emulate certain ideals. But then again, pehaps I am to idealistic.

[jon]

I have much respect for you and your background, it would take a lot more than you finding humour in something for me to lose that respect.

I think in truth we all are to judgemental, i personaly have made a VERY judgemental post today in this very forum and im already starting to regret it. On the other hand i cant help thinking we all take ourselfs WAY to seriously. I mean we cant all be mr perfect all the time, at least i cant. I dont think you could either, even if you do have better skills in your hands than me and more time on the training room floor. You are still made of the same thing in the end, to have to pretend your above being human is not plausible.
The plain fact is when you look at it from a totaly unbiased perspective.

You came in and judged a someone, even though only in humor.
Now others are judging you based on your comments.

Its not really fair but it is natural, we will all make the odd mistake or do things without fully considering all the consequences but if you can just accept it and learn from it then your on your way to becomming a better person.
We can all judge but the hard part is to accept the judgment of others and learn from the experience.
I would love to simply take back many things i have said as they have not been well recieved but in truth they have all taught me something and i have learnt many valuable lessons even from the harshest of critics. I may have a big loud stupid mouth but it helped me learn.

I wont attempt to truely speak for everyone here but i will say...
You would have to be a pretty poor judge of charactor to base an opinion solely on this thread. You have made MANY great posts and the value of them far out wieghs any of the ones you may not have been so well received in.

Happy Chinese new years to you and your family.
Both kung fu and personal
Respects and regards
Jon

[EARTH DRAGON]

Thank you jon for that insightful and kind post. I think the bible story of casting the first stone applies to this situation.
It seems as though the people who judge have not yet looked at themselves in the same way but are hasty to point out the faults of others. Heaven knows that people on this board are always responding with words of wisdom and they never say anything negitive about another even when trolling.... Give me a break!
this board is about learning, exchanging, sharing and entertaining. However as you have said it should not be for judging, though some people do. I think that possibly water dragon was hasty in his post and I really didnt think that he meant it for He has read many of my posts and out of 900 maybe 3 were of a negitive tone. This thread I dont feel is of that tone but rather to shed light on a funny situation and I dont feel the need to defend what I found quite funny.

What gets me is that if I said that I was student I could troll argue, rant, call names, insult, and hurt the feelings of others and that would be acceptible for some poeple but becuse I am a teacher of the art everything I say must be said on golden tongue. It is nice to know that you feel like my teaching and martial skill has nothing to do with cutting and pasting a funny thread. I just wish others could be just as open minded.
Lighten up people this is not classtime and you are not in the temple

[shaolinboxer]

"What gets me is that if I said that I was student I could troll argue, rant, call names, insult, and hurt the feelings of others and that would be acceptible for some poeple but becuse I am a teacher of the art everything I say must be said on golden tongue. "

That's right. Once you start calling yourself sifu, you should be expected to act like one, in all forums.

"It is nice to know that you feel like my teaching and martial skill has nothing to do with cutting and pasting a funny thread."

I wasn't your pasting of the thread, it was your sarcastic comment. I don't doubt your skill, but I don't affirm it either, as we have never met.

"I just wish others could be just as open minded.
Lighten up people this is not classtime and you are not in the temple"

The temple, as you say, exists only in our minds and hearts. It is not a place, it is a state of being.

[EARTH DRAGON]

Shaolin,
I dont feel that just becuse I posted something that I found funny I am not acting like a sifu. Again are we not intitled to have a sense of humor? or allowed to laugh?
I simply found something amusing and wanted to share it with others as I am sure other people would find it funny also, but I feel as though I am being chastised and percecuted for it
"how droll"

I do however honestly like your last comment, but if I said that with a sarchastic tone would you then judge me for it?

Or are'nt sifu's allowed to joke or be sarchastic either?

[shaolinboxer]

"Or are'nt sifu's allowed to joke or be sarchastic either?"

I am one of the most sarcastic sons-a-guns I know, and I appreciate what you are trying to say.

But I still think that sifu have a responsibility not to use this kind of sarcasm when discussing the beliefs or statements made by beginners. It creates bitterness and confusion, where encouragement and education could have been.

You are in the unique position to set an example and be a guide. I emplore you to seize this opportunity to do as much good as possible.

Thank you for your time in this discussion (and I mean that without sarcasm). I look forward to reading more of your typically excellent posts.

[EARTH DRAGON]

Well I must say that I like your kind attiude and that I one of the reasons that I am replying. If you had come across as anything other I would not feel the need to explian myself.

In your statement you said that sarcasim creates bitterness and confusion. I guess that would be up to the interpretation of the individual. Sometimes it is hard to know when someone is joking and pulling your leg and other times things are said that are taken the wrong way when the person had not that intention.

The second satement is true and if you read the original post I did give them a slight history on Tai Chi and told them that is was desigined for combat and much later slowed down to maximize the health benfiets. But spoke breifly becuse I thought the thread was a joke! And even aid so on the thread. I then checked his profile and found that they have been studying for 2 years. so while I still think that 10 years you are still a beginner I thought they were just poking fun at tai chi. for that would not be considered a newbie!!!

While I do set good examples I feel that when I am home and surfing the net I can be relaxed and not walk on egg shells. When I am reading something on line at KFO "my favorite internet passtime" I feel as though I should not be judged so closely. I even have sworn at home and also in the past had a couple alcoholic drinks. Some thing of which I would not due at the school or around my students. But I didnt think that by my posting that funny thread would place so much judgment on who and what I am all about. But kay sa ra ser ra.... thanks for your kind explianation.your freind E.D

[prana]

I think in truth we all are to judgemental, i personaly have made a VERY judgemental post today in this very forum and im already starting to regret it. On the other hand i cant help thinking we all take ourselfs WAY to seriously. I mean we cant all be mr perfect all the time, at least i cant.

Wise Mr Jon, wise. I forgive you for telling Nexus off :D

hehehe

no seriously, you make good sense... :)

Water and Earth Dragon,

I too am of the year of the dragon, and I think I might be an earth dragon myself (not sure). Dragons... :cool:

[jon]

You know you would never pick it but...
Im a fire snake:rolleyes:
Kinda suits me;)
Would be nice to be a Dragon like you guys but ill just have to settle for the hot tempered reptile that i am:(

[Nexus]

Keep releasing those emotions. Release, relax, harmonize.

- Nexus

[Water Dragon]

Actually Prana, I'm a wood Tiger. Who woulda thunk it ;)

[kungfuyou]

I have to say to everyone here that the way this is all being handled is done in a very mature and kind fashion. Everyone is entitled to their own opions. It's nice to see that now one is being slammed for having one.

ED,
I have to say that you are handling this matter in a way that is most becoming in a Sifu. I think that if this would have happened in any other forum, with other individual's on this board, there would have been tempers flaring and a lot of name calling. You addressed the people that had the problem in a very calm, and respectful way. You showed that they were allowed to have an opinion without ridiculing them for it.

This goes for everyone else that has posted. Just nice to see that things can be talked about in a calm manner without people being insulted and acting childish!

Not that I am anybody or what I say here is going to change the world, but I to have an opinion and will speak my mind when I feel the need to!! :)

Peace and good training to all!!

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

This reminds me of highly skilled pushing hands... each pushing untill feeling resistance.. then receiving the energy to return it to its' source.. pretty neat.. Too often, we elevate our images too highly, even as "teachers" we are humans first.. My own experience is that my students appreciate my Humanity as much as my title.. express both.. (balance)..

Just after a year into my Tai Chi experience, i asked Master Chan if Tai Chi could be done fast.. the resulting demonstration burns hot in my memory.. he did the entire Yang long formin about 5-6 minuteswith Chen-like pauses and explosive rebounds.. his butt seldom rose more than a foot off the floor.. of the 5-6 of us there that early Saturday morning, some 10 years later we still have troubly expressing what we witnessed with words..

I asked Master Chan if we should try that, too.. He said, "yeah, when you feel it happening, just do it".. again, 10 years later, i am beginning to understand.. when i practice alone, sometimes it just feels right, the form itself begins to express a new side of itself through me.. it just happens.. I think he was saying that to force it at combat speed is counter-productive.. i think he was saying to just wait, the speed and power will come to you, you don't need to chase it..

Be well, be "you"...

[guohuen]

I dunno, I laughed my arse off! I thought they were like two kids discovering you could cook on fire! Really, I almost fell off my chair (sitting in lotus position). Being dense myself I don't feel I was being disrespectfull, it was just another example of the beauty of "dawn at marblehead".

[EARTH DRAGON]

Kung fu you,
thank you I feel as though if I have to expalin myself it should be done in my normal way, ironically enough it was water dragon who said that I wasnt acting like a sifu when I posted this thread, which I thought was a little harsh from the disscussions that water and I have had and his outlook of me in general, but your words ring just the opposite. Yes you are right everyone has reponded with much respect which is why I have explianed myself to them, If I had recieved negivtiity or disprespect I would not have wasted my time to type nor bothered to repond back but so far this is the longest thread I have seen trying to explian my simple post.

Tai Chi Bob, I too pratice and teach tai chi chuan actually my sifu's sifu exchanged entire systems with Wu Ching Chang so we have everthing in the Wu system but I never thought someone with 2 years kung fu experience would think that he invented it! That was what I thought was funny.........imgagine that?

Gouhuen, Finally thanks I thought I was the only one on KFO that found humor in that thread. I found it so amusing that I reposted it hear for i thought that others whould find it funny but so far I am being persectuted like the only sinner in the village.

[Drone]

I have to admit I had a little laugh over the post. So EarthDragon you are not alone...
Then again from what so many people know or rather don't know of the internal arts (tai chi in particular). I can understand why some one might make a statement like the one that was made.
I still remember when I lived in Huntington, New York and was looking for a new Tai Chi instructor (I had no idea that this forum even existed). I called a number of local Martial Arts Schools, and was told by several instructors that Tai Chi was not a Martial Art but an exercise, and that perhaps I would do better calling Yoga centers. I wanted to laugh in there face but as a novice and speaking to a senior instructor I always shook my head and thanked them for their help before walking briskly out of their schools.
Oh yeah back to my main point.... I forgot it. LOL.:confused:
-Drone

[Shooter]

EARTH DRAGON, I understand the source of your amusement, and I don't think it's out of character to be amused at all. I visit these boards all the time and read how someone discovered a new insight or have read something they found on the web or in a book that suddenly clicks with them. There's a thread right now on punching the bladder/pubis on the main board for example. ;)

I've been a member of mma.com for years, and the same thing over there. If I try to tell most of those people that what they're talking about has been a part of Tai Chi for generations, they just laugh...like I'm making it up. HA! :rolleyes:

No big deal...everyone's at a different stage in their evolution. Help when you can...and keep on keeping on...

:)

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

Humble apologies if you interpreted my post as contentious.. it was not intended to be.. I have found much of your material informative and well intended..
I, too, am amused at similar accounts of "insight".. It's amazing to watch the human mind shaping its own reality.. but, that is the source of my amusement, not the beautiful innocence of self-discovery (however misplaced).. What i fear happened here, is that many perceived your post as ridicule rather than sincere amusement.. One can be amused AND compassionate at the same time.. It is not my nature to judge others without cause.. That someone might post something that i don't agree with, or something that is directed at me as criticism usually is responded to with examples of my own understandings of things.. If i should feel the need to suggest specific corrections to someone, i try to do that privately.. unless i feel the issue has real merit for the current dialogue..

As i stated in another thread.. one of the reasons Tai Chi is so special to me, is the endearing personalities i meet along the way.. This forum is no exception.. You guys are great, and this forum is a blessing.. it's like "cyber pushing hands"..

be well, do good deeds (deeds define us)..

[EARTH DRAGON]

Shooter,
thanks again It's nice to feel like I am not alone.

Tai Chi bob,
No I did not find your post to be contentious. Actually I find your posts to be very informative and wiith well spoken words of wisdom. Again being a teacher I seeand teach beginners everyday and would not laugh at thier expense, but then again they wernt saying they discovered the wheel either.

Perhaps if the original post would have been worded as a question rather than a statement I would have taken a differnt approach. but to say what they said was just plain funny from anyones view teacher, student, beginner, or master.

Everyday we have are own revalations and glimmers of self enlightenment, but again thats the beauty of learning it never stops. one we stop we are simply cheating ourselves out of the abundance of information that is available to us....

[Bobba Fett]

Here is another item in the "Humor" department. I bet my classmates that I could find a Tai Chi aeorbics class. Here's what popped up. "Urban Tai-Chi" Featuring, Ginette Deslauriers! The blurb goes on, "Ginette will start with an 11 minute warm-up, works you with 36 minutes of High Intensity, low impact Tai-Chi combinations and then cools you down with traditional Tai-Chi for 11 minutes. The picture shows, Ginette in a strange stance, that looks like something from a bad kung fu movie. If Yang Chengfu knew about this he would be turning over in his grave. Then again, Ginette is quite a babe.... Hey! where can I sign up!

[Kaitain(UK)]

I thought it was very funny - and I think there are a lot of pious people on here