Hey guys,
I remember reading a thread a while back that I think you guys posted on. I think it started out as a discussion about learning the basics and then a former student of Rickson's came on and started talking about Rickson's principles and philosophy in BJJ. I thought it was an interesting, and I was just trying to find it again, but I wasn't having much luck. I think it may have been a sub-forum, but I'm not sure.
Any of you guys remember the thread and have a link to it?
This might be what you're after...if not it might be of interest anyway:
These are not my posts...I copy and pasted them from elsewhere....
1. Rickson understands the principles of base (Base is the word Brazilians use to explain balance and leverage. It is the foundation behind the way they use leverage to overcome size and strength) better than anyone else. In my opinion, this give him the ability to capitalize on the smallest mistake by his opponent and avoid making mistakes that others could use to beat him. How else could avoid tapping to anyone but yet tap everyone else?
2. Rickson never taught me technique, he taught me principle. When I was sweep, he would try to explain to me how I lose my base. When I was stuck in a position, he tried to explain to me how I was not taking someone base and was therefore stuck. The way that he taught me allowed me to grow on my own. To this day, I seldom practice technique. Instead I work on taking people's base, keeping people from taking my base, controlling people from any position, and getting out from any position where my opponent controls me. This is how he thinks when training and why he is so fundamentally sound. It has allowed me to evolve into a brown belt in BJJ without ever training consistently or training under a black belt.
3. I bet you there are 100's of teachers who could show more technique than Rickson. However, I have never seen one that can teach the details that make the difference when competing against someone like Rickson. He makes it look simple because it is simple to him. Look at his vale tudo fights. Rickson clinches, Rickson gets to the ground without being hurt, Rickson mounts his opponent. Rickson wins by rear choke or armlock. Some people see this as a lack of technique. For me, I understand it is effectively using his skills to win his fights.
4. Rickson is a gifted athelete. He is flexible, fast, strong, and his cardio is unbelievable. These qualities obviously help his game.
5. Rickson has been doing this for over 35 years. Experience is your the best teacher and he has a lot of experience.
6. Rickson used to always tell me. When you train, let you opponent get any position or submission on you. You must learn how to upset their base and take away the elements they need to (1) control your base, or (2) submit you. This is how I have always trained BJJ. More important, I try to learn how to do this without linear strength but more with circular movement. By the way, when I started to learn how to compete without strength and really focus on movement, my game went to a whole new level.
7. Rickson has a way of creating trouble for himself regardless of who he trains with and where. For example, I have trained and been tapped by him when he has his hands in his gi. I have seen Royler get tapped in the same way. Why does Rickson train with no hands? To make his training harder when training with someone who is not near his level. Other times he will let people start with any submission they want and he works his way out. Personally, I think Rickson wants people in their best position or submission so he has to work harder to win the game.
8. We have forgot to cover one important principle that makes Rickson unique. The area would be the clinch. Many people feel Rickson has a weak clinch. Considering that NO opponent can finish him on his feet and EVERY opponent ends up on the groud, I am not sure how they come up with this conclusion. Here is what I remember when working with Rickson on the clinch. First, he told me their were two elements that I had to recognize that must be there for my opponent to hurt me - distance and base. Distance was simple. If I am at a range where someone can hurt be then I am at risk. The key is to take away that risk in an efficient manner. How? By taking away the other element they need to hurt me - their base. In standup, base is accomplished when someone has foundation to the ground. For this to occur, weight has to be distributed to one leg. Generally, this leg is the front leg which is why the front knee kick is so effective. If the TIMING of the kick takes away the ability for the opponent to get the base long enough for me to close distance, then I have taken away that element in their ability to hurt me. There were three other important elements of the stand up I remember from him. First, you must avoid reaching with your arms to early because you leave too big of an opening to be hurt. We used to work a specific drill to correct this instinct. Second, I was told to never back up. If you study Rickson's fights, you will probably notice his movement is always cutting off distance. This allows him to stay in base and also reduce space necessary for the opponent to hurt him. Finally, when you clinch, keep your hips close and your head up so you control the opponents ability to sprawl his weight and create distance to hurt you again.
9.Regarding the clinch. First, the most important part is just like the rest of Jiu Jitsu, controlling your partners base. If you study Rickson's clinch, you will find that when he attaches and clinches his opponent, he takes away all their space to move. He keeps his hips forward and disallows their movement away from him. Even if he shoots low, he immediate moves up to control his opponents hips. Have you ever seen anyone sprawl on Rickson? The answer is no. The reason is because the sprawl requires your opponent to be able to move his his away from you. The way Rickson clinches takes this away. The timing of his clinch in addition to the principles he uses during the clinch are why he NEVER gets in trouble while clinching opponents, even those with great striking skills.
10. I forgot one other important aspect of Rickson's clinch. Study his fights and you will notice two important parts of his clinch. First, he doesn't move backwards or dance around. His movement is designed so he remains in base at all times. Second, notice how he moves at angles instead of in a line to close distance. I think he does this to take away movement by his opponent when he does decide to proceed for the clinch. In the end, Rickson's clinch is just like the rest of his game. It is based on principles and their is a detailed focus and strategy in his fights. For those that don't understand the efficiency of his simplicity, they call him boring. For those who do appreciate it, we call it masterful. The more you study and understand the foundations behind Rickson, the more you understand why he always wins and always taps his opponents.
11. Rickson's BJJ is so grounded in principle that he can adapt his game against anyone. Others lose because they have a one dimensional game. Mario Sperry is a perfect example. He is a great fighter and I am a huge fan. However, if you take away his ability to use his strength, it takes away his probablity to win a fight. Go study the fights he lost and you will see what I mean by this statement. Every fight I have ever seen him win was because he could utilize his strengths to win and avoid his opponent from taking them away from him.
12. He shared some unique concepts about his thoughts regarding his BJJ. In particular he stressed the importance of keeping his opponent in trouble (pressured at all times), holding any position, and finsih fights the first time an opportunity presents itself. He is the only BJJ guy I know who can do all those things in every fight. This was the first time I have talked with Rickson about BJJ for years. It made me realize why he is different than anyone else in the sport. With Rickson, you are always in trouble. Even worse, your first mistakes is your last one. In particular we discussed the guard. He explained with the sport jiu jitsu guard is bad for MMA. We actually watched some fights together including his fight with Funaki (I hadn't seen the fight before that night).
13. Maybe I can summarize some of what I talked about with Rickson last week. Regarding position, we watched fights and he pointed out how many fighters had great positions and either (1) lost them, or (2) failed to submit from those position. He seems to believe that hold any position is critical and must lead to what he called "checkmate". He said he always tries to capatilize and win his fight on his opponents first mistake. As I have always said, with Rickson, your first mistake is your last. The efficiency of his BJJ is beyond description. Most of the time was spent on the guard. He explained why the sport JJ guard was bad for MMA. His strategies in the guard with BJJ and MMA are very different because the situations are different. He felt too many people played in the position looking for crazy submissions and simply holding on vs. forcing the action to keep in opponent in trouble. We talked about many of todays fighters and their weaknesses because of their strategies in the guard. With Rickson, even when you are in his guard it seems like you never have control or can take a breather. I have never seen anyone that can see things about a person watching a fight more than Rickson.. I did realize that what is unique about Rickson (other than his mental and physical abilities) is his way he learned BJJ. No matter what the problem, he searched for answers. I think this way of training vs. learning techniques gave him answers to any situation on the ground. He seems to like to play in trouble and change the game to make it difficult for him. For example, when he rolls with his students he often trains with his hands in his belt to make the fights difficult for him.
14. I agree Nog has a great guard. However, he fights with the intention of finishing the fight in the guard. Rickson doesn't fight with that strategy. If you understand BJJ, you know that to be hit, your opponent has to have base and commit his weight forward. Ground and Pound works because (1) BJJ guys let people play to far forward which gets them in trouble, and (2) the allow their opponent to control their movement. Rickson's guard takes away both of these elements. If you study his fights and when he is on his back, pay attention to how he avoids these problems and how he uses this opponents base to improve his position.
Theres lots more...tell me if you want me to post it
post it man, good points!
That's definately the stuff I'm looking for. Post all you have. Thanks.
Rolling with Rickson was kind of embarrassing in a way. I felt so incapable of making myself look even remotely athletic or competent.
Rickson knows he would make a killing with videos, but he has stated in the past if he is teaching someone, he wants to be able to see them and look em in the eye when he teaches somebody. It's totally understandable and respectable.
BTW, several black belts I have talked to say that he doesn't really show you anything different...the guy is just so unbelievably good at the basics that he is able to walk through any other black belt he gets on the mat with, hard to imagine, but everybody says it. 1 guy told me to take a private with him one day before I quit training..said I wouldn't really learn anything new really, maybe a couple details on basics but I would "feel the best jiujitsu"...analogy he gave was he is better at BJJ than Jordan was at hoops.
Draculino told me about a time when Rickson came to do a little teaching at Barra...I don't think it was too long ago...anyway, he said that he started teaching the class (mainly all black belts showed up) the x-choke from the mount....needless to say, everyone including Draculino kind of rolled their eyes and half assed practiced the move.
Rickson got ****ed and said that he had planned on teaching but that they could just roll instead..seeing as how everyone was an expert at the x-choke from the mount. He then proceeded to roll with the entire class and you guessed it....x-choked everyone from the mount
You know once I asked Roy what he thinks about Ricksons skills and I asked him if he is just so good out of pure instinct or if he really understand BJJ also perfectly on an interlectual level and he said that he belives Rickson is really understanding BJJ even mentally better than anyone else.
Another time I asked him how Rickson feels while roling. He grabbed my wrist really hard and says: That?s how Rickson feels even if you are on top.:-)
I've seen him roll at seminars and he just plays around and gives guys all kinds of openings. You can't try to look at him doing a move at a seminar and call him just another top black belt. He's demolished a ton of top bjj guys from various teams and they all say the same thing about him, every single one of them.
liborio is ****ing nasty, but while the rickson myth in mma should have been dispelled already, his herculian legend in grappling, is not myth, but fact.
he taps everyone, some people give him problems (rigan machado an all time great), but eventually eveyrone gets tapped.
there is a reason every persoon who steps on the mat with him doesnt give bull**** yea hes awesome answers, but say how weak and out of place they felt grappling with the great rickson.
Gracie Mag Article
Paul Filho reveals: Rickson is in shape and ready to impress in the rings. "I always knew that he was exceptional, but the truth is, I had no idea how," says the amazed fighter from BTT, after a few training sessions with Rickson Gracie.
The awe is big, but the context strengthens it. After a few years off fighting, and now middle-aged, Rickson's success in an MMA bout against today's top fighters was becoming more and more questionable, and not only among fans, but among fighters themselves. But suddenly a young outstanding athlete, undefeated in MMA, and coming from a rival school, does a training session with the black-belt, and gives something else to talk about regarding the myth that's been reigning for the last quarter century. "I've trained with all of Carlson's greatest pupils, from all generations, all of them excellent, some even phenomenal. I don't want to depreciate anyone, but what Rickson did to me no one else was ever able to do," confesses the fighter who has just been acclaimed in PRIDE after defeating undisputedly Murilo Ninja of Chute Boxe.
This statement, some ten years ago would have sounded quite normal. After all, Renzo Gracie, Fabio Gurgel, Roberto Roleta, Nino Schembri, Saulo Ribeiro, and many other outstanding athletes would walk away with the same impression after training with Rickson. But there is one difference: perhaps because no top fighter from Carlson's School had ever trained with Rickson before, they were the most skeptical regarding a supposed technical superiority, precisely that which Paul Filho stresses. "The knowledge he has is something absurd, which no one in the world comes close to. Look at it: He proved to me that I distribute my weight incorrectly," the fighter exemplifies. It seems like a lie, for one of Filho's specialties is good weight distribution. But he claims not to be exaggerating: "It's hard to explain, but he places himself in a way that makes him even heavier. And he moves his hips in an incomparable way. Like a snake," says Filho avoiding to get into technical details.
"The opportunity I'm having right now is unique, and I can't waste it. I'll incorporate all I can into my game and become an even more dignified Jiu-Jitsu representative. We watched the bout against Ninja together, and he showed me all I did wrong. If I had known these errors before, the fight would have ended differently," Filho guesses.
Before the "what-ifs" start arising, it is important to complete this report. The training sessions took place without a gi, and they weren't restricted to ground play, nor to grappling. "He'd simulate the most varied situations. And he always asked me to hit him when I thought I had a chance. Except, I usually found no room to strike. And when I did, I would miss the target. He is complete – in the clinch, and the approach on the ground. I have no more doubt as to whether he can beat anyone, up to 93 kg," he guarantees, unable to hide his enthusiasm.
In spite of this interchange, Filho is still a firm unit of the BTT fleet. "I talked to Murilo Bustamante. In the beginning he was a bit upset, perhaps jealous, but then cooled down. And he had a good reason. After all, Rickson told me that he admires Murilo, as a "carioca" ('born in Rio de Janeiro") who represents Jiu-Jitsu so well in the world," the young fighter points out. On the other hand, the secrets confided by Rickson should remained locked in a very well hidden vault. "Of course I'm not showing everybody the secrets that he told me alone. That would be betraying his confidence. It's up to the master to know what to teach and to whom," ponders Paul Filho, aged 26, 11 wins, eight of which have occurred in Japan.
Rickson -- who has been in Brazil for the past months and, by the looks of his training rhythm, appears to be getting ready for a return still this year – keeps discreet and doesn't comment on the training sessions, though confirming their existence, and appreciates the compliments: "I've got a great deal of respect for Paul. He is an authentic guy, very brave and a fierce defender of Jiu-Jitsu. I'll do anything in my power to help him."
Paul Filho reveals: Rickson is in shape and ready to impress in the rings. "I always knew that he was exceptional, but the truth is, I had no idea how," says the amazed fighter from BTT, after a few training sessions with Rickson Gracie.
The awe is big, but the context strengthens it. After a few years off fighting, and now middle-aged, Rickson's success in an MMA bout against today's top fighters was becoming more and more questionable, and not only among fans, but among fighters themselves. But suddenly a young outstanding athlete, undefeated in MMA, and coming from a rival school, does a training session with the black-belt, and gives something else to talk about regarding the myth that's been reigning for the last quarter century. "I've trained with all of Carlson's greatest pupils, from all generations, all of them excellent, some even phenomenal. I don't want to depreciate anyone, but what Rickson did to me no one else was ever able to do," confesses the fighter who has just been acclaimed in PRIDE after defeating undisputedly Murilo Ninja of Chute Boxe.
This statement, some ten years ago would have sounded quite normal. After all, Renzo Gracie, Fabio Gurgel, Roberto Roleta, Nino Schembri, Saulo Ribeiro, and many other outstanding athletes would walk away with the same impression after training with Rickson. But there is one difference: perhaps because no top fighter from Carlson's School had ever trained with Rickson before, they were the most skeptical regarding a supposed technical superiority, precisely that which Paul Filho stresses. "The knowledge he has is something absurd, which no one in the world comes close to. Look at it: He proved to me that I distribute my weight incorrectly," the fighter exemplifies. It seems like a lie, for one of Filho's specialties is good weight distribution. But he claims not to be exaggerating: "It's hard to explain, but he places himself in a way that makes him even heavier. And he moves his hips in an incomparable way. Like a snake," says Filho avoiding to get into technical details.
"The opportunity I'm having right now is unique, and I can't waste it. I'll incorporate all I can into my game and become an even more dignified Jiu-Jitsu representative. We watched the bout against Ninja together, and he showed me all I did wrong. If I had known these errors before, the fight would have ended differently," Filho guesses.
Before the "what-ifs" start arising, it is important to complete this report. The training sessions took place without a gi, and they weren't restricted to ground play, nor to grappling. "He'd simulate the most varied situations. And he always asked me to hit him when I thought I had a chance. Except, I usually found no room to strike. And when I did, I would miss the target. He is complete – in the clinch, and the approach on the ground. I have no more doubt as to whether he can beat anyone, up to 93 kg," he guarantees, unable to hide his enthusiasm.
In spite of this interchange, Filho is still a firm unit of the BTT fleet. "I talked to Murilo Bustamante. In the beginning he was a bit upset, perhaps jealous, but then cooled down. And he had a good reason. After all, Rickson told me that he admires Murilo, as a "carioca" ('born in Rio de Janeiro") who represents Jiu-Jitsu so well in the world," the young fighter points out. On the other hand, the secrets confided by Rickson should remained locked in a very well hidden vault. "Of course I'm not showing everybody the secrets that he told me alone. That would be betraying his confidence. It's up to the master to know what to teach and to whom," ponders Paul Filho, aged 26, 11 wins, eight of which have occurred in Japan.
Rickson -- who has been in Brazil for the past months and, by the looks of his training rhythm, appears to be getting ready for a return still this year – keeps discreet and doesn't comment on the training sessions, though confirming their existence, and appreciates the compliments: "I've got a great deal of respect for Paul. He is an authentic guy, very brave and a fierce defender of Jiu-Jitsu. I'll do anything in my power to help him."
good stuff :)
I trained wtih Rickson and Royler for a week or so around 1995... my experience is EXACTLY like what was posted... he's not about technique, more like 'essence", no, seriously....
I also know a guy from Graice Barra that grew up with him, and told a lot of stories about how Ricskon was raised by his fatehr to BE BJJ... I guess it worked!
I haven't trained against Rickson yet. Pretty much everyone who ever has, (who's opinion I respect) has told me the same thing. Rickson makes yo feel like a white belt or worse.
It's not like he shows any earth shattering radical techniques. Rickson is simply the basics perfected. He took the time to correct a very simple move I always do and take for granted and made a small adjustment that makes a HUGE difference. Most of yesterdays class was actually sparring with Rickson critquing technique and answering questions.
It was a simple little sit up with hips forward which I've seen used for drills a lot of the time. One leg forward one leg back and you kind of exaggerate with your hips coming forward. Easier to show than explain, I'm sure everyone has done it a million times. I was doing it and thinking whatever, but Rickson came over and showed me my hips were too flat, that by pointing only one hip and coming at an angle with my leg planted it was physically impossible to resist the forward momentum for an opponent trying to stop your progress. He demonstrated by letting me push on him as he showed the technique, and then did the same for me as he corrected. Sure enough, big difference.
None of this surprised me. I've rolled with Henry Akins (recieved hsi black belt directly from Rickson not too long ago) for years and he always has minute little details like that to add to my game. In everything Rickson does or explains he has every part of his body moving in perfect, optimal coordination. When you appreciate these little things he does one the ground you get a new appreciation for what he's doing when you watch him fight.
Speaking of fight, Rickson will be fighting soon, and the short list of opponents (he doesn't pick them) floored me. Honestly, no one will talk sh*t about him if these go down. No, I can't say anything yet. Next time I'm down there hopefully I can do a more formal interview.
Being over six feet I had the same problems with posture and keeping my hips forward. Especially when standing and trying to pass the guard. It seems so much more natural and comfortable for me to hunch forward. Of course I always got back swept or had to battle a foot on my hip. Rickson would always yell out to me in his Brasilian accent, "Come on, head up -- hips for! Head up -- hips for!" One day, while doing a private with him I was making the same mistake again. This time he yelled, "Head up -- hips for! Come on, hips for! Push your hips for! Make like F_cK!"
That did it for me.To this day, though I'm far from a Black Belt level, people always compliment me on how good my posture is. Everytime I stand to pass the guard or I'm in a position requiring good posture I still hear his words, "Head up -- hips for! Make like F_ck!"
I have to admit that I was somewhat less than comfortable being in a man's guard and told this. He also commented on how Americans are too stiff -- especially in the hips. He said that sitting in chairs is not as good as sitting on the ground as they do more in Brasil because when you're sitting on the ground you stretch out your knees and hip flexors more. He also said that if you watch Brasilians dance you'll see how relaxed and flexible they are in the hips. While he was telling me this he was standing and sort of rotating his hips back and forth in a semi-circular motion occassionally puncuated by a forward thrust. I fidgeted nervously and tried not to make eye contact.
I try to be open and accepting of different cultures and there was a lot of truth to what he was saying. And it's true that I am often told to loosen up. But, truth be told, I kind of like being a bit on the tight side. But, I assure you, when I "make like f*ck" while in a man's guard, it's strictly platonic and I do it with all due hygienic propriety. One of the things I noticed that makes him a GREAT instructior (the best) is he watches EVERYONE who they're rolling and somehow remembers something EVERYONE is doing wrong and helps them with it. (even the guy on the ohter side of the mat in a full class). I trained there one night and he was toying with a black belt while watching everone roll. He let the guy start on his back a couple of times with the choke nearly set. A half hour later he walked around and went over stuff people were doing wrong when they were rolling. WTF?!?!?! How could he watch everyone else with a black belt on his back?
I have ALWAYs sucked pretty bad but use to have occasional luck with strength over technique. I'd gotten a couple of his guys by trying to pull their heads off (A technique they seemed unfamiliar with). At the end of class Rickson said something like "sometimes a strong guy with a bad technique that's not jiu-jitsu will pull your head hard and you might tap becaiuse you are scaird and don't know how to scape. Then to make matters even worse he said he needed a big guy to try to pull his head off so he could show the scape. I looked the other way and tried to duck behind the guy in fromt of me. Didn't work. So he says "get in the good position you like and I want you to pull my head real hard." (Then my sick azz mind says "this is it, I will be the most famous guy on ITG. No one can scape the deadly FdT head pull thing without at least suffering greatly) So I get the position and crank. (For about a half second or less as he easily pushed my elbow up, pulled his head out, swept me and ended up mounted. Thank God I hadn't hurt him! I have this feeling he could very easily kill just about anybody he wanted to if he felt like it without breaking a sweat.
On the drive home I asked my BB friend (who lived at Ricksons when he first came to America) why he didn't choke him when he had his back with the choke set. I accused him of not trying hard. He got ****ed and said he was trying to choke him harder than I was trying to pull his head off. Then he named about 20 TOP black belts that he's seen Rickson toy with the same way. I think the guys some kind of alien or something. If you love Jiu-Jitsu and have the chance train with the guy at least once. He really is different.
Ask MArgarida who his hands down FAVORITE fighter is. I did. Ask him what happened to him when he went to a class Rickson was teaching and suggesetd a technique he was showing wouldn't work against a skilled fighter (He got tapped twice in a row with the tech knowing it was comming). The haters say this was when Margarida was a kid. Yep, a kid that was getting thrown out of schools all over the planet for tapping the black belts there.
I SAW the BB I was talking about (the one who Rickson let start on his back with the choke set) make a monkey out of Vitor a month before we went to Ricksons. I SAW Margarida injure/tap a world champion and one of his black belts a month after he went to Ricksons. (both in a couple of minutes).
Interview for tatame mag
1. Rickson, you were one of the fundamental pieces in the diffusion of jiu-jitsu around the world. How do you evaluate the jiu-jitsu which is practiced and taught today?
Rickson: First, I would like to thank Tatame for the opportunity to do this interview. I feel that it is one of the most important media for the Brazilian sports, so I feel honored. But, a lot of time has passed in relation to jiu-jitsu. Much work, much sweat, much blood. It fills me with proud that today jiu-jitsu has been spread to the four corners of the world. At the same time many people are competing, and a number of practitioners are giving the attention to the sports. But I feel that the self-defense part of jiu-jitsu has been a little neglected in the daily training.
2. How do you see the explosion of submission initiated by the Sheik Tahnoon after he learned jiu-jitsu from you?
Rickson: I don't see it as an increase of the sport, but rather as an option launched by the Sheik who injected financial conditions that had not existed in the sport until now. Evidently this attracts all sports segments. Jiu-jitsu fighters don't increase their efficiency by training without quimono. He has to create new technical situations to adapt his game, but this doesn't mean the sport is developed. Submission Grappling is just a style that because of financial incentives is attracting a large number of athletes.
3. Who impressed you most in the last edition (tournament)?
I liked very much the style of Marcelinho and obviously Roger and Kyra who are producing a fantastic results [que arrebentaram]. The Gracie family has the advantage of being the font of good technique, but also much dedication, suffering, a warrior spirit, that goers with the individual. Thanks to God, we are expecting to have good elements for the future.
4. You have been away from the fight and ring for some time now. What is the daily routine of Rickson Gracie?
Rickson: I divide my days between taking care of my family and the things I have to do to maintain my athletic condition, and my hobbies, such as surfing, and my profession--giving classes at the academy, and for my son and other people who need special attention. And also to business negotiations. I have some projects underway. I balance my life like this, but always keeping in good physical shape..
5. Have you received any interesting proposal for a fight?
Rickson: I am really enthusiastic about the possibility of fighting again But nothing definite has been offered.
6. Is it true that your first Vale-Tudo was when you had 16 years, in the street of Rio, against the gigantic Hawaiian "Black Trunk"?
Rickson: This wasn't really a Vale-Tudo, it was a street fight. I was in a situation, with having not yet 16 years old, to give support to my friend Malibu [Sergio " Malibu " Jardim]. A guy had smashed Malibu 's surf board, a guy Black Trunk Havaiano .....and thought that he was the owner of the beach in Rio . But it wasn’t that way, you know?
The next day was the day of the championship and they were on the beach. It was then that I saw them passing in front of the office of the Rico. over there. A lot of people had gathered there. Black Trunk Havaiano had a bad attitude [ele estava cheio de marra] and began to look at me like I was the one he thought he had to deal with. I confronted to him and with the little English that I knew, I began to cuss him out and I called to him: "You and me. Come here!". We went to the middle of the street. I took his back and put him to sleep. It was the beginning of my trajectory as a fighter.
7. Rolls was the natural successor of Carlson in the Gracie dynasty. Why were you the one selected to fight Zulu in 1981?
Rickson: By coincidence, when Waldemar Santana called it was my father who answered. I was in front of him and remember him saying, "Yo Waldemar, what's up?" And Waldemar said, "Aaaaa....professor, I have a guy here who no one can beat here in the North. I want to promote a big event. Do you have any fighter who is up for it?" My father repeated what Waldemar had said. I said "Father, let me do it, let me do it, let me do it". I was crazy to try. And he said, "I have a boy here who has never done anything, but I'll take a chance and do the business right. He is my son". Waldemar agreed. It was practically without the knowledge of Rolls, but he supported me and was in my corner and was an efficient second. I feel that this was possibly my must difficult fight. It was chaos [foi uma correria danada], soon after the fight started, I served him with a knee and he lost a tooth, and I thought that I would win the fight. He shook his head and got up. I was very impressed with his disposition, his strength, his intensity. He threw me out of the ring three times which also impressed me. I got tired but I knew when I started the fight that I would get tired and that my opponent would also get tired. That was big lesson for me. It was the fight that left the biggest impression on me, because when it started, I was inexperienced. I had just 19 years at that time.
When the first round was over, I was very tired. I returned to my corner and said to my father "I can't continue, I'm dead". My father said, "That's good. The other guy is more tired than you are." I said "Father, I'm serious". He said, "No, this is business, that's for sure". Rolls threw an ice bucket at my head. I took a big breath when I heard the gong and returned to the center of the ring. Within 3 minutes, he was sleeping. He had 96 kg. [211.2 lbs.] I had 72 kg. [158.4 lbs.].
8. What is the story about how you went to Boqueirão and challenged Hugo Duarte and Marco Ruas?
Rickson: Hugo wasn't around at that time. It was Fabio Molina, and after his fight with Pinduka, Marco Ruas, who were the tough luta livre guys. A little before I went to the USA , there was rumor that Ruas wanted to fight with me. Myself, my father, and Serginho looked for confirmation of this in Boqueirão, where they trained. I didn't waste time, because Ruas was a guy who I had always respected as a fighter, and the fact that he wanted to fight me is the reason I went looking for him. When I got there, the place was full of tough guys, led by Ruas. I asked him what was his intention, he had already said that he wanted to fight me. We can fight anytime, right here, before, or after, by arrangement o que fosse. He told me that he did not want to challenge me but that if I wanted to challenge him he wanted four months to train and then we'll see. I said, "Are you crazy? Can you imagine if Pele arrived with Cosmos to challenge Ferrioviario? I'm not challenging you nothing! I'm here to fight whoever wants to fight. If you don't want to fight, go home! My father sensed that the climate was getting strange, and wanted to calm things down, so he said, "any renown athletes here who want to fight Rickson, collect the names and we'll make a list for the future". At that moment Hugo made his first appearance and said "put my name in that list". I said, "this isn't a jogo do bicho my brother.[jogo do bicho is a form of illegal lottery. Rickson probably means that he isn’t there to fight just any chump who wants to take his chances, but only a worthy challenger, someone with a Name] The list is for jogo do bicho. If you want to fight, it's now. If you don't want to fight, be quiet and just listen" I was there to fight, with one or another one. Because of that appeasement, it was from that day that Hugo, for his own reasons, began to talk about how he was preparing to fight me. The rumor started and intensified. People, and my friends, were saying that Hugo was very good, that this, that that [que fez isso, fez aquilo] I couldn't challenge him because he wasn't famous yet. ..................We meet at Pepê and fought. We settled the matter, but he wasn't satisfied.
9. Five days later, he invaded your academy for revenge. He told Tatame that you were startled and that superman was something in the movies [Hugo means that Rickson wasn't the superman that everyone said he was].
Rickson: I wasn't at the academy when he arrived. I was at the apartment of a friend when a guy came and said, "they invaded the academy". I had long long hair at that time. I arrived to go up the stairs and meet them coming down.. He said "Hey, my brother, I'm talking to you! Come let's talk" I said, "dude [bicho], come down here". They came down. There must have been 20 students from the academy there, and there were 300 who came with him and Eugenio Tadeu. with them. It was a chaos, bandits mixed with fighters. The atmosphere was very strange. Before we fought, we walked a little into the center of the patio of the school. I said, "Hugo, come here I want to talk with you." Denilson (Maia) and Hugo, and my father and Royler, came. I said "This is the way it is, my brother. I respect you as a man. I respect you because you want a revenge. I'll accept the challenge anytime and anywhere. But if you think someone is going to stop the fight before it's finished, you are wrong, this is going to be a more serious matter than you think. I will decide when it's over. [This last statement by Rickson is a rough translation of what he actually said" não tem sem avisar. Agora uma parada é certa. Se o negócio sair do respeito e alguém botar a mão na luta anters de ela acabar, vai ficar um negocio muito mai pesado do que você está pensando. Uma parada que eu vou decidir de outra maniera", taking some translational liberties based on knowing how Rickson thinks about challenges.] Hugo replied "no, no, only me and you". So I said, "Then come out from the middle of the crowd and do it now". This fight was finished faster than the first one. The area was very prejudiced because he was a heavy person there. The entrance to the academy, which was concrete, was much better. It went to the ground, and very quickly, he begged to stop. When it was over, he got up and I said, "My brother, I respect you. Continue training to be a tough guy". He said, "I also respect you, for sure". Royler began to grab Eugenio and the police arrived shooting off their guns.
10. Today, how do you see the new representatives of jiu-jitsu, such as Rodrigo Minotarou and Fabricio Werdum, in the Vale-Tudos?
Rickson: The jiu-jitsu fighters are training other modalities to be able to fight in Vale Tudos, but their jiu-jitsu is weak. I'd prefer not to go into details but that is exactly how I feel.
11, How do you view your student Cristiano Marcello, who is now teaching the ground game to the Chute Boxe Team?
Rickson: I think that to be human it is necessary to grow. Not only as a fighter. The space that Cristiano has in jiu-jitsu is the least of the possibilities that he has, understand? I don't see it as inimical to jiu-jitsu. In my opinion, he has some anxiety about his growth. Nowadays, jiu-jitsu doesn't exist separately. Now there are Vale-Tudo fighters who fight with wrestling champions, who learn from wrestlers, look for boxers, kickboxers, the same style that Cristiano is teaching his ground game to. Anyway, jiu-jitsu is everything, we have the best fighters in the world today. He is doing the work with them that he thinks is right. I have nothing bad to say. If he produces a Vale-Tudo champion representing jiu-jitsu, I would be more satisfied. But if he can help other guys win too, it's good.
12. The sons of Rorion are training with a representative of Chute Boxe here in America . I would like to know if someday your son Kron is going to fight Vale-Tudo, would you accept it if he trains in another art outside of jiu-jitsu?
Rickson: As incredible as it seems, the efficiency of Vale Tudo is invisible. People are distorting the efficiency of Vale-Tudo, making it more complex than it is. I don't see the necessity to train other arts for Vale-Tudo. Jiu-jitsu is already a complete concept with all the necessities needed to be good in Vale-Tudo. But that is exactly the problem. The people of jiu-jitsu think about competition, think about a little half guard game, think about grabbing the quimono. But that is getting away from what I think is the real jiu-jitsu, which is based on the sense of the distribution of weight, which the major sense for self-defense. I don't look for to knockout someone standing up, I look for to not be in a position to be knocked out myself. I look for the position to take my opponent where I want to be. That is my concept. The day that I think that I have to train kickboxing to beat a kickboxing champion, that will be the day I lose.
13. So you don't think that by training in kickboxing, that it can in some way help you to neutralize the kickboxer's game?
Rickson: Much to the contrary. Show me a jiu-jitsu fighter who trains kickboxing who has an advantage over a kickboxer standing up.....and then maybe I'll change my opinion. But this never happens. They always end up trying to do the technique wrong., end up clinch anyway) and lose big opportunities.
14. So, if your son fights, you would like him to do only jiu-jitsu?
Rickson: He is going to do what he wants, but I think that if he wants to win he will follow my advice. I'm very proud of his work. He is doing everything to be the best that he can be. At the same time, I don't think that my expectations will change the rhythm of things. I am a collaborator. I am here to give force and not to put pressure or to demand results. Up to now, his style has produced big results. With only 16 years old, he has won the Pan-Americano against 30 competidors. It was a good result.
15. Are you teaching a lot of lessons especially for him?
Rickson: We train together. We correct everything. I think that is important. In the last competition he faced competitors that he had faced before and got better results. Even so, it was long way from perfection. He came back home, for correction on the bottom, on the top, on stand up, on finalizing, everything has correction. Good jiu-jitsu is invisible and you have to be precise. It's a matter of millimeters.
16. Kazushi Sakuraba defeated various members of your family. Why didn't you challenge him at that time?
Rickson: That fight was certain. But due to an accident, my son died at exactly that time when the thing was closed. Unhappily, I couldn't make a decision about it out of respect. I had to dedicate precious time to my family. I couldn't think about fighting and leave things in the way that they were.
17. Who do you think will win in Pride GP?
Rickson: That is a difficult question because today I haven't seen anyone with a superior technique, a smaller technical fighter who can handle big guys [galo magro]. What happens in these fights is either a fighter does nothing and then throws a punch and wins, or if the fighter on the bottom has a good control, the top fighter just tries to hang on. It's difficult to say. But emotionally, I would like to see Arona win. I like his personality. I think he has a very good attitude. But really, it's impossible to predict.
18. When Vale-Tudos began, the Gracies promulgated the theory that, without points and without time limits, technique will always defeat strength. Do you still believe that?
Rickson: No, that is completely antiquated. Those criteria were given when it was jiu-jitsu versus bigger guys, or jiu-jitsu versus boxing, or jiu-jitsu versus wrestling. Nowadays there doesn't exist jiu-jitsu versus nothing. Everyone knows everything, and everybody has their style [e muito vale o individuo]. Guys are using the drugs and pumping the irons, have enormous resistance and and a modicum of technique. The criterion that technique will overcome power is true only if the adversary has no technique, only power. But that doesn't exist anymore. There isn't anyone who doesn't know nothing anymore [everyone knows something].
19. At the present time, would you fight a heavier opponent without time limits?
Rickson: Definitely, I'd prefer it. I wouldn't rely only on technique, I'd also rely on physical preparation, with a vision of the fight in such a way that I would capitalize from the top on the errors committed by my adversary. But it isn’t simply a matter of technique. There is something fundamental and invisible that sometimes takes time
20. In your history of 400 fights, where did most of them happen?
Rickson: All of my life I have always fought. Not counting before I was a black belt. All of the championships that I participated in, not only jiu-jitsu, sambo, olympic fighting, challenges, It is difficult to give an exact number. But it was many more than 400. Since I had 16 years old, ......So if a guy asks me how many fights I've had, what can I say to that? Ten times,20 times, if you count only my championships, and the remainder of my life? Can set 500, 1000, 200, 1000....it makes no difference to me. What makes a difference to me is that I represented jiu-jitsu and thanks to God I got good results. So, as to how many of fights I had, you can chose a number.. But 80% of my competition matches have not gone more than 3 minutes.
21. Your most difficult fight in competition was against the student of Oswaldo Alves, Sergio Penha, right?
Rickson: That's not true. It was the fight in which I was the most intelligent strategically. We fought twice. Once was in the semifinal on Sunday, the other was in the finals. I entered as a favor to Oswaldo (Alves). When I registered for the competition, I was meio pesado and Penha was pesado. I had 84 kg. and he had 93 kg. When I was registering, Oswaldo waa there and said ""Professor, I have a good fighter [galo bom] for you there, a very tough guy [um negocio mais brigador]. I said "I know you have a champion there, a man of steel, I've heard a lot of good things about him." We exchanged pleasantries and I registered for meio pesado and absoluto. Oswaldo said, "Boy, in meio pesado? Serginho is pesado". I said "then I will register for pesado so we can soon have a double party". The first Sunday, we were in pesado or absoluto and I won by arm lock. He tapped quickly and was injured. I think it was bad luck. I'm not saying nothing, he was a good guy, but I felt that he had never been finalized so fast as that and was dissatisfied. That was before Rockson was born. My son was born, on Tuesday, and I was Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday without sleeping. I didn't train that week.. I stayed in the hospital, didn't sleep at all, and only put on my quimono on the way to the championship. It was the final Sunday of the peso and absoluto. In one fight I met Macarrão and in the other I met Serginho. Macarrão said "I’m not going to fight you” and conceded.. Serginho was lusting for revenge and when the fight started I felt like I was out of gas. The whole crowd was shouting "Courage Sergio, go, go, now, go"......and my quiet group of supporters didn't understand what was happening. In the middle of the fight my quimono slipped up over my head and I got up to fix my belt, and I asked Rolls to say that I wanted to stop for three minutes. I was already down 7 or 8 points. He had passed my guard twice, not mounted, but had passed my guard, and attacked but his finalization attempt was insufficient. He had a good base. The fight resumed. I thought I pretended to be dead, you know [eu me fiz de morto entendeu?] He was confident. I pulled guard. When he tried to pass, I reversed him, took the side, mounted, took his neck and put him to sleep. He didn't tap, he slept. He was a valiant guy, the first time he yelled and the second time he slept, he didn't want to tap again.
22. At one point your uncle Carlson after he left the Gracie Academy was bringing up fighters to a high level to compete with the Gracie Academy fighters. Was this important for the evolution of the sport?
Rickson: It was a positive rivalry, it was never something negative. There was no dispute. I have always thought of Carlson as someone who is extremely competitive, someone who liked to bet on rooster fights, liked to gamble. So for him a championship was like a rooster fight, he wanted to see his rooster win............... if it was his cousin, or family, or not, he wanted to see his student win. It wasn't a question of satisfying his ego. He wasn't interested in politics, the family was the most important thing, understand? I respect Carlson and have a certain admiration for his manner of living life. He created the evolution of his guys, because they felt they had potential and thought "I am with Carlson here so I can beat a Gracie.. The main strength of the Carlson academy was the guys of the Wallid type [Wallides da vida]. The Copa Company was really great, they were things that we feel nostalgic when we remember them.
23. Do you think that Vale-Tudo will one day reach the level of boxing?
Rickson: I think that as it is now, it isn't going to grow because the level is low, and might get worse. I think that it was the confrontation of styles, boxer against wrestler, that was the reason MMA has gotten to where it has gotten today. Royce did those fights in the Ultimates (UFCs) that was a sensational thing. Today everyone knows a little about everything the drugs problem is getting worse. So it is a crude thing, understand? There's nothing beautiful about it I would prefer to watch a beautiful K-1 fight rather than an ugly Vale-Tudo. All of the MMA fighters today are at a low technical level. There aren’t any stand outs. And that is something that takes the beauty away from Vale-Tudo, because there is no artist of the type of Cassius Clay that there was in boxing, for example.
24. It is always difficult for a guy who has reached the status of an idol, like you or Romario, to think about retirement. How do you face this question?
Rickson: I feel that I don't have anything to prove, but I still have one or two more fights left in me. Principally due to the fact that with one or two fights, I could, as people say in Brazil , “botar o meu burro na sombra” [take it easy, retire in comfort]. I think that to have the comfort that I expect in my retirement, one more big fight would be good for me, but if this doesn't happen for some reason, I don't feel like I need to prove anything to anyone. I am satisfied as it is. God and sports, throughout my whole career, have given me enough satisfaction. Only a very interesting opportunity is going to get me to return to the ring with the desire to fight and win. Other than this, I'm good, not worried about nothing.