When I said southern close range system like wing chun I meant a southern close range system they way southern mantis, bak mei, wing chun are all southern close range systems but NOT the same.
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When I said southern close range system like wing chun I meant a southern close range system they way southern mantis, bak mei, wing chun are all southern close range systems but NOT the same.
The difference between the Bak Mei system and the Wing Chun system is that, BM is an internal art. Bak Mei has a heavier hand and their punches are explosive, using Fa Jing. Wing Chun uses trap hands and are lighter for speed. As far as Bak Mei being simular to the White Tiger, we do use some Tiger Jows. I am not familiar enough with the White Tiger system to make any furthe comments about the differences.
What about in comparison to southern mantis, and other southern close range styles?
Also wing chun is internal,( not to the extent of the xing yi baugua etc) not everybody learns that, ALOT of variations in skill, practice and ability out there.
Anyway this thread wasnt about wing chun, in comparison to bak mei
but BaK MEI TO WHITE TIGER
Bak Mei/Bai Mei is a little "harder" in their application of faht ging/fa jing. They(Bak Mei) also do more with reverse breathing than most systems to build up a lot of energy to smash people with.
Bak Fu Pai(White Tiger Style) is a little softer in training their ging as well as being a little more sensitive when it comes to crossing hands or using certain bridge arms/hands. The breathing in Bak Fu is natural with certain techniques used to harness the hei gong.
Both are related historically as the founders of both were blood brothers before splitting up and going to various parts of China to hide from the fascist gov't men. But then again that could be a total crock. Both systems are short frame forms of martial arts which are similar to Lung Ying Pai(Dragon Shape Style) as well Nam Tong Long Pai. Elbows are held close into the body, usually an elbows width away. Stances are short and natural compared to the double shoulder width Ma Bu of Bei Sui Lum/Bei Shaolin. Feet are shoulder width apart and kept on the ground, not much jumping or flying around in Bak Mei, Jook Lum, Chow Gar or other related systems.
Wing Chun is internal as you must train the Yi in order to get your Chi Sau and other techniques to a higher level. Good body mechanics means Good internal. Doesnt mean you have to sit on your a r s e and meditate and dream your way into having internal power. Way too many of those fuzzy bunnies running around here and abroad. They make the MA a joke. But that is another thread in and of itself.
Bak Fu has layers of training as well as having a well developed Dit Da Ke(traumatology treatment). GM Doo Wai has some formulae that are very powerful without resorting to illegal herbs or animal ingredients. I have used them and can attest that they do what they are meant to do.
Hope this helps. Oh, if T-boy spouts off about anything, ignore him. He knows nothing.
In Quincy,
Dale Dugas
thanks for the info. I saw a bak mei guy do a form once at a tournament a couple years ago but thats it, there is a school here in nyc but I never checked them out.
Hey NP - The orginal poster asked if Bak Mei was develop to take advantage of the weaknesses of Wing Chun. My reply was expressing the difference between the two styles from my experience. No need to get so literal, am I wasting your time?Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedsPractice
As far as comparing the White Tiger system to Bak Mei. If the WTS does not concentrate on developing the internal to FA JING, then it would not be simuliar to Bak Mei.
Mr. Dugas seems to be familiar with all three styles, thanks for sharing.
Attention WAXOFF
As you should well know on kung fu forum every post and thread is twisted, distorted and turned into a controversy, so after a few posts the original post is forgotten.
THat being said I forgot what the original post was and APOLOGISE.
Now was wing chun so formidable that a style had to be created to beat it?
If I was a wing chun guy with a big ego I would feel pretty impressed.
Since I am a wing chun guy without the ego, I doubt it.
Good thread keep the info coming. No disrespect intended to ANYONE.
Also if the wing chun stylist doesnt develop alot of qualities not just the internal they may as well do karate, or hapkido. Getting the internal is the icing on the cake. But back to bai mei
NP - I agree and I am also guilty of forgetting sometime where a thread may take off to. Thanks for sharing your Wing Chun experiences.
I believe many styles were created to confront other formidable styles. I am not sure if Bak Mei was one of them. My experiences exchanging Chi Sao techqiues with Wing Chun practitioners, are as mention on my privious post. I feel Bak Mei hands are heavier from our Jing development and our punch is more expolsive. As for speed Wing Chun hands are some of the quickest I have experienced. The Bak Mei stance is totally the opposite of Wing Chun. We swallow our chest and have a forward lean, while Wing Chun has more of an upright posture.
I stand corrected, as Mr. Dugas mentioned Wing Chun Chi Sao involves using YI to lead, which is certainly an internal concept and skill.
Does any White Tiger practiioners have any experiences with Wing Chun or Bak Mei, that they would like to share?
I believe that you are foolishly comparing wingchun and white tiger kungfu. If a white tiger practitioner is proficient he can defeat a wingchun artists. The skills are nothing alike and they compliment each other. A wingchun practitioner can also defeat a white tiger artist as Yip Man did. The arts are related from the time they were first made.
White tiger's creator was the elder of the group and therefore the art would be more refined and contain many skills that a wingchun artist would know very little about. Yet, the art of wingchun was created by all five of these masters solely to destoy all other shaolin arts that were learned by the manchurians.
Each master gave his or her very best to create wingchun. Todays wingchun lacks the jings of the white tiger, the Zen, and Tao. The only skill most wingchun practitioners will practice is the suttle destruction of ng mui.
Wingchun does not lake faJing, or power. Power is hidden within the body movements.
There are no tiger strikes in wingchun because they are not necessary and they would violate the fighting theories of the style. Bak Mei, dragon, white crane, and many other styles are closely related to the 5 masters and the history is very important in learning to use the correct intent in each art.
We should not be fighting as traitors, but learning from one another.
you register and post on a thread that is over 2 years old?
welcome to KFO
Yes, this thread got my attention... I've been gathering information on the cause and effect of the creation of wingchun since I practice it and that's where I began to learn about the other styles that were created by the 5 elders. After learning more about them I've come to understand that we all share diffrent qualities and attributes in our styles. Yet they are all totally diffrent when practiced. I am very interested in Bak Mei and Bak fu Pai. Bak Mei was labeled as a traitor yet when looking further into history he had no choice. His style of fighting was on a very high level, enough to defeat many. Bak fu pai I know very little about until a couple months ago. I do see that the GM has great Chi. Dragon style was created by ng mui and generates power from the waist. This style in its higher levels can simply avoid blocking strikes altogether tiring the opponent. It seems to be known for its power. Southern mantis is known for its dim mak and Iron shirt techniques. A fight with this practitioner will almost certainly lead to death according to record. Yet we are all martial brothers. And could learn many skills from each other.
Instead we argue about who could defeat who. If any of these styles fought each other, because they have similar beginnings.... they would kill each other.
what is your name? as I hate internet nicknames.
Where do you live as I know many shifu and can direct you to a school where you might learn what you seek.
I do not agree with you about these arts. The arts have nothing to do with skills as that is what the person learning them has to inject into the equation to make them work. The arts themselves do nothing it is the person who applies them. Someone who trains more and trains for real will have better skills than someone who does not.
You seem a bit naive about the Mo Duk/Wu De brotherhood speech. Of course that is what we expect from each other but that is not reality.
Again I ask what is your name and where are you located.
I can help you if I know where you live.
Personally I also like to know with whom I am talking.
Rated: 2.1