Is YanFei from the new issue the same dude...
who used to have that website angrymonk.com or madmonk.com or furiousmonk.com...something like that?
I know that dude was in L.A.
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Is YanFei from the new issue the same dude...
who used to have that website angrymonk.com or madmonk.com or furiousmonk.com...something like that?
I know that dude was in L.A.
There are three Yanfeis mentioned in The Gold Mountain Monks: 38 Shaolin Immigrants to the San Francisco Bay Area By Chen Xinghua and Gigi Oh in Shaolin Special 2007B. But I'm guessing that you mean Yanfan from The First American Branded at Shaolin Temple By Melissa Leon-Guerrero Do. I'm not sure if it's the same guy. I was kind of hoping one of you out there could confirm this or not.
Yanfan's website is www.shaolintemplela.com. I still don't know if he was the furiousmonk or petulantmonk or tizzymonk or whatever. All you white guys look alike to me. ;)
he looks like... is he that guy from bulgaria?
he was teaching after spending 9 months in shaolin. i saw some videos of his. not to hate, but not too impressive for being a shifu. he was out of breath for a long period after just a couple minutes of easy forms. but 9 months isnt very long. kind of confusing.
is that him?
...but all you white guys look alike to me. :p Just kidding.
Yanfan (Franco Testini) is Italian. I'm not sure who the Bulgarian guy is that you speak of...
i guess not then. but i must agree, those white european guys all look alike. these two guys are like twins!
...I just don't know. I don't know the Bulgarian guy at all. Was he from Italy originally?
i have no idea about who he is really. but i know his name is nothing like franco tortellini, or anything. i think victor azmonov.
he was on a bulgarian talkshow talking about and demonstrating his gongfu which he learned while spending 9 months in shaolin, then became a teacher.
that show is on youtube. here is part one. maybe some bulgarian speaker here can translate? he shows his taijiquan and staff form on parts 3 and 4.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=zehSb5IWfQg
I've never heard of that guy in those vids. But Shaolin is so vast now that there are legions of people involved that I've never heard of. It's impossible to stay on top of it all anymore.
A link to a new documentary in the works about Shi Yan Fan the only Western (or non-Chinese) Shaolin Warrior Monk to be ordained into the tradition (the Jieba Ceremony).
http://www.siron.tv/landing/index.ph...d=48&Itemid=54
If anyone knows anything more about Shifu Shi Yan Fan aka Franco Testini, please post here...
:cool:
Gene, all you guys who look like Ming the Merciless look alike to me with your long hair and beards and mustaches. :p
I can only tell you apart by your hair colour!
Karate Kid has been good for coattailing.;)
Quote:
Shaolin Temple's real kick is inner peace
Closely aligned with the temple in China, the shrine in Sherman Oaks focuses on philosophy and meditation.
BELIEFS
June 19, 2010|By Ann M. Simmons, Los Angeles Times
* Mel Melcon, Los Angeles Times
China's world-famous Shaolin Temple gained prominence among many Americans with the release of the 1980s martial arts movie of the same name. An updated version of the film, loved by fans for the riveting kung fu stunts of the temple's legendary fighting monks, is in the works. And in recent weeks, Hollywood's remake of "The Karate Kid" has topped the box office, wowing audiences with its seemingly magical martial arts techniques.
But while kung fu continues to make a splash on the big screen, members of the Shaolin Buddhist Temple in Sherman Oaks are keen to spread a different message about the Shaolin culture and what their sanctuary has to offer.
"When people come here, it's not just about martial arts," said the temple's master, Italian-born Franco Testini, 43, whose Buddhist name, Shifu Shi Yan Fan, was given to him by the abbot of the Shaolin Temple in China.
"Hollywood has completely exaggerated the martial arts scene," added Cindy Truong, 32, a temple volunteer and event coordinator. "It's not all about Chinese people being thrown over chairs. The martial arts you see in the movies, that's Americanized. It's a very small part of Shaolin culture."
Situated on a busy stretch of Ventura Boulevard, the temple opened in 2008 and offers a tranquil escape from the world outside. Instruction focuses on Buddhist philosophy and meditation, the art of ancient Chinese tea ceremonies, a combination of stretching and breathing exercises known as chi gong, tai chi — and, of course, martial arts.
"But we don't train people to punch and kick," said Truong. "We train people to become strong internally, and that emanates externally. We try to educate people, that it's more than just fighting and fancy moves."
Testini stressed the link between breathing, listening and learning as a key to developing harmony between the mind and body.
Although there are several Shaolin schools in Los Angeles, only the Sherman Oaks shrine is listed on the official website of China's Shaolin Temple, where it is described as "the first official branch organization in North America."
What makes the Sherman Oaks temple even more unusual is Testini, its master.
In 2007, Testini became the first Westerner to be accepted into the elite of the 1,500-year-old Shaolin Temple in eastern central China, his supporters said. In an ancient ritual, he received the Buddhist brand marks that symbolize his high status in Shaolin culture, they added.
Articles in Chinese news media and American martial arts magazines publicized the honor bestowed on Testini, whose journey to monkhood began when he was a youngster in his hometown of Brindisi, an Italian port city.
Testini was 7 when he started taking martial arts lessons, he said. At 9, he began to compete. By his teens, he had won numerous competitions. And at age 21, he entered the monastery and eventually took vows to become a monk. His study at home was complemented by numerous trips to China's Shaolin Temple, to solidify his discipline and faith.
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In 1994, Testini arrived in the United States. He didn't speak English and he was homeless for the first several months, sleeping on the beach or in abandoned cars. He traded martial arts instruction for food and soon developed a following of students and friends, who eventually found him permanent shelter. And in 2008, his students helped him lease a former furniture store that became the Sherman Oaks temple.
For Testini, his good fortune wasn't the result of luck but of his unwavering conviction that "everything is within reach."
It's a message he preaches daily, over tea, to the more than 50 people who have become members of the temple.
"You have to learn to believe in yourself," said the monk, who still struggles to tackle some English words and grammar.
On a recent morning, about a dozen students gathered in the shrine's small hall, decorated with Chinese murals and ornate golden figurines, to practice chi gong. Testini drifted among the participants, gently adjusting their positions.
"He can feel your aura and energy, your intensity and anxiety level," said Truong, as she observed what has become a familiar ritual. "Just by looking at a person's facial expression, he can see what kind of stress they have inside."
The breathing exercises and positive thinking Testini teaches help to relieve that stress, said Gene Cantamessa, who attends the temple five days a week.
Cantamessa, who said he is "pushing 70," is among the temple's longtime members, whose ages range from 2 to 80. Some are novices to the exercises and meditation; others have years of experience. Several work in the film industry and use the Sherman Oaks shrine to escape from the Hollywood hustle.
"I find the meditation very good," said Cantamessa, a retired production sound mixer. "I like the experience of concentrating … the peace of mind. I feel like a different person when I'm in here."
"You find a sense of inner calm," actor Adrian Paul, 50, said of his frequent attendance at the temple. "It allows you to enter another world, which centers you. Shaolin is what ballet is to dance. It's the foundation that gives you the ability to do what you want to do, better."
Rosie DiPrima said she got interested in the temple after observing her children, aged 7 and 10, participate in a martial arts class.
"After a week of watching, I started participating," said DiPrima, 37, a movie industry chef. "It's completely changed my life."
"Although there are several Shaolin schools in Los Angeles, only the Sherman Oaks shrine is listed on the official website of China's Shaolin Temple, where it is described as 'the first official branch organization in North America.'"
um, no.
http://www.shaolin.org.cn/templates/...spx?nodeid=572
The Sherman Oaks school is not affiliated with Songshan.
As for Shi Yan Fan, his performance starts about 1:05, judge for yourselves.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPuDYBhhgFI
The jieba ceremony does not an ordination make.
Shaolin Temple Cultural Center LA is listed in the "overseas cultural center" section.
Shaolin Temple Los Angeles is listed in the "sub-temples" section.Quote:
The Sherman Oaks school is not affiliated with Songshan.
http://www.shaolin.org.cn/templates/...spx?nodeid=326
http://www.shaolin.org.cn/templates/...contentid=2082
Not in itself, but what are you trying to say?Quote:
The jieba ceremony does not an ordination make.
The sub temple and cultural center sections are referring to the same thing; The Shaolin Temple Cultural Center.
I believe he is misrepresenting himself as a Shaolin warrior monk.
that doesnt seem to make any sense.
those listed in the overseas cultural centers section are not found on the sub-temples section, nor vice-versa.
one is also called "Shaolin Temple Cultural Center LA", as it is.
and the other is called "Shaolin Temple Los Angeles", as it is.
based on what?Quote:
I believe he is misrepresenting himself as a Shaolin warrior monk.
Ahahah, Never trust anyone who says that. I know at least 12 people personally who make that claim and another load I have heard of. Hell I've done the whole ceremony several times, with monks who were in Shaolin in the 60's and 70's and consider themselves above the authority of the new abbott when it comes to shaolin lineage (something most old/good masters agree on). I had to do it just to train with one of them....
Ni bu neng chi roe, neng chi bao? Neng Chiiiiiiiiiiii.
The only western guy who can claim that he is a shaolin monk is a guy called Shan Li who has been here in shaolin 13 years, and has actually left home and lives the ascetic lifestyle. But he doesn't claim to be a shaolin monk. Its a really Douchebag thing to do.
hmmm...Southern Lion Dance, two handed "Bagua dao", a girl doing Lien Bo Ch'uan, a guy doing the same three moves with the dan-dao..looks like a hodgepodge taken frm videos...:rolleyes:
I'm changing the title of this thread from "Is YanFei from the new issue the same dude..." to "Yanfan (Franco Testini)" as my coach is named Yan Fei and I don't want there to be any confusion. It makes MK's initial post a little odd, but if readers get this far, they'll understand it.Quote:
For the record
June 26, 2010
Shaolin Temple: An article in the June 19 LATExtra section about the Shaolin Buddhist Temple in Sherman Oaks said that it was the only temple in Los Angeles listed on the official website of the Shaolin Temple in China and that the website described it as "the first official branch organization in North America." However, there is another Southern California temple listed on the site, in Temple City. A representative of the Shaolin Temple in China confirmed that the Sherman Oaks temple is recognized by the official temple in China, but said that the temple in China does not want to recognize "any temple as the first in North America."
There is a brief video documentary of him receiving the Jieba on Youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPqF08tNjsw
The whole event was attended by Chinese government officials no less. I think its a slap to the face of Buddhism for Shaolin to allow such a thing to happen. I'm an atheist, but I respect all religions. Shaolin obviously had ulterior motives, like trying to attract more westerners to the temple so they would shell out big bucks to learn kung fu. If the guy truly wanted to be a Buddhist monk, he could have gone to any number of places to gain his ordination. I'm sure there are thousands of westerners so caught up in "Shaolin culture" that they would love to become monks. I doubt religion has anything to do with it. Its all about Kung fu and that is sad.
The person who posted the video is not allowing any nasty comments (such as the one I left).
Apparently the divisions go like this:
Religious Monk
Warrior Monk
Fake Monk
and
Douchebag Monk (these are they who aren't really monks and are being douchebags about it.)
that's certainly clear enough for me! :p
This may amount to nothing more than wild speculation on my part, but it appears likely to me that this was a taking refuge ceremony and not an ordination, or maybe even a taking of the bodhisattva precepts. I'm pretty sure anybody can show up, pay a fee, buy some robes and take part. In fact I think there is another such mass ceremony taking place soon or has already taken place. I'm sure shaolin is not the only temple that practices this.
I don't think Buddhism cares if government officials attend ceremonies or laowai take and uphold precepts. ;)
Yeah, cause Shaolin Si really needs the $$!:rolleyes:
There is definitely a western fetishization of Shaolin monkhood at work here; the tendency to mystify the life of a monk, shaolin or otherwise conveniently disregards the extreme hardships of leaving home. Karmic reconciliation through means of enduring hardships is no weekend retreat.
I myself have taken refuge, follow the five precepts and practice traditional shaolin culture, but I know better then to lie to myself by thinking i could withstand for one day the hardships of life as a Shaolin monk. I probably wouldn't make it a day in chan monastery without the gong fu.
Except that whenyou go there to train you never make make your payment to "the shaolin temple"Quote:
Shaolin obviously had ulterior motives, like trying to attract more westerners to the temple so they would shell out big bucks to learn kung fu.
he was apparently ordained at chi ri monastery nearby kyung ju in south korea at the age of 21.
http://www.shaolintemplela.org/pages/shiyanfan_biography.php
jieba means 'precepts scars', and are taken on the head only by the fully ordained in chinese monasticism as a part of taking bodhisattva precepts. chinese monasticism is a two-part ordination combining the bhikshu/ni upasampada and bodhisattva precepts- making one a bodhisattva bhikshu/ni (bodhisattva monk/nun). if laity receive precept scars it is usually done on the arm or wrist.
the ceremonies that took place recently were a full ordination ceremony and a bodhisattva precepts transmission ceremony for laity. these ceremonies were held at the site of shaolin monastery, but conducted and participated in by followers from all over.
www.fightschool.co.uk
Here is another genuine shaolin warrior monk..one of only handfull westerners to become fully ordained :rolleyes:
Le claims he's part of the Shaolin Warrior Monk Reserve Team
Le Fujun & Shaolin Chan City
Should we change the title of this thread to non-Chinese warrior monks? ;) There are more. I'd just have to dig them up.
We've discussed Matthew Ahmet a little already on the Shaolin on Superstars of Dance thread.
that is the name of master deyang's school in english, "wuseng houbeidui", where members are trained in traditional wugong and chan, as warrior monks would. some of his students after personal training and study have then taken discipleship under him.
but the "warrior monk reserve team" is not a class of monk that master deyang initiated, but a preparatory training base which he originally started in the mid-90's with ven. shi suxi to develop secular students external to the monastery, hence the name. so to be a member does not mean one has taken any level of ordination, as you can see.
...but most people don't. The very fact that you need to explain it demonstrates how it can be misleading. It all falls back on the wuseng class, which is poorly defined in the public eye. They just see a bald robed guy and read 'Shaolin monk'.
Another person of interest here would be Juan Carlos Aguilar, aka Huang Aguilar. Here's his site - www.shaolinmonastery.org - nice web addy, eh? Juan and I had some Shaolin adventures together back in the mid '90s. He put out a DVD - Shaolin Kung Fu Encyclopedia - here's a quote from the sell text:Quote:
In this encyclopedia, Juan Carlos Aguilar, the only Western monk recognized by the Temple and with the approval of the unveils the true Shaolin Kung fu.
its explained on that same page, and elsewhere on the site, which means the reader made assumptions after having failed to actually take care in understanding what they were reading.
same thing happens with understanding what wuseng are, when people judge them by the standards of fully ordained monks, just because "monk" is part of the term "warrior monk", and they dress that way.
the fault is not of the wuseng, but belongs to those who judge without making an effort to understand the shaolin culture.
the fault here lies on those who make assumptions without proper familiarity of the culture. thats the major issue in the western world regarding shaolin- everyone has something to say, but few actually bother educating themselves on the topic.Quote:
It all falls back on the wuseng class, which is poorly defined in the public eye. They just see a bald robed guy and read 'Shaolin monk'.
you'll notice in this thread, when several clarifications concerning yanfan's legitimacy and sincerity were made, his critics suddenly disappeared....
so what was the point of dogging on him? just for the love of controversy?
i personally havent met yanfan and dont know much about him, whether what he says is accurate or not, but i think it is unfair to denounce someone without even bothering to look into their history as they state it.
like questioning the sincerity of his buddhist devotion because he hasnt ordained elsewhere besides shaolin, when in fact, he has, at a young age, as can be read clearly on his website.
it is also unfair to lump someone in with all the people making large claims of monkhood, when nowhere have they claimed any level of ordination or even a generation name.
like those for example;
Quote:
In this encyclopedia, Juan Carlos Aguilar, the only Western monk recognized by the Temple and with the approval of the unveils the true Shaolin Kung fu.
I still don't buy it. Granted it appears he was ordained as monk. However, having seen his gong fu and having spoken with people who were privy to his time at shaolin; he spent little time training there, certainly not enough to be considered a warrior monk (unless Shaolin has lowered their standards dramatically).
I would expect such a diligent researcher as yourself to look beyond
to have noticed the discrepancies in his stated timeline.
I'm only indirectly calling into question his Buddhist devotion insofar as he is seemingly misrepresenting himself for fame and/or profit.
This is no love of controversy, rather a response to what are genuinely felt to be misleading claims made in an article in a major metropolitan publication.
On a side note, I just returned from a breif visit to Shaolin Si and saw that there are in fact foreigners training at the temple proper (a few Ukranian nationals and a German I believe), as to their level of ordination the Chan monk I discussed it with was unsure. He mentioned that they are training Gong Fu, Chan and massage
wenshu,
i was mainly referring to ghostexorcist when he said:
this appears to be denouncing the guy without a solid case, and without even really attempting to look into it. because if you read his website he writes of a korean ordination in his early 20's. this is taken at his word, but still.
you have of course made a much better case, which doesnt appear to just be for the sake of controversy.
right, i'm sure there's much more to it than meets the eye. like i said, i'm not really in a position to know any of the details. and honestly i'm not particularly interested to do a deep investigation of his situation. i dont find it necessary.
if you understand shaolin culture, you wouldnt need to question anyone's claims. because they would become glaringly obvious.
i just wish more people interested in shaolin would take the time to study the culture, and not speak on politics if just for the sake of controversy. all that serves is to damage each other, and fill the air with more air.
but i notice that much of shaolin culture is inaccessible to the western world because they dont speak enough chinese - for one - and because a lot of it is not available in english as of yet. not just shaolin but buddhism, and chinese buddhism in particular, is largely in its infancy or non-existent in the west. many important chinese sources have yet to be translated or even touched by westerners.
thats part of the reason i started sharing some culture articles a couple years back. kind of anonymously. just to make it available. it was only when another shaolin disciple of master deyang suggested and urged i start teaching here. and when master deyang approved i had to open up a bit.
some people emailed me saying they felt it was like one of the "highlights in supporting and spreading the shaolin 'philosophy' without any other purpose than 'supporting and spreading the shaolin philosophy' has now been put in line with those who have schools and businesses"...
but its kind of necessary. everyone has their reasons and aims for being involved in shaolin, and aspirations for what they wish to do with it. its a natural evolution.
give shaolin and buddhism another hundred years or so in the west. it will be interesting to see what becomes of it.
Thanks for making that clear. I was somewhat perplexed when I saw this thread was still active after about a week or so. Don't really want to continue beating a dead horse.
I'm in complete agreement with you regarding the confusion surrounding Shaolin. The language is the door to the culture; Shaolin, Buddhist or otherwise.
Unfortunately I cannot help myself but get caught up in the fog of petty politics on occasion, especially when it is so close to home. But if I was perfect what would I have to cultivate?
I never disappeared, I just don't live on the forum like a lot of people do. I think the fact that I've been a member for almost 4 years and I only have 300 sum posts shows that. Work, school, and life in general keeps me pretty busy. I drop by every few days or say just to see if anything interesting has been posted.
My points were not made for the "love of controversy". That sounds like something only a troll would do. I just questioned whether the entire situation was kosher or not. I mean a westerner receiving the Jieba and then being made the abbot of the LA Shaolin temple just seemed fishy to me at the time. Because he took his vows in Korea, I'll concede he might actually be a devout Buddhist, but the whole Shaolin aspect seems like a way of making money.
a lot of people seem to have this sort of view - and i'm not saying that you necessarily do - that if someone is involved with shaolin, then they must not be sincere buddhists, that its just for the recognition, martial arts, or something. as if shaolin cannot be taken seriously as a buddhist monastery and a tradition for dharma practice.
its unfair to assume that one cannot be involved in shaolin and be taken seriously as a buddhist practitioner. a lot of that has to do with the image of recent events and the direction of the monastery as of late, and those who take advantage of the name, but that people come to shaolin for whatever reason means they have some karmic connection with it, which predates any sort of modern business approach to spreading the tradition.
i remember master deyang speaking to me of three wishes he has for shaolin in the world. one was for the dissolving of this image of shaolin monks being uncultured martial artists who cannot be taken seriously as buddhist monks, and that martial arts cannot be a vehicle for dharma practice.
shortly after this conversation is when i began work on making shaolin culture articles easily available in english. the latest one is on "shaolin warrior ethics", which is strongly influenced by traditional buddhist literature.
LFJ, point taken on lumping Yanfan in 'with all the people making large claims of monkhood' and recant that. Those others can warrant their own threads someday perhaps.
However, I don't think it controversial for controversy's sake. Shaolin has a lot of controversy. It always has. To not engage that is to be mindless and that flies in the face of Shaolin's fundamental philosophy of mindfulness.
I've met Yanfan. We met at Songshan Shaolin Day last year. We broke his story in The First American Branded at Shaolin Temple By Melissa Leon-Guerrero Do in our November/December Shaolin Special 2007 issue. I think being the first Westerner to get jieba at Shaolin is pretty **** cool. I wish it had been me. Nevertheless, Yanfan's controversy will continue, as it will for every one who steps up to claim that 'first Western Shaolin monk' title. This is exactly as it should be. That's a title that really needs to be earned.
Controversy, you want controversy, well I claim to be the first western Shaolin Grand Puba. How's that for controversy. And yes I practice kungfu in my rather large blue fur hat.