The Making of a Butterfly... a new book by a kung fu master telling the story of his training as an american student. was a good read, recommended. Got it on amazon.
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The Making of a Butterfly... a new book by a kung fu master telling the story of his training as an american student. was a good read, recommended. Got it on amazon.
Thank you! Glad you enjoyed it!
Actually, there was another thread regarding the book but it seems to have vanished-
One of the members asked if I had once been the Chairman of the AAU Chinese Martial Arts Committee and I told him that, yes, it was me- from 1991-95.
And this is my first book that has been published-
Anyway, I'm very pleased that you enjoyed it!
It's pretty inexpensive, but maybe Sifu Starr could you make it searchable so we could at least view the table of contents and get an idea of what it's about?
If you go to North Atlantic Books on the internet, they have an excerpt from the book and the Table of Contents. If you have any difficulty, let me know and I'll try to post the TOC here-
Thanks very much! I'll check that out.Quote:
Originally Posted by P. Starr
Let me know what you think!:p
I read through the first two chapters.
It's interesting because at this time in my life I'm tired of kung fu teachers who want you to do everything their way. I've pretty much given up on that approach. In fact, I've pretty much given up on teachers.
Honestly, it's not that I don't want a teacher that pushes me, it's that I'm tired of the 'do it this way' thing. 'My way or the highway'. Every new teacher wants you to do it their way, study their forms, etc. Well what if you already have 10-20 years of training? Just throw it away? It's a waste of time if you move around or don't want to train with the same person forever.
I have a hard time finding teachers who will work on what I want to work on. For example, I currently want to train with staff, but I cannot find anybody who fights with staff. The MMA places don't fight with staff.
Yet, at the same time I lack a lot of motivation for martial arts practice, because I don't think I will ever use it. Does that make sense? When will I ever fight a high level fighter bare-handed in my life? Probably never. If I get attacked by a random person they'll probably have a gun, not attack me with fists.
So it's kindof a double-edged sword. At the same time I hate the training methods of the current teachers, I'm not that prepared for a real fight, but at the same time I probably will never get into one, so there's not much point.
So this book is kindof like a weird thing, because if I had a teacher like yours when I was younger, I would have worked hard, etc. But now, I wouldn't really want a teacher like that. In fact, I'd probably tell him to shove off. Make sense?
reads well so far.
thanks for sharing.
here is the link to the exerpt:
http://northatlanticbooks.com/store/1583941517.html
the actual exerpt link is near the bottom of that page.
If I wrote that for my first teacher, it would be something more like,
"So we were all doing kicks. After 50 snap kicks in cat stance on the right side, we shifted to the left side, and did 50 kicks there."
"I thought I was going to puke, but out of the corner of my eye I saw my teacher's daughter, Lan, and I didn't want to look like a fool in front of her, so I worked harder to make sure my kicks looked better than Brad, her current boyfriend."
"All of that effort made my legs really hurt, and I thought I was going to fall down, but when we went into the character 'Sun' punches, I didn't want to lose face, so I made an extra effort to do them even faster."
"Later in sparring, in an effort to impress the women, I worked extra hard not to get hit, and in doing so nailed Greg hard in the eye, so hard it turned red and watered. Hopefully he'll forgive me. He didn't forgive me the last time I nailed him in the 1st grade with a pail, though, but he forgot after a few years." (Truth is Greg never forgot the pail).
The next day I had to get a ride to school from Pete, because I was so sore that I couldn't ride my bike. At least I have a day off until next class.
That's great! You ought to take up writing!!!
Actually, I interned in several publications in college, so actually that was terrible. Not enough description or style or anything.Quote:
Originally Posted by P. Starr
But seriously, I don't have anything worth saying. People want to hear about some great sifu with a lot of students like you, not some divorced loser who gets drunk and bangs on poles in his back yard. :)
lmao
that was rich neilhytholt, your a funny guy.
I understand what you're saying, but...
Every teacher is accustomed to training with his or her particular system. Their forms, including weapons sets and techniques, are based on the fundamental principles of the system that they teach. This is why they won't allow you to skip over the other parts of training and go directly to training with something like a staff.
Some years back, I taught a staff seminar at the behest of my students. We had participants from many other disciplines come in - from aikido, cuong nhu, karate styles, taekwondo, wing chun, and so on. They had a terribly difficult time learning parts of our form and many basic (staff) techniques because their footwork and body shifting principles were different from the system that I teach.
Weaponry is based on the empty-hand system and that's why the bare-hand method is learned first.
A teacher who really knows what he's teaching will insist that you do everything just so...not for the sake of his ego, but because he wants you to learn (the system that he's teaching) correctly. A good teacher will push you beyond what you think you were capable of...if he won't do that, he probably shouldn't be teaching.
You may never need martial arts for purposes of self-defense. I hope not. In today's world, though, there's more of a need for effective self-defense skills than ever before. But to learn basic self-defense doesn't require that much time.
If you ask someone who's been involved in the martial arts for a long time (like a decade or more) why they started in the first place, their answer usually involves self-defense. But that's usually not why they're doing it now -
It becomes a part of you, a lifestyle that includes a lot of discipline and a love of learning and striving to be better than you are.
If you can find a good teacher, one who really knows his stuff, immerse yourself into the art. As a dear friend of mine (who's now a 7th dan with JKA) once said, "There are some people in the martial arts who don't have a clue. Then there are those who odn't even suspect...";) There's a whole world inside the martial arts that most people never see and never experience.
Give yourself a chance - and feel free to let me know if I can ever be of help.
-And I do have a striking post in my backyard...a neighbor heard me out there one afternoon and came by (he's nearly 80). "I thought you were getting into a fight with all that racket," he said, "And I guess you are...hitting a stick...":D
I wonder why you say this about needing more effective self-defense than ever before? Because it seems like there's less and less violence in the world than ever before.Quote:
Originally Posted by P. Starr
Fewer wars, fewer people dying, people living longer, life expectancies at all time highs.
Yeah, I agree with you on the teachers and teaching thing, but that's the problem. I don't want to learn another entirely different way of moving. Martial arts teachers like that are boot camp instructors, so to go through one boot camp, and then to go to an entirely other boot camp where they do everything differently, is a bit purturbing, to say the least. Especially when you just want to spar with their students and you don't really want to learn their way at all.
Anyways, it's no big deal. Poles are harder than bones or faces anyway.
Judging from what I've seen and been told by friends who are still in law enforcement, this country is still suffering from serious violence problems. We don't necessarily have the high-profile gangsta-type stuff happening with the same frequency that it did years ago, but there's still more than enough violence to go around.
If I may ask, what martial art(s) did you study previously?
Yeah I did some research about that recently, and it really varies from state to state. States like California where they have 3 strikes laws have had a lot of reduction, like in 1/2 or something, but evidently other states haven't had as much.
About the only item that hasn't gone down that much is rape for some reason. Although why anybody would rape anybody with all the STDs these days is beyond me. I guess those people don't think very much.
The main martial art that I spent the most time in was a family style, that the instructor just called 'animal style kung fu'. I tried to track down what actually it was, and it turns out it was brought back by a guy who was in the Korean war. His son was teaching it for a while.
How long did you study it?
Well I don't want to say, because it's nothing compared to your experience. You'd just laugh at me.
No, not at all! I don't laugh at anyone who seriously wants to learn martial arts-
Well somebody saying that they don't want to study with teachers anymore sounds like they have a huge ego. You know, the whole cup is full thing.
So if I say something less than you studied, or another teacher, then it is going to sound like I'm an idiot and not just a huge ego.
But the bottom line is, it's not a matter of ego. I don't have time to practice even what my first sifu taught me, or good partners to run drills, therefore why bother working on anything else? It seems like a waste of time. I mean, every new school has their own drills. If you find yourself away from a particular school in the style, or even the same sifu (some sifus do things differently), they make you do everything over again.
Sifu Starr, is there some good info on your style, Yiliquan, out there somewhere?
I keep finding all these posts everywhere about how it's some sort of longfist + bagua + xingyi + taiji all together, but I fail to understand how you could concatenate all of that together into 8 shapes, and all the applications into 1 step drills. How many different 1-step drills are there?
Do you do any sort of weapons work at all?
Are there some movies anywhere or anything?
The drills aren't carved in stone...and the "shapes" are ways of responding to an attack (in terms of footwork and body shifting). So there's no memorization of certain combinations or any of that sort of thing...
We should have our website up very soon. I'll be sure to let you know when that happens (we're using our own server, so it's taking some time).
Presently, there are no books or videos as yet on Yiliquan. But I'll be happy to provide you with whatever information I can.
Where are you located? Our numbers are few at this time but there may be one of my senior students near you-
Well, depending on where you are located, you could always check out either our regular training classes or our seminars... Failing that, correspondence with any of our seniors, or our entire student body, via our Yahoo Group is an option as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by neilhytholt
It isn't that all of that training is concentrated into 8 drills... Rather, there are 8 conceptual models that incorporate variations of footwork, technique, throws, locks, etc. For example, some throws work better with certain kinds of footwork, so they are incorporated into that "shape." Further, each "shape" applies certain methods of general movement; Heaven Shape always advances, Earth Shape always retreats, Water Shape retreats and then advances...Quote:
I keep finding all these posts everywhere about how it's some sort of longfist + bagua + xingyi + taiji all together, but I fail to understand how you could concatenate all of that together into 8 shapes, and all the applications into 1 step drills.
As many as you can think of. Some are simple technique combinations. Some are taken directly from the forms. Some are taken from the forms and then deliberately made "different" (by changing the distance, angle, or attack from the basic application of the form, forcing the student to see how the exact same technique series can be applied against a myriad of possibilities).Quote:
How many different 1-step drills are there?
We use 4 primary weapons - Staff, Broadsword, Spear and Straight Sword. There are others, but these are the main ones.Quote:
Do you do any sort of weapons work at all?
We don't have any official videos (yet), so the only way to see Yili at the present time is in person...Quote:
Are there some movies anywhere or anything?
Thanks for the info.
But basically I gave into the Borg, in nerdspeak. Joined a karate McDojo ... the kids love it, and the sensei's really nice, and the best thing is I get to do a ton of sparring.
I just got tired of all the nonsense of CMA systems, not being able to practice things from other styles, the tons of different forms, not being able to spar for months or years.
This way we all can practice pretty much anywhere. Must easier for everybody. Plus it's a family environment and the kids like it almost as much as Playstation.
You're welcome! Anytime... If you have any other questions, feel free to ask away! :DQuote:
Originally Posted by neilhytholt
Well, I'm glad you found something to your satisfaction, regardless of what it is... I tell people that discuss martial arts with me that not every art is "for" everybody. Some folks have preferences, and some have to make compromises. For instance, there's a BJJ school here locally that I'd love to train at, however with the prices the teacher charges for the minimal class time, I refuse to attend. I don't care how good the instruction may be, I simply won't shell out a kidney and a liver for a few paltry hours each week...Quote:
But basically I gave into the Borg, in nerdspeak. Joined a karate McDojo ... the kids love it, and the sensei's really nice, and the best thing is I get to do a ton of sparring.
I don't blame you. Some of the things I like about training in Yiliquan are:Quote:
I just got tired of all the nonsense of CMA systems, not being able to practice things from other styles, the tons of different forms, not being able to spar for months or years.
a) Most everyone has some kind of prior training background;
b) Their prior background is used to one degree or another to gradually guide their technique inline with our doctrines and theories of application;
c) That even other forms/kata/hyung are used on occasion to illustrate similarities between arts (in our club, since I know Naihanchi Shodan fairly well, we use that to show similarity in technique between it and Baixingquan for example...);
d) We work gradually to work a straight beginner into "sparring," but when someone's ready, they get full tilt boogie.
I've been with it for 20 years, and even when I tried to find something to substitute it (permanently in some cases, due to military assignments), I was completely unable to find anything with the same depth and breadth. Ever.
Good luck with it, and I hope your kids get plenty out of training! :DQuote:
This way we all can practice pretty much anywhere. Must easier for everybody. Plus it's a family environment and the kids like it almost as much as Playstation.
Starting Feb 1st, 2007, enter to win your autographed copy of Phillip Starr's book, The Making of a Butterfly. This promotion will last two months. Good luck everyone!
Sifu Starr, I just wanted to tahnk you for your book. I read it a few months ago, it was a grand recollection of the process you went through while learning. It was great to hear the perception changing as you learned more and more about the culture and art.
Truly, thank you. =)
...the contest starts today. I'm going to overlook those of your who don't read the fine print and jumped the gun.
Good luck again, everyone!
The twenty winners of autographed copies of Phillip Starr's MAKING OF A BUTTERFLY have been posted. With your support, we'll continue to bring you unique online sweepstakes here at KungFuMagazine.com.
dang it i missed out :mad: :(
I've been a student of Sifu Starr's since 1985. The book is awesome. It's got something to offer on multiple levels, and I've re-read it three times so far. My son recently started training in Yiliquan, and I've assigned him "homework" in the form of reading Sifu Starr's book. For an 11 year old to like it, you know it has to have something interesting in it...
Congratulations to all the winners.
no doubt.
I want to read anything by someone who got neil to talk sensibly for once :p:p :p
Not hiding anything... Our website is under construction currently (www.yiliquan.org), and will likely contain some video clips in the future. Right now we're busy building the basic information aspects of the site. We had another website, but there were issues with the server and the creator of the site, so that's no longer functional.
As stated so very many times before, Neil, you've got Yili folks in your backyard. All you'd have to do is make the very simple, easy drive from Seattle to Tacoma (for you non-Washingtonians, that's a trip of roughly 41 miles via I-5) to see what we do in person. But, you've given no end of excuses precluding you from making the drive, so your comments don't carry much weight (especially the "what are they hiding" remark).
You're welcome to come down, join in class, hell I'd even bet we'd make a point to entertain your "I want to train my own techniques without learning anything new" expectation, just to make a point. If we had something to hide, as you snidely attempted to allege, I doubt we'd be so forthcoming with information as we have been, and always are.
Enjoy your isolation chamber.
Just a little additional info/insight -
Neil has said he doesn't want to come down because a) we're too far away, b) we're too rude, c) he doesn't want to catch some communicable disease, d) he doesn't want to learn anything new (even though he admits to not having learned all that much from his first teacher). However, as stated in this thread, he's decided to join what he termed a "McDojo" to satisfy his desire to train (though he said earlier in this thread that he didn't have time to practice even the small amount he'd learned of "animal style kung fu" from his first teacher).
Neil has contradicted himself repeatedly, in this thread and others. My offer stands - he can come down to our club and I'll gladly allow him to use me as a practice dummy. I will happily provide documentation that I'm free of any communicable disease (specifically, the herpes gladiatorum he's so afraid of catching), signed by Army medical personnel. I'll answer any and all questions he has about Yiliquan, and I'll post any such answers on the internet for all and sundry to view. If he's got a video camera, he can video my responses as well.
Here's the neat thing, though... He won't show. I'm looking forward to seeing what excuse he gives this time...
[QUOTE=neilhytholt;751457]Maybe if you weren't so busy calling what I say moronic you might have a different opinion.
QUOTE]
about you? unlikely. :) I almost did for a second here though. If you actually take these fellows up on their offer, it might be a start.
About the medical stuff? Because you seem afraid of your own shadow when it comes to catching very minor diseases, fungi, or parasites from actually making physical contact with another human being for the sake of developing combative skill. I've been training for 22 years, and the worst I ever got was a case of athlete's foot from a gym I showered in...
About Yiliquan in general?
Because you're not the first person, especially from up here in the PacNW, who's claimed all sorts of knowledge but repeatedly refused to attend seminars, Throwdowns, or any other cooperative training event. I can't remember how many times the Bagua folks from Seattle bellyached about not being able to get together and train (they apparently all train individually and alone, though many are students of the same teacher), but then failed to show over and over again...
Because you're not the first person who, from the safety of their keyboard, tried to insinuate all manner of things about us Yili folks, all the while making excuse after excuse to cover their inability to actually show up and check us out in person.
So, in the spirit of full disclosure (hard to have secrets when you spill the info from the initial outset), I welcome anyone to check out our training group to answer whatever questions they may have instead of making half-informed, smart-assed comments from the obscurity of the internet.
And this attitude isn't new... Maybe for this area, but as long as I've been training in Yiliquan, we've always welcomed folks into the school - for information, education, or "other reasons."
So when are you coming down? :rolleyes: