There are some other fights Karate versus Kung Fu , Kung Fu versus Tai Kwon Do Ect..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S19Vs...elated&search=
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There are some other fights Karate versus Kung Fu , Kung Fu versus Tai Kwon Do Ect..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S19Vs...elated&search=
This clip gets posted onto most martial art forums very often. If you are familiar with TWC and TCC it is an awsome fight.
Maybe they connected, but apparently had little effect.
No TWC in that fight whatsoever. (Traditional Wing Chun)
TWC, Tibetan White Crane.
I find that fight lacking quite a bit of chi.
That aside :D I happen to know for a fact that Chan Hak Fu was totally embarassed, not at all proud, of his performance. He subsequently made all his students spar with boxing gloves.
This is a great example of how deluded and out of touch TCMA people are... he thinks that is a great fight!
"'Ng was 54. CH Fu was 27, still alive and overseeing a school"
I'm hoping that was a typo:p
I have heard that this was an exhibition match. Does anyone actually have all the details?
It is a fantastic example of how backward the TCMA world was at the time. Everyone was worried these two "masters" were going to kill eachother prior to the match! LMFAO, as you can see, they fought like two beginning students who have never sparred before....
The fight got stopped over a bloody nose! Yeah, the referee said "where the blood goes, the chi goes, and if he continues to bleed he might die"
YEAH - they stopped a fight over a bloody nose! Because it was "deadly" :rolleyes:
I see more blood on a daily basis in the gym. I have kids with 3 months training who would have KO'ed either one of them.
Like I said, Chan Hak Fu was embarassed adn ashamed and changed the way he trained students after this
It isnt' something to hold up as a great example
It must just be by some miracle that Hak Fus' students became reputable fighters.
you must be retarded, yes? The fact that Chan Hak Fu's students became fighters is because after this disgrace, he CHANGED THE WAY HE TRAINED.... I already said that TWICE. I guess you missed that part? :rolleyes:
Agian, if you think this is a awesome fight, you must be retarded....
Wow!!
:):):):):)
That video linked to perhaps the greatest fight in the history of all mankind. It was practically epic.
No, I think that was the state of sarcasm.
Just out of curiousity, LKFDMC, how do you know the background to this fight, and how the guy changed his cirriculum? I'm not doubting you. Just curious, as it was a very long time ago.
Chan was considered as a junior student in the system (not a master)at the time of the fight, later in life he became a figurehead. It was a demo fight that took place Jan/17/54, there was some "bad blood" between the 2 fighters as many rumors were being thrown around so the demo match was an emotional one. The fight was stopped to prevent real injury as the fighters were starting to forget the "rules", the video quality being so poor doesn't reveal the blood. Chi magazine autumm 2002 has a big spread(29 pages) detailing the fight, origin and drama sorrounding it. They give Ngs' age as "53" and Chan Hak Fus' as "nearly 30).
The reason I like the fight as a TWC guy is many of our strikes and timing loops are being carried out out right here. I don't ccare they didn't get ko'd or choked out. At one point Hak Fu uses a rain storm of overhands to get control of the center of the ring, or the fist hook sending Ng into the ropes for example is what I enjoy seeing. The system has changed some since the fight yes, but it is the order in which things are presented rather than the actual changing of the art. Our seed punches are the same today as they were in the video.
the fight was castrated by rules and the "fighters" clearly weren't really fighters.
Frankly I know some 17 year olds that would dominate ground and pound both of those demonstrators. :p
not kidding. :)
that was a terrible display of "kungfu" and is not representative of decent tcma in my opinion.
It is ok, there is a long history of us being pounded on all the time. It all started somewhere around here-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wong_Yan-Lam
and then just kind of gets worse for us here-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lama_%28martial_art%29
Please don't invoke Wong yan Lam in your pathetic defense of this....
What's even funnier is your si gung originally talked trash about Lama Pai and about Wong yan Lam, then I guess you figured affiliation would make you seem tougher :rolleyes:
I posted those links for the history and information in them hoping Golden would read them and see that his comment was a little off the marker. Wong Lam was a legend and at one time used the roots of ours and your practice to get there. The politics you bring up I am going to ignore.
You say this match is so bad, well lets here your side? I can see many things that were right here for Tai Chi and crane.
Notice the probing feed that Ng fell for 3 times in a row then paid the price with a kick landing in his belly. Or how Ng triangled in on Fu right at the start landing the short uppercut jab busting his nose? When this video comes up none ever says, wow nice slam to the nose, they only make comments about 2 old drunkards flailing like girls when they see a volley of overhands.
I will use your own post
your line doesn't even go to Wong Yan Lam! Why invoke him when he isn't even in your line....
do you NOT realize he isn't in your line? :rolleyes:
Yeah, let's ignore the fact taht Gareth talked a lot of smack and got called on it big time. McGee Kwan, the Leung brothers and Chan Hak Fu himself denounced him. Wong Ching in San Francisco was going to send a guy to find him.
Funny, you want to invoke Wong Yan Lam when it suits your purposes, and ignore the fact your si gung trashed him in a public magazine?
Regardless of the look of the fight. One thing we don't know is what the strikes felt like. We imagine that we would be tough, faster, stronger. etc. But its still an uncertainty. I was more disappointed in the wtc guy.
When I see this clip it reminds me of two things.
One, that people are commenting on one fight between two guys in a country of hundreds of millions as the epitemy of CMA for all time. Its sad really. Considering that, at the same time, others in the country would have killed them both.
Two, along with the above, this fight was between what would be considered here a grudge match at a high school between two local boys. It was a big deal to them. But it was made more by the coverage it received.
Right, it was Wong Lam Hoi, sorry I had confused him with Wong Yan Lum. They both trained under Lung, My mistake. By my comment on ignoring politics, what I mean by that is I just want to talk about the fight. You could have simply asked if I ment to include Lam Hoi rather than Yan Lum since it was obvious I had mixed the 2 up. It's not like people havne't made this type of mistake fumbling of names before. I don't have any direct involvment of comments or bad blood between others in the past, my slate is clean on these matters.
Here is the link that should have gone in with the others. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wong_Lam-Hoi.
These are good points you bring up and I agree. I just become frustrated over the endless battery of negative feedback it recieves. My intention here was to add some explanation to what was going on in the fight. I want people to understand that the swinging arms for example are real techniques and not just uncontroled "swinging arms" of some random hillbilly.
What gets me most about this video, and the repeated circulation of it on the net, is the fact that most people will use this video as a comparison of todays TCMA folk. Which IMO is completely rediculous.
Yes, I agree that this fight is not the most dynamic and exciting, nor the best show of skill or technique. I also understand that this was taken a very long time ago, and in no way represents the modern man.
Practitioners of traditional styles have a great boom in their studies compared to people in the past, as well as any other martial practitioner. Modern state of mass communication, the collecting and sharing of information gives people today many tools to use in their pursuit of martial studies.
Many people who have studied traditional styles in the past and have since moved to other styles or modern methods often see that they are "no longer TMAists". IMO I dont believe this to be the case. I believe the adaption, accumulation to be a truthful extension of TMA. At the root core of the study of combat, integration and evolution are key elements to having a successful system in place for study, experimentation, utilization and passing of knowledge.
These are my thoughts on this video in regards to TMA
There is still a direct way to test the validity of the many theories proposed about the 1954 fight. Anyone who wants to know about the skill of at least one of the contestants should look up Eddie Wu at www.wustyle.com and tell him what you think of his grandfather. Sifu Eddie learned from his grandfather from the age of six. That should settle it. :D
I would not say that 1953 is a very long time ago to put this fight into the context that because of its age there would be a less amount of fighters.Quote:
I also understand that this was taken a very long time ago
Karate, Thai, Western Boxing, Savate, Sambo, Catch Wrestling, and even more specific a bunch of Judoka were all banging it out back then in ways that actually had the merit to call it a fight.